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emtbraincase
RETR0 PR0 GAMERS
INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS
34
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Posted - 2013.12.14 16:20:00 -
[1] - Quote
If you want all benefits of a skill, you should need to spec into that skill. I shouldn't get access to all AR's just because I put 3 levels in it. Certain items make sense, like dropsuits and vehicles since they all operate similarly with only slots/size differnces (no operational differences), and the generic equipment/weapon variants should be all that LP gets you. Nobody should have access to everything because they fight for 1 side, but you should get the generic variant of whatever that race is famous for for each level (maybe a 2 item choice at proto like Tac v Assault or Assault v Breach). Also, triage on hives is a level 4 skill, you are not required to spend the extra 1-2 levels for triage, or the 2 levels to get a proto hive, so I think that is fair since you could spend that SP on other things that I couldn't since hives were a priority of mine.
Also, a bonus is still a bonus even if you don't think it is as useful, and more clusters means more ammo means more WP means more SP per item dropped. You want wonderhives? Spec into them like we all did to get triage.
**EDIT** Please don't take this as a personal attack. I have told my corpmates with this line of thinking like yours the same thing as here. I just think that LP should be a shortcut to the basics, but to fully flesh out an ability you should be required to max out that skill. |
emtbraincase
RETR0 PR0 GAMERS
INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS
34
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 19:02:00 -
[2] - Quote
Then you can already buy them, so use that LP on other race-related items. Just saying most items have a lower skill requirement than the ISK counterpart, so it allows proto-level entry with adv-level sp investment. Carrying more (and better) gear to the battle at once helps both your team and your sp haul. |
emtbraincase
RETR0 PR0 GAMERS
INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS
34
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:26:00 -
[3] - Quote
But aurum costs real money, and LP only cost time. Yes, time is a commodity, and worth maybe more than the aurum cost. However, that isn't everyone. You get aurum benefits if you invest the time instead of that money. |
emtbraincase
RETR0 PR0 GAMERS
INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS
35
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Posted - 2013.12.14 20:22:00 -
[4] - Quote
I ignore it because it doesn't matter overall. There are likely going to be some additions to it SoonGäó, thus possibly providing more depth at that time (such as when racial suit patch hits). If there is no significant difference at that time I will agree with you. But as it stands for an initial rollout, I think the LP store is a godsend to those of us who have spent all our SP on passives and base stats early and have maintained Adv since just after open beta "ended". I understand your frustration, but not getting a unique hive is, to me, a non-factor. I use them on almost every suit (Gallogi), and would like a bit of differentiation for a proto suit fit, but with all they did release I can't see it being that unfair.
Again, if this is the finalized LP store (which I doubt), then I will join you. Until that time, I'm going to enjoy early-access proto. |
emtbraincase
RETR0 PR0 GAMERS
INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS
35
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 00:26:00 -
[5] - Quote
Looking at the LP store (as I wirte this), you actually have a choice of 2 nanohives at proto level. The AR and other weapons/equip with multiple variants also have 2 proto variants. I don't see the complaint. I'm sorry. I stand by my initial assessment. |
emtbraincase
RETR0 PR0 GAMERS
INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS
35
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Posted - 2013.12.15 18:53:00 -
[6] - Quote
So what I am hearing is that putting 3 levels into a logi suit, hives, rep tool, scanner and weapon of choice yet being able to fit a fully-comparable (your comparison, not mine) proto variant isn't a big enough advantage for a logi, or anyone else? I see that as the major benefit to the LP store, with minor differences to usefulness. Yes, unique equipment is fun and interesting to find useful implementation, but there is no standard in the store except how many variants are there. Some have better/worse stats for increased/decreased costs while others are level-reduced proto-equivalents, so why is it that having LP hives comparable to 2 hives already restricted to proto in ISK purchase available to you at level 3 a negative?
And as for no logical reason, the reason is you save the SP that would've been spent on level 4-5 of Nanocircuitry/suit variant/etc and can still use proto-equivalent gear. That means that the logi can make their reps/armor/shields/etc mods work better with SP that would've been required in nanocircuitry 5 for those hives (as well as getting LP variants of all those items if they choose to go that route. Thus you are saving SP to be put elsewhere, since you don't get a boost to how well the hives/injectors work at higher level investment since it is fixed.
If that isn't a large enough bonus, then I can at least discuss that, but I think I have explained why I think you are wrong. Is it different/useful enough for everyone, absolutely not. Is it an overall benefit that you aren't willing to admit to since it doesn't directly benefit yourself, I would have to think so. |
emtbraincase
RETR0 PR0 GAMERS
INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS
35
|
Posted - 2013.12.16 00:43:00 -
[7] - Quote
1. You should be. Not everything is early release, but where it is can make a difference for anyone. However, since hives are not that way, I can understand this, however....
2. here are actual numbers State Ishukone Quantum (7083 isk/150LP) vs Isukone Guaged (28335 isk)
active 2 v 3
carried: 3 v 4
clusters 90 v 72
range 7m v 7m
rate 35% v 30%
triage:no v no
Health 400HP each
CPU 59 each
PG 11 each
**a refill is from 0 ammo to full, not 1 clip.
A single hive of each
90 clusters x .35 (replenish rate) = 31.5 refills vs 72 x .3 (replenish rate)=21.6 refills advantage: LP
If I were to go further and just say what they can do while out at once
90 clusters x 2 active = 180 clusters vs 72 clusters x 3 active = 216 clusters
180 x .35 = 63 refills vs 216 x .3 = 64.8 refills advantage: ISK
However, if you take the total number of hives deployable and if they get fully exhausted you get this....
90 clusters x 3 = 270 total available clusters vs 72 x 4 = 288
270 x .35 (rate of replenish) = 94.5 refills vs 288 x .30 (rate of replenish) = 86.4 refills advantage: LP
More people got their ammo refilled by those three hives than the 4 on isk variant, as well as on a single hive basis. The only time that the hive is going to be outperformed is when you have all 3 active and operational at once. In regards to a random berry (green or blue), running over each hive, they will get more on they stop, and faster, than the isk variant by almost 9 full refills.
3. If SP shouldn't factor in, then neither should Aur. Aur costs real world money that is not available to everyone. Playing FW is/can be a way to get Aur benefis if you are poor and use Dust as a free game to play with friends. You may have enough money to think of Aur as a quick way to better suits, but I don't have enough spare money for that to register as a legitimate possiblity. I know many who feel the same. Enough to say this is at best a push. No SP talk, no Aur talk.
4. LP gear is exclusive. You don't play FW for that faction, you don't get that faction's gear available to you.
5 Showed you (with math) that the LP hive is better on individual, or overall basis.....just not if all possibile are rocking at once. And the second that the final hive for each goes out, then the LP will eventually pass up quite rapidly.
*edit* only pointing out we are both biased.
6. Math above is my logic. |
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