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The Battle of Vak'Atioth

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Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 1831	Posted - 2014.02.26 12:05:00 - [1] - Quote I've been seeing this battle used as evidence as to why the Amarr are somehow 'inferior'. The battle was a catastrophic loss for the Amarr. There is no denying that. No Amarr survived the battle for long; those that escaped were executed for failure. However, that the Amarr lost any significant proportion of their military might is entirely incorrect. The Amarr are possessed of the largest military in New Eden, and, as True Adamance likes to point out, it's never utilised more than 25% of its total power in a single engagement [citation needed] Quote: The Amarr Navy has almost twice as many ships as the next two empire navies put together Amarr Navy There's quite a bit of backstory, but essentially the Amarr, being the expansionistic persons that they are, were looking for a new source of 'indentured servants' (in quotes because everyone else will call them slaves) The Amarr sent a single squadron to attack the Jove, greatly underestimating the Jove's information-gathering network (and also the work of a filthy traitor) Quote: The Imperial Navy sent a single squadron, numbering roughly 200 ships, to open the war. - The Battle of Vak'Atioth ...Two hundred golden, gleaming hulls, gathered on the fringes of the VakGÇÖAtioth system. ...such a small force. - The Battle of Vak'Atioth (Chronicle) A small force, though nonetheless one that apparently required the use of what is considered by some the first Titan, (though the Jovian Mothership is a refitted vessel originally designed for a completely different purpose, many consider the Amarr's Imud Habrau the first true Titan) which would presumably have been a large proportion of the power of the fleets of the Jove. Had the Minmatar Rebellion not occured during the battle, it is almost a certainty that the Jove would not for long have escaped the collars of the Amarr, particularly considering the humiliation of the utter destruction visited on the Amarr squadron. Quote: The Empire was shocked by the complete loss to the Jove. It quickly regrouped and planned a second assault, using different tactics that would be capable of countering the Jove frigates... The Empire quickly turned its eyes on the Minmatar and entered into a hasty peace treaty with the Jove. The Amarr were unsuccessful in containing the Minmatar Rebellion, in part because of the morale blow suffered by the loss to the Jove. - Battle of Vak'Atioth TL;DR The Battle of Vak'Atioth is insignificant in the number of Amarr vessels lost, relative to the size and power of the Amarr Navy. Its significance is more that it was that the focus on the Jove meant that the Minmatar could successfully rebel and that the Jove have a significant intelligence-gathering arm. Two hundred years on, the Amarr military has a counter to the Motherships, where plausibly the Jove have not increased. Also, I found this while writing. Amarr Victor! Forge on for great justice! Defend the meek! Destroy the weak! Q-sync breaches into the rectum of everyone else!
Tech De Ra Electronic Sports League 338	Posted - 2014.02.26 12:23:00 - [2] - Quote In a later fight, the rebellion built 3 titans, using one of them to assault one of the throne worlds. Empress Jamyl Sarum was like "these slaves are hilarious", told a disciple to go to the eve gate because she predicted a terran weapon would be around there that the jove haven't cloaked or stolen. She was correct, the disciple brought the weapon back so Jamyl decided to put it to good use She ducktaped the weapon to her ship, warped to zero on the titans (because why not, she's like the steven seagal of space), told the rebels that she wanted to clear the sky so that the annual deadmau5 concert could take place in peace. The rebels were like "lol daumau5 is really bad", so Jamyl was all "u wot m8" and then in a single shot instantly killed the titan along with most of the rebel fleet **** yes, Jamyl Sarum PS: The amarr also invented slavery, child prostitution, dust mercs, and the element gold Tech De Ra for CPM1
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 2718	Posted - 2014.02.26 12:29:00 - [3] - Quote All talk Amarr lost Jove won Intelligence is OP
Akdhar Saif Intaki Liberation Front Intaki Prosperity Initiative 340	Posted - 2014.02.26 12:36:00 - [4] - Quote The Amarrian loss was a catalyst for the Minmatar Rebellion.
Aisha Ctarl Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3575	Posted - 2014.02.26 12:38:00 - [5] - Quote Not really seeing how this makes the Amarr inferior. Everyone is inferior to the Jove, period. Amarr is superior to the other three races, period. Yes we lost to the Jove, but we had mandates stating it was illegal to flee battle because we have faith we will always win whatever battle we engage in. We were actually doing well until the Jove began moving, once they began to move, our fleet became confused and couldn't track their fast moving ships. When it comes to the Minmatar rebellion, they attacked while we were weakened. In short it's like attacking the schoolyard bully when he's already been kicked in the nads and has had dirt kicked in his face...you'd have to suck complete ass not to beat him. I could list the ways how we Amarr are better than you, but your lesser mind wouldn't comprehend it.

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 5163	Posted - 2014.02.26 12:38:00 - [6] - Quote A fight between the Amarr and the Who? (Also moved to DUST 514 Fiction) CCP Logibro // EVE Universe Community Team // Distributor of Nanites // Patron Saint of Logistics

Ansiiis The Trustworthy Mocking Bird Inc. 712	Posted - 2014.02.26 12:40:00 - [7] - Quote I don't want to invade this post with Caldari culture but... Anyone selling cheap guns? Corporate sponsor of those in need. Master of Coin.
