|
|
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
16
   |
Posted - 2014.01.24 02:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
CCP i normally don't like to make posts asking for any changes or what not, because normal i feel that despite all the problems Dust has you guys are moving (admittedly very slowly) in the right direction. However there is one problem that has continued to be a thorn in the side of players for as long as i have been playing Dust.
That problem is the problem of the murder taxi
the murder taxi has taken mean different forms over the history of dust but the despite changes, patches, hot fixes, and out right nerfs they are still trouble.
no vehicle that requires 0 skill 0 sp and 0 isk to use should be able to instantly kill anything period. This is really the root of the problem that Lavs are damn near impossible to see coming, have enough ehp to tank incoming damage and fast enough that nothing can get out of their way before BOOM its to late.
Now the current murder taxi version is the type people have taken to call the "Jihad Jeep"
While this murder taxi may not be able to run over hordes of ground pounders like it did in uprising, instead it now stalkers and kills tanks in the very same manner that it did to proto suits.
THE EFFECT IS THE SAME!
it is unavoidable, unkillable except of the most luck of shots, and is impossible to see coming.
It is not fair to those people that are well skilled and trained in their chosen field to let something that cost the user NOTHING to be able to completely shut them down
something must be done about this problem CCP in a game where isk is a major factor, these free kills unacceptable
it diminishes the efforts of the people who take the time to skill in to tanks AS WELL as those who skill into AV as it denies them the use of their chosen game play style.
Now before i get a lot of hate for this i know that Vehicle and AV balance is kittened to hell. However that is not an excuse to use broken mechanics to farther break the game.
That is all |
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
16
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 02:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
lol i am not mad i just want to have a fair fight. i pisses me off to bring in a swarm, forge or tank (which ever i feel like that day) to kill a red tank only to find that a **** in a free lav already killed it. it also suck when i Know that it's coming and i have done everything humanly possible to avoid it only to end up dead anyway the only way to beat it is to not play.......
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
16
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 02:49:00 -
[3] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:REs require skill investment and there is no militia or BPO variant of them. They always cost something. I personally applaud the use of Jihad Jeeps, they are effective, inventive, and risky.
first off RE are not the problem if someone can get me with their REs that is fine i am ok with that and i do it my self
it is when you stick said REs to a LAV that there becomes a problem
also you can buy aurum and lp REs that require 0 sp and you dont even have to leave the red line with them as you can just swich to a FREE suit after using them
they also have 0 risk because as i said you can swich to a free suit to drive in as well as use a free lav so this cost the user NOTHING
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
16
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 02:58:00 -
[4] - Quote
Goric Rumis wrote:Glitch116 wrote:no vehicle that requires 0 skill 0 sp and 0 isk to use should be able to instantly kill anything period. I have all kinds of problems with this statement, but as a previous responder pointed out, suicide LAVs are not 0 ISK. If you remove the ISK part of the argument, then you must also believe that militia tanks shouldn't be able to instantly kill anything period, nor militia suits. Do you believe I shouldn't be able to kill with a starter fit? The problem isn't that suicide LAVs are allowed, the problem is that other AV solutions aren't better than rigging up an exploding jeep. I believe you should be able to do it, but I also believe it shouldn't be your best option.
that statement was not to say thay you cant kill will free stuff just that it shouldn't do it in a manner that is impossible to avoid starter fits can be shot and militia tanks can be killed and can do the same however both things leave the person fighting them a fair fight back. murder taxis are not a fair fight.
