message from Godin: Hell no

'hardens HAV' Haha ************! ' jumps out and throws even more OP than before AV nades at HAV', jumps back in, and turns on damage modifier' bend over *****.

That, and several other reasons why. AV grenades should be removed and replaced with homing stasis grenades.

message from Godin: Hell no

'hardens HAV' Haha ************! ' jumps out and throws even more OP than before AV nades at HAV', jumps back in, and turns on damage modifier' bend over *****.

That, and several other reasons why. AV grenades should be removed and replaced with homing stasis grenades.

AV grenades should wreak LAV's, be a pain to any dropship pilot who dares to hover to low, and be the warning signal to HAV's telling them they're not wanted.

Well this is why I made this thread, for ideas how to balance them so they aren't I win buttons, but are useful AV that keep vehicle users on their toes. Any suggestions?

Also like I said any hardeners or modules that were active before the grenade hit wouldn't be effected in any way. Plus for a tanker to use AV grenades or anyone for that matter the Tank would have to be withing throwing distance; which they shouldn't ever be. only bad tankers role up another tanks ass during a fight or sit on top of infantry spawn points or buildings and smash helpless ground units.

Not everyone uses Scrub techniques Godin.

>..>

why do people fail to understand tiers(even CCP at things)
10sec-30sec isn't proper tiers.
then balance...
10 second is too long even proto

and then to the OP
do you even know how chaff works?

message from Godin: Do I have to point out all the scrub techniques that people do use, or do you say that you're wrong now?

This might possibly be my first topic on the dust forums, I am not sure if I should be afraid or excited. Regardless of how I should feel I had an epiphany while reading several of the Tank threads littering the forums right now and felt it needed to be shared.

The topic of AV Grenades is a touchy one; should they kill tanks? Dropships? LAVs? Should they only be a hindrance, finisher, or area denial? Should they have any AI effect or solely be for AV. The community seems split on this subject and unable to find any common ground or compromise in any way.

While I think AV grenades should be a threat to any vehicle, especially since you give up one of the most effective weapons in the game to use them, but my idea is they can be a threat in a different way. Say for example, they work like chaff grenades from MGS4. If you hit a tank with them the Tank's HUD is scrambled and they cannot turn on modules; any module activated before you hit them however will be unaffected and remain active for its duration. This effect would last 10 seconds STD and increase 10 seconds each tier to about 30 seconds at PRO. This affect will also not be stackable so hitting a tank with three will not stall it for 1:30; any Av grenade used on an already affected tank would be a waste.

This would make AV Grenades a powerful opener that lets swarms and other AV do their job without worrying about hardeners or other Active modules. If this isn't enough to help balance make them stall or outright stop shield regen and armor repairs; if it is too much make infantry only carry one.

I would really like some community feedback to build and shape this from a rough idea into something workable for everyone. Individuals I'd really like some feedback on is Char, Atlim, Taka, Spkr, and True Adamance; I feel you are the most vocal about the issues with tanks but please try to keep it civil.

damn, I felt that burn all the way over here

1st-what happened to that intiki thing alt char you had? realized the name was lame and dropped it?
2nd- as it is, AV nades, are a JOKE.I know many tankers liek yourself wanted this but the FPS equation is broken here=
SHORT RANGE = HIGH DAMAGE.
Grenades will soon be incapable of being re-supplied and i say, at proto level , grenades could hit as hard as 2250 (2 per suit) and still,between the lack of supply ability, Tank superior SPEED, Tank HARDENER and uselessness vs DS it would be balanced.
for a total of 4500 with 2 proto grenades,considering MOST tanks carry more than that HP (a MLT SOMA has more than that) and have hardeners, they could still take in 2 proto grenades and survive.

BUT OF COURSE, tankers LOVE getting INTO urban areas where FG are almost useless since cannot use their RANGE advantage and swarms , well , LOL @ Swarms...
And would HATE for something to scratch their hulls.

What im saying is.
Anything Godin says against AV buffs should be ignored as he is as Biased as one can be.

message from Godin:

1: This is not my alt. I got a friend typing this for me.