Heathen Bastard The Bastard Brigade 1024	Posted - 2014.02.26 13:25:00 - [8] - Quote Jeesh. Ya got your asses kicked by the jove because you morons decided to attack them. stop trying to spin it like you won anything, they could have annihilated your entire empire if they felt like it. they probably felt it was funny that ants were trying to fight the sun so they let you continue to exist. the mothership was not "required" it was a show of force, to teach you not to bite the hand that feeds you. It was a swift, emotionless backhand to teach a child that being stupid hurts, which you apparently learned nothing from. and yes, you have vast armies that have never seen combat and will break lines at the first bullet and you've possibly developed a counter against retrofitted medical ships, good for you? You seem to forget that their frigates were eating your battleships alive even before the mothership showed up. If you hear the words "WORTH IT!" look about, something hilarious just happened.
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 2280	Posted - 2014.02.26 13:29:00 - [9] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Two hundred years on, the Amarr military has a counter to the Motherships, where plausibly the Jove have not increased. That's a hell of an assumption. Dedicated sidearm scout - Watch out for that headshot Scout community is the nuts
steadyhand amarr TeamPlayers Negative-Feedback 2379	Posted - 2014.02.26 14:12:00 - [10] - Quote Django Quik wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Two hundred years on, the Amarr military has a counter to the Motherships, where plausibly the Jove have not increased. That's a hell of an assumption. The amarr nation lives on... The jove in there heathen nature has apprenty vanished noone has heard anything from them in years its highly likely their no longer important players. "i dont care about you or your goals, just show me the dam isk" winner of EU squad cup GOGO power rangers

True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 7639	Posted - 2014.02.27 00:42:00 - [11] - Quote I need to find the quote, but anyone with access to Templar One should be able to find and instance of Mordu speaking about the Amarr Navy and its military strength, and battle history. Cited from EVElopedia "It was the meeting with the Jove, however, that shattered the Navy's illusion of invulnerability. The Amarr Navy utilized a single squadron to attack the Jove at the Battle of VakGÇÖAtioth. The squadron was only a fraction of the NavyGÇÖs full force, comprising a diverse mix of cruisers and battleships. " No titan was deployed, no capital class vessels, and a mere squadron of some 200 Ships between Cruisers, standard small vessel, and Battleship class. This most certainly does not reflect the Imperial Navy. "Just know that though our enemies may only #YOLO, through God's grace we can #YOLF at his side." - Disciple of Kesha
Sergamon Draco Rautaleijona Top Men. 324	Posted - 2014.02.28 16:57:00 - [12] - Quote Ammarrians have lost to jove,gallentes,minmatars,one question when they have won anything without terran super weapon? Fck the kdr,i`m going in
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 7764	Posted - 2014.02.28 20:39:00 - [13] - Quote Sergamon Draco wrote: Ammarrians have lost to jove,gallentes,minmatars,one question when they have won anything without terran super weapon? They have never truly lost to the Gallente, wisely the Empress chose not to plunge the Empire into a war across the cluster against the Gallente. Simply put I don't really think you should claim that having a force 4x the size of that of an Heir Fleet, and having to deploy an Erebus was necessarily that respectable. Especially considering the personal fleet of one single Heir is not representative of the Imperial Navy.....and considering our fleet is the largest in the cluster....there isn't a way for the Gallente to outnumber us. "War is not hell, far from it. War is beautiful. War is divine." - Grand Admiral Mekioth Sarum
Hawk-eye Occultus Omega Elite Mercs INC. 57	Posted - 2014.02.28 21:15:00 - [14] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Sergamon Draco wrote: Ammarrians have lost to jove,gallentes,minmatars,one question when they have won anything without terran super weapon? They have never truly lost to the Gallente, wisely the Empress chose not to plunge the Empire into a war across the cluster against the Gallente. Simply put I don't really think you should claim that having a force 4x the size of that of an Heir Fleet, and having to deploy an Erebus was necessarily that respectable. Especially considering the personal fleet of one single Heir is not representative of the Imperial Navy.....and considering our fleet is the largest in the cluster....there isn't a way for the Gallente to outnumber us. Barring, of course; a massive shipbuilding drive due to either a massive boom in the Gallente manufacturing industry, resulting in huge drives in shipbuilding and research, the likes of which have never been seen. Or some ambitious warmongering president being elected (or a combination of the two). Unfortunately, the former...... Never happens. And the latter doesn't happen as often as one would think. Intelligence without ambition; is a bird without wings...
