DUST Search - change to swarm launchers good and bad

Pvt Numnutz wrote:

Atiim wrote:

The statement did originally end with that, but I use it in it's modified form to reflect what most vehicle pilots want, and have even openly said in multiple threads. But don't worry, I pay the creator (Spkr4TheDead), a total of 1 ISK in royalties every time I use that word.

Yes, I was trying to say something else. What I'm trying to say is we are switching to FGs because there is literally no point or reason to use the Swarm Launcher anymore. It's new model is going to defy the logic of all weapons.

Long range weapons are supposed have lower damage, but with the advantage of long range (with a few exceptions of course); and Short range weapons are supposed to deal huge amounts of damage with the drawbacks of short range.

Why would anyone use a weapon with both short range and lower amounts of damage? You can't give me a good reason as to why I should use the Swarm Launcher over the Forge Gun. I already know that the FG will also be nerfed into uselessness, so I'm going to finish skilling into my Large Railguns. It will clearly be the only viable AV weapon if we continue down this road, so why not get a head start?

To make things clearer, it's one of the same reasons why barely anyone uses a PLC.

Yeah this change breaks the rule that long range weapons have low damage, like the sniper rifle, forge gun, and large rail gun......
The swarm launcher isn't a short range weapon, what other weapon (aside from those mentioned above) can hit effectively at 175m?
The swarm launcher is meant to be used with another swarm launcher, hence the name swarm launcher. You're right about one thing, why use a swarm launcher when you could use a forge gun? Clearly the forge gun is out of balance, and its super easy to get kills. Only those that enjoy hunting vehicles will use swarms, or those who want to deny an area to vehicles.
I hope the forge isn't nerfed to uselessness, it should be an effective av weapon, however it shouldn't be overpowered either.
Stop running Away from having to use your brain, its not healthy


