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Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
198
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Posted - 2013.12.06 14:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
Well guys I've hit a turning point. I've turned aim assist off just to see how much it really means. (This week)
And actually it makes such a difference I was quite honestly shocked.
With aim assist:
Weapons automatically track at their predefined ranges
Initial accuracy is the most important, to get a lock.
Firing weapons down range in burst makes them terrifyingly accurate (I'm looking at you AR/SCR)
Scouts go down easy mode as the SMG chews them up no problem
KBM rapid strafers are almost unkillable
KDR 7-10 very common up to high teens on good matches.
Without aim assist:
Weapons seem to still snap onto targets initially
As targets strafe it is very difficult (maybe heavy specific) to turn at a fast enough rate to keep up
Scout dancing makes them easily do at least 1/3 more damage before I kill them.
Hip fire AR in CQC is significantly less effective
KBM rapid strafers are almost unkillable
KDR 2-3 good games up to 5-7
Tl;dr
You realize that you were setting up the gun to do most of the work!
Literally aim-assist trains users to get their reticle on the enemy player and dodge around while AA does the brunt of the aiming.
Use of AA encourages bad gun game
With that said, I am curious, how many people out there have the balls to admit that they use aim assist, and what is a way we can fix this problem to make aim assist help keep you on target without enforcing poor gun skill level? |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
198
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Posted - 2013.12.06 14:33:00 -
[2] - Quote
Reserved |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
198
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Posted - 2013.12.06 15:04:00 -
[3] - Quote
To be fair is it that linear? Just good and bad?
I understand why AA was added -- the discrepancy between FPS Pros or Vets is so disparate that no one would ever stand a chance.
I'm lead to the conclusion that we need aim assist, but not in it's current form, it should help you adhere to your targets, but not do all of the work for you. |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
198
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Posted - 2013.12.06 15:06:00 -
[4] - Quote
Also for all of you people who like making the video demonstrations, I really think there is an increase in turning speed with AA on.
I don't think this effects scouts, and maybe only medium frames to a very small degree, but for heavies it definitely feels as if on max acceleration I am turning FAR slower than with AA on.
It seems as if AA is forcing my character to turn some speed in addition to my max turn speed when the stick is full tilt. Can anyone confirm this ? |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
200
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Posted - 2013.12.06 15:22:00 -
[5] - Quote
I wracked up 5k kills before I even played without AA, it's really a whole different game.
The bit that gets me is AA is so powerful that you never actually get "gun game" with it on. Which leads me to the conclusion that the only way you get good is to turn it off and prepare to die.
Also out of curiosity is gun game truly the only thing that matters? Not wining, teamwork, loadouts, or tactics? If aim assist makes the difference between winning and losing, what incentive do I have to Not use it?
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Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
200
|
Posted - 2013.12.06 15:28:00 -
[6] - Quote
But this is not just a FPS, it is a MMOFPS and I think that makes an important differentiation. The playerbase is naturally far more varied than your typical standard "pick this role and spawn" shooter. |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
200
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Posted - 2013.12.06 15:30:00 -
[7] - Quote
How about this -- what mechanism would allow us to draw in new players and train them (hand holding or call it what you will) without letting that mechanism do all the work for them? |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
202
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Posted - 2013.12.06 16:44:00 -
[8] - Quote
I understand the KBM was added to appeal to pc gamers/eve players, but without doubt if KBM works properly it is many times easier to use than a DS.
With KBM a very large portion of the playerbase needs AA to be competitive.
It sounds like two problems could be eliminated at once, but I'm sure that would garner just as much rage.
For now I will try leaving it off for another week or so to see how it pans out, but I play pubs, I can't imagine gimping myself in FW by leaving it off. Empirically it would be the equivalent of throwing suits away. |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
203
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Posted - 2013.12.06 18:11:00 -
[9] - Quote
It's not that all of it needs to be removed, but I'd like to see AA toned down and turn speed increased. Killing strafing targets on a heavy without it is almost impossible. In CQC |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
203
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Posted - 2013.12.06 18:43:00 -
[10] - Quote
Rahl Draak wrote:If AA was completely gone, you wouldn't die in two seconds because, alas, every single shot wouldn't land.
