We'll... Hum... Isn't that to point of leveling scout up? For the bonus CPU/PG it gives you towards fitting cloaks?

Edit: wow those numbers up above make me sad. Nvm.

A new scout coming in will be running my ADV suit at STD and they'll passively beat all but proto scanners passive where until now that took scout 5 and dampening 3. They've got it much easier than the current scouts.

Who cares?

Everyone wanted scouts to be viable WITHOUT A CLOAK.

Guess what? It's more than viable without a cloak.

No different then logistics suits unable to fit good equipment until level 5. It's not a requirement to use a cloak on a scout suit.

So what about heavies and HMGs?

Weaponry 5 is not exactly cheap either.

Nope the Cloak needs to be hard to fit. Its kinda the end game for scouts.

Just think of it as a trail of becoming a scout. Once you get to lvl 5 you get to bask in the glory that is the scout.

Hey new players! Want to try heavy weapons? Tough luck.

And nobody cares. New players need to first practice basic shooting before they get into advanced game mechanics.

Gastun's HMG at max skills

No overheat.

The cloak is the endgame for a scout, it has to be something to strive for that requires some SP expenditure. Make it too easy and we have to make everything easier.

To be a heavy HMG user for instance, requires unlocking the suits which needs more SP, weaponry V, a high level of Engineering and Electronics to fit it and have enought PG & CPU to fit decent modules.

Why should scouts have access to such a powerful tool without having to investing in the core and support skills to properly fit it?

That said, I'm in favour of a milita version but let's make it so it's CPU and PG needs requires a higher level of core skills to run it.

The current TCM for the skills and how some are more 'difficult' to learn and need more effort from the player is about the only balanced thing in the game. Let's not mess around with it please.

So how is this different from old players like me who hasn't skilled into scout at all?

The flip side of this problem, which I'm pretty sympathetic to, is that if the fitting costs aren't prohibitive then any suit can fit them win out having to sacrifice much else, and then we have the problem of cloaking slayer logis or whatever. It has to be high and then reduced down to the ground by the suit that is intended to run it the most.

In EvE this is handled by role bonuses on suits, and to my mind they work admirably. If the cloak is a scout essential then the suit should just have a CPU and pg reduction built into it that doesn't require skill ranks to make it workable.

So a cloak is hard to fit on a militia light, just as it would be hard to fit on militia mediums, no? I don't see the problem with that.

For new players who'd like to try playing with a cloak without having to spend SP they could just add a few AUR scouts that come equipped with a cloak (and have the rest of the modules built into the stats and no or few free slots) -- that's kinda the business model they have anyway.

Being a rookie is hard. If they could fit a militia cloak they'd all be hiding the whole match, ruining their fits just to carry a cloak. I agree that it should be something for true scouts to work towards because it will be so powerful. Learn to be stealthy without one first.

Fair enough, impossible. I still don't see the problem (considering how everything in this game works, that is).

No I don't. And I'm known as being the cheerleader for a vastly improved NPE. But once again, the cloaking is something to work for, like the HMG or Forge gun for a heavy. Expecting everything to be availble to you on day one in a free to play game, is not a good idea.

Pretty sure the new scouts will be able to fit a cloak even with the skill at no more than level1. It'll take some sacrifices but shouldn't be *that* much worse compared to what a low-SP char can fit otherwise. Having do dedicate slots to CPU/PG upgrades, or even leave them empty, isn't that big a deal when the alternative is, at best, standard level modules.

Not being able to try specialisations without either SP or AUR is very much in keeping with the rest of the game.

My god, they must skill into scouts a bit to fit cloaks designed for scouts?! What sort of herasy is this?! Milita scouts should be able to fit these easy!

New players shouldn't be able to use a cloak. Like in EvE you have spend time/training to get it, why should it be different for dust?

As for putting a cloak on a MLT suit. Thank **** they can't do that from day one!

I'm not understanding the problem here. I was uderthe assumption that scouts in general were getting buffed. Just because youare a scout does not mean you NEED to fit a cloak. Scouts are suposed to move faster, be harder to detect etc.

Wth that logic scouts (in theory) are all ready really hard to detect, and an intelligent player is doing things other than stacking damage mods and gunning while standing in the middle of the fight.

I would think cloak would have very specific uses like passing through heavy fighting to plant an uplink or take care of other uplinks. I don't think the idea is to run with cloak on a fitting at all times. You use it for times where it is necessary.

I would HOPE that this is CCP learning from our current "slayer logi" nonsense and attempting to prevent scouts fromm being the new FoTM.

Well, with level 1 for any scout suit you have enough PG and CPU to fit a cloak on it. All but caldari have two or more low slots for CPU/PG upgrades, pretty sure you can squeeze in a weapon there without too much trouble.

I meant the scout is a specialisation. What is the problem with its "defining characteristic" requiring that you, you know, specialise before you can use it?

They're not exclusive to light frames so you can still make exotic fittings with other suits. You're just talking about a crap militia suit here. And Engineering is something everybody should max out sooner or later anyways.

I actually like this.

Being a true scout is hard work and requires lots of personal experience. Making your work to make things easier (cloak) is kind of what scouts have had to deal with this whole time.

If you want to be a real scout then the training you will go through without the cloak will teach you the tactics you need to survive. Once you have learned enough then you will be gifted with the cloak to unlock a new world of strategies.

Not to be mean but...so?

Isn't it better anyway? Newbies running around in cloaks and cloak spam would be annoying. I mean we're going to get a lot of players trying to spam it already but sheesh.

Hey guess what?

If you are a new or trial account player in EVE online you can't try out cloaking devices there either! Go figure they applied the same rule to both games.