DUST Search - Why are all minmatar suits losing their base armor rep rate in 1.8?

D legendary hero wrote:

Ventis Gant wrote:

I see a reason why the Minmatar are having problems. As several have pointed out, the strength of the Minmatar lies in speed, which is not enough of an advantage given the low TTK we have right now, and high damage weapons, which any other race can use. These racial traits are taken from EVE, where speed matters a LOT. And in EVE, every ship intended for combat that I am aware of gets bonuses to a weapon type, most often to a racial weapon. So in EVE, the only ones who can make full use of the mighty Minmatar projectile weapons are the Minmatar. Anyone else using them gives up the bonus to racial weapons on their own ships.

The solution to this is simple. Give most of the suits a bonus to racial weapons (we also need a full suite of racial weapons for everyone of course), and nerf these weapons a bit. Then, for example, only a Minmatar suit can get full intended damage out of the CR. Anyone else using it will get significantly less damage out of them. In EVE, most common multiplier for damage is 5% per level, but this could obviously be adjusted to whatever value is necessary. I like the 5% value. This would mean that at skill level three, which is easily reachable, a suit using its racial weapons would do 15% more damage than a user of another race using the same weapons. That is enough to encourage most players to stick with their own race's weapons.

I am not advocating a net boost to weapon damage, note. Just that only a racial suit can get the maximum balanced amount of damage out of a given weapon. Basic suits should also get this modifier. Racial bonuses can also be used for things other than damage. Think things like range, ammo, accuracy, etc. For instance, maybe a Caldari suit is the only one that can really get the great hipfire accuracy that is the hallmark of the rail weapons. For everyone else they aren't as accurate. Just some examples of how racial bonuses could be used to keep racial weapons with their racial suits. You can still use anything you want that you can fit, but fitting against bonuses is usually not the right way to go.

This isn't just about the weapons but about making the suit better itself.... if the suit sucks then people from other races will just use minmatar weapons to the same efficacy. even if they lose their bonus beause they can tank it better (ehp wise they can endure the weapon fire longer thn we can)...


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Ventis Gant Goibhniu Industries 41	Posted - 2014.02.04 05:27:00 - [1] - Quote I see a reason why the Minmatar are having problems. As several have pointed out, the strength of the Minmatar lies in speed, which is not enough of an advantage given the low TTK we have right now, and high damage weapons, which any other race can use. These racial traits are taken from EVE, where speed matters a LOT. And in EVE, every ship intended for combat that I am aware of gets bonuses to a weapon type, most often to a racial weapon. So in EVE, the only ones who can make full use of the mighty Minmatar projectile weapons are the Minmatar. Anyone else using them gives up the bonus to racial weapons on their own ships. The solution to this is simple. Give most of the suits a bonus to racial weapons (we also need a full suite of racial weapons for everyone of course), and nerf these weapons a bit. Then, for example, only a Minmatar suit can get full intended damage out of the CR. Anyone else using it will get significantly less damage out of them. In EVE, most common multiplier for damage is 5% per level, but this could obviously be adjusted to whatever value is necessary. I like the 5% value. This would mean that at skill level three, which is easily reachable, a suit using its racial weapons would do 15% more damage than a user of another race using the same weapons. That is enough to encourage most players to stick with their own race's weapons. I am not advocating a net boost to weapon damage, note. Just that only a racial suit can get the maximum balanced amount of damage out of a given weapon. Basic suits should also get this modifier. Racial bonuses can also be used for things other than damage. Think things like range, ammo, accuracy, etc. For instance, maybe a Caldari suit is the only one that can really get the great hipfire accuracy that is the hallmark of the rail weapons. For everyone else they aren't as accurate. Just some examples of how racial bonuses could be used to keep racial weapons with their racial suits. You can still use anything you want that you can fit, but fitting against bonuses is usually not the right way to go.
Ventis Gant Goibhniu Industries 44	Posted - 2014.02.05 01:32:00 - [2] - Quote D legendary hero wrote: Ventis Gant wrote: I see a reason why the Minmatar are having problems. As several have pointed out, the strength of the Minmatar lies in speed, which is not enough of an advantage given the low TTK we have right now, and high damage weapons, which any other race can use. These racial traits are taken from EVE, where speed matters a LOT. And in EVE, every ship intended for combat that I am aware of gets bonuses to a weapon type, most often to a racial weapon. So in EVE, the only ones who can make full use of the mighty Minmatar projectile weapons are the Minmatar. Anyone else using them gives up the bonus to racial weapons on their own ships. The solution to this is simple. Give most of the suits a bonus to racial weapons (we also need a full suite of racial weapons for everyone of course), and nerf these weapons a bit. Then, for example, only a Minmatar suit can get full intended damage out of the CR. Anyone else using it will get significantly less damage out of them. In EVE, most common multiplier for damage is 5% per level, but this could obviously be adjusted to whatever value is necessary. I like the 5% value. This would mean that at skill level three, which is easily reachable, a suit using its racial weapons would do 15% more damage than a user of another race using the same weapons. That is enough to encourage most players to stick with their own race's weapons. I am not advocating a net boost to weapon damage, note. Just that only a racial suit can get the maximum balanced amount of damage out of a given weapon. Basic suits should also get this modifier. Racial bonuses can also be used for things other than damage. Think things like range, ammo, accuracy, etc. For instance, maybe a Caldari suit is the only one that can really get the great hipfire accuracy that is the hallmark of the rail weapons. For everyone else they aren't as accurate. Just some examples of how racial bonuses could be used to keep racial weapons with their racial suits. You can still use anything you want that you can fit, but fitting against bonuses is usually not the right way to go. This isn't just about the weapons but about making the suit better itself.... if the suit sucks then people from other races will just use minmatar weapons to the same efficacy. even if they lose their bonus beause they can tank it better (ehp wise they can endure the weapon fire longer thn we can)... I didn't call it out, but speed should also matter. A straight line speed bonus is probably not effective either. You don't have time to run away before you die in most cases. The straight line still needs a boost, but the real boost that minmatar especially and all scouts generally need is strafe. I realize that this existed at one time and was nerfed, but the other suits have gotten a lot of love since then. A heavy especially should not be able to stay on target on a strafing scout in CQC, and it is debatable whether the medium suits should be able to either. Beyond that though, I also want to see racial weapon boosts as a matter of flavor. In EVE, you rarely see a ship fitting against bonuses. It does happen, in certain cases, but you won't typically see a ship bonused for lasers fitting hybrids, for instance.