DUST Search - Nerf armor tanks.

Cat Merc wrote:

Foundation Seldon wrote:

Atiim wrote:

Looks like I'm in before the tankers.

Anyways, I think making it to where you could only equip 1 repper would be the better idea. If the Complex could only push 100HP/s, then what would the Enhanced and Basic ones do? 80HP/s? 60HP/s?

That wouldn't even suffice for a MLT LAV.

Shield tanks are even better when fitted properly. Have you seen some of their fits? it's like a Madrugar on steroids. (Guess that's why they get the high slot lol).

Why would it be a problem to model Vehicle repair modules like Dropsuit repair modules? Don't put an arbitrary distinction on the number of modules of a certain type you can fit to a vehicle but change it so that their repair amounts are far less than what they're repping currently.

Shield Tanks should rely on their regen to counteract their low base health amounts

Armor Tanks should rely on their large health pool to counteract much lower repair rates.

Even with a single module I'd argue that the repair amounts for vehicle reps that stay on constantly are far too high currently, a basic heavy vehicle repair is the equivalent of a dropsuit running around with a 10hp/s base armor repair amount off of a single module, and it gets worse as you skill into it further.

It doesn't really apply to vehicles.
In CCP's design, armor vehicles are designed to stay and fight, which is why they have poor turning speed and acceleration.
To stand and fight you need to regenerate your HP, or have a large enough HP pool to last for a good while.

The HP pool isn't that big when you consider it's the difference between 4 shots from a swarm launcher and 5 shots from a swarm launcher.