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Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 1412	Posted - 2013.11.28 20:54:00 - [1] - Quote Aww man. I wanted the big boys like Charlotte, Void, and Spkr to come out. Heck even 'Ol Ben would suffice. Why did the LOLTank Brigade send you of all people? Check out my corp's new website here :D -HAND
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 1412	Posted - 2013.11.28 21:16:00 - [2] - Quote To answer the OP, We are changing to FGs in 1.7 because we don't think that our PRO weapons should do minimal damage to a vehicle We also are switching to FGs because it will take multiple people to destroy one vehicle. Which is disgustingly sick considering how it only takes one person to operate what is quite literally the easiest role in the game, as well as one that doesn't require even teamwork. I on the other hand, find it quite impossible to switch considering how I use both FGs and SLs. "Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me" -such is the motto of vehicle pilots Check out my corp's new website here :D -HAND
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 1415	Posted - 2013.11.28 21:29:00 - [3] - Quote Blaze Ashra wrote: Really Atim? Dropships are the easiest role in the game? Go take your vehicle hate to a tanker thread please. Well this was directed towards HAVs. You know, considering how the OP mentions HAVs. And why do you believe that I hate vehicles? Because I don't want them becoming a FoTM? Also, that doesn't make what I said any less true. Check out my corp's new website here :D -HAND
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 1415	Posted - 2013.11.28 21:50:00 - [4] - Quote Pvt Numnutz wrote: Atiim wrote: To answer the OP, We are changing to FGs in 1.7 because we don't think that our PRO weapons should do minimal damage to a vehicle We also are switching to FGs because it will take multiple people to destroy one vehicle. Which is disgustingly sick considering how it only takes one person to operate what is quite literally the easiest role in the game, as well as one that doesn't require even teamwork. I on the other hand, find it quite impossible to switch considering how I use both FGs and SLs. "Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me" -such is the motto of vehicle pilots Vehicles are also loosing some HP too. The whole concept of a dropship is teamwork. A dropship is nothing without gunners or mercs to drop. Saying that a dropship doesn't require teamwork is wrong, just wrong. I believe that quote came from a vehicle pilot making a point about how av mercs think av should work. Atiim wrote: We also are switching to FGs because it will take multiple people to destroy one vehicle. Which is disgustingly sick considering how it only takes one person to operate what is quite literally the easiest role in the game, as well as one that doesn't require even teamwork. Thank you for proving his point. This statement was directed towards HAVs. Not Dropships. You can't tell me that with my 6+ months of piloting an HAV that they require teamwork. I'd love to see you try though. Also, if your going to quote someone; then use the full quote. Don't cut or edit the quote to make your argument seem "better" or the other(s) "worser". That's called Libel. Do you work for Fox News by any chance? Oh so I was correct in my statement: Atiim wrote: "Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me" -such is the motto of vehicle pilots Check out my corp's new website here :D -HAND
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 1415	Posted - 2013.11.29 00:40:00 - [5] - Quote Pvt Numnutz wrote: Atiim wrote: This statement was directed towards HAVs. Not Dropships. You can't tell me that with my 6+ months of piloting an HAV that they require teamwork. I'd love to see you try though. Also, if your going to quote someone; then use the full quote. Don't cut or edit the quote to make your argument seem "better" or the other(s) "worser". That's called Libel. Do you work for Fox News by any chance? Oh so I was correct in my statement: Atiim wrote: "Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me" -such is the motto of vehicle pilots I believe that quote originally ended with, such is the motto of av players. Sorry I didn't clarify that. I was not quoting you there to make my argument better. Its simply what you said, and illustrates how av players believe av should be. The reason why people will be switching to using forgeguns is because they want to be able to destroy vehicles easily without much skill or effort. Or are you trying to say something else? I don't work for fox, I wouldn't sell my soul like that. The statement did originally end with that, but I use it in it's modified form to reflect what most vehicle pilots want, and have even openly said in multiple threads. But don't worry, I pay the creator (Spkr4TheDead), a total of 1 ISK in royalties every time I use that word. Yes, I was trying to say something else. What I'm trying to say is we are switching to FGs because there is literally no point or reason to use the Swarm Launcher anymore. It's new model is going to defy the logic of all weapons. Long range weapons are supposed have lower damage, but with the advantage of long range (with a few exceptions of course); and Short range weapons are supposed to deal huge amounts of damage with the drawbacks of short range. Why would anyone use a weapon with both short range and lower amounts of damage? You can't give me a good reason as to why I should use the Swarm Launcher over the Forge Gun. I already know that the FG will also be nerfed into uselessness, so I'm going to finish skilling into my Large Railguns. It will clearly be the only viable AV weapon if we continue down this road, so why not get a head start? To make things clearer, it's one of the same reasons why barely anyone uses a PLC. Check out my corp's new website here :D -HAND
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 1415	Posted - 2013.11.29 00:53:00 - [6] - Quote jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: Atiim wrote: To answer the OP, We are changing to FGs in 1.7 because we don't think that our PRO weapons should do minimal damage to a vehicle We also are switching to FGs because it will take multiple people to destroy one vehicle. Which is disgustingly sick considering how it only takes one person to operate what is quite literally the easiest role in the game, as well as one that doesn't require even teamwork. I on the other hand, find it quite impossible to switch considering how I use both FGs and SLs. "Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me" -such is the motto of AV infantry i pwn tanks with my std av nades and std swarms quite often, it's actually easier than using a tank or dropship. btw 1. tanks use a form of teamwork. 2. tank characters in games take multiple people to take down If you can easily solo a vehicle with STD AV, then it was a poorly fit vehicle. There is no getting around that and if you are quickly taken down by one guy running STD AV you need to start using hardners and (while I hate to use this) "GET GOOD". 1.) Tanks and all vehicles (besides DSs) are self sustainable. They only require one person to operate and you are not required to use teamwork in any condition, shape, fashion, or form to be successful. 2.) I care why? In FPS games like COD vehicles don't even exist. Should we just remove vehicles to be like "other games"? Should we remove all diversity in this game to make it like other games? This isn't your average run-of-the-mill shooter. And I couldn't care about how many people you think it should take to destroy a vehicle. Why should any unit, class, suit, or weapon require teamwork and multiple people to take down when they themselves require no teamwork or multipule units to be successful whatsoever? Because I paid more? Alright, then give me a bundle that costs 500k AUR and Includes an Officer Swarm Launcher, 4 Complex Damage Mods, and Hacked AV grenades, and make it a BPO. Make the SL do 660 damage per swarm and have it launch 9 missiles per volley. It would be perfectly balanced right? After all I did pay more. Check out my corp's new website here :D -HAND
