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Riddle me this - Gallente vs Amarr

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Aisha Ctarl Scions of Athra 2281	Posted - 2013.12.18 15:24:00 - [1] - Quote Let us put the Amarr and Gallente suits under the microscope. Both suits are "Armor Tanking" suits and are designed to utilize armor to its maximum effectiveness. Now in EVE, Gallente pilots focus on armor tanking but lean towards repairing while the Amarr armor tank but lean towards resistance and hardening (basically making a brick). In DUST, it seems as if these tanking ideals were thrown out of the window and the tanking styles reversed. The Amarr Assault has equal stats of 180/180 Shields/Armor while the Gallente get more armor at the start (sorry don't know the Gallente values, someone feel free to throw them up). From the get go this is already incorrect. As stated beforehand, Amarr are armor tankers that rely on hardeners and resistance plates and therefore should have more base armor on the suit. A better value for the Amarr Assault may be something like 130/220 to emphasize the fact that the Amarr rely on plates. Another area where I feel that these suits have been reversed is slot layout. The Amarr Assault ADV is 2/2 H/L - Proto, 3/3 HL. The Gallente on the other hand I believe either has 3 or 4 lows at ADV and either 4 or 5 at proto. Ok timeout, lets think here. The Gallente Assault already gets a higher armor value and then on top of it gets more low slots than the Amarr which is the pure armor tanking faction. Yep....totally makes sense. Anyone with half a mind would stick plates in all of those lows and make a Gallentean brick of doom instead of reps which leads to higher armor values than the Amarr...yeah you know, the resistance plate/hardener tanking faction. BUT WAIT AISHA, THE AMARR HAVE MORE SHIELDS LEADING TO MORE EHP!!! Yes, the Amarr does have a higher base shield value, BUT in the end if you start adding things up, EHP differences are very marginal. Both Amarr and Gallente Proto Assaults can push EHP's in the 800 - 900 ranges. At the ADV tier, the EHP's between all of the racial suits are pretty similar depending on how you fit your suit (brick tank). This goes on to lead me to my final point..... THE AMARRIAN SPEED PENALTY Yes, that one stat that no DEV, CPM member, DUST'er, or even Morgan Freeman himself can explain - the Amarrian speed penalty. As stated above, EHP's are marginal between the suits depending on how you set up your tank yet the Amarr is the only suit in the game that gets a speed penalty. Now this would make perfect sense if CCP set up the Amarr to be armor plate tankers in DUST and used my hypothetical value of 130/220, but they didn't. CCP, I already know what you're thinking "but the Amarr have more EHP, their shield and armor values are equal!" CCP, sit down and give it the once over - EHP values between suits if properly tanked come out to around the same values and you slapped a speed penalty on one suit because you "perceived" that they will have more EHP. Meanwhile the Gallente can stack plate upon plate in their plentiful lows (which the Amarr should have) and may move at say 6.57 m/s - if the Amarr stacked the same amount, they would probably sprint at 6.02 m/s or slower. The slower Amarr suits was a mechanic from EVE you tried to port to DUST, but in DUST it just doesn't make sense. Yes you smart cookies out there, I'm aware that the Amarr have more base stamina and a faster stamina regen, but that is not a sensible reason as to why they have a speed penalty. "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor
Aisha Ctarl Scions of Athra 2283	Posted - 2013.12.18 15:49:00 - [2] - Quote 8213 wrote: Whoa there. A lot of people can't see the forest for the trees. DUST is rock, paper, scissors balancing. You can't just compare two factionsg technology.You need to compare all 4. Amarr have dual tank and low speed. Minmatar have speed and less dual tank. Gallente have speed but armor dependancy. Caldari have shield dependancy and are slower. That's why Minmatar are CQC, Caldari long range, Gallente mid range, Amarr mid to long range. Its 360 degree balancing. But until all the racial content arrives, its throwing wrenches into the works. Yes I get that, but did you read where I said all four EHP's come out relatively the same if you properly tank the suits? Amarr get a speed penalty and they have no more EHP than the other three variants. I'm not saying make them as fast as Minmatar suits, but I am saying the speed penalty just appears to be "slapped on," it's just there... "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor
Aisha Ctarl Scions of Athra 2290	Posted - 2013.12.18 18:52:00 - [3] - Quote I really wish that the DEVs would take a look at this at the least. It is a pretty big problem when the Amarr suits are PERCEIVED to have a higher eHP value but really have a lower or around the same eHP cap as the other racial variants of suits and due to that PERCEPTION have an unfair speed penalty. @Your Absolut End Already have you beat - I have both Prototype Amarr Assault and Amarr Logistics. "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor
Aisha Ctarl Scions of Athra 2294	Posted - 2013.12.18 19:08:00 - [4] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: I really wish that the DEVs would take a look at this at the least. I may be playing devil's advocate here, but I actually agree with you: Amarr suits are not competitive compared to the same tier. In Eve, the poor agility and max speed of the Amarr ships is an inconvenience. In Dust, being less mobile is crippling. I hate seeing the rest of my squad speed pass me when we are taking an objective or rushing a front. This hits it right on the head. In EVE, as you said, being slow is just a mere inconvenience - the Amarr ships can still dish out some punishing damage. In DUST, being slow just equates to getting your ass kicked no matter if it is close, medium, or long range and it doesn't help that we Amarr actually have a lower eHP cap than all other factions. "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor
Aisha Ctarl Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 2298	Posted - 2013.12.19 04:25:00 - [5] - Quote Bump to keep this alive for devs to see. "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor
Aisha Ctarl Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 2302	Posted - 2013.12.19 15:14:00 - [6] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: Mauren NOON wrote: Sadly the amarr suits are underpowered. Logi as an example. Minmatar has 4 high 4 low and 4 equipment. The amarr have 3 high 4 low with a side arm. Are the amarr supposed to be fighting minmatar because minmatar seems to have an unfair advantage. If the amarr gets 4 high 4 low it would be a perfect balance Compare the base stats. Base stats yes the Amarr have higher eHP, but in the end, the Amarr actually comes out with lower or around the same eHP. "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor
Aisha Ctarl Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 2310	Posted - 2013.12.19 16:17:00 - [7] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: Mauren NOON wrote: Sadly the amarr suits are underpowered. Logi as an example. Minmatar has 4 high 4 low and 4 equipment. The amarr have 3 high 4 low with a side arm. Are the amarr supposed to be fighting minmatar because minmatar seems to have an unfair advantage. If the amarr gets 4 high 4 low it would be a perfect balance Compare the base stats. Base stats yes the Amarr have higher eHP, but in the end, the Amarr actually comes out with lower or around the same eHP. The Amarr Logi vs the Minmatar? Are you serious? READ THE OP BRO - I'm talking assault suits. "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor
Aisha Ctarl 0uter.Heaven 2460	Posted - 2013.12.25 19:09:00 - [8] - Quote #CCPHatestheAmarr "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor

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