DUST Search - To the rifle variant users, do you even use the prototype variants?

Aero Yassavi wrote:

The Robot Devil wrote:

1) Do you use Advanced variants?
I use the ELM.

2) Do you use Prototype variants?
No

3) If yes to either, how often do you use them?
Once or twice every 5 or so games.

4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet?
60M

5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair?
Yes, I think that a merc should be able to use a better rifle because they have the skill and the money.

I just started using a standard breech AR last Thursday instead of the BPO AR I normally use. Other than that I use a BPO smg or Templar weapon. I am not a good shot so buying expensive weapons makes no sense. I spend my ISK on logi stuff and modules.

Hello Robot Devil! I believe there was a miscommunication here. By advanced variants and prototype variants, I mean advanced and prototype versions of rifle variants, with the list of what that entails in the original post. The ELM-7 is an advanced variant of the laser rifle, but it is not an advanced version of a rifle variant, which is what this thread is about. Hope that clears things up.

GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."

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Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4791	Posted - 2014.01.13 01:29:00 - [1] - Quote Just curious. By rifle variants, I mean -Assault Scrambler Rifles -Assault Combat Rifles -Assault Rail Rifles -Tactical Assault Rifles -Breach Assault Rifles -Burst Assault Rifles And then non-variants would be the regular base version. When you look at the cost value at advanced and proto level, you have the following Advanced Non-Variants: 10,770 ISK Advanced Variants: 17,625 ISK Prototype Non-Variants: 47,220 ISK Prototype Variants: 77,280 ISK You're looking at a 6,855 ISK difference between variant and non-variant at the Advanced level, but a 30,060 ISK difference at the Prototype level. That is a 36,450 ISK premium to go from Advanced to Prototype on non-variants, but a 59,655 ISK difference to go from Advanced to Prototype on variants. So here's a few questions: 1) Do you use Advanced variants? 2) Do you use Prototype variants? 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? As for me, 1) Yes 2) Yes 3) I use Advanced variants quite frequently, but rarely use Prototype variants. 4) 75 million ISK. Enough to play the game comfortably, but not enough to ignore prices. 5) I do believe it is fair to have a premium on the variants, as to encourage the use of the base weapon. However, I believe the premium at the prototype level is ridiculous. It is more painful losing one of these than it is a prototype suit. Personally, I would like to see the price lowered to say around 60k ISK. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Scheneighnay McBob Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 3550	Posted - 2014.01.13 01:32:00 - [2] - Quote Better question: I saw in a FW someone on the enemy team (they were redlined) teamkill somone with a prototype burst AR. There are so many layers to that wtf. Why teamkill with something that expensive? Why use something that expensive if you're redlined? Why use a burst AR? We used to have a time machine
Azri Sarum BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 257	Posted - 2014.01.13 01:39:00 - [3] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: So here's a few questions: 1) Do you use Advanced variants? 2) Do you use Prototype variants? 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? Yes - the ACR Yes - ACR I use advanced every FW match. The prototype doesent see much use tbh 250m I never gave it much thought, but looking at the numbers, no. We are talking a 64% increase in cost and it leaves me asking why? In all honesty the ACR is more balanced than the stock CR because modded controllers have no effect. So we are paying more for simply a different feel? That does not feel right. For what we are paying we should be getting something. If we get nothing then the prices should be normalized. EVE - Victor Maximus DUST - Azri Sarum