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 1417	Posted - 2013.11.29 01:55:00 - [7] - Quote Pvt Numnutz wrote: Atiim wrote: The statement did originally end with that, but I use it in it's modified form to reflect what most vehicle pilots want, and have even openly said in multiple threads. But don't worry, I pay the creator (Spkr4TheDead), a total of 1 ISK in royalties every time I use that word. Yes, I was trying to say something else. What I'm trying to say is we are switching to FGs because there is literally no point or reason to use the Swarm Launcher anymore. It's new model is going to defy the logic of all weapons. Long range weapons are supposed have lower damage, but with the advantage of long range (with a few exceptions of course); and Short range weapons are supposed to deal huge amounts of damage with the drawbacks of short range. Why would anyone use a weapon with both short range and lower amounts of damage? You can't give me a good reason as to why I should use the Swarm Launcher over the Forge Gun. I already know that the FG will also be nerfed into uselessness, so I'm going to finish skilling into my Large Railguns. It will clearly be the only viable AV weapon if we continue down this road, so why not get a head start? To make things clearer, it's one of the same reasons why barely anyone uses a PLC. Yeah this change breaks the rule that long range weapons have low damage, like the sniper rifle, forge gun, and large rail gun...... The swarm launcher isn't a short range weapon, what other weapon (aside from those mentioned above) can hit effectively at 175m? The swarm launcher is meant to be used with another swarm launcher, hence the name swarm launcher. You're right about one thing, why use a swarm launcher when you could use a forge gun? Clearly the forge gun is out of balance, and its super easy to get kills. Only those that enjoy hunting vehicles will use swarms, or those who want to deny an area to vehicles. I hope the forge isn't nerfed to uselessness, it should be an effective av weapon, however it shouldn't be overpowered either. Stop running Away from having to use your brain, its not healthy That's why I said with the exception of a few weapons. No it's not. You can not show me a single quote or description from CCP saying that the SL is supposed to be as you just said. That's like me saying HAVs should be slow bricks that are completely dependent on LLAVs to survive and are destroyed easily without one. I don't have an exact quote or description from CCP, but I'm going to assume that it's called "Swarm Launcher" because it fires a *swarm* of rockets at it's targets. Tell me, how can you deny a vehicle of anything when the swarms do minimal damage and the vehicle can easily evade the attack with minimal harm and escape easily? I'd love to see someone try to destroy a dropship with Swarms in 1.7. And the small missile turrets will have 300HP of splash damage? Sounds like Assault Dropships will be the next FoTM to me. I could easily see them firing at infantry while staying above SL lock range. That creates semi-invincibility. I do believe that 400m was way too long, but at 175m they will be a joke weapon. Right next to PLCs. Heck, I want to see you or anyone attempt to give me a good reason as to why I should keep using SLs. To give pilots easy kills? Heck no. Infact, I'm gonna finish skilling into Large Railguns. It's already what most pilots want. HAVs being the best and/or only counter to themselves. Check out my corp's new website here :D -HAND
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 1424	Posted - 2013.11.29 06:19:00 - [8] - Quote Luna Angelo wrote: Pvt Numnutz wrote: Vitharr Foebane wrote: Just remember guys, FG range = 300m. Large Rail range = 600m b*tch less about FG and more bout the return of redline railing All vehicles should not be able to shoot in redline. Even Sniper tanks should exit it to shoot. So you think redline AV is a problem, yet redline tanking is perfectly fine? Another double standard. And I though I heard all of the pilot ones. What a shame Check out my corp's new website here :D -HAND
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 1424	Posted - 2013.11.29 06:40:00 - [9] - Quote Luna Angelo wrote: Atiim wrote: Luna Angelo wrote: Pvt Numnutz wrote: Vitharr Foebane wrote: Just remember guys, FG range = 300m. Large Rail range = 600m b*tch less about FG and more bout the return of redline railing All vehicles should not be able to shoot in redline. Even Sniper tanks should exit it to shoot. So you think redline AV is a problem, yet redline tanking is perfectly fine? Another double standard. And I though I heard all of the pilot ones. What a shame ....Where did I say that? Redline tanking is a problem. I said they need to exit to shoot, Atiim. lol OMG. I thought that said exist. Man I really gotta stop playing DUST Forums at 1am. Check out my corp's new website here :D -HAND
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 1427	Posted - 2013.11.29 16:13:00 - [10] - Quote jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: Atim wrote: If you can easily solo a vehicle with STD AV, then it was a poorly fit vehicle. There is no getting around that and if you are quickly taken down by one guy running STD AV you need to start using hardners and (while I hate to use this) "GET GOOD". 1.) Tanks and all vehicles (besides DSs) are self sustainable. They only require one person to operate and you are not required to use teamwork in any condition, shape, fashion, or form to be successful. 1. my infantry doesn't need teamwork so thats invalid 2. i use teamwork with tanks so HTFU 3. the rest disregarded as thats just sily and a poor example 4. in BF3 it takes teamwork to destroy vehicles, in bf3&4 it takes teamwork to destroy a scout heli with engineers, tanks are a team asset, besides you can easily hide from tanks. 5. i destroy tanks solo but not in 1 second, 6k hp tanks i get the drop on or i spam AV from hives. 6. i and they use hardeners so saying "get good" is invalid as AV is in such a OP state that it's going to kill 1.) It doesn't need teamwork, but you will be utterly destroyed unless you use teamwork 2.) Are you required to? No. And while we're at it, why don't you HTFU and stop QQIng. I can only fill so many buckets at a time. 3.) Disregard it if you like, but that still doesn't make my statement any less true. 4.) In BF3? Oh yes we should make this like other games! That's perfect. Let's make DUST 514 like other FPS titles! We should also make this like COD and lower the TTK even further! In other words, your an idiot. 5.) Anyone can solo anything. Just like I could start using melee attacks against a heavy and kill him that way. But how long do you think it would take? And AV grenades require you to get right in front of the vehicle, so 9/10 times, it's the driver's fault. 6.) I use hardners too. And because of this I don't get insta-killed or near insta-killed by PRO AV. If you use hardners,AV is a joke weapon. So yeah tankers are either not running hardners, they have poorly fit vehicles, or they are lying. (I already know that in most cases, all three are true. But the latter applies to almost everyone). Check out my corp's new website here :D -HAND