2: I wanted AV's removed and replaced with homing stasis grenades in the first place. They can't be balanced, at all. It's pointless to try. Giving them just the right amount of damage is impossible. SO, therefore, they should be just chucked out the window for good. AS for that last bit about me wanting no AV buffs, this, and I just said clearly to put in stasis grenades. So you can shut that **** up.

why do people fail to understand tiers(even CCP at things)
10sec-30sec isn't proper tiers.
then balance...
10 second is too long even proto

and then to the OP
do you even know how chaff works?

I like this idea but it seems like it should be a whole different kind of AV grenade than the one already present. What you described is more of a "electronic warfare" AV grenade. CCP really needs to incorporate electronic warfare into Dust. It's very present in Eve, almost nonexistent in Dust.

AV Scrambler Grenade - Lessens effects of active modules of vehicle 'X' effect % increase per level.
or
AV Scrambler Grenade - Vehicle cannot use active modules for 'X' duration per skill level.

AV Webifiber Grenade - Lowers vehicles overall movement speed for 'X' duration per level.

With the addition of those AV grenades it would give AV a better shot at destroying vehicles. Thus leaving AV and tanks alone in their current state. No need to nerf or buff either.

I love the idea of AV having more tools, and the idea of module disruption is not a bad idea. However I would make it a new weapon and not replace current AV grenades with them.

The issue I have is with your numbers though. 30 seconds of downtime is absolutely insanely long for a single grenade. Try to imagine you're a Caldari dropsuit and your shield recharge was disabled for 30 seconds...pretty harsh yeah? I'd much rather see each grenade have a short duration (around 5 seconds) and allow you to stack them, so continual impacts from grenades would build up, making the weapon very effective at freaking tankers out and getting them to move.

message from Godin: Do you even blaster HAV? only scrubs use rails. Yes, I saw what you said, still wouldn't matter. And Like I said, get rid of AV nades (it was a stupid concept in the beginning, and it's a stupid concept now), and put in stasis nades, which has a homing function.

1-I know thats a ''friend'' of yours,i was just asking what happened to your intiki thing, alt,character you had...
2-I agree with your stasis grenades. I disagree with removing a Highly damaging AV solution for Close quarters.

In the case Teamwork is not available, a player must always have the means of dropping ANOTHER single player.

3-you should know by now you dont have the power to shut me up.

I only Tank when I steal someone's tank, which is happening more and more lately. Getting rid of AV nades might be the answer or not but non vehicle users need a deterrent at least that isn't fully specced proto AV with damage mods. Something to keep tanks from Rolf stomping them with no chance of survival.

Although to keep things fair and positive your stasis grenades might be fun, mind explaining how they would work?

message from Godin: I assume you never played EVE then? well, if you hit, for X amount of time, you slow down by X%. I'd like to see tracking disruptors as well. Those two things will make AV awesome, especially on a scout.

I see you point and thank you for being civil about it; perhaps the numbers I pulled from thin air are a bit much so lowering them would be necessary. However making the. Stackable is probably not a good idea, perhaps 5 STD, 10 ADV, and 15 PRO? With only one grenade to throw. Or 1 seconds for STD 3 for ADV and 5 for Pro and make them stackable?

Edit: fixed errors

message from Godin: Honestly, just having it turn off your HUD and giving you tons of interference would do just fine. I'd flip out and take off it that were ti happen, as without a HUD, and partially/fully blinded, I would be pretty vulnerable. Blaster HAV's need two things to work: sight and the heat bar. Without those 2 things, you're useless in a fight.

Dear Godin,

Every time you post on a thread, or create a thread, you turn it into a troll factory. There's a reason why you were banned. Stay that way.

Now your getting my idea, without your HUD you couldn't aim, turn on hardeners, or see your radar so you'd run am I right? This is the basic idea I had and I thought I had put that in clear enough terms, my apologies.

message from Godin: Actually, you could; just you wouldn't be able to do it effectively. What I was saying is basically like trying to drive normally, but blindfolded.

EDIT: you would still be able to do everything normally, but unless you're a jedi, good luck surviving, as, well you can't see ****.