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
16
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 03:14:00 -
[5] - Quote
Goric Rumis wrote:Glitch116 wrote:Goric Rumis wrote:Glitch116 wrote:no vehicle that requires 0 skill 0 sp and 0 isk to use should be able to instantly kill anything period. I have all kinds of problems with this statement, but as a previous responder pointed out, suicide LAVs are not 0 ISK. If you remove the ISK part of the argument, then you must also believe that militia tanks shouldn't be able to instantly kill anything period, nor militia suits. Do you believe I shouldn't be able to kill with a starter fit? The problem isn't that suicide LAVs are allowed, the problem is that other AV solutions aren't better than rigging up an exploding jeep. I believe you should be able to do it, but I also believe it shouldn't be your best option. that statement was not to say thay you cant kill will free stuff just that it shouldn't do it in a manner that is impossible to avoid starter fits can be shot and militia tanks can be killed and can do the same however both things leave the person fighting them a fair fight back. murder taxis are not a fair fight. Many would disagree where it comes to militia tanks. Most infantry can't even do significant damage to them. And these suicide drivers are hardly impossible to avoid. You're basically dealing with the vehicle version of a scout shotgunning you in the back of the head. If you had better situational awareness or the scout were not as good, you wouldn't die.
while you are right on the militia tank thing that is a problem of vehicle and av balance and is a whole other thing
was it fair when LLAV where running over every suit in the game regardless of fit or skill?
is it fair that murder taxis are destorying every tank regardless of skill or fit?
i have seen murder taxis being called in i know its coming and i have taken ever thing i can do to stop it. unless i am EXTREMLY Luck they get you
i have had these lavs drive right at me making no attempt to avoid my fire at all they just eat the bullets and keep coming
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
16
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 03:16:00 -
[6] - Quote
Hawk Steel1 wrote:Is there any fair fight in Dust?
well........... i cant really answer that one but i how that one day we can get there and i want to help if i can
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
16
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 03:30:00 -
[7] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Glitch116 wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:REs require skill investment and there is no militia or BPO variant of them. They always cost something. I personally applaud the use of Jihad Jeeps, they are effective, inventive, and risky. first off RE are not the problem if someone can get me with their REs that is fine i am ok with that and i do it my self it is when you stick said REs to a LAV that there becomes a problem also you can buy aurum and lp REs that require 0 sp and you dont even have to leave the red line with them as you can just swich to a FREE suit after using them they also have 0 risk because as i said you can swich to a free suit to drive in as well as use a free lav so this cost the user NOTHING They had to buy the free LAV. It costs $50.
so i pay money to win?
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
16
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 03:31:00 -
[8] - Quote
TheEnd762 wrote:If swarms and FGs didn't function like water balloons and BB guns respectively, the Jihad Jeep wouldn't even be a thing, so until they're fixed, get used to it.
even if you do that some people will still take the free isk risk free route
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
16
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 03:32:00 -
[9] - Quote
Munin-Frey wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:REs require skill investment and there is no militia or BPO variant of them. They always cost something. I personally applaud the use of Jihad Jeeps, they are effective, inventive, and risky. And they require some actual skill to hit something while going fast enough to explode. I like them, they are the AV infantry needs.
the same arguement was used with then LLAV back in the early uprising do you thing that was fair or took skill?
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
16
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 03:41:00 -
[10] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Glitch116 wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:Glitch116 wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:REs require skill investment and there is no militia or BPO variant of them. They always cost something. I personally applaud the use of Jihad Jeeps, they are effective, inventive, and risky. first off RE are not the problem if someone can get me with their REs that is fine i am ok with that and i do it my self it is when you stick said REs to a LAV that there becomes a problem also you can buy aurum and lp REs that require 0 sp and you dont even have to leave the red line with them as you can just swich to a FREE suit after using them they also have 0 risk because as i said you can swich to a free suit to drive in as well as use a free lav so this cost the user NOTHING They had to buy the free LAV. It costs $50. so i pay money to win? No, you pay money to save ISK. They could do the same thing with a MLT LAV that you have to purchase. Pay to Win refers to when you pay RL money to have an item that has better stats. BPO LAVs are statistically identical to MLT LAVs.
that is true of the LAVS themselves but as i stated earlier you can also get the REs for no isk or sp and never have to lose them
you have an unlimited supply of these which can insta pop any tank on the field no matter what
sounds like pay to win to me
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
|
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
17
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 06:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Denn Maell wrote:This sounds like a problem the real world military found themselves in. Do hardeners and shields not prevent this?
