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Aerius Corius
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Posted - 2014.02.26 00:48:00 -
[1] - Quote
This is a concept for an "aerial map" and I'd love input on what you guys think. The idea was based a lot on a similar, though fundamentally different idea by Adam-of-Eve, seen here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=142159&find=unread Please support his idea because it is much more feasible than this and also very cool!
While I picture an MCC below for the map, a simple "skybarge" that is a flat platform for transportation (lore wise) may be easier for the art team to render and build. What's described below is a HUGE undertaking for development but very doable with existing mechanics.
Battle Map is an actual MCC on a much larger scale (again, a different ship type may be needed) - turret installations on the MCC are initially 'offline' and must be hacked by the teams to gain control. Rails and Missiles are located on the exterior platforms of the MCC, blasters on the interior. CRU's and Supply Depots exist throughout the MCC as you would imagine (though skinned to be more permanent looking hopefully). The MCC is actually in the air, though not at the height we normally see to ease dropship movement around it.
How it works...
Map Layout
"Neutral MCC" is located in the center of map. Team 1 and Team 2 have two starting CRU's - one in each corner that correspond to the front and rear of the neutral MCC in terms of approach. i.e. The Neutral MCC is diagonally positioned on the map.
Access to the MCC is gained, initially, via dropships. At each CRU is a free dropship to help teams get started - this dropship will 'respawn' when destroyed or left idle after a minute. This prevents a team that might have no dropships available to their members from literally being stuck. Teams are of course able to spawn their own additional dropships to get more members to the MCC immediately. Two turrets, a missile and railgun, will be provided to defend the starting point per normal. All starting points are red zoned to prevent ease of spawn camping by enemy movements.
By approaching from different sides, the teams will ideally meet in the MCC where a skirmish layout of five points are. Two in the rear (engineering - very cluttered but open bays), Two in the center (Main Rooms - urban style with corridors and rooms), and one at the front (Control Areas - wide open spaces). Each team has a 'health bar' similar to the current setup that represents control of the MCC. Team that loses all control (by not controlling points) will lose. There is no 'gradual' degradation as we see in MCC-to-MCC fire in current maps as there are five points, preventing an even match from taking place.
For Domination, a flat "sky barge" would be much more useful to the above 'detailed' map. However, you could use that same map with simply a smaller section of the MCC being used (as we see currently with skirmish maps "cropped" via redzone to use as dominations or ambush). Ambush mode would have players start on the ship itself, not needing to get there first.
Tactics
MCC map would enable vehicle use with LAVs and HAVs by summoning these vehicles to the docking points on the MCC that teams initially head to at the beginning. Dropship summoning is normal as well, though flying a dropship in the MCC won't be easy or necessarily helpful.
Team strategies could include trying to take the exterior turrets on both sides in the rear, middle, or front, to shoot down reinforcement dropships in the event a team is unable to establish a CRU presence on the MCC. This could quickly lead to a situation where a team is at a severe disadvantage. Essentially the first priority is to establish CRU and uplink presence on the MCC so you no longer need dropships to get to the MCC.
Moving from front to rear will be quicker by dropship, literally 'island hopping' from one platform to the next - this encourages dropship pilots to remain active and can lead to potential dogfights when both teams are trying to hit the same platform. Assault dropships should not be the determining factor in a team's success.
The main point of a map like this is strategic options - teams that are coordinated will succeed very well on this map, and it features an "all hands on deck" approach that incentivises all vehicles (though dropships are in the spotlight). Probably most important, it's just a cool map and many players (especially newer players) will really be blown away by a 'mission' like this.
Again, crazy time to develop - but all of the resources are there.
(This would be wicked cool in FW and PC engagements too - given future plans of asset deployment)
Thoughts? I know it probably won't happen anytime soon if ever - so please post constructively on your ideas for an 'aerial' map: that is, a map that depends some or heavily on dropship usage.
That guy you killed with 0% shields?
Yeah, I sniped him - go team.
Oh, you didn't know...hmm.
*CCP: Display Assists!!!
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Aerius Corius
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Posted - 2014.02.26 17:29:00 -
[2] - Quote
Something mentioned in the link I had at beginning by Adam-of-Eve is very important - you may not want to render land vehicles useless. What you describe - especially the island hopping - does that. Don't get me wrong, I think eventually we should have maps that are very biased towards each general class of vehicle: LAV, HAV, Dropship.
I'd recommend doing what I did and make a post based on game modes you'd like to see - I'd be more than happy to support your ideas. For this topic, though, what I'm looking for is input on maps that necessitate the use of ALL vehicles.
In this scenario I've provided, dropships are the obvious necessary need - but if the map itself where the points are is built right, you can still have LAV and HAV tactics provide significant advantages.
To use your island hopping idea and the gas planet - you could take an existing map structure and simply gouge out large tracts of land into the 'bottomless pits' we see inside some buildings and reskin as the gas planet. Access from the 'platforms' surrounding the five skirmish points is limited to large and long bridges (which we already have on some maps - but this time, no valley to go around).
