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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
The Robot Devil
Molon Labe.
Public Disorder.
1467
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Posted - 2014.01.10 15:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
I think it should work similar to the active scanner. Once deactivated the merc has to wait for the module to finish the cycle before anything except movement can be done.
The uncloak cycle should last around 3 seconds and higher tier cloaks and SP placement changing the decloak cycle time. Cloaks are tools to be used to help sneak and infiltrate not a win buttons for suits.
Let any suit where a cloak with lower tier cloaks changing movement speed more than higher tier. Scout only cloaks isn't my favorite idea and I don't think it would be as much fun as all suits being able to use them.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
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The Robot Devil
molon labe.
Public Disorder.
1546
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Posted - 2014.01.13 21:47:00 -
[2] - Quote
I do think that giving the scout suits a cloak bonus is a nerf to the suit. Light frames are hard to use and easy to kill and a cloak bonus takes up a bonus that could be use on something else and they lose a slot that they desperately need. There are not enough light frames in the game and this just makes the scout even more useless.
I don't like the idea that cloaks should have a finite cloak time.
I don't like that cloaks will only be scouts or will be so restrictive that other suits are useless with one. I don't think super high fitting costs is that great of an idea because we shouldn't be using price or resource draw to control what items are being used. Yes, in EVE the Covert Ops cloak can only really use on covert ops ships but those ships have a role bonus that doesn't take another bonus out.
I would much rather see the cloak come with stats that makes it useless without bonuses. I might want to run a cloak on my Amarr assaut but I can't because it is a scout item? That kind of flies in the face of the concept of fitting your suit how you want to fit your play style. Have the cool down be excessive so that weapons can't be fired within 6 seconds of decloak or something in that vein.
If a team of heavies and logi want to stealth their way to an objective around the edge of the map then they are out of luck because they either won't be able to fit a cloak or if they do will not be combat effective. I do agree that scouts should use them a little better and I do agree that being able to fire while cloaked isn't good but denying entire classes the ability to fit a cloak is bad also.
Dust will be missing out on emergent game play, the meta game and loads of tactics if a cloak is restricted to one frame size. I feel that buy gearing them towards scouts we are limiting the players.
Have the cloak reduce speed, increase weapon switch time, have a timer that doesn't allow one to hack for a second or two after decloak or some drawback that punishes everyone the same way and then bonus the light frames to alleviate the punishment. Cloaks should be able to used on any suit if you are willing to give up the slot. I would know that a heavy could be cloaked around the corner but at the same time I would know that he has to wait 3 seconds(or some other amount of time) and is short a module on his suit.
I have read precious few posts that make the cloak sound like a good idea, again the problem is that there is not enough light frames to make it interesting. I see a scout and know that they are still junk and even more so because they have no combat bonuses. We have relegated the scout suit and Light frames to nothing more than a hide and go seek game.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
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The Robot Devil
molon labe.
Public Disorder.
1547
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Posted - 2014.01.14 00:55:00 -
[3] - Quote
To achieve this, the cloaks should
Be an equipment that must be held in one's hands to remain active
Have a very audible and recognizable sound when first engaged and when disengaged
Have a minimum 20 second cooldown that begins upon deactivation (Increased duration if forcibly decloaked by enemy fire or otherwise taking damage)
No maximum active duration
Affect speed. Non-Scout suits should move at roughly a 25% decrease to speed.
Create very small, yet visible distortion around the cloaked player (not a perfect 'human' outline). Only amplifies to become super visible when sprinting
Be directly countered by scanners depending on range and precision. Assuming equal values, at short (30m or less) range the scanner should beat the cloak. At long ranges the cloak should beat the scan.
Disable Melee, or carry a steep (minimum 90%) penalty to melee damage while carried.
When used on an air vehicle, all weapons and other modules should be disabled and prevented from being activated for the duration of the cloak and for an additional (minimum 15s) timer afterwards. (Higher tiers of cloaks can reduce delay)
When used on an air vehicle, flying below a certain altitude should immediately decloak the vehicle.
Provide points to a cloaked player if they evade a scan, conversely provide points to a scanner if they reveal a cloaked player to their team. (Scanned players should not be decloaked, but highlighted visually with a much greater distortion than usual which would be visible to players on both teams)
Or at the very least, the cloaks SHOULD NOT
Allow a player to equip, aim, or fire a weapon while activated
Allow a player to regenerate armor or shields, or receive any remote effects while cloak is active and for a short duration after becoming visible
Be limited to only a certain class of suit or have abnormally high fitting requirements. All suits should be able to cloak, effectiveness with a cloak should be determined by speed stats and scan profiles.
Be accessible to any ground vehicles. None of the ground vehicles currently in the game would contribute positively to gameplay if allowed to cloak.
Have visual distortion based on regular movement speed. (See Killzone 3 cloaks for reference on how to /not/ do cloaks) Cloaks which encourage standing still for maximum effect only lead to campy, unfun playstyles. Players should be encouraged to move around while cloaking to aid their team.
Great list and I agree with almost all of them. The two I don't agree with is full invisibility while not moving and a minimum height for dropships. Here are the reasons why. If a merc is at an objective camping it and not moving then they should be invisible and I think the counter to this is partially the wait to fire time and the other main counter would be any weapon with splash damage. A mass driver, flux grenade or even just half a clip of random fire would probably decloak them or force them to move. Also, if they show up when pinged with an active scanner then there is no need to not allow full invisibility. Good teamwork and tactics should counter most cloaks in the long run.
I don't like the minimum dropship height that much because they are loud and if you can't hear one hovering over the objective then you probably shouldn't be there, again, a well place round or even one random will decloak the ship. If I can't see the ship above me making all that noise all I have to do is shoot up in the air in the direction of the sound. Cloaks should be a powerful weapon but they shouldn't be unbearable and I think that there is enough direct counters to these two things. Great post, good discussion and I think it is productive as well. Keep up the hard work CPM.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
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The Robot Devil
molon labe.
Public Disorder.
1549
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Posted - 2014.01.14 02:14:00 -
[4] - Quote
MassiveNine wrote:So what about hacking while cloaked? I think it should be allowed. I mean if someone is at a letter and it starts getting hacked any decent player would know to huck a nade or start firing at the hack screen.
Any action other than jumping should decloak you.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
|
The Robot Devil
molon labe.
Public Disorder.
1550
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Posted - 2014.01.14 11:20:00 -
[5] - Quote
Kain Spero wrote:Whether or not the cloak has to be held the whole time it's active I don't know. As long as you can't shoot at the same time you are cloaked is my main sticking point.
I think it should be turned on and should stay on until the player or something else decloaks you.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
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