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Sir Dukey KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 375	Posted - 2014.03.16 04:33:00 - [1] - Quote They are fking getting out of hand. Repping 250+ armor a sec (more than a shield tanks passive). That is messed up and on top of their hardener, they are fking invincible. Shield tanks are better because you can at least stop their freaking recharge and their hardners don't last very long (also, they suck without hardners) but ARmor tanks are goldlike. Nerf armor tank passive recharge and make it go back to the way it was before in 1.6 or reduce the heavy reppers HP repped so the complex is repping 100hp/sec.
jerrmy12 kahoalii 516	Posted - 2014.03.16 04:37:00 - [2] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: They are fking getting out of hand. Repping 250+ armor a sec (more than a shield tanks passive). That is messed up and on top of their hardener, they are fking invincible. Shield tanks are better because you can at least stop their freaking recharge and their hardners don't last very long (also, they suck without hardners) but ARmor tanks are goldlike. Nerf armor tank passive recharge and make it go back to the way it was before in 1.6 or reduce the heavy reppers HP repped so the complex is repping 100hp/sec. Its double reps Nerf double reps and hards, reduce gunlogi shuekd depleted delay to a low number because its totaly unfair atm, buff ahuekd recharge rate to 180 hp/s Closed beta vet Logi, Heavy, Python, Scout.
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 5758	Posted - 2014.03.16 04:43:00 - [3] - Quote Looks like I'm in before the tankers. Anyways, I think making it to where you could only equip 1 repper would be the better idea. If the Complex could only push 100HP/s, then what would the Enhanced and Basic ones do? 80HP/s? 60HP/s? That wouldn't even suffice for a MLT LAV. Shield tanks are even better when fitted properly. Have you seen some of their fits? it's like a Madrugar on steroids. (Guess that's why they get the high slot lol). AV > HAV > INF > AV \| Not: HAV > AV GëÑ INF [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
DEATH DEALER 1975 KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 16	Posted - 2014.03.16 04:45:00 - [4] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: They are fking getting out of hand. Repping 250+ armor a sec (more than a shield tanks passive). That is messed up and on top of their hardener, they are fking invincible. Shield tanks are better because you can at least stop their freaking recharge and their hardners don't last very long (also, they suck without hardners) but ARmor tanks are goldlike. Nerf armor tank passive recharge and make it go back to the way it was before in 1.6 or reduce the heavy reppers HP repped so the complex is repping 100hp/sec. Dude!!!! I wish you would consult with your corp tankers before posting a nerf about tanks. We need the reps when we are getting hit by Rail tanks.
Foundation Seldon Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 570	Posted - 2014.03.16 04:49:00 - [5] - Quote Atiim wrote: Looks like I'm in before the tankers. Anyways, I think making it to where you could only equip 1 repper would be the better idea. If the Complex could only push 100HP/s, then what would the Enhanced and Basic ones do? 80HP/s? 60HP/s? That wouldn't even suffice for a MLT LAV. Shield tanks are even better when fitted properly. Have you seen some of their fits? it's like a Madrugar on steroids. (Guess that's why they get the high slot lol). Why would it be a problem to model Vehicle repair modules like Dropsuit repair modules? Don't put an arbitrary distinction on the number of modules of a certain type you can fit to a vehicle but change it so that their repair amounts are far less than what they're repping currently. Shield Tanks should rely on their regen to counteract their low base health amounts Armor Tanks should rely on their large health pool to counteract much lower repair rates. Even with a single module I'd argue that the repair amounts for vehicle reps that stay on constantly are far too high currently, a basic heavy vehicle repair is the equivalent of a dropsuit running around with a 10hp/s base armor repair amount off of a single module, and it gets worse as you skill into it further. Saga v. Methana Balance
jerrmy12 kahoalii 516	Posted - 2014.03.16 04:51:00 - [6] - Quote Atiim wrote: Looks like I'm in before the tankers. Anyways, I think making it to where you could only equip 1 repper would be the better idea. If the Complex could only push 100HP/s, then what would the Enhanced and Basic ones do? 80HP/s? 60HP/s? That wouldn't even suffice for a MLT LAV. Shield tanks are even better when fitted properly. Have you seen some of their fits? it's like a Madrugar on steroids. (Guess that's why they get the high slot lol). Exept to survive anytbing you need a hardener. Closed beta vet Logi, Heavy, Python, Scout.
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect Negative-Feedback 2430	Posted - 2014.03.16 06:05:00 - [7] - Quote Are you guys mad? If there are any nerfs then both categorys needs to be nerfbatted. -longer cooldown time for hardeners -lower threshold so that the swarm launcher damage actually sticks to shield tanks -lower resistance bonus granted from hardeners (both shield+armor) -lower shield recharge and less armor repair rate -less agility and speed for armor+shield tanks -bigger pricetag for tanks. A militia tank should at least cost the same like a advanced suit from there it should go up. I could keep going on but i think every 1 should get the idea. TANKS MUST BE NERFED. I shall show you a world, a world which you cant imagine, a world full off butthurt n00bs at the other end of my gun
jerrmy12 kahoalii 516	Posted - 2014.03.16 06:11:00 - [8] - Quote The dark cloud wrote: Are you guys mad? If there are any nerfs then both categorys needs to be nerfbatted. -longer cooldown time for hardeners -lower threshold so that the swarm launcher damage actually sticks to shield tanks umm, no, shield tanks regen already blows hard -lower resistance bonus granted from hardeners (both shield+armor) umm, no -lower shield recharge and less armor repair rate. no for shield recharge nerf -less agility and speed for armor+shield tanks. only armor loses agility -bigger pricetag for tanks. A militia tank should at least cost the same like a advanced suit from there it should go up. I could keep going on but i think every 1 should get the idea. TANKS MUST BE NERFED. Closed beta vet Logi, Heavy, Python, Scout.
Mobius Wyvern Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 4806	Posted - 2014.03.16 06:17:00 - [9] - Quote jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: They are fking getting out of hand. Repping 250+ armor a sec (more than a shield tanks passive). That is messed up and on top of their hardener, they are fking invincible. Shield tanks are better because you can at least stop their freaking recharge and their hardners don't last very long (also, they suck without hardners) but ARmor tanks are goldlike. Nerf armor tank passive recharge and make it go back to the way it was before in 1.6 or reduce the heavy reppers HP repped so the complex is repping 100hp/sec. Its double reps Nerf double reps and hards, reduce gunlogi shuekd depleted delay to a low number because its totaly unfair atm, buff ahuekd recharge rate to 180 hp/s Uh...those two words I can't understand are supposed to be shield and armor, right? Amidst the blue skies A link from past to future The sheltering wings of the protector
jerrmy12 kahoalii 516	Posted - 2014.03.16 06:24:00 - [10] - Quote Mobius Wyvern wrote: jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: They are fking getting out of hand. Repping 250+ armor a sec (more than a shield tanks passive). That is messed up and on top of their hardener, they are fking invincible. Shield tanks are better because you can at least stop their freaking recharge and their hardners don't last very long (also, they suck without hardners) but ARmor tanks are goldlike. Nerf armor tank passive recharge and make it go back to the way it was before in 1.6 or reduce the heavy reppers HP repped so the complex is repping 100hp/sec. Its double reps Nerf double armor reps and hards, reduce gunlogi shield depleted delay to a low number because its totaly unfair atm, buff shield recharge rate to 180 hp/s Uh...those two words I can't understand are supposed to be shield and armor, right? Touch screen ftw Fixed in quote. Closed beta vet Logi, Heavy, Python, Scout.