Jacques Cayton II Providence Guard Templis CALSF 630	Posted - 2014.03.04 05:05:00 - [15] - Quote Tech De Ra wrote: In a later fight, the rebellion built 3 titans, using one of them to assault one of the throne worlds. Empress Jamyl Sarum was like "these slaves are hilarious", told a disciple to go to the eve gate because she predicted a terran weapon would be around there that the jove haven't cloaked or stolen. She was correct, the disciple brought the weapon back so Jamyl decided to put it to good use She ducktaped the weapon to her ship, warped to zero on the titans (because why not, she's like the steven seagal of space), told the rebels that she wanted to clear the sky so that the annual deadmau5 concert could take place in peace. The rebels were like "lol daumau5 is really bad", so Jamyl was all "u wot m8" and then in a single shot instantly killed the titan along with most of the rebel fleet **** yes, Jamyl Sarum PS: The amarr also invented slavery, child prostitution, dust mercs, and the element gold Technically a Caldari scientist along with a Caldari prisoner made the first dust merc.... using sleeper tech. Just saying. We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals
Jacques Cayton II Providence Guard Templis CALSF 630	Posted - 2014.03.04 05:12:00 - [16] - Quote Hawk-eye Occultus wrote: True Adamance wrote: Sergamon Draco wrote: Ammarrians have lost to jove,gallentes,minmatars,one question when they have won anything without terran super weapon? They have never truly lost to the Gallente, wisely the Empress chose not to plunge the Empire into a war across the cluster against the Gallente. Simply put I don't really think you should claim that having a force 4x the size of that of an Heir Fleet, and having to deploy an Erebus was necessarily that respectable. Especially considering the personal fleet of one single Heir is not representative of the Imperial Navy.....and considering our fleet is the largest in the cluster....there isn't a way for the Gallente to outnumber us. Barring, of course; a massive shipbuilding drive due to either a massive boom in the Gallente manufacturing industry, resulting in huge drives in shipbuilding and research, the likes of which have never been seen. Or some ambitious warmongering president being elected (or a combination of the two). Unfortunately, the former...... Never happens. And the latter doesn't happen as often as one would think. No one ever counts the state I mean the entirety of the state can be mobilized around 96 hours. That's a big military that can come knocking on your door. Look at when tibus heth took Caldari Prime. He basically got together the small navy at the time and drafted several others including construction of countless ships for a hasty invasion. I'm not saying it's on par with the amarr's size but the gallente wouldn't be able to combat a true war time State. We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals
Jacques Cayton II Providence Guard Templis CALSF 630	Posted - 2014.03.04 05:14:00 - [17] - Quote Ansiiis The Trustworthy wrote: I don't want to invade this post with Caldari culture but... Anyone selling cheap guns? You are mistaken we don't buy cheap guns we buy what works for its cheap price. We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals
Hawk-eye Occultus Omega Elite Mercs INC. 60	Posted - 2014.03.04 07:44:00 - [18] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: Ansiiis The Trustworthy wrote: I don't want to invade this post with Caldari culture but... Anyone selling cheap guns? You are mistaken we don't buy cheap guns we buy what works for its cheap price. I thought that's what the Matari did... CONTRACTS: ' Remember, whenever we need muscle; we simply farm it out to our favourite band of shady missionaries...
Jacques Cayton II Providence Guard Templis CALSF 630	Posted - 2014.03.04 07:53:00 - [19] - Quote No matari pick up amarr weaponry and equipment once their weapons which don't work but are cheap break We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals
Hawk-eye Occultus Omega Elite Mercs INC. 60	Posted - 2014.03.04 08:05:00 - [20] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: No matari pick up amarr weaponry and equipment once their weapons which don't work but are cheap break I'll have you know, from much experience with the HMG, a notable Matari weapon, that they are actually very durable. And unlike Amarrian weaponry, it doesn't try to kill you when it gets too hot. CONTRACTS: ' Remember, whenever we need muscle; we simply farm it out to our favourite band of shady missionaries...

Sergamon Draco Rautaleijona Top Men. 333	Posted - 2014.03.04 09:02:00 - [21] - Quote And the latter doesn't happen as often as one would think. [/quote] No one ever counts the state I mean the entirety of the state can be mobilized around 96 hours. That's a big military that can come knocking on your door. Look at when tibus heth took Caldari Prime. He basically got together the small navy at the time and drafted several others including construction of countless ships for a hasty invasion. I'm not saying it's on par with the amarr's size but the gallente wouldn't be able to combat a true war time State.[/quote] ok but you should also remeber,tibus heth moved all your forces in that offensive and left doors open in caldari systems.If our side had attacked and answered caldarians rising acts of aggression,caldaris would have lose more than gallente side.But decicion was to spare those numerous gallente lifes in luminaire/caldari prime. Fck the kdr,i`m going in
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 7862	Posted - 2014.03.04 10:18:00 - [22] - Quote Sergamon Draco wrote: And the latter doesn't happen as often as one would think. No one ever counts the state I mean the entirety of the state can be mobilized around 96 hours. That's a big military that can come knocking on your door. Look at when tibus heth took Caldari Prime. He basically got together the small navy at the time and drafted several others including construction of countless ships for a hasty invasion. I'm not saying it's on par with the amarr's size but the gallente wouldn't be able to combat a true war time State.[/quote] ok but you should also remeber,tibus heth moved all your forces in that offensive and left doors open in caldari systems.If our side had attacked and answered caldarians rising acts of aggression,caldaris would have lose more than gallente side.But decicion was to spare those numerous gallente lifes in luminaire/caldari prime.[/quote] Again you under estimate the logistical nightmares of or trying to control a people dedicated to their ways, each on with military training..... the entire Federation would be rife with insurgency. "War is not hell, far from it. War is beautiful. War is divine." - Grand Admiral Mekioth Sarum
jaksol returns highland marines IMMORTAL REGIME 10	Posted - 2014.03.06 05:13:00 - [23] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: Not really seeing how this makes the Amarr inferior. Everyone is inferior to the Jove, period. Amarr is superior to the other three races, period. Yes we lost to the Jove, but we had mandates stating it was illegal to flee battle because we have faith we will always win whatever battle we engage in. We were actually doing well until the Jove began moving, once they began to move, our fleet became confused and couldn't track their fast moving ships. When it comes to the Minmatar rebellion, they attacked while we were weakened. In short it's like attacking the schoolyard bully when he's already been kicked in the nads and has had dirt kicked in his face...you'd have to suck complete ass not to beat him. lies the ammar are not superior to all others no one is superior otherwise there wud only be 1 empire. Sacrifice is a choice you make, Loss is a choice made for you .
