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Minor Treat The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 165	Posted - 2013.12.13 04:50:00 - [1] - Quote Do we feel Anti Vehicle weapons have lost their place on the battlefield or do we feel that they are in the proper placement? Personally I am more against our current patch of AV vs Vehicles being that I am both infantry and Vehicle user. I like the concept of opportunity kills for vehicle which its up to the driver to not be destroyed by activating their countermeasures and I feel its appropriate, But I also believe A single Anti Vehicle piece of equipment should destroy vehicles due to the reality that its a weapon designed primary for destroying vehicles. Sure, I also agree that team tactics are important to use when destroying vehicles but tactics in my eyes should be used against the pilot who is skilled, not just a average joe tanker. As of right now I do not see any reason to actually skill further into Anti Vehicle equipment due to the abilities they currently have. Vehicle improvements was a necessary step for dust 514 but further nerf to all AV's is more a problem than a solution now. Tanks currently are very fast and AV equipment does do some damage but significantly less even if the weapon was properly counter picked against the Vehicle. If you're running a Forge gun and use it against a shield tank well either the countermeasure is going to protect him (i like) or the speed of the tank will keep him from harms way (dislike). But we also face the issue of how long those countermeasures last... 30 seconds is very long, long enough to figure out where you're getting hit from and shooting back at multiple AV-ers. Vehicles should be punished when hit without their deflectors, if they have deflectors that last 30 seconds the idea for assaulting should be activating them before engaging and fleeing before the deflectors disengage. So i really like this idea but I feel Anti Vehicles are no longer doing that particular type of damage to be effective whether the deflector is on or not. Recovery Rate for many of these Vehicles is extremely high making it hard to keep the pressure on them to stay back especially if they can move quickly. With All these said, I think Anti Vehicle weapons have now become less effective to the point where, I don't see myself ever bring a Swarm launcher or even Forge gun (unless sniping infantry) into battle again, instead I will just use the railgun tank to clear out vehicles, but even than I risk myself being largely exposed to a hidden rail gun tank. Beyond this issue I love 1.7 changes but Anti Vehicle equipment in my eyes is too ineffective to be useful. (also I have a alternative character who is primary Forge gun and Swarm Launcher Focused, So i have used them and still have little results with them as well.) These are my thoughts on this current topic, What do you guys think?
Cosgar ParagonX 8613	Posted - 2013.12.13 04:55:00 - [2] - Quote I think that AV has been spoiled this build. Few remember the challenge that was marauder tanks and the glory of blowing them up. Uprising made everyone soft and those that don't remember those days weak. There was no strategy nor any passion. Blowing up HAV crippled by bad re-balancing could be likened to taking out the trash. Now you actually have to work for it and that's what makes it great. As of 1.7 I've invested all my refunded vehicle SP into infantry because vehicles still don't offer what I'm working for, but I enjoy blowing them up because it means something. To sum things up, I think AV needs to grow a pair and Harden The **** UP. I tried to put a level into Amarr Commando once, but got a server notification saying "Why?"
Eurydice Itzhak State Patriots Templis Dragonaors 248	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:01:00 - [3] - Quote I was going to make my own thread but I'll just keep it concise and post it here. AV is no longer capable of soloing tanks. Simply not possible. In groups of 2 you can pop a tank with modules down. In a group of 3 its easy as pie. But here's the thing. Tank v Tank battles are EXTREMELY easy for tanks to escape from. We fight each other for a LONG time and when you're losing and your mods are about to be on CD, you bounce. We've all seen it. All it takes is one forge gunner to pop that tank as it leaves and suddenly, credit to team. I can run up to a madrugar in my fully proto gunnlogi missile tank with a Dmod active and unload a full 12 missile salvo RIGHT in his weak spot, and he will have about 300 armor left. I wish there was a weapon with 175 or 300m range that could do those 300 points of damage I need to kill the tank before it runs away :P AV is now a force amplifier for vehicle battles. They tip the scales but if you don't have the groundwork in place (already having a vehicle to combat their vehicle) you wont be tipping any scale. EDIT: Oh and for the record, this is how it CURRENTLY is and I believe its the BEST iteration of vehicle/av balance so far. Nitrous need to be removed. Other than that, almost spot on for balance.