8213 BIG BAD W0LVES Canis Eliminatus Operatives 1752	Posted - 2014.03.16 06:27:00 - [11] - Quote Perhaps I've grown tired of the tank debate... I think the tank building is far to simplistic and dumbed down. Leaving a tanker to rely on the build instead of his in-game skill. My builds are 50/50. My railgun is straight up crutch Hammer of the Empress because I don't tolerate tanks. I was in a game and a guy with a Maddy had triple hardeners (2 complex, and a Light of some sort) He was out repping my Assault FG, and I had every advantage I could get on him. I had a high spot, a perfect line of sight, etc. 4 direct hits against him did nothing, and 5th didn't do it either, by the time the 6th came, he was long gone. And the kicker was I had someone FG-ing him w/ me... It was only when he made a mistake and backed into a rock and got stuck that I was able to out DPS him. I must have put 30 shots into him before that. The next tank he brought out was a double hardened Maddy Build -_- At that point I had it with this clown, so I called in my Hammer, drove it off the roof and hunted him down like a pig. He brought a 3rd Maddy out, I don't what it was as the game ended before we could engage one another. However, I wasn't angry or annoyed at the time. in-between I popped 4-5 other tanks. I just don't get angry at tanks as much anymore. I either pop them, or just avoid them. I hardly play ambush anymore, so that may have a lot to do with it. Perhaps, I'e just given up, or settled into 1.7. Tanks are still crazy OP, and I kicked and screamed for a while (mostly on behalf of the new players and the obvious imbalances) but in my old age has made me timid. As always, you bring a tank onto my field in a pub, it's not getting off alive. I ain't got time for dat sht!*
Lynn Beck Wake N' Bake Inc Top Men. 865	Posted - 2014.03.16 07:44:00 - [12] - Quote Fought a madrugar the other day. Triple complex reps. Twin dmg modded CBR7 swarns with a commando pushing lv2 reload and lv3 commando(BETTER than proto reload speeds) He repped back the first swarm before i even started locking the 2nd volley, and the worst part is, he sat there. Stared me down as i unloaded 6 volleys. Then 6 more(k-2 nanohive) then 6 mlre, then 6 more. Then 6 more! After ALL that, his HP was at max. 0/4000 HP. He was in fact DOUBLE outrepping my swarm DPS, and i exhausted 2 k-2 nanohives pelting his ass. He sat there, unmoving, unwavering, jus staring me down, laughing. 'Sorry Dakka, they're just so... Beautiful.' -cries- Tits are my new god, as the Galscout has enlightened me.
Foundation Seldon Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 571	Posted - 2014.03.16 07:50:00 - [13] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: He was in fact DOUBLE outrepping my swarm DPS, and i exhausted 2 k-2 nanohives pelting his ass. He sat there, unmoving, unwavering, jus staring me down, laughing. Hahaha, yeah I've done this as well (staring at swarmers trying to out DPS my rep). It's a pretty unfortunate situation. Saga v. Methana Balance
jerrmy12 kahoalii 516	Posted - 2014.03.16 08:00:00 - [14] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: Fought a madrugar the other day. Triple complex reps. Twin dmg modded CBR7 swarns with a commando pushing lv2 reload and lv3 commando(BETTER than proto reload speeds) He repped back the first swarm before i even started locking the 2nd volley, and the worst part is, he sat there. Stared me down as i unloaded 6 volleys. Then 6 more(k-2 nanohive) then 6 mlre, then 6 more. Then 6 more! After ALL that, his HP was at max. 0/4000 HP. He was in fact DOUBLE outrepping my swarm DPS, and i exhausted 2 k-2 nanohives pelting his ass. He sat there, unmoving, unwavering, jus staring me down, laughing. Does it out rep forges? Closed beta vet Logi, Heavy, Python, Scout.
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 3006	Posted - 2014.03.16 10:31:00 - [15] - Quote Working as intended Intelligence is OP