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 7917	Posted - 2014.03.06 06:31:00 - [24] - Quote jaksol returns wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Not really seeing how this makes the Amarr inferior. Everyone is inferior to the Jove, period. Amarr is superior to the other three races, period. Yes we lost to the Jove, but we had mandates stating it was illegal to flee battle because we have faith we will always win whatever battle we engage in. We were actually doing well until the Jove began moving, once they began to move, our fleet became confused and couldn't track their fast moving ships. When it comes to the Minmatar rebellion, they attacked while we were weakened. In short it's like attacking the schoolyard bully when he's already been kicked in the nads and has had dirt kicked in his face...you'd have to suck complete ass not to beat him. lies the ammar are not superior to all others no one is superior otherwise there wud only be 1 empire. Hate to break it to you bud but in Templar One Mordu canonically confirms the Amarr have a mighty Naval force which is not only holding off 3 other Empires but at the same time winning the battles. We mainly do not see true War amongst the Empires because it would not favourably benefit one Empire or another, and there is too much uncertainty to risk by instigating war. "War is not hell, far from it. War is beautiful. War is divine." - Grand Admiral Mekioth Sarum
Templar Twelve Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 41	Posted - 2014.03.07 08:58:00 - [25] - Quote Sergamon Draco wrote: Ammarrians have lost to jove,gallentes,minmatars,one question when they have won anything without terran super weapon? "The Lord loosed upon them his fierce anger All of his fury and rage. He dispatched against them a band of Avenging Angels" - The Scriptures, Book II, Apocalypse 10:1 Some week after the petty Minmatar rebellion, the Amarr Navy crushed their resistance, just as we are continuing doing to this day: Battle of Golgothan Fields - Holoreel Data History repeats itself. Librarian and Keeper of the Praetorian Temple Library
Jacques Cayton II Providence Guard Templis CALSF 643	Posted - 2014.03.07 15:05:00 - [26] - Quote Sergamon Draco wrote: And the latter doesn't happen as often as one would think. No one ever counts the state I mean the entirety of the state can be mobilized around 96 hours. That's a big military that can come knocking on your door. Look at when tibus heth took Caldari Prime. He basically got together the small navy at the time and drafted several others including construction of countless ships for a hasty invasion. I'm not saying it's on par with the amarr's size but the gallente wouldn't be able to combat a true war time State.[/quote. ok but you should also remeber,tibus heth moved all your forces in that offensive and left doors open in caldari systems.If our side had attacked and answered caldarians rising acts of aggression,caldaris would have lose more than gallente side.But decicion was to spare those numerous gallente lifes in luminaire/caldari prime.[/quote] OK first off if you attacked Caldari systems you would have lost your homeworld. Secondly if you tried to take back luminaire you would have lost more than half of your fleet due to gate camping. Tibus heth only activated a small portion of the state at that time. He left the systems navy less but we had more land military waiting for a possible invasion. You wouldn't have gotten any systems without losing great amounts of life. The Caldari defenses aren't all navy sir and it would take a very large fleet to take one sytem. Which the Caldari had 1 planet away from luminaire which at the time had only a small number of ships in between the to. All we wanted was are homeland back and to prove that the state is still here and proud. We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals
Jacques Cayton II Providence Guard Templis CALSF 643	Posted - 2014.03.07 15:09:00 - [27] - Quote Hawk-eye Occultus wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: No matari pick up amarr weaponry and equipment once their weapons which don't work but are cheap break I'll have you know, from much experience with the HMG, a notable Matari weapon, that they are actually very durable. And unlike Amarrian weaponry, it doesn't try to kill you when it gets too hot. That weapon is top notch weapons. Try using mortal matari weaponry doesn't last long We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals
Volitian Elozan DUST University Ivy League 0	Posted - 2014.03.24 00:54:00 - [28] - Quote I'd like to point out something. The Amarrians have the largest OFFICIAL navy in New Eden but the Caldari actually have a comparable sized total fleet. This is because each of the 8 major Caldari corporations maintain their own private army and fleet. Considering that these forces are not counted as official components of the Caldari Navy and Army it would be unreasonable to say that the Amarr have the largest fleet "by far" as there are plenty of non-commissioned Caldari Military vessels.
Hawk-eye Occultus Omega Elite Mercs INC. 84	Posted - 2014.03.24 01:12:00 - [29] - Quote Volitian Elozan wrote: I'd like to point out something. The Amarrians have the largest OFFICIAL navy in New Eden but the Caldari actually have a comparable sized total fleet. This is because each of the 8 major Caldari corporations maintain their own private army and fleet. Considering that these forces are not counted as official components of the Caldari Navy and Army it would be unreasonable to say that the Amarr have the largest fleet "by far" as there are plenty of non-commissioned Caldari Military vessels. This is a picture of *SOME* of the Amarrian fleet. Like, a tiny fraction that came for the coronation of the current Empress. Not all the ships present are visible. And during this, there were *YET MORE* ships elsewhere all over the empire and whatnot. Trust me, they have the biggest fleet. (for reference, the big ships that look like clubs are Avatar class Titans, each about 15km long, the size of a small mountain range) CONTRACTS: ' Remember, whenever we need muscle; we simply farm it out to our favourite band of shady missionaries...
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8702	Posted - 2014.03.24 01:19:00 - [30] - Quote Volitian Elozan wrote: I'd like to point out something. The Amarrians have the largest OFFICIAL navy in New Eden but the Caldari actually have a comparable sized total fleet. This is because each of the 8 major Caldari corporations maintain their own private army and fleet. Considering that these forces are not counted as official components of the Caldari Navy and Army it would be unreasonable to say that the Amarr have the largest fleet "by far" as there are plenty of non-commissioned Caldari Military vessels. I also wish to point out the Heir Houses also maintain their own fleet independant of the Imperial Navy..... think about that...... "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two

Hawk-eye Occultus Omega Elite Mercs INC. 84	Posted - 2014.03.24 01:23:00 - [31] - Quote Plus, If you include the fleets of the Ammatar Mandate and the Khanid Kingdom (both of which have strong relations to the empire), then the figures get even more inflated. CONTRACTS: ' Remember, whenever we need muscle; we simply farm it out to our favourite band of shady missionaries...