Patrick57 Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 3864	Posted - 2014.01.13 01:42:00 - [4] - Quote I don't use much Advanced, certainly not weapons. But in PC I use the Assault Combat Rifle, because IMO it is better than the non-variant Combat Rifle.
Racro 01 Arifistan 501st Knights of Leanbox INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 107	Posted - 2014.01.13 01:48:00 - [5] - Quote So here's a few questions: 1) Do you use Advanced variants? 2) Do you use Prototype variants? 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? 1)not really 2)i love my credron breach AR's now extened range while reteing its ridiculous damge 3) been useing the creobreach sinc ei got my gall assault gko 4) **** all. between maxed out tanker and 5 proto guns and proto suit. always low on isk. 5) personally i like how much they are atm but they are quite expensive and could do with 20-30k price reduction so they are more than base varient but slightly.
Leadfoot10 molon labe. Public Disorder. 229	Posted - 2014.01.13 01:49:00 - [6] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: So here's a few questions: 1) Do you use Advanced variants? 2) Do you use Prototype variants? 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? I use the Assault RR. 1) Yes. 2) Yes. 3) About 50/50 -- some suits I run can fit the Proto one, others require the advanced. 4) ~ $150m 6) 77k seems steep for the Proto Assault RR to me. FWIW, I tend to run the AUR version of the Proto Assault RR -- I bought a few hundred with spare AUR when I didn't have the SP to buy the ISK one and I haven't yet run out. But to be honest, I don't see much of a difference between the advanced and proto one. That said, I tend to support the overall idea of upper tier weapons being multiple times more expensive than their advanced counterparts -- it causes players with $200k+ suits to think twice before using them (or ensuring their wallet is fairly large before they do).
Fire of Prometheus DUST University Ivy League 2831	Posted - 2014.01.13 01:51:00 - [7] - Quote The only variant I use the assault scrambler rifle, but I only use the adv variant :p Commando 6 // ARC Commander // D-Uni instructor
Vicious Minotaur Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 541	Posted - 2014.01.13 01:55:00 - [8] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: So here's a few questions: 1) Do you use Advanced variants? 2) Do you use Prototype variants? 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? 1) Yes, the assault Combat rifle 2) Nope 3) I only bring out my advanced variants if I have some isk to burn, or I simply want a slightly different feel to a weapon. And that all happens once in a blue moon, because I am cheap. 4) 40 million isk, give or take. 5) Nope. The rifle variants are not necessarily better. And in some cases, they are worse (AR). All they do is offer a slightly different feel to the weapon. The differences are slight, and you pay a premium price for those small differences, for some reason. It makes no sense. It never did.
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4793	Posted - 2014.01.13 01:59:00 - [9] - Quote Great feedback guys, keep it up! ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Sinboto Simmons SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 3972	Posted - 2014.01.13 02:06:00 - [10] - Quote Sometimes, I like the burst though Sinboto - The True Blood Minja Forum Warrior level 3 STB-Infantry (Demolition)