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1919	Posted - 2014.03.16 10:37:00 - [16] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: They are fking getting out of hand. Repping 250+ armor a sec (more than a shield tanks passive). That is messed up and on top of their hardener, they are fking invincible. Shield tanks are better because you can at least stop their freaking recharge and their hardners don't last very long (also, they suck without hardners) but ARmor tanks are goldlike. Nerf armor tank passive recharge and make it go back to the way it was before in 1.6 or reduce the heavy reppers HP repped so the complex is repping 100hp/sec. Maybe you should... get... good... I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Piraten Hovnoret Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 409	Posted - 2014.03.16 10:39:00 - [17] - Quote DEATH DEALER 1975 wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: They are fking getting out of hand. Repping 250+ armor a sec (more than a shield tanks passive). That is messed up and on top of their hardener, they are fking invincible. Shield tanks are better because you can at least stop their freaking recharge and their hardners don't last very long (also, they suck without hardners) but ARmor tanks are goldlike. Nerf armor tank passive recharge and make it go back to the way it was before in 1.6 or reduce the heavy reppers HP repped so the complex is repping 100hp/sec. Dude!!!! I wish you would consult with your corp tankers before posting a nerf about tanks. We need the reps when we are getting hit by Rail tanks. So one broken game mechanic warrants a other broken game mechanic? Isn't it better to fix both ? War never changes
bastille123 REYES DE DOMINACION 1	Posted - 2014.03.16 11:07:00 - [18] - Quote its just sad that ppl dont realise the real problem with tanks, i mean why cpp does not do something like this: armor hardener: 25% dmg resist at lvl 1 or militia / 35% at advanced level/ 45% at proto (yes is a 5 percent more for complex to compensate) shield hardener:45% dmg resist at lvl1 or militia / 55% at advanced level / 65% at proto dmg mods: 10% at level 1 or militia / 20% at advanced / 30% at complex level there you go no skill militia tanks are balanced and this gives room for advanced and proto tanks too not sure what to put here lol
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 1011	Posted - 2014.03.16 11:11:00 - [19] - Quote Atiim wrote: Looks like I'm in before the tankers. Anyways, I think making it to where you could only equip 1 repper would be the better idea. If the Complex could only push 100HP/s, then what would the Enhanced and Basic ones do? 80HP/s? 60HP/s? That wouldn't even suffice for a MLT LAV. Shield tanks are even better when fitted properly. Have you seen some of their fits? it's like a Madrugar on steroids. (Guess that's why they get the high slot lol). That would prevent the wonderful happy dance connection to the fabulous spreadsheet game called EVE. So, too bad. Also, that would mean the Shield tanks would lose double modules as well. Which would make them even easier to pop. Anti-tankers, they spew the best QQs. And so it goes.
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 7422	Posted - 2014.03.16 11:15:00 - [20] - Quote Foundation Seldon wrote: Atiim wrote: Looks like I'm in before the tankers. Anyways, I think making it to where you could only equip 1 repper would be the better idea. If the Complex could only push 100HP/s, then what would the Enhanced and Basic ones do? 80HP/s? 60HP/s? That wouldn't even suffice for a MLT LAV. Shield tanks are even better when fitted properly. Have you seen some of their fits? it's like a Madrugar on steroids. (Guess that's why they get the high slot lol). Why would it be a problem to model Vehicle repair modules like Dropsuit repair modules? Don't put an arbitrary distinction on the number of modules of a certain type you can fit to a vehicle but change it so that their repair amounts are far less than what they're repping currently. Shield Tanks should rely on their regen to counteract their low base health amounts Armor Tanks should rely on their large health pool to counteract much lower repair rates. Even with a single module I'd argue that the repair amounts for vehicle reps that stay on constantly are far too high currently, a basic heavy vehicle repair is the equivalent of a dropsuit running around with a 10hp/s base armor repair amount off of a single module, and it gets worse as you skill into it further. It doesn't really apply to vehicles. In CCP's design, armor vehicles are designed to stay and fight, which is why they have poor turning speed and acceleration. To stand and fight you need to regenerate your HP, or have a large enough HP pool to last for a good while. The HP pool isn't that big when you consider it's the difference between 4 shots from a swarm launcher and 5 shots from a swarm launcher. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. DUST514514

