DUST Search - Hold off on AV buff until 1.9

Logi Bro wrote:

The Attorney General wrote:

Logi Bro wrote:

Don't pretend for one second that 1.0-1.6 was as bad for tanks as 1.7 is currently for AV.

Lets see:

75m render range. I think that since infantry can see tanks at all times, they have a HUGE advantage in this regard.
Didn't really matter when you could nitro your way to safety at the first hint of damage. Can infantry equip a nitro to gtfo in 1.7 when a blaster tank rolls up from invisible-land? Nope.

Having weapons that could destroy you from outside that render range, in the time it took for you to activate your repper and hardeners.
See above. Also, bullshit on the, "before you can activate hardeners and reps," part. I had a 3mil tanker alt in pre1.7, and I could easily trollolololl my way out when I started getting hit by forges/swarms.

Slower than LLAV's so that any infantry man with even advanced grenades and advanced swarms(700k SP investment) could easily destroy any tank.
I believe I already mentioned nitro, you were a bad tanker if didn't have one of those equipped at all times.

LLAVs stronger than tanks to deliver those infantry right up on you to grenade you to death.
You could have just rammed them and instakilled them, that's still a problem for LAVs even now.

Plus we had the time where you couldn't recall, then we had the bugged turrets that wouldn't allow you to fire if you activated too many modules in a short amount of time.
What, you mean you couldn't use the, "hide behind a wall, jump out, and recall," exploit to get away from AV? How sad.

Does your gun pop you up in the air if you touch a wall with it? Ours did.
A bug, not a gameplay mechanic. Obviously that is something that needed to be fixed.

I can see how this seems bad for you right now, but you still have meaningful counters to tanks. Tanks had no counter to invisi swarms and forges. There was no counter to invisible turrets that would not draw no matter what you did.
Any meaningful counters besides strapping REs to an LAV and ramming? Unless you consider having to spec into PRO AV in order to dent a MLT HAV a, "meaningful counter?"

Tankers had it much worse than infantry has it now. No question.
I beg to differ, back then, infantry were simply in hard to reach places. Now, tanks are in incredibly easy to reach places, but simply unkillable without the highest tier of AV.