(real question, since the vehicle redesign was supposed to be along the lines of 'Waves of opportunity")
no hardeners are not enough to save you even 2 hardeners can be beaten
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
17
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 06:15:00 -
[12] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Glitch116 wrote:
that is true of the LAVS themselves but as i stated earlier you can also get the REs for no isk or sp and never have to lose them
you have an unlimited supply of these which can insta pop any tank on the field no matter what
sounds like pay to win to me
There is no way to get unlimited REs. They don't have a BPO. There are also no Militia REs. At the very least, a Jihad Jeep costs: [Starter] fit suit: free BPO LAV: $50 or Militia LAV: 25000 ISK? About that much at least. and Remote Explosives: About 1000 ISK. or Aurum REs: 20 AUR. At the very least a Jihad Jeep will run you 1000 ISK or 20 AUR per death. For most people it runs them about 26000 ISK. Considering the low cost of HAVs nowadays, this is reasonable. There is no risk free Jihad Jeep.
the suit you equip your REs never has to leave the red line you can switch to your RE suit slap them on and then switch to a free starter suit
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
17
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 06:20:00 -
[13] - Quote
TheEnd762 wrote:Glitch116 wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:Glitch116 wrote:
that is true of the LAVS themselves but as i stated earlier you can also get the REs for no isk or sp and never have to lose them
you have an unlimited supply of these which can insta pop any tank on the field no matter what
sounds like pay to win to me
There is no way to get unlimited REs. They don't have a BPO. There are also no Militia REs. At the very least, a Jihad Jeep costs: [Starter] fit suit: free BPO LAV: $50 or Militia LAV: 25000 ISK? About that much at least. and Remote Explosives: About 1000 ISK. or Aurum REs: 20 AUR. At the very least a Jihad Jeep will run you 1000 ISK or 20 AUR per death. For most people it runs them about 26000 ISK. Considering the low cost of HAVs nowadays, this is reasonable. There is no risk free Jihad Jeep. the suit you equip your REs never has to leave the red line you can switch to your RE suit slap them on and then switch to a free starter suit They just detonate on impact?
yep when the LAV dies from hitting the tank it sets off the REs
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
17
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 06:30:00 -
[14] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Glitch116 wrote:Denn Maell wrote:This sounds like a problem the real world military found themselves in. Do hardeners and shields not prevent this?
(real question, since the vehicle redesign was supposed to be along the lines of 'Waves of opportunity") no hardeners are not enough to save you even 2 hardeners can be beaten You are exaggerating. 2 hardeners on an Armor Tank will put its armor alone at over 10K. 2 hardeners on a Shield Tank will put its shield HP at over 10K. Unless they are using 7 REs (which you need Demolitions V to do) and ramming you at full speed, you'll survive.
REs deal 1500 damage
with the aurum, lvl1, and lp Res that 9 REs total for a grand total of 13500 damage thats a **** ton to take in one shoot
plus Res are explosives so bonus damge to armor
plus the damage you take form the LAV hitting you
i have taken close to 20k damage from a murder taxi
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
17
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 06:43:00 -
[15] - Quote
Azri Sarum wrote:Against infantry I find them to be in a perfectly balanced state, outside of the occasions where they fail to show on the minimap at all. A couple RE's and they will be a burning husk in no time.
As for vs tanks, i think its more a symptom of being able to spam 6+ by a single suit, and all of the other AV options sucking vs the current tanks.