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8704	Posted - 2014.03.24 01:30:00 - [32] - Quote Hawk-eye Occultus wrote: Plus, If you include the fleets of the Ammatar Mandate and the Khanid Kingdom (both of which have strong relations to the empire), then the figures get even more inflated. The Khanid and Anmatar are considered pseudo independent.....sort of..... though I believe Yonis Ardishapur currently is in charge of maintaining the Mandate as a result of the Empress trying to put him in an untenable position......however this doesn't infer that he has direct authority over them....I believe only the Empress does. The Caldari actually have the smallest Navy in New Eden, though possibly one of the largest militaries since its people are able to be pressed into service due to expected military educations. It was said on EVElopedia that Tibus Heth emptied the reserved in YC 110 when he mounted and invasion force of Caldari Prime with some 20 Million military personnel. Still I am more inclined to believe the Amarr have the largest standing Navies and Militaries.... the Empire has a population of some 15 Trillion citizens. "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two
Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 2289	Posted - 2014.03.24 03:15:00 - [33] - Quote why is this still going i was just yelling at people in GD!!! ak.0 4 LYFE Large Missile Turrets: the real unicorns of DUST.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8731	Posted - 2014.03.24 03:25:00 - [34] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: why is this still going i was just yelling at people in GD!!! Also I'm pretty sure this is meticulously researched and all my claims are verifiable. i.e. if you happen to be arguing that the Jove's victory was significant in the scale of the loss, you better have some evidence, 'brochacho' (or whatever that thing is) New info from Dagger Two also indicated that the Amarr inflicted casualties across the Jovian fleet reducing their strength by 1/3 which considering their level of technology, the small fleet size, and much speculated upon Jovian assets...... I certainly would not consider an utter defeat. "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two
Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 2289	Posted - 2014.03.24 03:27:00 - [35] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: why is this still going i was just yelling at people in GD!!! Also I'm pretty sure this is meticulously researched and all my claims are verifiable. i.e. if you happen to be arguing that the Jove's victory was significant in the scale of the loss, you better have some evidence, 'brochacho' (or whatever that thing is) New info from Dagger Two also indicated that the Amarr inflicted casualties across the Jovian fleet reducing their strength by 1/3 which considering their level of technology, the small fleet size, and much speculated upon Jovian assets...... I certainly would not consider an utter defeat. reread OP pl0x I said that already. ~~Meticulous amirite~~ EDIT: How embarrassing. Apparently I forgot to add that :( ak.0 4 LYFE Large Missile Turrets: the real unicorns of DUST.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8732	Posted - 2014.03.24 03:37:00 - [36] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: True Adamance wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: why is this still going i was just yelling at people in GD!!! Also I'm pretty sure this is meticulously researched and all my claims are verifiable. i.e. if you happen to be arguing that the Jove's victory was significant in the scale of the loss, you better have some evidence, 'brochacho' (or whatever that thing is) New info from Dagger Two also indicated that the Amarr inflicted casualties across the Jovian fleet reducing their strength by 1/3 which considering their level of technology, the small fleet size, and much speculated upon Jovian assets...... I certainly would not consider an utter defeat. reread OP pl0x I said that already. ~~Meticulous amirite~~ EDIT: How embarrassing. Apparently I forgot to add that :( Good lord Lorhak get yo **** together. "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 232	Posted - 2014.04.12 16:59:00 - [37] - Quote Yes we haven't ever went full power, we aren't so bad as people would say, we had or still have a giant death machine that uses giant blue star elements as ammo, we are just as if not more diverse then the Gallente, helped with The Nation, pulled everyone out of the dark times & so much more. If you recall The Elder Fleet was very wrong in what they did to the Amarr but they were punished for they're wrong doing. As for The Jove they knew the entire plan in advance so had a trap made for the Amarr appearance but they are weakening but we are nice so we're leaving them be. We also decided not to attack the Caldari & Gallente upon 1st contact because we were friendly but the Gallente & Caldari both stopped fighting for oncce upon 1st meeting the Amarr as both sides saw the Amarr as a bigger threat. Not to mention we kinda made immortal Mercs & we have very advanced tech. So... ya....
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 232	Posted - 2014.04.12 17:13:00 - [38] - Quote Heathen Bastard wrote: Jeesh. Ya got your asses kicked by the jove because you morons decided to attack them. stop trying to spin it like you won anything, they could have annihilated your entire empire if they felt like it. they probably felt it was funny that ants were trying to fight the sun so they let you continue to exist. the mothership was not "required" it was a show of force, to teach you not to bite the hand that feeds you. It was a swift, emotionless backhand to teach a child that being stupid hurts, which you apparently learned nothing from. and yes, you have vast armies that have never seen combat and will break lines at the first bullet and you've possibly developed a counter against retrofitted medical ships, good for you? You seem to forget that their frigates were eating your battleships alive even before the mothership showed up. The Jove actually just knew about it in advance as they hacked into Amarr systems & found out in advance so they set a trap. You say The Jove could've destroyed The Amarr - wrong did you ever consider they just made it seem like they were all powerful with a show of force to prevent entering a full scale war becuase if they did in they're weakening state it be very bad? The Jove just want left alone as much as possible & they know if they're tech was overly released to 1 or all 4 empires it be a gallatic disaster. If we the Amarr, were dead set on beating the Jove at the time. We set all our ecomony on it, ask maybe the caldari for help, maybe pay the pirates some for aid, set 100% military might on them, sent the death machince, use all our diverse cultures & people we had, including all our servants, plus Mercs & capsuleers. The second we got 20% or less serious The Elder Fleet got utterly destroyed & put on the run in a matter of minutes if you recall. No we were just more testing the waters, but we decided to be friendly after testing the waters for serveral reasons.