Minor Treat The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 165	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:03:00 - [4] - Quote Cosgar wrote: I think that AV has been spoiled this build. Few remember the challenge that was marauder tanks and the glory of blowing them up. Uprising made everyone soft and those that don't remember those days weak. There was no strategy nor any passion. Blowing up HAV crippled by bad re-balancing could be likened to taking out the trash. Now you actually have to work for it and that's what makes it great. As of 1.7 I've invested all my refunded vehicle SP into infantry because vehicles still don't offer what I'm working for, but I enjoy blowing them up because it means something. To sum things up, I think AV needs to grow a pair and Harden The ** UP. Okay, Can i ask you how do you take out these current vehicles? As for my thoughts on this statement, yes I do agree that Vehicles recently have been way to easily destroyed but I also believe that there is many bad drivers out there too because Tank running is a skill of it own. So I would like to see more punishing players who clearly don't know what they are doing this way they actually do harden the ** up.
Minor Treat The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 165	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:06:00 - [5] - Quote Eurydice Itzhak wrote: I was going to make my own thread but I'll just keep it concise and post it here. AV is no longer capable of soloing tanks. Simply not possible. In groups of 2 you can pop a tank with modules down. In a group of 3 its easy as pie. But here's the thing. Tank v Tank battles are EXTREMELY easy for tanks to escape from. We fight each other for a LONG time and when you're losing and your mods are about to be on CD, you bounce. We've all seen it. All it takes is one forge gunner to pop that tank as it leaves and suddenly, credit to team. I can run up to a madrugar in my fully proto gunnlogi missile tank with a Dmod active and unload a full 12 missile salvo RIGHT in his weak spot, and he will have about 300 armor left. I wish there was a weapon with 175 or 300m range that could do those 300 points of damage I need to kill the tank before it runs away :P AV is now a force amplifier for vehicle battles. They tip the scales but if you don't have the groundwork in place (already having a vehicle to combat their vehicle) you wont be tipping any scale. EDIT: Oh and for the record, this is how it CURRENTLY is and I believe its the BEST iteration of vehicle/av balance so far. Nitrous need to be removed. Other than that, almost spot on for balance. So what would be your suggestion for a team who is being redlined and needs to AV a tank without being snipped or cut down my ground units? if they dont kill the tank they have no hope of getting back on the battlefield.
Eurydice Itzhak State Patriots Templis Dragonaors 248	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:10:00 - [6] - Quote Minor Treat wrote: Eurydice Itzhak wrote: I was going to make my own thread but I'll just keep it concise and post it here. AV is no longer capable of soloing tanks. Simply not possible. In groups of 2 you can pop a tank with modules down. In a group of 3 its easy as pie. But here's the thing. Tank v Tank battles are EXTREMELY easy for tanks to escape from. We fight each other for a LONG time and when you're losing and your mods are about to be on CD, you bounce. We've all seen it. All it takes is one forge gunner to pop that tank as it leaves and suddenly, credit to team. I can run up to a madrugar in my fully proto gunnlogi missile tank with a Dmod active and unload a full 12 missile salvo RIGHT in his weak spot, and he will have about 300 armor left. I wish there was a weapon with 175 or 300m range that could do those 300 points of damage I need to kill the tank before it runs away :P AV is now a force amplifier for vehicle battles. They tip the scales but if you don't have the groundwork in place (already having a vehicle to combat their vehicle) you wont be tipping any scale. EDIT: Oh and for the record, this is how it CURRENTLY is and I believe its the BEST iteration of vehicle/av balance so far. Nitrous need to be removed. Other than that, almost spot on for balance. So what would be your suggestion for a team who is being redlined and needs to AV a tank without being snipped or cut down my ground units? if they dont kill the tank they have no hope of getting back on the battlefield. have your own vehicle to counter. Your statement is no different if you change the problem from a vehicle to protobears. What if a team is being redlined and needs someone with proto gear (and somehow none of them have it) to fight back against the protobears? They have other issues.