I for one would prefer we balance things, and not disregard the clever things players can come up with.
true however this cant go on like these because it screws with any attempt to balance it needs to be removed from the equation so that we can test and find out what really works. broken mechanics are not a reason to farther break the game
the main problem with it is really the fact that
1. LAV explode if they so much as little tap a tank
2. equipment spam in general
3. REs exploding on destruction
the best thing to fix this i think is number 3 because there really is no need for that to happen dont know what everyone else thinks though
again the problem is not the LAVs or the REs themselves just the combo of them
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
17
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 06:48:00 -
[16] - Quote
Lonewolf Heavy wrote:Glitch116 wrote:lol i am not mad i just want to have a fair fight. i pisses me off to bring in a swarm, forge or tank (which ever i feel like that day) to kill a red tank only to find that a **** in a free lav already killed it. it also suck when i Know that it's coming and i have done everything humanly possible to avoid it only to end up dead anyway the only way to beat it is to not play....... Secret to most Jihad Jeeps, They have to have their R/Es on the front bumper or on the hood becuse they are driving straight at you in a suicide attempt. Nail the front of their Jeep with a single shot and they explode. I don't see it as a problem. I AV, but i dont mind the Jeeps killing tanks for me. It lets me just go back to hacking installations and the objective. When my buddies tank they get a little flustered about it but then we just laugh it off because it is funny plus the fact is, They managed to hit their tank even though even a single stray bullet could blow them up (I have used the suicide jeeps myself, and I laugh so hard when im about to hit a tank, and some random stray bullet hits my bumper and my LAV explodes and barrelrolls onto the tank)
hitting that small explosive on the front of a wildly moving LAV is damn near impossible
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
17
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 07:01:00 -
[17] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Glitch116 wrote:Azri Sarum wrote:Against infantry I find them to be in a perfectly balanced state, outside of the occasions where they fail to show on the minimap at all. A couple RE's and they will be a burning husk in no time.
As for vs tanks, i think its more a symptom of being able to spam 6+ by a single suit, and all of the other AV options sucking vs the current tanks.
I for one would prefer we balance things, and not disregard the clever things players can come up with. true however this cant go on like these because it screws with any attempt to balance it needs to be removed from the equation so that we can test and find out what really works. broken mechanics are not a reason to farther break the game the main problem with it is really the fact that 1. LAV explode if they so much as little tap a tank 2. equipment spam in general 3. REs exploding on destruction the best thing to fix this i think is number 3 because there really is no need for that to happen dont know what everyone else thinks though again the problem is not the LAVs or the REs themselves just the combo of them People are using Jihad Jeeps out of nessecity. There are only 3 effective AV options right now, Rail Tanks, Jihad Jeeps, and Assault Dropships. Jihad Jeeps are the cheapest option that works. If there were real vailbe AV options, you would see their numbers go down.
while yes you are right that current AV is lacking this problem will not just go away due to how cheap and effective it is people will still do it even if AV is strong because DUST is so massive dependent on Isk if people can do more or the same with less isk they will
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
17
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 07:10:00 -
[18] - Quote
Lynn Beck wrote:Haha, this is fun to read!
Thankfully i have both a tanker alt AND guristas LAV's with demo V.
I don't care that it takes a jihad jeep to kill a tank, you know what's more annoying? Having an ADV blaster tank die to a mlt rail IN CQC. Before you can even begin to circle around him he's already landed 4 shots on you, which is double the amount needed to kill you.
So put up with it wannabe tanker/failAV.
I've killed quite a few HAV's using Dau/5 forgies, i killed one with a federation allotek plc, and i've killed 2 tanks with state wyrrkomi's, if FW wasn't botched i'd still be earning LP for wyrrkomi's, they're pretty darn effective.
^_^
i have been tanking and AVing in Dust from the very beginning i have tanked though every single build of this game and never have i seen something so brutally unbalanced as this
i have had a maxed out tank for over a year now there is nothing i can skill to be any better with my tank
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
Glitch116
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
Legacy Rising
18
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 07:44:00 -
[19] - Quote
TheEnd762 wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:
People are using Jihad Jeeps out of nessecity. There are only 3 effective AV options right now, Rail Tanks, Jihad Jeeps, and Assault Dropships. Jihad Jeeps are the cheapest option that works. If there were real vailbe AV options, you would see their numbers go down.
This.
while yes you are right that current AV is lacking this problem will not just go away due to how cheap and effective it is people will still do it even if AV is strong because DUST is so massive dependent on Isk if people can do more or the same with less isk they will
this
I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!!
deal with it
|
|
|
| |
|