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 8752	Posted - 2014.04.21 23:52:00 - [39] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: Hawk-eye Occultus wrote: True Adamance wrote: Sergamon Draco wrote: Ammarrians have lost to jove,gallentes,minmatars,one question when they have won anything without terran super weapon? They have never truly lost to the Gallente, wisely the Empress chose not to plunge the Empire into a war across the cluster against the Gallente. Simply put I don't really think you should claim that having a force 4x the size of that of an Heir Fleet, and having to deploy an Erebus was necessarily that respectable. Especially considering the personal fleet of one single Heir is not representative of the Imperial Navy.....and considering our fleet is the largest in the cluster....there isn't a way for the Gallente to outnumber us. Barring, of course; a massive shipbuilding drive due to either a massive boom in the Gallente manufacturing industry, resulting in huge drives in shipbuilding and research, the likes of which have never been seen. Or some ambitious warmongering president being elected (or a combination of the two). Unfortunately, the former...... Never happens. And the latter doesn't happen as often as one would think. No one ever counts the state I mean the entirety of the state can be mobilized around 96 hours. That's a big military that can come knocking on your door. Look at when tibus heth took Caldari Prime. He basically got together the small navy at the time and drafted several others including construction of countless ships for a hasty invasion. I'm not saying it's on par with the amarr's size but the gallente wouldn't be able to combat a true war time State. Gallente is basically a sleeping giant. Caldari can mobilize their military quickly, but unless they crush the Gallente within the first week or so of combat, they will feel the pain once the Gallente are fully mobilized. This giant and powerful economy can be directed in many ways. Overlord of all humans CAT MERC
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 8752	Posted - 2014.04.21 23:55:00 - [40] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: Sergamon Draco wrote: And the latter doesn't happen as often as one would think. No one ever counts the state I mean the entirety of the state can be mobilized around 96 hours. That's a big military that can come knocking on your door. Look at when tibus heth took Caldari Prime. He basically got together the small navy at the time and drafted several others including construction of countless ships for a hasty invasion. I'm not saying it's on par with the amarr's size but the gallente wouldn't be able to combat a true war time State.[/quote. ok but you should also remeber,tibus heth moved all your forces in that offensive and left doors open in caldari systems.If our side had attacked and answered caldarians rising acts of aggression,caldaris would have lose more than gallente side.But decicion was to spare those numerous gallente lifes in luminaire/caldari prime. OK first off if you attacked Caldari systems you would have lost your homeworld. Secondly if you tried to take back luminaire you would have lost more than half of your fleet due to gate camping. Tibus heth only activated a small portion of the state at that time. He left the systems navy less but we had more land military waiting for a possible invasion. You wouldn't have gotten any systems without losing great amounts of life. The Caldari defenses aren't all navy sir and it would take a very large fleet to take one sytem. Which the Caldari had 1 planet away from luminaire which at the time had only a small number of ships in between the to. All we wanted was are homeland back and to prove that the state is still here and proud.[/quote] Actually, re reading the book, it says it pretty clearly. Tibus was taking a HUGE gamble, what you saw there was the entire military might of the Caldari inside of Luminaire. Gallente could have razed every single planet the Caldari have, at the cost of their homeworld. I know which side would lose more. Overlord of all humans CAT MERC

Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 8752	Posted - 2014.04.21 23:58:00 - [41] - Quote From the sounds of it, the Jovians had at most 30 ships in the batltle + that mothership. 10 ships for 200 doesn't sound too bad, considering the first one was a cheap shot at a frigate that's standing still lol Overlord of all humans CAT MERC
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 8752	Posted - 2014.04.22 00:05:00 - [42] - Quote As far as Jovians... Look at CONCORD. Those ships pack a punch, the frigates instantly warp in and lock you down with heavy fire, and if you survive for long enough, they bring in a battlecruiser who's cannon can... insta kill a titan. That's right, a single shot to destroy a titan, from a battlecruiser. And where did CONCORD get that technology? The Jovians are insanely advanced compared to us, for f*cks sake they figted us pod technology, cloaking technology, and much more that I don't remember. If they can give gifts like that, they probably have much better technology reserved for themselves. Overlord of all humans CAT MERC
Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 2864	Posted - 2014.04.22 01:24:00 - [43] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: From the sounds of it, the Jovians had at most 30 ships in the batltle + that mothership. 10 ships for 200 doesn't sound too bad, considering the first one was a cheap shot at a frigate that's standing still lol Eighty :) ak.0 4 LYFE I am the Lorhak. I speak for the trees.