Minor Treat The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 165	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:11:00 - [7] - Quote Minor Treat wrote: Eurydice Itzhak wrote: I was going to make my own thread but I'll just keep it concise and post it here. AV is no longer capable of soloing tanks. Simply not possible. In groups of 2 you can pop a tank with modules down. In a group of 3 its easy as pie. But here's the thing. Tank v Tank battles are EXTREMELY easy for tanks to escape from. We fight each other for a LONG time and when you're losing and your mods are about to be on CD, you bounce. We've all seen it. All it takes is one forge gunner to pop that tank as it leaves and suddenly, credit to team. I can run up to a madrugar in my fully proto gunnlogi missile tank with a Dmod active and unload a full 12 missile salvo RIGHT in his weak spot, and he will have about 300 armor left. I wish there was a weapon with 175 or 300m range that could do those 300 points of damage I need to kill the tank before it runs away :P AV is now a force amplifier for vehicle battles. They tip the scales but if you don't have the groundwork in place (already having a vehicle to combat their vehicle) you wont be tipping any scale. EDIT: Oh and for the record, this is how it CURRENTLY is and I believe its the BEST iteration of vehicle/av balance so far. Nitrous need to be removed. Other than that, almost spot on for balance. So what would be your suggestion for a team who is being redlined and needs to AV a tank without being snipped or cut down my ground units? if they dont kill the tank they have no hope of getting back on the battlefield. Also, To be frank i have never seen it in a shooter where a single infantry unit with the correct equipment is not able to destroy tanks. Every shooter out there follow that rule because it believes in the principle of punishment. Halo the spantan laser for tanks as well as rockets. Battlefield 3 with the Javelin and multiple forms of AVs, Planetside 2 with Launchers and mobile attack units. ect.
Minor Treat The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 165	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:15:00 - [8] - Quote Eurydice Itzhak wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Eurydice Itzhak wrote: I was going to make my own thread but I'll just keep it concise and post it here. AV is no longer capable of soloing tanks. Simply not possible. In groups of 2 you can pop a tank with modules down. In a group of 3 its easy as pie. But here's the thing. Tank v Tank battles are EXTREMELY easy for tanks to escape from. We fight each other for a LONG time and when you're losing and your mods are about to be on CD, you bounce. We've all seen it. All it takes is one forge gunner to pop that tank as it leaves and suddenly, credit to team. I can run up to a madrugar in my fully proto gunnlogi missile tank with a Dmod active and unload a full 12 missile salvo RIGHT in his weak spot, and he will have about 300 armor left. I wish there was a weapon with 175 or 300m range that could do those 300 points of damage I need to kill the tank before it runs away :P AV is now a force amplifier for vehicle battles. They tip the scales but if you don't have the groundwork in place (already having a vehicle to combat their vehicle) you wont be tipping any scale. EDIT: Oh and for the record, this is how it CURRENTLY is and I believe its the BEST iteration of vehicle/av balance so far. Nitrous need to be removed. Other than that, almost spot on for balance. So what would be your suggestion for a team who is being redlined and needs to AV a tank without being snipped or cut down my ground units? if they dont kill the tank they have no hope of getting back on the battlefield. have your own vehicle to counter. Your statement is no different if you change the problem from a vehicle to protobears. What if a team is being redlined and needs someone with proto gear (and somehow none of them have it) to fight back against the protobears? They have other issues. indeed but do we agree that prototype gear is being less irrelevant (not completely) do to the fast TTK? because of this if a skilled militia fighter who gains the drop on the prototype gear fighter, the proto guy will lose. If this is the case why is that not true for AVs against Vehicles.