Azri Sarum BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 258	Posted - 2014.01.13 02:13:00 - [11] - Quote Question 5 got me curious so I took a look at the market. While the rifles and their variants cost different amounts of isk, their price in AUR is the same. Getting some mixed messages here CCP... I think the variants isk costs are just a holdover from the past, and are just needing updating. EVE - Victor Maximus DUST - Azri Sarum
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4796	Posted - 2014.01.13 02:14:00 - [12] - Quote Azri Sarum wrote: Question 5 got me curious so I took a look at the market. While the rifles and their variants cost different amounts of isk, their price in AUR is the same. Getting some mixed messages here CCP... I think the variants isk costs are just a holdover from the past, and are just needing updating. Very interesting, going to add this to the OP. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 3239	Posted - 2014.01.13 02:26:00 - [13] - Quote Yes Yes Rarely use Proto 34.4M Yes Breach AR FTW You wanna battle / Aztec's not afraid of you / I could care less about your reputation / Even though it maybe true.
Viktor Hadah Jr Critical-Impact 1863	Posted - 2014.01.13 02:28:00 - [14] - Quote I use to use the Assault scram rifle in my logi fit until the combat rifles came out. Selling Templar BPO 300Mil Earn 50Mil+ ISK in Dust
Zekain K Expert Intervention Caldari State 1015	Posted - 2014.01.13 02:40:00 - [15] - Quote 1) Do you use Advanced variants:Yes 2) Do you use Prototype variants:Yes 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them: I manly use the AVD types because going proto in a pub game is a waste of time. Ill use the proto gear in FW, or PC though. 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet: 300 million 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair: Nope. *CALDARI not so MASTER RACE* Forum Warrior Level: 10
Luk Manag of Terror TRE GAFFEL 289	Posted - 2014.01.13 03:01:00 - [16] - Quote 1. Yes. 2. Yes. 3. The Six Kin ACR is pretty swell, but the price is silly. I run the ACR constantly, but I would run out of ISK if I ran suits that cost more than most tanks. 4. 45mil, but my reserves are held in equipment. 300 tanks and about 1200 fitted proto suits. 5. Not really. The price isn't proportional to the increased DPS. The only reason to run with it is for the status..."see how much ISK I can blow?" I've lost less than 100 Six Kin ACRs so far. There will be bullets. ACR+SMG
The Robot Devil molon labe. Public Disorder. 1527	Posted - 2014.01.13 03:02:00 - [17] - Quote 1) Do you use Advanced variants? I use the ELM. 2) Do you use Prototype variants? No 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? Once or twice every 5 or so games. 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 60M 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? Yes, I think that a merc should be able to use a better rifle because they have the skill and the money. I just started using a standard breech AR last Thursday instead of the BPO AR I normally use. Other than that I use a BPO smg or Templar weapon. I am not a good shot so buying expensive weapons makes no sense. I spend my ISK on logi stuff and modules. GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride." Hunter S. Thompson
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4814	Posted - 2014.01.13 03:07:00 - [18] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: 1) Do you use Advanced variants? I use the ELM. 2) Do you use Prototype variants? No 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? Once or twice every 5 or so games. 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 60M 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? Yes, I think that a merc should be able to use a better rifle because they have the skill and the money. I just started using a standard breech AR last Thursday instead of the BPO AR I normally use. Other than that I use a BPO smg or Templar weapon. I am not a good shot so buying expensive weapons makes no sense. I spend my ISK on logi stuff and modules. Hello Robot Devil! I believe there was a miscommunication here. By advanced variants and prototype variants, I mean advanced and prototype versions of rifle variants, with the list of what that entails in the original post. The ELM-7 is an advanced variant of the laser rifle, but it is not an advanced version of a rifle variant, which is what this thread is about. Hope that clears things up. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
The Robot Devil molon labe. Public Disorder. 1527	Posted - 2014.01.13 03:08:00 - [19] - Quote Azri Sarum wrote: If we get nothing then the prices should be normalized. I heard a guy in EVE say that T2 guns allow you to dictate range better and I the thrust of what he's saying is that T2 in only moderately better. The slide upward shouldn't be linear and shouldn't bring that much of an advantage. This keeps the weapons powerful but not unbeatable. GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride." Hunter S. Thompson
The Robot Devil molon labe. Public Disorder. 1527	Posted - 2014.01.13 03:09:00 - [20] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: 1) Do you use Advanced variants? I use the ELM. 2) Do you use Prototype variants? No 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? Once or twice every 5 or so games. 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 60M 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? Yes, I think that a merc should be able to use a better rifle because they have the skill and the money. I just started using a standard breech AR last Thursday instead of the BPO AR I normally use. Other than that I use a BPO smg or Templar weapon. I am not a good shot so buying expensive weapons makes no sense. I spend my ISK on logi stuff and modules. Hello Robot Devil! I believe there was a miscommunication here. By advanced variants and prototype variants, I mean advanced and prototype versions of rifle variants, with the list of what that entails in the original post. The ELM-7 is an advanced variant of the laser rifle, but it is not an advanced version of a rifle variant, which is what this thread is about. Hope that clears things up. I fixed it, talking to my wife I didn't notice the LR was missing GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride." Hunter S. Thompson

