Our Deepest Regret
L.O.T.I.S.
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
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Posted - 2014.02.19 10:13:00 -
[1] - Quote
Alena Ventrallis wrote:The point was to see how much effort a swarm needed to do to destroy a tank, period. This wasn't theorycrafted on a calculator. This was actual footage of how many swarms were needed to kill a militia tank. The point is, even sitting there letting him blow me up, it still took 4-5 proto swarms to destroy me, even with his proficiency 3. That should not be. The point I had going in was that swarm damage was good at the proto level, but the problem was application of that damage.
We discussed making swarms go as fast as missiles from tanks and installations, slowing tanks down, and other things about keeping the current damage, and changing other factors to make it harder for tanks to avoid swarms, and thus making it easier for swarms to kill tanks without directly buffing their damage.
But as was shown, the prototype swarms, even with proficiency, and some with damage mods, still struggled to kill a tank THAT WAS NOT FIGHTING BACK AT ALL. I could have killed him at any time, but even offering no resistance, it took more than one magazine of proto swarms (with prof 3, don't forget that) to down my tank. That long reload gives me plenty of time to respond and take him out, and even if I fit nothing at all beyond what comes on the base militia tank, I still have a large chance of surviving the encounter, simply because he cannot put out enough damage.
I think a small damage increase, or increasing the magazine size of swarms by 1 at each level, would do wonders to help them be a threat to tanks. Swarms should be able to kill a tank that offers no resistance in one magazine.
The resiliency of milita tanks is absolutely absurd. We've all known it for a while, but seeing actual footage to illustrate the point should help. They do too much damage, and they soak too much damage. I like a good deal as much as the next fellow, but they offer waaaaay too much bang for your buck. |
Our Deepest Regret
L.O.T.I.S.
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
509
|
Posted - 2014.02.22 04:12:00 -
[2] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Ld Collins wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Ld Collins wrote:Alena Ventrallis wrote:Video test of how much damage swarms do vs militia tanks. All militia tanks were as they come, nothing extra added. The Gunnlogi at the end was fitted with two basic hardeners and a complex heavy shield extender. Swarm user (ratamaq doc) had proficiency 3. 1st swarm launcher was a dren launcher with 1 basic damage mod. When he suicides, the second was proto swarm with 2 complex mods. 3rd swarm was proto swarm with no damage mods. I admit, I was wrong. Swarms do need a small buff to damage. I suggest this. Make current proto swarms the new militia/basic swarms. All versions would shoot 6 missiles.Militia/basic would do 220 damage per missile. Advanced would do 235 per missile. Proto would be 250 per missile. The Video. The only thing this video shows me is that 1 person shouldn't try to kill a tank on his own with a swarm launcher alone. Before 1.7 there use to be av squads that would run around in lavs and ambush tanks because they were extremely easy to kill but what everyone has done was given up and put all their skills into Rail Rifles. You show me a video of a commando, a heavy and a logibro in a lav attacking a hardened tank with the following. Assualt FG Flux nades Swarm Launchers and Av nades have the three of them jump out of the lav and ambush the tanker. Post that video and then the truth will come out. Give the Logi A 2 man rep tool a nano hive and a scanner give the heavy a decent FG fit and the commando dual Swarms. Three guys to kill one tank. That's funny. I suppose I can request that my Gallente Assault suit should have enough armor that it should require three other players to kill me..? Because it's expensive..? While we're at it, bear in mind that the reason those AV teams don't really exist anymore is because AV Grenades got nerfed to hell. Light infantry can't just run up on a tank and destroy it with burst damage like that anymore, especially what with dual-hardener shield tanks being able to recharge through almost anything. I used to run these exact things with Harlequin13 - we've tried it a few times since 1.7 dropped. Doesn't work nearly as well anymore. You're better off dropping in a railgun tank to alpha-strike it to death or use a forge team. when it was expensive for tankers no one cared they just said it was all qq and poorly fitted tanks and in pre 1.7 it only took 1 lav and a heavy with a FG to kill a tank. Jihad lav FG dead tank nano hive av nades dead tank now that it takes some effort. People want to complain its expensive please how is it expensive if the load is shared by 3 different players. Pre 1.7 tanks were averaging 1.5 mil that was for 1 person to bear. Well, now your tanks are far more powerful and cost less than most of my Advanced suits, let alone my Proto AV suits. Soooo, which are you willing to sacrifice? Power or price?
Price gawd demmit, price! I'm sorry, I love my tank, I got ten million SP invested in the bastard as proof, but tanks are too ******* good right now. For the performance you get out of them, they should have doubled the price, not reduced it.
If they don't reduce the performance of militia tanks, then the only right thing to is mark up their price. BY TEN FOLD. Yes folks, I am saying that Somas and Sicas should cost over a million isk. Militia means you can use something without skill: There's no rule that says they have to be cheap too. Let's bring the economic game back to tanks. It wasn't just AV that kept the tank population under control last build, it was the prohibitive pricing too. |