Eurydice Itzhak State Patriots Templis Dragonaors 248	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:15:00 - [9] - Quote Minor Treat wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Eurydice Itzhak wrote: I was going to make my own thread but I'll just keep it concise and post it here. AV is no longer capable of soloing tanks. Simply not possible. In groups of 2 you can pop a tank with modules down. In a group of 3 its easy as pie. But here's the thing. Tank v Tank battles are EXTREMELY easy for tanks to escape from. We fight each other for a LONG time and when you're losing and your mods are about to be on CD, you bounce. We've all seen it. All it takes is one forge gunner to pop that tank as it leaves and suddenly, credit to team. I can run up to a madrugar in my fully proto gunnlogi missile tank with a Dmod active and unload a full 12 missile salvo RIGHT in his weak spot, and he will have about 300 armor left. I wish there was a weapon with 175 or 300m range that could do those 300 points of damage I need to kill the tank before it runs away :P AV is now a force amplifier for vehicle battles. They tip the scales but if you don't have the groundwork in place (already having a vehicle to combat their vehicle) you wont be tipping any scale. EDIT: Oh and for the record, this is how it CURRENTLY is and I believe its the BEST iteration of vehicle/av balance so far. Nitrous need to be removed. Other than that, almost spot on for balance. So what would be your suggestion for a team who is being redlined and needs to AV a tank without being snipped or cut down my ground units? if they dont kill the tank they have no hope of getting back on the battlefield. Also, To be frank i have never seen it in a shooter where a single infantry unit with the correct equipment is not able to destroy tanks. Every shooter out there follow that rule because it believes in the principle of punishment. Halo the spantan laser for tanks as well as rockets. Battlefield 3 with the Javelin and multiple forms of AVs, Planetside 2 with Launchers and mobile attack units. ect. I love that your head is so far up your own butt you replied to yourself. None of those games handle vehicles the same way this game does. I would be fine with PS2s setup because you get a free resupply of vehicles every so often and its not straining your personal resources. EDIT: Minor Treat wrote: indeed but do we agree that prototype gear is being less irrelevant (not completely) do to the fast TTK? because of this if a skilled militia fighter who gains the drop on the prototype gear fighter, the proto guy will lose. If this is the case why is that not true for AVs against Vehicles. Because they're not equal. AV's new role is to SUPPLEMENT a vehicle against other vehicles. If team sizes ever get increased every single tank will have a designated "tank buddy" riding shotgun with proto AV. I'm convincing my longtime scout buddy of this new need.
Minor Treat The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 165	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:19:00 - [10] - Quote Eurydice Itzhak wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Eurydice Itzhak wrote: I was going to make my own thread but I'll just keep it concise and post it here. AV is no longer capable of soloing tanks. Simply not possible. In groups of 2 you can pop a tank with modules down. In a group of 3 its easy as pie. But here's the thing. Tank v Tank battles are EXTREMELY easy for tanks to escape from. We fight each other for a LONG time and when you're losing and your mods are about to be on CD, you bounce. We've all seen it. All it takes is one forge gunner to pop that tank as it leaves and suddenly, credit to team. I can run up to a madrugar in my fully proto gunnlogi missile tank with a Dmod active and unload a full 12 missile salvo RIGHT in his weak spot, and he will have about 300 armor left. I wish there was a weapon with 175 or 300m range that could do those 300 points of damage I need to kill the tank before it runs away :P AV is now a force amplifier for vehicle battles. They tip the scales but if you don't have the groundwork in place (already having a vehicle to combat their vehicle) you wont be tipping any scale. EDIT: Oh and for the record, this is how it CURRENTLY is and I believe its the BEST iteration of vehicle/av balance so far. Nitrous need to be removed. Other than that, almost spot on for balance. So what would be your suggestion for a team who is being redlined and needs to AV a tank without being snipped or cut down my ground units? if they dont kill the tank they have no hope of getting back on the battlefield. Also, To be frank i have never seen it in a shooter where a single infantry unit with the correct equipment is not able to destroy tanks. Every shooter out there follow that rule because it believes in the principle of punishment. Halo the spantan laser for tanks as well as rockets. Battlefield 3 with the Javelin and multiple forms of AVs, Planetside 2 with Launchers and mobile attack units. ect. I love that your head is so far up your own butt you replied to yourself. None of those games handle vehicles the same way this game does. I would be fine with PS2s setup because you get a free resupply of vehicles every so often and its not straining your personal resources. EDIT: Minor Treat wrote: indeed but do we agree that prototype gear is being less irrelevant (not completely) do to the fast TTK? because of this if a skilled militia fighter who gains the drop on the prototype gear fighter, the proto guy will lose. If this is the case why is that not true for AVs against Vehicles. Because they're not equal. AV's new role is to SUPPLEMENT a vehicle against other vehicles. If team sizes ever get increased every single tank will have a designated "tank buddy" riding shotgun with proto AV. I'm convincing my longtime scout buddy of this new need. Well to be honest I only replied to myself because I wanted to add something, but lets talk like adults and argue like adults.