Fizzer94 L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1335	Posted - 2014.01.13 03:09:00 - [21] - Quote Once in a blue moon I'll run a Carthum AScR, but I generally stick to ADV weapons. Yours Truly, Reginald Fizzer94 Delafontaine III, Esquire
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4819	Posted - 2014.01.13 03:14:00 - [22] - Quote Something else to consider, a prototype version of a rifle variant like the Carthum Assault Scrambler Rifle or Ishukone Assault Rail Rifle cost almost as much as a well fit militia HAV. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Leadfoot10 molon labe. Public Disorder. 232	Posted - 2014.01.13 03:36:00 - [23] - Quote That is an interesting observation. However, I might suggest it's more the militia HAV being too cheap and less that the proto gun is too expensive.
Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 2079	Posted - 2014.01.13 03:41:00 - [24] - Quote Mostly HMG user, but I'll offer my 0.02 ISK... 1) Do you use Advanced variants? I use the AHMG in particular situations, like when my squad/team is having trouble closing the gap between objectives. 2) Do you use Prototype variants? Rarely. Usually for experimenting or out of pure frustration when we're getting stomped. 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? AHMG - maybe 2 every 7 matches. FAHMG or BHMG 3 times a week 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? <20,000,000 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? Cost vs. Efficacy curve doesn't seem appropriate in any of the weapon types when going from ADV to PRO. However, the pricing does seem appropriate from MLT and STD to ADV and ADV variants. Beer before Liquor, never sicker. Toothpaste before Orange Juice, you're dead.
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 6225	Posted - 2014.01.30 21:12:00 - [25] - Quote Bump and added a 6th question in regards to standard grade rifle variants. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 8716	Posted - 2014.01.30 21:45:00 - [26] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: So here's a few questions: 1) Do you use Advanced variants? 2) Do you use Prototype variants? 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? 6) Do you thin variants should be available at standard level, unlocked at level 2 operations like in Chromosome? 1) On ADV fits, yes. 2) Yes. Primarily the CreoDron Breach and the Duvolle TAR. 3) Somewhat frequently - generally a few times per play session. 4) 1.2b 5) IDC, but tbh no. I may be biased because of how terrible the AR variants are, but I don't think so. 6) Yes. ZATARA CARRIES US ALL Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution MAG Raven
Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 703	Posted - 2014.01.30 21:57:00 - [27] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: 1) Do you use Advanced variants? 2) Do you use Prototype variants? 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? 6) Do you thin variants should be available at standard level, unlocked at level 2 operations like in Chromosome? 1) For the RR - no. Pre-RR I used the ASCR exclusively. 2) Only when i used the ASCR prior to 1.7 3) Proto...in PC, always. I sometimes use proto for FW or Pub Skirm against que-synch'd serious adversaries...essentially when you've got a psuedo-corp battle going down. 4) Why do you need this data point? 5) I think for the most part the premium is fair. Right or wrong, I equate it to a race or manufacturer incentivizing their specific weapon. Example...why buy a burst AR when you can have the CR? 6) No. Similar thought pattern as point #5. I think advanced level is a fair balance. "Third star to the right...straight ahead 'till morning."
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 6236	Posted - 2014.01.30 21:59:00 - [28] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: 4) Why do you need this data point? Because the rich minority in Dust who have more ISK than they could possibly ever spend don't really count in my opinion when it comes to "Is the premium fair" point since they don't even look much at the costs of their fittings. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR F.T.U. IMMORTAL REGIME 1345	Posted - 2014.01.30 22:06:00 - [29] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: So here's a few questions: 1) Do you use Advanced variants? 2) Do you use Prototype variants? 3) If yes to either, how often do you use them? 4) How much ISK do you have in your wallet? 5) Do you think the ISK premium on rifle variants is fair? 6) Do you thin variants should be available at standard level, unlocked at level 2 operations like in Chromosome? 1.) no 2.) yes 3.) pretty rarely when think about it. 4.)145 mill 5 ADV: yes PRO:not really. most of the time you're actually losing DPS on a variant just for a different feel. 6.) yes. that's the case in sidearms so why not light weapons? Anime > EVERYTHING


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