Derpty Derp It's All Gone Derp 130	Posted - 2014.03.16 11:16:00 - [21] - Quote Armour vehicles should be balanced around high hp while Shield vehicles balance around being able to recharge... Currently this fails since Armour vehicles have higher hp and more recharge. Nerf the repair or remove it completely, if you have teamwork someone probably has a rep tool, if you need to repair your vehicle then go to one of them or a supply depo... Would make the game more fun with less vehicles just moving round a corner for a few seconds to pop back out with full hp. Need to at least stop armour rep stacking... I have a Grimsnes that can also sit and stare at a swarm launcher this also only needs to dodge a shot or two against forge guns to fully repair while they reload. Another option is to make armour repair stall for 3 seconds when it takes damage, causing it to only be used between fights or having to evade attacks to benefit. Failing all the above, how about making armour repair into an active module that can't be spammed?
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 7425	Posted - 2014.03.16 14:18:00 - [22] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: Armour vehicles should be balanced around high hp while Shield vehicles balance around being able to recharge... Currently this fails since Armour vehicles have higher hp and more recharge. Nerf the repair or remove it completely, if you have teamwork someone probably has a rep tool, if you need to repair your vehicle then go to one of them or a supply depo... Would make the game more fun with less vehicles just moving round a corner for a few seconds to pop back out with full hp. Need to at least stop armour rep stacking... I have a Grimsnes that can also sit and stare at a swarm launcher this also only needs to dodge a shot or two against forge guns to fully repair while they reload. Another option is to make armour repair stall for 3 seconds when it takes damage, causing it to only be used between fights or having to evade attacks to benefit. Failing all the above, how about making armour repair into an active module that can't be spammed? The difference in HP is not enough to warrant both a slower recharge AND poor manevourability. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. DUST514514
Charlotte O'Dell Sooper Speshul Ponee Fors 2161	Posted - 2014.03.16 14:22:00 - [23] - Quote did you try using a sica (new ishukone assault forge)? Charlotte O'Dell is the highest level unicorn!
Sir Dukey KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 376	Posted - 2014.03.16 14:49:00 - [24] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Foundation Seldon wrote: Atiim wrote: Looks like I'm in before the tankers. Anyways, I think making it to where you could only equip 1 repper would be the better idea. If the Complex could only push 100HP/s, then what would the Enhanced and Basic ones do? 80HP/s? 60HP/s? That wouldn't even suffice for a MLT LAV. Shield tanks are even better when fitted properly. Have you seen some of their fits? it's like a Madrugar on steroids. (Guess that's why they get the high slot lol). Why would it be a problem to model Vehicle repair modules like Dropsuit repair modules? Don't put an arbitrary distinction on the number of modules of a certain type you can fit to a vehicle but change it so that their repair amounts are far less than what they're repping currently. Shield Tanks should rely on their regen to counteract their low base health amounts Armor Tanks should rely on their large health pool to counteract much lower repair rates. Even with a single module I'd argue that the repair amounts for vehicle reps that stay on constantly are far too high currently, a basic heavy vehicle repair is the equivalent of a dropsuit running around with a 10hp/s base armor repair amount off of a single module, and it gets worse as you skill into it further. It doesn't really apply to vehicles. In CCP's design, armor vehicles are designed to stay and fight, which is why they have poor turning speed and acceleration. To stand and fight you need to regenerate your HP, or have a large enough HP pool to last for a good while. The HP pool isn't that big when you consider it's the difference between 4 shots from a swarm launcher and 5 shots from a swarm launcher. Armor tanks vs. shield tanks repair/recharge rate is equivalent to Gallante suit repping 30 hp/s with one complex armor repair and when you add in the hardner the a tank would normally have, its equivalent to a gallante suit repping 42 armor/s with no delay and 2x the hp as a shield suit recharging like 25-30 shield with a 4 sec delay.
Sir Dukey KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 376	Posted - 2014.03.16 14:51:00 - [25] - Quote Charlotte O'Dell wrote: did you try using a sica (new ishukone assault forge)? yes but still, If the armor tank had a railgun, I would have lost.
Derpty Derp It's All Gone Derp 132	Posted - 2014.03.16 16:46:00 - [26] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Derpty Derp wrote: Armour vehicles should be balanced around high hp while Shield vehicles balance around being able to recharge... Currently this fails since Armour vehicles have higher hp and more recharge. Nerf the repair or remove it completely, if you have teamwork someone probably has a rep tool, if you need to repair your vehicle then go to one of them or a supply depo... Would make the game more fun with less vehicles just moving round a corner for a few seconds to pop back out with full hp. Need to at least stop armour rep stacking... I have a Grimsnes that can also sit and stare at a swarm launcher this also only needs to dodge a shot or two against forge guns to fully repair while they reload. Another option is to make armour repair stall for 3 seconds when it takes damage, causing it to only be used between fights or having to evade attacks to benefit. Failing all the above, how about making armour repair into an active module that can't be spammed? The difference in HP is not enough to warrant both a slower recharge AND poor manevourability. The slow turn speed/acceleration is down to having a higher top speed... Also I have no problem with the armour tanks handling they move around the battlefield perfectly fine... My tank for choice currently has no repair, just a hardener and a CPU upgrade + double damage mods (Because the only use of this tank, is to remove other annoying tanks, most of which are in the redzone and need to die before they can hit reverse) & it can take more of a beating than any Sica can dish out before going boom!


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