DUST Search - This is whats wrong with the RR

Virtual Riot wrote:

Awry Barux wrote:

Virtual Riot wrote:

http://imgur.com/yuenoes

I was running adv Minmatar assault

With a pro smg

and cmplx sidearm dmg mods

and he dropped me in under a second

started shooting him

he turned around

and dropped me in under a second

done for tonight

No RR can do 776 damage in <1 second, especially with spool-up time. Not saying it isn't overpowered right now (1.8 nerfbat confirmed), but your anecdote is not plausible. If you started shooting first, you have only yourself to blame for missing, because there's no way the events could have transpired as you describe them. Please don't post such gross exaggerations.

Lynn: I've read your post three times and absolutely can't figure out what you mean. Why are low recoil weapons hard to use in CQC? Why should low ROF = low accuracy?

Ok fine if you wanna get all ******* technical
A RR with NO damage mods or skills in prof, does 423 damage per second (rof / 60) x 55 dmg = 423dps
776 / 423 = 1.8 seconds
Thats WITHOUT any damage increases that could have been present

Like it makes a huge ******* difference do some math before you trash my post

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Virtual Riot The Vanguardians INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 175	Posted - 2014.02.11 06:14:00 - [1] - Quote http://imgur.com/yuenoes I was running adv Minmatar assault With a pro smg and cmplx sidearm dmg mods and he dropped me in under a second started shooting him he turned around and dropped me in under a second done for tonight
Lynn Beck Granite Mercenary Division Top Men. 724	Posted - 2014.02.11 06:22:00 - [2] - Quote Seems about the gist of it. The problem isn't the fact that the hipfire is too accurate- it's the fact that for the Rof, IT'S TOO DAM ACCURATE. Think about that. With other weapons (Ar) you have a higher RoF, more bullets to throw about, and (supposed to be) more Clip damage to throw about. With a slow Rof weapon, you can 'miss' more as by the time you realign with the enemy, it's already chambering the next round. Imagine if the RR had the hipfire of a sniper, or a burst Scrp. It would be so inaccurate that you would have a better chance of hitting a scout with 2-3 hits, but those 3 hits would be spread out so far that you would likely waste half your clip in attempting. If the Gal AR had RR spread, it would be near impossible to use-except for 30-40m engangements or Kb/m, due to the facr that it's (bold this) LACK of RECOIL(kk i'm done) would make it almos impossible to aim. It's kind of hard to understand, but it does make sense. At least to me it does... Tl:dr if the RR is supposed to 'kick like a mule' then super nerf it's accuracy. Under 28db Officially nerfproof (predicting CR nerf February '14) Selling SP: 10k SP per 100k ISK.
Awry Barux Paladin Survey Force Amarr Empire 481	Posted - 2014.02.11 06:29:00 - [3] - Quote Virtual Riot wrote: http://imgur.com/yuenoes I was running adv Minmatar assault With a pro smg and cmplx sidearm dmg mods and he dropped me in under a second started shooting him he turned around and dropped me in under a second done for tonight No RR can do 776 damage in <1 second, especially with spool-up time. Not saying it isn't overpowered right now (1.8 nerfbat confirmed), but your anecdote is not plausible. If you started shooting first, you have only yourself to blame for missing, because there's no way the events could have transpired as you describe them. Please don't post such gross exaggerations. Lynn: I've read your post three times and absolutely can't figure out what you mean. Why are low recoil weapons hard to use in CQC? Why should low ROF = low accuracy?
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 3164	Posted - 2014.02.11 06:36:00 - [4] - Quote Oh stop your moaning. It's getting nerfed next month. Yet the CR can drop you quick and from distances that seem to be out of its range. Oh well, it's just the "in" thing to talk about, RRs. Like generator for days... Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