Eurydice Itzhak State Patriots Templis Dragonaors 249	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:21:00 - [11] - Quote Minor Treat wrote: Well to be honest I only replied to myself because I wanted to add something, but lets talk like adults and argue like adults. Then feel free to reply to either of the statements you just quoted.
Cosgar ParagonX 8616	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:22:00 - [12] - Quote Minor Treat wrote: Cosgar wrote: I think that AV has been spoiled this build. Few remember the challenge that was marauder tanks and the glory of blowing them up. Uprising made everyone soft and those that don't remember those days weak. There was no strategy nor any passion. Blowing up HAV crippled by bad re-balancing could be likened to taking out the trash. Now you actually have to work for it and that's what makes it great. As of 1.7 I've invested all my refunded vehicle SP into infantry because vehicles still don't offer what I'm working for, but I enjoy blowing them up because it means something. To sum things up, I think AV needs to grow a pair and Harden The ** UP. Okay, Can i ask you how do you take out these current vehicles? Have someone in my squad running distraction while I run up behind it and either slap REs on its back or on the path of its possible escape route. Jihad jeep if I'm solo. When the modules wear off, they're even more paper thin than 1.0-1.6 or any other build when tanks were over nerfed. It's not hard, you just need a little teamwork and common sense. Quote: As for my thoughts on this statement, yes I do agree that Vehicles recently have been way to easily destroyed but I also believe that there is many bad drivers out there too because Tank running is a skill of it own. So I would like to see more punishing players who clearly don't know what they are doing this way they actually do harden the ** up. You're seeing it now. There's some good AVers out there not complaining because they understand the concept of glowy tank = baaaad, not glowy tank = good. Everyone on here crying seems to be expecting the same results of 1.0-1.6. Wolfman wasn't joking about tanks being vulnerable, but not weak. AV was probably nerfed to compensate for there only being standard tanks and most likely will scale up better when they get advanced and prototype. On that same token, don't expect them to be cheaper than a proto suit either for long. All this seems to be about making data collection a top priority. I tried to put a level into Amarr Commando once, but got a server notification saying "Why?"
burning powers Algintal Core Gallente Federation 5	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:22:00 - [13] - Quote Eurydice Itzhak wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Eurydice Itzhak wrote: I was going to make my own thread but I'll just keep it concise and post it here. AV is no longer capable of soloing tanks. Simply not possible. In groups of 2 you can pop a tank with modules down. In a group of 3 its easy as pie. But here's the thing. Tank v Tank battles are EXTREMELY easy for tanks to escape from. We fight each other for a LONG time and when you're losing and your mods are about to be on CD, you bounce. We've all seen it. All it takes is one forge gunner to pop that tank as it leaves and suddenly, credit to team. I can run up to a madrugar in my fully proto gunnlogi missile tank with a Dmod active and unload a full 12 missile salvo RIGHT in his weak spot, and he will have about 300 armor left. I wish there was a weapon with 175 or 300m range that could do those 300 points of damage I need to kill the tank before it runs away :P AV is now a force amplifier for vehicle battles. They tip the scales but if you don't have the groundwork in place (already having a vehicle to combat their vehicle) you wont be tipping any scale. EDIT: Oh and for the record, this is how it CURRENTLY is and I believe its the BEST iteration of vehicle/av balance so far. Nitrous need to be removed. Other than that, almost spot on for balance. So what would be your suggestion for a team who is being redlined and needs to AV a tank without being snipped or cut down my ground units? if they dont kill the tank they have no hope of getting back on the battlefield. Also, To be frank i have never seen it in a shooter where a single infantry unit with the correct equipment is not able to destroy tanks. Every shooter out there follow that rule because it believes in the principle of punishment. Halo the spantan laser for tanks as well as rockets. Battlefield 3 with the Javelin and multiple forms of AVs, Planetside 2 with Launchers and mobile attack units. ect. I love that your head is so far up your own butt you replied to yourself. None of those games handle vehicles the same way this game does. I would be fine with PS2s setup because you get a free resupply of vehicles every so often and its not straining your personal resources. EDIT: Minor Treat wrote: indeed but do we agree that prototype gear is being less irrelevant (not completely) do to the fast TTK? because of this if a skilled militia fighter who gains the drop on the prototype gear fighter, the proto guy will lose. If this is the case why is that not true for AVs against Vehicles. Because they're not equal. AV's new role is to SUPPLEMENT a vehicle against other vehicles. If team sizes ever get increased every single tank will have a designated "tank buddy" riding shotgun with proto AV. I'm convincing my longtime scout buddy of this new need. Thats ******* stupid... Anti Vehicle is meant to destroy Vehicles... Thats why its called ANTI VEHICLES
Mary Overdrive Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 1	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:24:00 - [14] - Quote TANKS OP
Eurydice Itzhak State Patriots Templis Dragonaors 249	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:25:00 - [15] - Quote burning powers wrote: Thats ******* stupid... Anti Vehicle is meant to destroy Vehicles... Thats why its called ANTI VEHICLES What a well thought out argument. My rebuttal: HURR ADURR. Discuss.