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The Attorney General 1828	Posted - 2014.01.20 20:54:00 - [1] - Quote Nah, swarms need and will receive a touch up. However, because of scrubs like the guy who posted second, expect some reactionary over buffing. Heaven forbid people learn how to make things work instead of relying on swarms because everything else requires aim. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
The Attorney General 1832	Posted - 2014.01.20 21:01:00 - [2] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Let's see how the Caldari Sentinal with Forge and Minmitar Commando with Swarm Launcher do. Let's not. Let's fck tanks over the way they've fcked infantry for the last few weeks. Because tanks didn't get f'd over for all of 1.0-1.6? Tell yourself that, self delusion is great to witness. If we follow your logic, AV needs a good six months more of being down before you guys get your relief. Thankfully, most tankers are not half as ignorant and vindictive as you lot are. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
The Attorney General 1835	Posted - 2014.01.20 21:25:00 - [3] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: Don't pretend for one second that 1.0-1.6 was as bad for tanks as 1.7 is currently for AV. Lets see: 75m render range. I think that since infantry can see tanks at all times, they have a HUGE advantage in this regard. Having weapons that could destroy you from outside that render range, in the time it took for you to activate your repper and hardeners. Slower than LLAV's so that any infantry man with even advanced grenades and advanced swarms(700k SP investment) could easily destroy any tank. LLAVs stronger than tanks to deliver those infantry right up on you to grenade you to death. Plus we had the time where you couldn't recall, then we had the bugged turrets that wouldn't allow you to fire if you activated too many modules in a short amount of time. Does your gun pop you up in the air if you touch a wall with it? Ours did. I can see how this seems bad for you right now, but you still have meaningful counters to tanks. Tanks had no counter to invisi swarms and forges. There was no counter to invisible turrets that would not draw no matter what you did. Tankers had it much worse than infantry has it now. No question. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
The Attorney General 1837	Posted - 2014.01.20 21:45:00 - [4] - Quote Rusty Shallows wrote: However last NovemberDecember when seeing AV Nerfs and saying, "let's wait and see if this is part of the rebalancing," has become a major regret. What does this mean? It was a part of the rebalancing. They didn't nerf AV and leave tanks as they were, they overhauled everything at once. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
The Attorney General 1839	Posted - 2014.01.20 21:55:00 - [5] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: The Attorney General wrote: Logi Bro wrote: Don't pretend for one second that 1.0-1.6 was as bad for tanks as 1.7 is currently for AV. Lets see: 75m render range. I think that since infantry can see tanks at all times, they have a HUGE advantage in this regard. Didn't really matter when you could nitro your way to safety at the first hint of damage. Can infantry equip a nitro to gtfo in 1.7 when a blaster tank rolls up from invisible-land? Nope. Having weapons that could destroy you from outside that render range, in the time it took for you to activate your repper and hardeners. See above. Also, bullshit on the, "before you can activate hardeners and reps," part. I had a 3mil tanker alt in pre1.7, and I could easily trollolololl my way out when I started getting hit by forges/swarms. Slower than LLAV's so that any infantry man with even advanced grenades and advanced swarms(700k SP investment) could easily destroy any tank. I believe I already mentioned nitro, you were a bad tanker if didn't have one of those equipped at all times. LLAVs stronger than tanks to deliver those infantry right up on you to grenade you to death. You could have just rammed them and instakilled them, that's still a problem for LAVs even now. Plus we had the time where you couldn't recall, then we had the bugged turrets that wouldn't allow you to fire if you activated too many modules in a short amount of time. What, you mean you couldn't use the, "hide behind a wall, jump out, and recall," exploit to get away from AV? How sad. Does your gun pop you up in the air if you touch a wall with it? Ours did. A bug, not a gameplay mechanic. Obviously that is something that needed to be fixed. I can see how this seems bad for you right now, but you still have meaningful counters to tanks. Tanks had no counter to invisi swarms and forges. There was no counter to invisible turrets that would not draw no matter what you did. Any meaningful counters besides strapping REs to an LAV and ramming? Unless you consider having to spec into PRO AV in order to dent a MLT HAV a, "meaningful counter?" Tankers had it much worse than infantry has it now. No question. I beg to differ, back then, infantry were simply in hard to reach places. Now, tanks are in incredibly easy to reach places, but simply unkillable without the highest tier of AV. Yeah, that just reads like someone who never tanked in PC. So unless you had some experience tanking against people with properly skilled AV then your opinion isn't really valid. Considering that I have had a prof 5 forge toon since uprising started, I know exactly how easy it was to kill tanks in 1.0 -1.6. Because I was max skilled on both sides of the matter. I still kill tanks within a couple of seconds of contact now. MLT, STD, doesn't matter. The worst that I will do is drive them off on fire. Once the forge gets its charge reduced to 1.6 levels, even more tanks will be popping with ease. You know whats really funny is that there are so many shield tanks running around, that if have of the complainers just ran proto fluxes, those tanks mostly become one hitters. But I guess using a grenade that doesn't track for you is too much work for the "skilled" infantry to use. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
The Attorney General 1844	Posted - 2014.01.20 22:15:00 - [6] - Quote Rusty Shallows wrote: They said it was rebalancing. I even supported it as such. In the end it was just crazy nerfing and buffing. The current game title Tanks514 pretty much sums it up. If you want to be literal, it was a rebalancing. Beyond that, the swarm nerf went too far, the PLC was already screwed, and the Forge got left pretty usable, although it really needs the charge reduction to 1.6 levels to make it a serious threat to vehicles. AV nades were made into a very potent supplemental AV option instead of a primary option, which is better for game balance. The only reason why Tanks 514 is even being allowed is because people would rather follow the herd than do their own thing. I can assure you that if I am playing on my heavy, there is no such thing as easy mode tanking. Too bad there are not many players with a similar mindset to protect the infantry who would rather die in a medium frame than spec heavy and destroy vehicles. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
The Attorney General 1846	Posted - 2014.01.20 22:19:00 - [7] - Quote Regnier Feros wrote: offtopic does anyone know how to calculate weapon dps? Roughly Rof * damage/60 Mr. Hybrid Vayu.