Virtual Riot The Vanguardians INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 176	Posted - 2014.02.11 06:37:00 - [5] - Quote Awry Barux wrote: Virtual Riot wrote: http://imgur.com/yuenoes I was running adv Minmatar assault With a pro smg and cmplx sidearm dmg mods and he dropped me in under a second started shooting him he turned around and dropped me in under a second done for tonight No RR can do 776 damage in <1 second, especially with spool-up time. Not saying it isn't overpowered right now (1.8 nerfbat confirmed), but your anecdote is not plausible. If you started shooting first, you have only yourself to blame for missing, because there's no way the events could have transpired as you describe them. Please don't post such gross exaggerations. Lynn: I've read your post three times and absolutely can't figure out what you mean. Why are low recoil weapons hard to use in CQC? Why should low ROF = low accuracy? Ok fine if you wanna get all ***** technical A RR with NO damage mods or skills in prof, does 423 damage per second (rof / 60) x 55 dmg = 423dps 776 / 423 = 1.8 seconds Thats WITHOUT any damage increases that could have been present Like it makes a huge ***** difference do some math before you trash my post
Lynn Beck Granite Mercenary Division Top Men. 724	Posted - 2014.02.11 06:38:00 - [6] - Quote Let's day you miss .5 seconds of fire- that would be 3.5 shots of Gal Ar, or 100 damage. If you miss .5 seconds of Rr that's about 2 shots, 105 damage. The thing though is the RR has the same Damage per clip, so it takes longer to use that clip. Thus meaning for that second you lose the same amount of Dps, but you're missing much less of your total clip. Also you could just sweep fire it, and hit the 6 shots necessary to drop any frame save heavies. Under 28db Officially nerfproof (predicting CR nerf February '14) Selling SP: 10k SP per 100k ISK.
Auris Lionesse Capital Acquisitions LLC Renegade Alliance 192	Posted - 2014.02.11 06:49:00 - [7] - Quote There's really nothing wrong with rail rifles. Damage mods yes, the rifle itself is fine especially compared to the assault combat rifle. But rr will be overnerfed soon enough.
Awry Barux Paladin Survey Force Amarr Empire 481	Posted - 2014.02.11 06:50:00 - [8] - Quote Virtual Riot wrote: Awry Barux wrote: Virtual Riot wrote: http://imgur.com/yuenoes I was running adv Minmatar assault With a pro smg and cmplx sidearm dmg mods and he dropped me in under a second started shooting him he turned around and dropped me in under a second done for tonight No RR can do 776 damage in <1 second, especially with spool-up time. Not saying it isn't overpowered right now (1.8 nerfbat confirmed), but your anecdote is not plausible. If you started shooting first, you have only yourself to blame for missing, because there's no way the events could have transpired as you describe them. Please don't post such gross exaggerations. Lynn: I've read your post three times and absolutely can't figure out what you mean. Why are low recoil weapons hard to use in CQC? Why should low ROF = low accuracy? Ok fine if you wanna get all ***** technical A RR with NO damage mods or skills in prof, does 423 damage per second (rof / 60) x 55 dmg = 423dps 776 / 423 = 1.8 seconds Thats WITHOUT any damage increases that could have been present Like it makes a huge ***** difference do some math before you trash my post So, when you count in the 0.25 seconds of spool-up time, you had 2.05 seconds (if your opponent had perfect accuracy) AFTER he turned around to kill him with a damage-modded proto SMG. Assuming you were using a Six Kin SMG with a single complex damage mod, you were putting out 423.5 damage per second. While the RR is certainly OP, you definitely could have won that one. You can't blame this one on the gun.
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 3164	Posted - 2014.02.11 06:53:00 - [9] - Quote Auris Lionesse wrote: There's really nothing wrong with rail rifles. Damage mods yes, the rifle itself is fine especially compared to the assault combat rifle. But rr will be overnerfed soon enough. People never consider skill acquisition and damage mods stacked. My poor RR. Wrongfully accused while the CR snickers in the corner Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p TRA1LBLAZERS 511	Posted - 2014.02.11 06:56:00 - [10] - Quote spool up time=joke. most people just tap it every so often to keep it fully spooled Kills- Archduke Ferdinand Balance!