Burntface man112 Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 78	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:26:00 - [16] - Quote Eurydice Itzhak wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Well to be honest I only replied to myself because I wanted to add something, but lets talk like adults and argue like adults. Then feel free to reply to either of the statements you just quoted. Eurydice get the stick out of your ass TANK SPAMMER.
Burntface man112 Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 78	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:27:00 - [17] - Quote Eurydice Itzhak wrote: burning powers wrote: Thats ******* stupid... Anti Vehicle is meant to destroy Vehicles... Thats why its called ANTI VEHICLES What a well thought out argument. My rebuttal: HURR ADURR. Discuss. actually i laughed, i think its a pretty damn good argument.
Eurydice Itzhak State Patriots Templis Dragonaors 249	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:27:00 - [18] - Quote Burntface man112 wrote: Eurydice Itzhak wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Well to be honest I only replied to myself because I wanted to add something, but lets talk like adults and argue like adults. Then feel free to reply to either of the statements you just quoted. Eurydice get the stick out of your ass TANK SPAMMER. Oh? Whats this? Secret admirer? I don't know what "tank spamming" is but I'm glad I got you angry. Did I redline your team or just dunk on you specifically?
Burntface man112 Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 78	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:28:00 - [19] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Cosgar wrote: I think that AV has been spoiled this build. Few remember the challenge that was marauder tanks and the glory of blowing them up. Uprising made everyone soft and those that don't remember those days weak. There was no strategy nor any passion. Blowing up HAV crippled by bad re-balancing could be likened to taking out the trash. Now you actually have to work for it and that's what makes it great. As of 1.7 I've invested all my refunded vehicle SP into infantry because vehicles still don't offer what I'm working for, but I enjoy blowing them up because it means something. To sum things up, I think AV needs to grow a pair and Harden The ** UP. Okay, Can i ask you how do you take out these current vehicles? Have someone in my squad running distraction while I run up behind it and either slap REs on its back or on the path of its possible escape route. Jihad jeep if I'm solo. When the modules wear off, they're even more paper thin than 1.0-1.6 or any other build when tanks were over nerfed. It's not hard, you just need a little teamwork and common sense. Quote: As for my thoughts on this statement, yes I do agree that Vehicles recently have been way to easily destroyed but I also believe that there is many bad drivers out there too because Tank running is a skill of it own. So I would like to see more punishing players who clearly don't know what they are doing this way they actually do harden the ** up. You're seeing it now. There's some good AVers out there not complaining because they understand the concept of glowy tank = baaaad, not glowy tank = good. Everyone on here crying seems to be expecting the same results of 1.0-1.6. Wolfman wasn't joking about tanks being vulnerable, but not weak. AV was probably nerfed to compensate for there only being standard tanks and most likely will scale up better when they get advanced and prototype. On that same token, don't expect them to be cheaper than a proto suit either for long. All this seems to be about making data collection a top priority. you would never get lose to my Tank with RE i promise you that... AVs useless. promise you this will kill dust.... i bet you were a gaylocker
Minor Treat The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 165	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:32:00 - [20] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Cosgar wrote: I think that AV has been spoiled this build. Few remember the challenge that was marauder tanks and the glory of blowing them up. Uprising made everyone soft and those that don't remember those days weak. There was no strategy nor any passion. Blowing up HAV crippled by bad re-balancing could be likened to taking out the trash. Now you actually have to work for it and that's what makes it great. As of 1.7 I've invested all my refunded vehicle SP into infantry because vehicles still don't offer what I'm working for, but I enjoy blowing them up because it means something. To sum things up, I think AV needs to grow a pair and Harden The ** UP. Okay, Can i ask you how do you take out