Quoted for truth |
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Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
204
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Posted - 2013.12.06 19:20:00 -
[11] - Quote
Rahl Draak wrote:I can't think of one problem completely removing aim assist would create. This is, of course, operating under the assumption that mouse and keyboard is removed and ds3 turn speeds are given the option in sensitivity to vastly increase.
There is the possibility that it would no longer be as fun or accessible, you ant to talk about proto stomping, this could lead to such an ass whooping that people leave after the first match.
And as much as I hate KBM on a console shooter I'd hate to lose that chunk of the player base as well. |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
204
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Posted - 2013.12.06 19:23:00 -
[12] - Quote
Happy Violentime wrote:Rahl Draak wrote:I can't think of one problem completely removing aim assist would create. This is, of course, operating under the assumption that mouse and keyboard is removed and ds3 turn speeds are given the option in sensitivity to vastly increase. Please just **** off back to whichever twitch shooter you preferGǪ. Dust isn't the game for you.
Unknot your panties guy, regardless did he's wrong/right I don't want this thread to devolve into name flame wars. |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
204
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Posted - 2013.12.06 19:39:00 -
[13] - Quote
Rahl Draak wrote:It's important to note, that before KAGEHOSHI took his ball and went home, he mentioned that there were an entire host of other issues that could possibly be tied to a declining playerbase and the current build's woes. I'm merely saying that aim assist by itself, because it is a CORE mechanic of a FPS, has rendered the game incompatible with respect to merging with eve someday. Whiiiiiiiiiiiiiich......was the whole point of Dust 514 in the first place.
You simply cannot have kids and casuals dictating even the smallest of nullsec sov. It is going to require players with the same engagement level as eve. Dust is catering to a crowd that will never offer that.
Removing aim assist and mouse and keyboard, while sounding elitist will lead to attracting serious, engaged, pro-like players. Then, you can begin to consider Dust-Eve tie ins.
I may be mistaken but I never saw anything that indicated 100% integration with EVE. If they wanted that it should be on PC and not a console. Which completely takes the DS3/KBM/AA argument out the window.
Will there be super hardcore professional gamers on dust, yes. Will they be the majority, no. Is Dust supposed to EVE, again the answer is no. |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
204
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Posted - 2013.12.06 19:42:00 -
[14] - Quote
Operative 1171 Aajli wrote:Slag Emberforge wrote:With that said, I am curious, how many people out there have the balls to admit that they use aim assist, and what is a way we can fix this problem to make aim assist help keep you on target without enforcing poor gun skill level? This is a video game. I use aim assist. I do not measure my balls by a video game. I save my good gun skills for RL That is all. P.S. I thought this game was supposed to be about "group play", "communication" and "cooperation"; Not about shooting. Aim Assist puts the emphasis back on strat and not proto leets stroking themselves on thumb jockey skills.
I apologize if I was not explicit in my meaning.
I was not indicating you had to have balls to play without AA.
I was stating, based on the forumites' views of HTFU and Gun Game, that it requires some amount of courage to admit that you use AA, that is all. |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
207
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Posted - 2013.12.07 16:11:00 -
[15] - Quote
Well the consensus seems pretty clear; the most vocal FORUM members want aim assist and KBM gone.. Whether this is actually the voice of the players or not I can't be certain.
What seems odd to me is how everyone seems to view it in black and white, either keep it, or get rid of it.
Why not just change it to do what it's supposed to do ASSIST and not be an aimbot. |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
213
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Posted - 2013.12.07 21:18:00 -
[16] - Quote
I don't know that anyone indicated that, but as there is no way to verify if someone else is using AA, declaring all users need to "HTFU" is just another way to stroke your own epeen, and is not a useful addition to this topic. |
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