Honestly I would sooner see the basic suits removed.

Honestly I would sooner see the basic suits removed.

Honestly I would sooner see the basic suits removed.

They could still be reworked to have a use.

E.G.
Increase the base eHP of the basic light suit so it can be a fast assault
Increase the base speed of the basic heavy so it is more mobile than the sentinel (still slower than the Commandos though)

They could be worked to add a cause but to be honest, with all the specialisations they are a irrelevent complication that doesnt warrant the time needed to figure our a balance. Its better just to commit tieracide and get rid of them and just simplify the sitiuation.

The alternative would be to take a page out of EVE's book, get rid of basic, advanced and prototype tiers and simply make the specialisation suits T2 while the basics T1. However this would take a lot of work. honestly its just easier to simply remove basic suits.

The alternative would be to take a page out of EVE's book, get rid of basic, advanced and prototype tiers and simply make the specialisation suits T2 while the basics T1. However this would take a lot of work. honestly its just easier to simply remove basic suits.

Honestly I would sooner see the basic suits removed.

No.

Honestly I would sooner see the basic suits removed.

As a heavy I look at this rather warily Jen. I would have to see the final stats of all the racial heavies before thinking about pulling basic .



A lot of heavies go full basic instead of skilling into Sen for good reason.

A lot of heavies go full basic instead of skilling into Sen for good reason.

[Specializations]
When Uprising 1.0 launched, I made this thread, basically the point was this:
The logistics and now the commando dropsuit are the only examples of specialization done right as of now. The logistics is very different from the basic mediums; giving up one thing to be very good at (or "specialize") something else. Likewise, the commando heavy specialization sacrifices HP and and the heavy weapon slot in exchange for 2 light weapons.

The majority of what we have right now however are not real specializations, but mild tweaks. From medium to assault, from light to scout, and from heavy to sentinel there is barely any change. This is very bad in my opinion.

[Basic frames]
Basic frames are suits with no reason to use them, we should NOT have useless suits with no purpose, especially since it can't be used to save money (seriously, why are they more expensive?). Not only are basic frames bonus-less (thus inferior) versions of specialized suits, but also more expensive. There should be situations where you would actually want to use them, both ISK-wise, and gameplay reasons.

They need a price cut, they should be at least 10% cheaper than their specialized counterpart, they should be the cheaper alternative to specialize suits.

They should be very generalized and versatile in slot layouts compared to their specialist counterparts, like a middle ground between the specializations of the suits; this could be done by altering the basic frames (like medium basics get a 2nd equipment slot and lose a module slot), or by altering the specialist suits (like taking equipment slot from assaults, and grenade slot from logi, so basic will be a middle ground with both).

[Solutions]: these are just examples of how I would solve the issues of price and slot layout.
PRICE: basic frame price = specialization price - 10%

LIGHT (reasoning can be found here)
Basic: + 1 high or low slot (& PG/CPU to fit it, they need a buff anyway)
Scout: + 1 equipment slot (& PG/CPU to fit it, they also need a buff)
Pilot: ? (not here yet, so can't say)

MEDIUM
Basic frame: + 1 equipment (2 equipment total, between assault and logi)
Logi: - grenade (they already have an extra low slot & lots of equipment compared to assaults, offensive abilities like grenades shouldn't be emphasized)
Assault: + 1 high slot (logis get an extra low slot compared to assaults anyway)

HEAVY
Basic: -sidearm, + 1 equipment (middle-ground between commando and sentinel)
Sentinel: same
Commando: same

Related dropsuit threads: tiercide | specialization bonuses

Honestly I would sooner see the basic suits removed.

We need the Basic proto Minmatar skin on the Assault Minmatar Proto so much better...

I think Gallante might want this too...

h8 the white on my suit, specially with no arctic based snow planets(Yes CCP started in Iceland go figure)


Either that or significantly raise the cost of specialized suits, give lighter(lesser?) racial bonuses and make them significantly cheaper. while raising the cost of specialized prototype suits.

Allowing the Basic Proto suits to be versatile cheap efficient suit option for both NPE and Vet alike.

Or jenza's idea and just press the "delete" button.

I think the Frame suit was CCP's attempt at Tech 1 Dropsuits and Specialty Suits were Tech II

However if you're going to do it like that, the Tech 1 Dropsuit really should have a bonus attached to their skill, and level 3 unlocks the specialty suit which has additional bonuses which stack on top of the frame's bonus. This would likely be the most synonymous with EVE's system.

However as Jenza pointed out, it might just be simpler to remove them altogether, since frame suits are so rarely used aside from Heavies, but that's a failure of the Sentinel bonus and not the overall system.

Tiericide would be fantastic and now is the time to do it. Give us the prototype level slot layout and let skills improve the suits. Rookies will be able to fit more basic gear but will be limited by core skills. Veterans will be able to fit them nicely but the gap will be less.

Racial Militia Light, Medium, and Heavy with no skill benefit but the same slot layout as one of the specialized.
Racial Scout, Pilot, Assault, Logistics, Sentinal and Commando with prototype level stats.

Honestly I would sooner see the basic suits removed.

Proto Basic Frames look better than their racial proto variants.

We need the Basic proto Minmatar skin on the Assault Minmatar Proto so much better...

I think Gallante might want this too...

h8 the white on my suit, specially with no arctic based snow planets(Yes CCP started in Iceland go figure)


Either that or significantly raise the cost of specialized suits, While give lighter(lesser?) racial bonuses to Basic Proto suits and make them significantly cheaper.

Allowing the Basic Proto suits to be versatile cheap efficient suit option for both NPE and Vet alike.

Or jenza's idea and just press the "delete" button.

I forgot that part too. The skin is dark, providing a tactical movement advantage I don't get with my NASCAR Logi.

Excellent idea.

Booo, two thumbs down. I run MinBasic suits all the time, and the idea of having them removed completely burns me hard. For those who don't use them, then don't use them. Not everything in here is going to serve your purposes.

For me, the basic suits have allowed me to get a medium frame with the same stats as its assault counterpart for HALF the SP investment. No bonus, but that's fine, I'll deal. The PROTO is more expensive ISK-wise than the assault, yes, but again, its HALF the SP invested. The slot layout works for me and my role (Combat Logistics, regardless of suit) and lets me field an overall relatively (SP and ISK-wise) cheaper suit than my Logistics suits that by design has a little more "beef" in the armor and shields. I've done this since crunching the numbers in beta/start of Uprising. The designed purpose is there.

I also have a basic heavy suit. Again, no bonuses. Yet again, HALF the SP investment. This suit allows me the ability to field a Heavy weapon at point defense when its needed as well as have a heavy armor option to use when everybody on the squad says, "I'm a logi."

I like Jenza and Dent's idea to just remove them. The thought hadn't even crossed my mind. The basic frames are pale imitations of the assault and scout and even with some form of skill benefit you aren't gaining anything. Let people go straight into the specialized suits. The SP you save will even let dedicated logistics and scouts pick up an advanced assault frame for doing secondary roles.

Kill them with fire.

Honestly I would sooner see the basic suits removed.

Let me try it this way: The bonus built into every basic suit regardless of race is that they're half the SP to get into.That's half the time, that's half the grind, for a suit that has the exact same slot layouts/specs as their more SP expensive specialist counterparts. How much "DUST has no diversity" QQ could be avoided if people just ran a basic suit that was opposite of their main fit occasionally?