these current vehicles? Have someone in my squad running distraction while I run up behind it and either slap REs on its back or on the path of its possible escape route. Jihad jeep if I'm solo. When the modules wear off, they're even more paper thin than 1.0-1.6 or any other build when tanks were over nerfed. It's not hard, you just need a little teamwork and common sense. Quote: As for my thoughts on this statement, yes I do agree that Vehicles recently have been way to easily destroyed but I also believe that there is many bad drivers out there too because Tank running is a skill of it own. So I would like to see more punishing players who clearly don't know what they are doing this way they actually do harden the ** up. You're seeing it now. There's some good AVers out there not complaining because they understand the concept of glowy tank = baaaad, not glowy tank = good. Everyone on here crying seems to be expecting the same results of 1.0-1.6. Wolfman wasn't joking about tanks being vulnerable, but not weak. AV was probably nerfed to compensate for there only being standard tanks and most likely will scale up better when they get advanced and prototype. On that same token, don't expect them to be cheaper than a proto suit either for long. All this seems to be about making data collection a top priority. Well here is the thing, I dont mind that aspect but I dont think AVers are not complaining. There are many more Post out there in the last two days saying that same thing. Truth is Punishing tanks is not a punishing game now.

Minor Treat The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 165	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:36:00 - [21] - Quote Eurydice Itzhak wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Minor Treat wrote: Eurydice Itzhak wrote: I was going to make my own thread but I'll just keep it concise and post it here. AV is no longer capable of soloing tanks. Simply not possible. In groups of 2 you can pop a tank with modules down. In a group of 3 its easy as pie. But here's the thing. Tank v Tank battles are EXTREMELY easy for tanks to escape from. We fight each other for a LONG time and when you're losing and your mods are about to be on CD, you bounce. We've all seen it. All it takes is one forge gunner to pop that tank as it leaves and suddenly, credit to team. I can run up to a madrugar in my fully proto gunnlogi missile tank with a Dmod active and unload a full 12 missile salvo RIGHT in his weak spot, and he will have about 300 armor left. I wish there was a weapon with 175 or 300m range that could do those 300 points of damage I need to kill the tank before it runs away :P AV is now a force amplifier for vehicle battles. They tip the scales but if you don't have the groundwork in place (already having a vehicle to combat their vehicle) you wont be tipping any scale. EDIT: Oh and for the record, this is how it CURRENTLY is and I believe its the BEST iteration of vehicle/av balance so far. Nitrous need to be removed. Other than that, almost spot on for balance. So what would be your suggestion for a team who is being redlined and needs to AV a tank without being snipped or cut down my ground units? if they dont kill the tank they have no hope of getting back on the battlefield. Also, To be frank i have never seen it in a shooter where a single infantry unit with the correct equipment is not able to destroy tanks. Every shooter out there follow that rule because it believes in the principle of punishment. Halo the spantan laser for tanks as well as rockets. Battlefield 3 with the Javelin and multiple forms of AVs, Planetside 2 with Launchers and mobile attack units. ect. I love that your head is so far up your own butt you replied to yourself. None of those games handle vehicles the same way this game does. I would be fine with PS2s setup because you get a free resupply of vehicles every so often and its not straining your personal resources. EDIT: Minor Treat wrote: indeed but do we agree that prototype gear is being less irrelevant (not completely) do to the fast TTK? because of this if a skilled militia fighter who gains the drop on the prototype gear fighter, the proto guy will lose. If this is the case why is that not true for AVs against Vehicles. Because they're not equal. AV's new role is to SUPPLEMENT a vehicle against other vehicles. If team sizes ever get increased every single tank will have a designated "tank buddy" riding shotgun with proto AV. I'm convincing my longtime scout buddy of this new need. Well why is it required for a Vehicle to destroy another Vehicle when there is equipment meant to destroy Vehicles? Also, what makes you think this was CCP intention to make Anti Vehicle equipment to be supplemental to Vehicle battles?