Denak Kalamari Intaki Liberation Front Intaki Prosperity Initiative 1557	Posted - 2014.04.22 03:46:00 - [44] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Look at CONCORD. Those ships pack a punch, the frigates instantly warp in and lock you down with heavy fire, and if you survive for long enough, they bring in a battlecruiser who's cannon can... insta kill a titan. That's right, a single shot to destroy a titan, from a battlecruiser. Where did you get that from? Battlecruisers, even CONCORD, ones don't one-shot anything beyond a frigate or maybe a weak destoyer, just look at any CONCORDOKKEN video and see how long it takes for them to kill people. Cruisers last a few seconds, battlecruisers five and maybe the most tanked up battleships can last 10 or 20 seconds. Titans don't even count here, since you can't bring a Titan into CONCORD territory. They don't really have as much firepower as they have powerful EWAR that makes your ship completely helpless to do anything while they rip your ship apart, they are at their weakest point here. In most cases, these ships would have hardeners, they'd be moving, they'd have reps or boosters to repair damage and maybe even have a friend remote repairing them, not to mention being able to actually shoot back and use EWAR on them, all of these increasing the ship's survivability significantly. With all these options out becuse you were neuted to hell, all ships are quite weak. Even if they had a Battlecruiser that could instakill a titan, it didn't help much when a Thukker fleet assaulted Yulai, the CONCORD HQ and arguably the most heavily defended place in the cluster, destroyed them and crippled their rapid-response units. Then right at the start of the Battle for Caldari Prime, the Shiigeru titan used it's doomsday on a CONCORD battleship, killing it instantly. It is also a false impression to say CONCORD ships are based on Jovian tech only, when in reality they're just a mix of all the empire's technology. CONCORD was originally formed by the fove empires to keep peace, and they've been given exclusive access to tech not available to capsuleers yet(but this tech is not exclusively Jovian based) which gave them their power against individual targets, but not so much against fleets. Thukker won against them. Heck, even a group of capsuleers managed to kill a CONCORD battlecruiser once. In reality, the only reason CONCORD still exists is because it benefits all the empires. As for the original topic, my side is leaning towards Amarr, but I'm too tired to explain my point after that. Grahisha of ILF // Writer of Thoughts of a Clone Soldier // Latest entry published Apr. 1st
Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 2872	Posted - 2014.04.22 04:07:00 - [45] - Quote Denak Kalamari wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Look at CONCORD. Those ships pack a punch, the frigates instantly warp in and lock you down with heavy fire, and if you survive for long enough, they bring in a battlecruiser who's cannon can... insta kill a titan. That's right, a single shot to destroy a titan, from a battlecruiser. Where did you get that from? Battlecruisers, even CONCORD, ones don't one-shot anything beyond a frigate or maybe a weak destoyer, just look at any CONCORDOKKEN video and see how long it takes for them to kill people. Cruisers last a few seconds, battlecruisers five and maybe the most tanked up battleships can last 10 or 20 seconds. Titans don't even count here, since you can't bring a Titan into CONCORD territory. They don't really have as much firepower as they have powerful EWAR that makes your ship completely helpless to do anything while they rip your ship apart, they are at their weakest point here. In most cases, these ships would have hardeners, they'd be moving, they'd have reps or boosters to repair damage and maybe even have a friend remote repairing them, not to mention being able to actually shoot back and use EWAR on them, all of these increasing the ship's survivability significantly. With all these options out becuse you were neuted to hell, all ships are quite weak. Even if they had a Battlecruiser that could instakill a titan, it didn't help much when a Thukker fleet assaulted Yulai, the CONCORD HQ and arguably the most heavily defended place in the cluster, destroyed them and crippled their rapid-response units. Then right at the start of the Battle for Caldari Prime, the Shiigeru titan used it's doomsday on a CONCORD battleship, killing it instantly. It is also a false impression to say CONCORD ships are based on Jovian tech only, when in reality they're just a mix of all the empire's technology. CONCORD was originally formed by the fove empires to keep peace, and they've been given exclusive access to tech not available to capsuleers yet(but this tech is not exclusively Jovian based) which gave them their power against individual targets, but not so much against fleets. Thukker won against them. Heck, even a group of capsuleers managed to kill a CONCORD battlecruiser once. In reality, the only reason CONCORD still exists is because it benefits all the empires. As for the original topic, my side is leaning towards Amarr, but I'm too tired to explain my point after that. Such words! So logic! Wow! But seriously, the Jovian fleet was about 80 ships from memory, all frigates, all Capsuleers, all presumably higher tech. The strategy of the Jovians in this battle was to pin the Amarr using their traditional battle-line tactics (think ships of the line, men'o'war etc) and splat them with the doomsday from stupid distances. Which they did; half the Amarr fleet was destroyed, making it a catastrophic defeat (but not quite as total as some suggest, excepting that all the rest of the fleet were executed upon returning to Amarr space for their egregious failure). So the Jovians had all the advantages, which is to say technology, fleet composition and advance warning; the only advantage the Amarr had was numerical superiority. Which seemed to work out pretty well; the Jovians lost a full third of their fleet. Now. Some guesstimating will follow. The three Jovian Motherships were fitted for entirely different purposes; one war, one industry and one exploration (or so it's said). We can assume that the mothership was an extremely high-value asset, and was therefore supported by a significant portion of their military might. If this assumption is correct, it means the Jovian fleet is small and not so significantly advanced over empire technology that they're undefeatable. Which means that the Amarr, being possessed of an immense fleet , the likes of which exists in none of the other empires, would have utterly crushed the Jovians in the second offensive that was to follow. As I have said, the only reason the Jovians still exist (which they probably don't; I hear Sansha Kuvakei has basically sodomised them) is because the Minmatar rebelled against the Amarr. A rebellion which was only possible because of the stunned military at the Jovians actually having a military presence, and the mobilisations following such. Oh well. EDIT: Denak, I am simply expressing amusement at the wall'o'text you wrote :) woulda deleted it in my reply but smartphone says no :( ak.0 4 LYFE I am the Lorhak. I speak for the trees.