Awry Barux Paladin Survey Force Amarr Empire 481	Posted - 2014.02.11 07:03:00 - [11] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: Let's day you miss .5 seconds of fire- that would be 3.5 shots of Gal Ar, or 114 damage. If you miss .5 seconds of Rr that's about 2 shots, 105 damage. The thing though is the RR has the same Damage per clip, so it takes longer to use that clip. Thus meaning for that second you lose the same amount of Dps, but you're missing much less of your total clip. Also you could just sweep fire it, and hit the 6 shots necessary to drop any frame save heavies. Ahh, I see what you mean. The thing is, if you're sweep firing, the RR's low ROF means you have a higher chance for the gaps in between shots to correspond with the moments when you're actually on target, which is a non-trivial drawback. The granularity of, say, the ACR allows you to apply damage more consistently- it's nearly impossible for even a scout's hitbox to avoid taking significant damage, even if you're just spinning in circles holding down the trigger. I just don't want to see the RR made into the TAR 2.0 (OP, then nerfed into absolute uselessness by small clip, useless hipfire and high ADS recoil). I waited so long for a long-range rifle.
Virtual Riot The Vanguardians INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 176	Posted - 2014.02.11 07:03:00 - [12] - Quote Awry Barux wrote: So, when you count in the 0.25 seconds of spool-up time, you had 2.05 seconds (if your opponent had perfect accuracy) AFTER he turned around to kill him with a damage-modded proto SMG. Assuming you were using a Six Kin SMG with a single complex damage mod, you were putting out 423.5 damage per second. While the RR is certainly OP, you definitely could have won that one. You can't blame this one on the gun. Yes, but the point is that there should have been NO WAY for me to lose that engagement. Even if I miss half my shots I should still have won that because he is using a weapon optimized for mid-long range (77m) and i'm using one optimized for close range ( 20 - 1 m) It shouldnt have been "could have won", it should have been "I got inside this guys range and now I shall proceed to destroy him"
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 3165	Posted - 2014.02.11 07:18:00 - [13] - Quote I don't know why folks think that a close range weapon means a guaranteed win percentage of 100% in CQC. Like variables just doesn't happen in a CQC. There's a thing called probability you know. I feel like we should just start playing Dust like a MTG card game, the way people go on about losing to RR in CQC. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
Awry Barux Paladin Survey Force Amarr Empire 481	Posted - 2014.02.11 07:21:00 - [14] - Quote Virtual Riot wrote: Awry Barux wrote: So, when you count in the 0.25 seconds of spool-up time, you had 2.05 seconds (if your opponent had perfect accuracy) AFTER he turned around to kill him with a damage-modded proto SMG. Assuming you were using a Six Kin SMG with a single complex damage mod, you were putting out 423.5 damage per second. While the RR is certainly OP, you definitely could have won that one. You can't blame this one on the gun. Yes, but the point is that there should have been NO WAY for me to lose that engagement. Even if I miss half my shots I should still have won that because he is using a weapon optimized for mid-long range (77m) and i'm using one optimized for close range ( 20 - 1 m) It shouldnt have been "could have won", it should have been "I got inside this guys range and now I shall proceed to destroy him" No, this is an FPS. There is and should ALWAYS be a way for you to lose, regardless of you out-maneuvering your opponent. Also, you were using a sidearm- if you were using your primary weapon slot for a close-range weapon, you would have had significantly more DPS (a militia AR does 425 DPS before damage mods). You can't compare light weapons to sidearms- there's a reason the commando loses so much in exchange for having two light weapons instead of a light and a sidearm. If you were using a shotgun, I would have infinite sympathy, but since you were using a sidearm, you could have been packing just as much long-range capability as he was.
Asha Starwind VEXALATION CORPORATION Partners of Industrial Service and Salvage 327	Posted - 2014.02.11 07:45:00 - [15] - Quote Virtual Riot wrote: Awry Barux wrote: Virtual Riot wrote: http://imgur.com/yuenoes I was running adv Minmatar assault With a pro smg and cmplx sidearm dmg mods and he dropped me in under a second started shooting him he turned around and dropped me in under a second done for tonight No RR can do 776 damage in <1 second, especially with spool-up time. Not saying it isn't overpowered right now (1.8 nerfbat confirmed), but your anecdote is not plausible. If you started shooting first, you have only yourself to blame for missing, because there's no way the events could have transpired as you describe them. Please don't post such gross exaggerations. Lynn: I've read your post three times and absolutely can't figure out what you mean. Why are low recoil weapons hard to use in CQC? Why should low ROF = low accuracy? Ok fine if you wanna get all ***** technical A RR with NO damage mods or skills in prof, does 423 damage per second (rof / 60) x 55 dmg = 423dps 776 / 423 = 1.8 seconds Thats WITHOUT any damage increases that could have been present Like it makes a huge ***** difference do some math before you trash my post Don't forget the spool up time1.80s + 0.25s = 2.05s, while the absolute may not be much, that's still more than double than what you originally said. Anyway the problem in this situation is not RR it's that you're butthurt that you got the drop on someone and they turned around and wasted you, that person just happened to have an RR. 776hp, A lot of weapons can out put that damage in a second(s) or an instant. looking at you ScR 32db Mad Bomber.
Operative 1171 Aajli Bragian Order Amarr Empire 1191	Posted - 2014.02.11 07:56:00 - [16] - Quote Auris Lionesse wrote: There's really nothing wrong with rail rifles. Damage mods yes, the rifle itself is fine especially compared to the assault combat rifle. But rr will be overnerfed soon enough. Lol, I used the basic RR and not that good at aiming with a stupid controller and I did too dmn well with it in CQ. Caldari is long range. CCP focus on lore. These dmn kiddie consolers are ignorant of the lore. Lore matters. Otherwise why even have the Caldari be long range shooters or not have every other weapon be just as good at the sameranges? CCP lore defines the weapons and reasoning in this game. Rommel, you magnificent bastard, I read your book!


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