Dropships are not NECESSARY in a map like this, but they provide significant mobility advantages - but a team with multiple skilled land vehicle pilots could still storm bridges and be successful. The point of the map is that dropships will be able to move from platform to platform far quicker than the round-about-way of using a bridge(s). In current "bridge" maps there is always a round-about via the valley beneath or around the bridge...but it still enables land vehicles. This restricts land movement between major zones (land vehicles once in a given 'platform' zone would be able to move about normally as they do now.)
A good simple layout is a Cross - points at the North, S, E, W of the map with a large central platform that houses the internal capture point. Starting points for both teams are at the farthest end of the North and South platforms...effectively making their first capture relatively easy and not require any vehicles.
In Domination, the East and West platforms would be redzoned - leaving the N and S platforms as starting points and the large central platform as the capture point - dropships still provide mobility since the only alternative could be a blood bath on the bridge - again, no valley to circumnavigate. This map is basically a 'corridor', which we see already.
-An alternative to this is a "T" map where the T is on its side - same concept as above, but the domination point is actually on the West or East platform, making for two sets of bridges to cross. Majority of fighting would take place at the capture point on its smaller platform, but defenders could potentially push back to hold the central platform as well, further cutting off the attacker...vice versa, an attacker may control the central platform, cutting off the defenders to only dropship support as the bridges are under attacker control.
I'm all about tactical domination maps! Otherwise they are just ambush maps with more clones and one actually important hack.
For ambush, you'd likely just use the central platform like most maps are now for good urban fighting - vehicles still useful as this platform would be the largest.
That guy you killed with 0% shields?
Yeah, I sniped him - go team.
Oh, you didn't know...hmm.
*CCP: Display Assists!!!
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Aerius Corius
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Posted - 2014.02.26 17:44:00 -
[3] - Quote
killertojo42 wrote:Good idea but i want dust players to become boarding parties, why just destroy a titan when we can steal them
You and I both know that *some day* CCP wants that. DUST players capturing ships in EvE would be beyond epic but talk about a huge undertaking in cross platform technology. That said, of all the things DUST can do someday for EvE, our primary focus right now needs to be what can DUST do for...well, DUST! The game needs lots of things and maps are probably pretty far down the pipe, but we as players can help devs do some of the legwork by expediting the concept stage.
In its current format though, I do think CCP should consider a method for allowing mercs to assault a Starbase that is reinforced. If the attackers win, the starbase reinforcement timer ends immediately, enabling the attacking fleet to engage immediately. If the defenders win, the reinforced timer can be modified (by alliance/corp leaders' choice) to be even longer to buy time for reinforcements. Again, way, way, WAY into the future of DUST and EvE development I'm sure. Soon (tm) doesn't even cover this.
Anyhow...for this topic, all of the ideas about what the map should be artistically is great! I totally agree an aerial map could be an EvE starship (considering scale, it'd probably be a capital but not supercapital). However, that means a LOT of art development.
I'd rather see this map sooner than later, so think in terms of existing art assets and ideas - art devs need love too!
Much of the ground installations (i.e. the buildings) could be reformed into assets that would comprise an aerial sky barge or platform.
That guy you killed with 0% shields?
Yeah, I sniped him - go team.
Oh, you didn't know...hmm.
*CCP: Display Assists!!!
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Aerius Corius
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Posted - 2014.02.26 18:03:00 -
[4] - Quote
killertojo42 wrote:Well dust still has basic problems, their basic idea of balancing leaves out the possibility of letting higher level players being overly epic
I won't comment too much to that - but bear in mind that when God walks the battlefield, 16 people are having a horrible game experience guaranteed regardless of their own skill and gear and its possible another 10 to 15 are also having a poor experience because...well, you killed everyone too fast and easily. 
I'm confident CCP will get balancing a lot better with 1.8 and, hopefully by 1.9, the game will really be squared up for new content. But keep in mind everytime you add more content in the form of gear, everything has to be potentially rebalanced. Most shooter games don't deal with this problem. It's what makes DUST what it is - and not something else.
SO - on the aerial idea:
1) Would you prefer the "Cross" layout mentioned earlier or the large single map in the sky that requires dropship access early on?
2) If you chose aerial platform, how would you have the different skirmish points be environmentally unique? How should vehicle movement work on the aerial platform - relatively unobstructed like current maps, or with some choke points?
3) If you chose the "Cross" platform idea, explain your thoughts on the bridges - how wide should they be considering they will be the only land access between large parts of the map and their capture points? How would you position installations (especially turrets as they pose the single greatest risk to Dropships)?
4) Given the map layouts and their favoring all vehicles in some capacity, with a heightened tactical advantage to dropships for mobility, what mode would YOU want to play this map as? Skirmish, Domination, or Ambush? Thinking on ambush's current woes of tankbush, do you think an ambush map that incentivises dropship use is feasible? Why or why not?
For the sake of the devs I'm a huge proponent of multi-function maps, which we've already seen where a domination point can actually be used in several different spots on the same map and ambush maps can be 'red-boxed' inside a larger skirmish map in different spots to provide more variety. If we had an aerial/bridge map it would need to be effectively usable for all game modes.
That guy you killed with 0% shields?
Yeah, I sniped him - go team.
Oh, you didn't know...hmm.
*CCP: Display Assists!!!
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