Denak Kalamari Intaki Liberation Front Intaki Prosperity Initiative 1559	Posted - 2014.04.22 15:41:00 - [46] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Denak, I am simply expressing amusement at the wall'o'text you wrote :) woulda deleted it in my reply but smartphone says no :( Wall'o'texts are what I do on this forum, it's just rambling at an off-topic point of this thread anyway. Grahisha of ILF // Writer of Thoughts of a Clone Soldier // Latest entry published Apr. 1st
da GAND L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 810	Posted - 2014.04.29 12:47:00 - [47] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: Tech De Ra wrote: In a later fight, the rebellion built 3 titans, using one of them to assault one of the throne worlds. Empress Jamyl Sarum was like "these slaves are hilarious", told a disciple to go to the eve gate because she predicted a terran weapon would be around there that the jove haven't cloaked or stolen. She was correct, the disciple brought the weapon back so Jamyl decided to put it to good use She ducktaped the weapon to her ship, warped to zero on the titans (because why not, she's like the steven seagal of space), told the rebels that she wanted to clear the sky so that the annual deadmau5 concert could take place in peace. The rebels were like "lol daumau5 is really bad", so Jamyl was all "u wot m8" and then in a single shot instantly killed the titan along with most of the rebel fleet **** yes, Jamyl Sarum PS: The amarr also invented slavery, child prostitution, dust mercs, and the element gold Technically a Caldari scientist along with a Caldari prisoner made the first dust merc.... using sleeper tech. Just saying. Ummmm read the book Templar One Along time ago and it was just Amarr scientists that used sleeper tech on one of their Caldari prisoners that they brainwashed to make the first near Dust merc/ Near Immortal troop. Rage at Fanfest??
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 9917	Posted - 2014.04.29 23:54:00 - [48] - Quote da GAND wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: Tech De Ra wrote: In a later fight, the rebellion built 3 titans, using one of them to assault one of the throne worlds. Empress Jamyl Sarum was like "these slaves are hilarious", told a disciple to go to the eve gate because she predicted a terran weapon would be around there that the jove haven't cloaked or stolen. She was correct, the disciple brought the weapon back so Jamyl decided to put it to good use She ducktaped the weapon to her ship, warped to zero on the titans (because why not, she's like the steven seagal of space), told the rebels that she wanted to clear the sky so that the annual deadmau5 concert could take place in peace. The rebels were like "lol daumau5 is really bad", so Jamyl was all "u wot m8" and then in a single shot instantly killed the titan along with most of the rebel fleet **** yes, Jamyl Sarum PS: The amarr also invented slavery, child prostitution, dust mercs, and the element gold Technically a Caldari scientist along with a Caldari prisoner made the first dust merc.... using sleeper tech. Just saying. Ummmm read the book Templar One Along time ago and it was just Amarr scientists that used sleeper tech on one of their Caldari prisoners that they brainwashed to make the first near Dust merc/ Near Immortal troop. And just look at the result. "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two
da GAND L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 812	Posted - 2014.04.30 02:51:00 - [49] - Quote True Adamance wrote: da GAND wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: Tech De Ra wrote: In a later fight, the rebellion built 3 titans, using one of them to assault one of the throne worlds. Empress Jamyl Sarum was like "these slaves are hilarious", told a disciple to go to the eve gate because she predicted a terran weapon would be around there that the jove haven't cloaked or stolen. She was correct, the disciple brought the weapon back so Jamyl decided to put it to good use She ducktaped the weapon to her ship, warped to zero on the titans (because why not, she's like the steven seagal of space), told the rebels that she wanted to clear the sky so that the annual deadmau5 concert could take place in peace. The rebels were like "lol daumau5 is really bad", so Jamyl was all "u wot m8" and then in a single shot instantly killed the titan along with most of the rebel fleet **** yes, Jamyl Sarum PS: The amarr also invented slavery, child prostitution, dust mercs, and the element gold Technically a Caldari scientist along with a Caldari prisoner made the first dust merc.... using sleeper tech. Just saying. Ummmm read the book Templar One Along time ago and it was just Amarr scientists that used sleeper tech on one of their Caldari prisoners that they brainwashed to make the first near Dust merc/ Near Immortal troop. And just look at the result. It's amazing, the Jovians and the sleepers have some amazing tech. Makes me wonder what else the Sleepers, Jovians and other small but technologically superior groups have. First with the capsuleer tech saving factions from losing thousands of their people from the loss of one large ship. Now with troops that transfer to another body like the capsuleer tech once the body becomes useless. Rage at Fanfest??
Hawk-eye Occultus Omega Elite Mercs INC. 140	Posted - 2014.04.30 10:55:00 - [50] - Quote da GAND wrote: It's amazing, the Jovians and the sleepers have some amazing tech. Makes me wonder what else the Sleepers, Jovians and other small but technologically superior groups have. First with the capsuleer tech saving factions from losing thousands of their people from the loss of one large ship. Now with troops that transfer to another body like the capsuleer tech once the body becomes useless. Any ship bigger than a firgate (even if said ship has a capsule pilot) has a crew in some form or another. For instance, when a battleship is blown up, there are still hundreds of other people on that ship who aint' the capsuleer. I shall take my staff, and with it, bonk you! I Must have all the things!

Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 3133	Posted - 2014.04.30 11:02:00 - [51] - Quote Hawk-eye Occultus wrote: da GAND wrote: It's amazing, the Jovians and the sleepers have some amazing tech. Makes me wonder what else the Sleepers, Jovians and other small but technologically superior groups have. First with the capsuleer tech saving factions from losing thousands of their people from the loss of one large ship. Now with troops that transfer to another body like the capsuleer tech once the body becomes useless. Any ship bigger than a firgate (even if said ship has a capsule pilot) has a crew in some form or another. For instance, when a battleship is blown up, there are still hundreds of other people on that ship who aint' the capsuleer. ^^^ Titans have something in the order of 3k support staff along with the capsuleer. There are a lot of menial tasks too trivial to concern the Capsuleer, who kind of has bigger things to worry about, like targeting and flying and stuff. ak.0 // 4 LYFE I am the Lorhak // I speak for the trees. Jason Person for CMP!


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