[10:39:48] Samahiel : We're really worried on our side about Dust.
[10:40:57] Kane Spero: Our side being the Eve side?
[10:41:06] Samahiel : SPERG
[10:41:40] Samahiel : We're worried that a large portion of our remaining active players are motivated by the hope that all of this will one day mean something, and that if CCP doesn't communicate clear public plans at fan fest we'll drop below the critical mass of active players necessary to make playing this game bearable.
[10:42:14] Kane Spero: I hear that.
[...]
[10:42:44] Samahiel : The EVE side is pretty much convinced this game is done design wise, and will never be anything else.
[10:43:15] Kane Spero: Dust is far from being done in terms of its interaction with Eve.
[10:43:22] Samahiel : And that's the one's who aren't outright hostile and feel any integration would be dangerous to EVE.
[10:43:47] Samahiel : If I say that they'll say, "Prove It"
[10:43:52] Samahiel : and they wouldn't be wrong to ask.
[10:44:30] Kane Spero: Well, I unfortunately am not at liberty to "prove it"
[10:44:46] Kane Spero: One of the downsides to being a CPM
[...]
[10:45:47] Kane Spero: A clear and obtainable plan is something I've been professing to CCP that they need
[10:46:22] Kane Spero: Not pie-in-the-sky stuff designed to instill hope and not much more
[10:47:07] Samahiel : It's just galling that Para and I are sitting on top of what should be one of the largest most motivated blocks of players. People who bought merc packs, and aurum boosters, who wanted to believe in CCPs advertising. And all that has been squandered.
[10:48:11] Kane Spero: CCP realizes that they have ****** up I can say that much.
[10:48:58] Kane Spero: I do think that CCP Rogue is passionate and ambitious enough to take Dust into a good direction though
[GǪ]
[10:54:46] Kane Spero: I think one of the biggest issues is that a lot of the examinations have been what can Dust make for Eve so that Eve will care. It really needs to be what can Dust DO for Eve that would make Eve care.
[10:55:24] Samahiel : I think the biggest issue is dust doesn't make or do anything, and we've seen no plans that weren't markers on a whiteboard.
[10:56:21] Kane Spero: People keep thinking if PC made Eve resources that a lot of the issues would be solved, but what really needs to happen is to have Dusters themselves be a resource that Eve uses to accomplish a task.
[10:56:58] Kane Spero: A tool in the toolbox of Eve corporations if you will.
[10:56:59] Samahiel : which is fine, but low level design like this should have been theory crafter, nailed down, iterated on, published for comment, and implemented at launch.
[10:57:17] Kane Spero: Pretty much.
[10:57:18] Samahiel : and if they expect us to wait around for it, they need to make it clear they're moving in a direction.
[...]
[10:59:56] Samahiel : Anyway, If you could pass on our concerns I'd appreciate it.
[11:00:07] Kane Spero: Of course.

In short you say a lot of stuff most have been saying for months and months

so this is an 'i'm pretending i'm a big thing' thread?

And more importantly, did a single person in EVE think about DUST during the several hours the battle raged?

So, Samaheil, you and I might be on opposite sides of the fence, but we're still both on the same page.

showing you cut things just make people wonder what you cut.

They already responded. On twitter.

Does anyone have a link, or even better, can someone copy/pasta their response? (twitter is trash for anything other than witty one-liners and pictures of lunches)

This should have a blue tag.

Great thread and discussion.

Just yesterday, I filled out the latest survey which CCP inviting me to take part in via e-mail. I couldn't emphasize enough the need to have clear and consise communication regarding any and all future plans for DUST 514. "Currently no plans to..." and "SoonGäó" just don't cut it!


Survey link - http://ccp.questionpro.com

Survey Structure - Section A = CCP / Section B = EVE / Section C = DUST

Questions? Contact the Research Team - [email protected]


EDIT: Make sure all your corpmates take the survey, especially those who don't use the forums!

I see your point, and I respect your opinion. But on this particular issue I agree with CCP, and I think it's a waste of time to push against what CCP wants here. They want the games to be able to both stand on their own before they integrate them more fully, and I completely understand that line of thinking. EVE already works well without Dust 514, but Dust 514 does not stand on it's own as a complete experience.

Mmm...Yes...Yes...

Say it all again to me,

But this time with your clothes off.

I think you guys are both actually touching on what most of us are expressing in here.

However I just want to point out that Dust 514 is, in and of itself, part of New Eden.

So, when we all say that we are waiting for the day "Dust will actually make a difference in New Eden" really all this requires is for Dust to make a difference in Dust, which it currently doesn't do. There's no real clear impact of our actions, even within the confines of Dust's little corner of New Eden. Sure, PC technically has some benefits with the fact that the corps holding districts make extra ISK, but that's really all it is: extra ISK for pre-scheduled battles (and an abstracted representation of their holdings in the form of a little colored dot on a map that no one looks at).

If CCP can find ways in which the decisions and actions of Dust 514 players can be seen and felt by the people logging in and playing Dust 514 day to day, then we're starting to get somewhere. But, until Dust 514 players can effect the world in which Dust 514 players currently inhabit (even claiming that we inhabit a world at all is a stretch), it doesn't make sense for us to be worried about how we effect the world of the EVE player.

Furthermore, I think we can all spitball specific ideas about how to approach this all day, but in the end CCP are the developers. It's their vision and they'll do things the way they want to do them. I think our time, as players looking to give feedback, is best utilized making sure they don't lose track of the broader vision that they originally sold us on, and the vision that most of us are waiting to see realized. I don't care how they go about make the game feel more cohesive, or how they go about making it feel like we're all having an impact on a living and breathing universe populated by us, all we should care about is that CCP understands that this is something they have not achieved and that the player base thinks these things are of the utmost importance.

I think making good decisions for how to make the world of Dust 514 persistent and meaningful, and allowing dust mercs and corps to feel as if they are actually participating in an MMO-like environment will naturally dovetail with Eve: Online. If they focus on these goals with Dust 514, the connections that can be made to strengthen the connection between the two will be much more evident.

I just crossed promote this thread in the forum

see here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1831797#post1831797

It has become an inception of thread posting and bumping.

The sky is blue but I dont know where pedro stands on abortion so I can't in good conscious offer my support.

This is me, another homeless who may be ablaze.

A Goon in with the CPM is like walking backwards whilst cutting your own throat.