lee corwood The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 31	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:39:00 - [22] - Quote I think vehicles are back to where they were supposed to be. I think some AV items were made less viable but I also want to see how things play out when the super boosters wears off. I've seen plenty of tanks die in this build, but I've seen a larger number able to run away. I had a proto swarmer and the only challenge I have is not against the vehicles but the infantry that is across the map and can kill me before I can finish a lock on. Someone else in a different thread suggested making the rockets slightly faster. No damage/range nerf, but I agree its sad to see freaking rockets being out runned by a HAV. I'm not talking HAV runs behind a building, I mean in straight open areas, flat out runs. Also, making the rockets slightly faster makes it easier for us to hit the sweet spot when the hardeners are down. So far, REs seem to be where it's at. The only other thing I'll add on here is I can't wait for the hype to die down a little on the tanks. I'm very happy for the tankers and VERY happy for the DS pilots. They needed the loving and I feel they have a powerful place in the game. However, after a good bit of time in matches since the patch, its starting to get a bit stale. I rarely run into infantry now that so many vehicles are running around. Vehicle warfare is fun, I completely feel these guys are justified in getting their kicks in while they can (and I secretly hope for more DS on DS action). However, for those of us that run infantry only (trust me, you NEVER want me in a vehicle. where there are no cliffs, I create one), the maps are feeling pretty scarce of dots... Minmatar Logisis \| Heavy lover. Come get some badass Band-Aids from this chick
Burntface man112 Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 80	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:40:00 - [23] - Quote TANK is gay!!!!!!!!!!
Eurydice Itzhak State Patriots Templis Dragonaors 249	Posted - 2013.12.13 05:42:00 - [24] - Quote Minor Treat wrote: Well why is it required for a Vehicle to destroy another Vehicle when there is equipment meant to destroy Vehicles? Also, what makes you think this was CCP intention to make Anti Vehicle equipment to be supplemental to Vehicle battles? Somehow the title of the weapon is confusing you guys. Anti means opposed. Vehicle means vehicle. It's used against vehicles. Yep. Check. Perfect. It doesn't mean instagib from 600m. It doesn't mean you get to yolosolo tanks. It just means it's used against vehicles. Its used against vehicles EFFECTIVELY when paired WITH a friendly vehicle. And I think they meant make it this way because they made it this way. I'm not omniscient. I don't know that they didn't COMPLETELY ruin everything. I have to take their actions at face value.
NAV HIV The Generals General Tso's Alliance 724	Posted - 2014.01.09 16:43:00 - [25] - Quote Bump!
Gelan Corbaine Gladiators Vanguard 284	Posted - 2014.01.09 18:01:00 - [26] - Quote Cosgar wrote: I think that AV has been spoiled this build. Few remember the challenge that was marauder tanks and the glory of blowing them up. Uprising made everyone soft and those that don't remember those days weak. There was no strategy nor any passion. Blowing up HAV crippled by bad re-balancing could be likened to taking out the trash. Now you actually have to work for it and that's what makes it great. As of 1.7 I've invested all my refunded vehicle SP into infantry because vehicles still don't offer what I'm working for, but I enjoy blowing them up because it means something. To sum things up, I think AV needs to grow a pair and Harden The **** UP. Look I used to blow up Sags and Suris solo and can still send Mads and Gunnies to the scrap heap . BLOWING UP THE TANK IS NOT THE PROBLEM ! The problem is a rail Sica can do it better , cheaper , and safer at times when it actually frikking matters. It's all about the isk. With a rail Sica with no sp investment... I can make a big profit protecting my team. Dedicated AV with months of SP into it I make a little profit by abandoning them . That's is whats messed up about the current system . No job is worth doing if you don't get paid in the end .


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