DUST Search - Small arms do lot of damage to vehicle

Kane Fyea wrote:

Spkr4theDead wrote:

Zero Harpuia wrote:

Spkr4theDead wrote:

negative49er wrote:

a concentrated fire from AR, SCR, Flaylocks, and Mass driver do **** ton of damage to a tank

Small arms should do absolutely zero to vehicles.

No, they shouldn't. Could you imagine if LAVs were immune to all small weapons fire? Vehicles should have great resistances, as that is what sets them apart from infantry. The vehicles should be able to be harassed by people with light arms. In New Eden, the smallest Rifter can still tickle an Avatar's shields and armor, so why should Light weapons not effect vehicles? The divide isn't nearly as wide.

Furthermore, how does it make logical sense? If I fire, say, a Scrambler Rifle at an HAV, it's shields intercept the blast. It isn't like the shields aren't USED, you can see them flash. They are therefore drained due to the power output required to block the shot and re-energize the defensive layer.

In any case, its not like the AR or ScR or any anti-infantry weapon will out-do an Anti-Vehicular weapon in any way, shaoe, or form for anti-vehicular warfare. But arbitrarily making them do no damage is just silly. You have high resistances, those are tallied into things when small arms fire hits you, so it is really nothing to worry about. In the OP's example, it was a mass of players doing a significant amount of damage, the OP specifically stating they were just an irritation at best.

See, in EVE, all turrets are anti-ship turrets. Those are the only weapons. The only platform you have is a space ship. In Dust, we have more than one platform.

Why should something designed for taking out people, also do damage to an 80 ton vehicle? That doesn't make sense. Even a .50cal doesn't do anything to a tank. Why should an SMG damage a tank?

So you're saying that a 50 caliber round doesn't even tickle a tank? For some reason I highly doubt that. Would it hurt it much? No not at all. Would it still damage the vehicle? Yes. So why shouldn't our small arms do minimal damage that can barely even be noticed.

Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.

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Zero Harpuia Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 1243	Posted - 2013.11.25 21:12:00 - [31] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Zero Harpuia wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: negative49er wrote: a concentrated fire from AR, SCR, Flaylocks, and Mass driver do **** ton of damage to a tank Small arms should do absolutely zero to vehicles. No, they shouldn't. Could you imagine if LAVs were immune to all small weapons fire? Vehicles should have great resistances, as that is what sets them apart from infantry. The vehicles should be able to be harassed by people with light arms. In New Eden, the smallest Rifter can still tickle an Avatar's shields and armor, so why should Light weapons not effect vehicles? The divide isn't nearly as wide. Furthermore, how does it make logical sense? If I fire, say, a Scrambler Rifle at an HAV, it's shields intercept the blast. It isn't like the shields aren't USED, you can see them flash. They are therefore drained due to the power output required to block the shot and re-energize the defensive layer. In any case, its not like the AR or ScR or any anti-infantry weapon will out-do an Anti-Vehicular weapon in any way, shaoe, or form for anti-vehicular warfare. But arbitrarily making them do no damage is just silly. You have high resistances, those are tallied into things when small arms fire hits you, so it is really nothing to worry about. In the OP's example, it was a mass of players doing a significant amount of damage, the OP specifically stating they were just an irritation at best. See, in EVE, all turrets are anti-ship turrets. Those are the only weapons. The only platform you have is a space ship. In Dust, we have more than one platform. Why should something designed for taking out people, also do damage to an 80 ton vehicle? That doesn't make sense. Even a .50cal doesn't do anything to a tank. Why should an SMG damage a tank? I'll give you that, but it's all a question of scale in EVE. A Light class turret in EVE is about as big as a Heavy class DUST turret, if I've done my research right. Using Railguns as a starting point, these turrets fire Hybrid Rounds roughly as large as ones that the Forge Gun or Large Railgun Turrets planetside. The only difference between them and the XL sized turrets is a matter of scale, and a severe one at that. XL turrets are huge, their rounds alone larger than your HAV. Be thankful EVE corps want the land we fight on or else we wouldn't exist :3 To put that in perspective DUST side, the difference between Light weapons and Heavy Attack Vehicle Turrets isn't quite as wide. An HAV's main battery fires bullets about the size of an AR, give or take a few centimeters. This means that, if starting with sidearms as their own power level, EVE to DUST, we get... Small is Sidearm Class Medium is Light Class Large is Heavy Class and Light Turrets, both roughly of comparable power and size, comparing the Small Blaster to the HMG Extra Large is Large Turrets So AV proficient weapons are only two levels above standard issue Light weaponry. And yes, enough people shooting ARs at an HAV will eventually kill it, but so will enough Rifters swarming a Myrmidon. Numbers may be a factor, but if we think that a 10 v 1 fight should be unerringly won by the 1, we are being a tad foolish. Shields as Weapons
Zero Harpuia Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 1243	Posted - 2013.11.25 21:14:00 - [32] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: This thread gave me chemo. I hope you just came off one that gave you cancer then :p Shields as Weapons
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows 1161	Posted - 2013.11.25 21:20:00 - [33] - Quote IKR Last week I killed a HAV with my Toxin SMG. Seriously, three kills plus a dead HAV, I know they had to be pissed (or would've been had it not said "Alaika Arbosa (Road Kill) Reddot Name" three times in a row). Praise St. Arzad and Pass the Nanohives Karin Midular, gone, never forgotten Executing Amarr Trash since Closed Beta
Patrick57 Fatal Absolution 1739	Posted - 2013.11.25 21:22:00 - [34] - Quote negative49er wrote: a concentrated fire from AR, SCR, Flaylocks, and Mass driver do **** ton of damage to a tank There have been times when I take more damage from small arms fire in a Gunnlogi than I do from Swarm Launchers When I'm depressed, I cut myself......A BIG SLICE OF CHOCOLATE CAKE!
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4295	Posted - 2013.11.25 21:22:00 - [35] - Quote Mdog 24158 wrote: negative49er wrote: a concentrated fire from AR, SCR, Flaylocks, and Mass driver do **** ton of damage to a tank Why dont you just kill them your in a god damn tank :/ Hehehehe Lai Dai mate, if you have em' were a running from you. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4295	Posted - 2013.11.25 21:24:00 - [36] - Quote Zero Harpuia wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: This thread gave me chemo. I hope you just came off one that gave you cancer then :p Not all that funny of a joke. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 5403	Posted - 2013.11.25 21:45:00 - [37] - Quote Medic 1879 wrote: Roger Cordill wrote: Medic 1879 wrote: Yeah and its incredibly stupid that small arms damage tanks (with the exception of PLC swarms and MD obviously,a nd heavy weapons should damage them.) vehicles in 1.7 will be getting shield recharge delays which means one guy with an AR taking a shot at you every few seconds will completely halt passive regen. Although I must admit firing 1 random ScR shot at a nearly dead tank and getting 150 wp is always amusing. Message from Godin: I've heard otherwise.... Is it confirmed that small arms wont reset the recharge delay because I have seen a few people claim it wont but no confirmation. Hopefully your right but I asked in the vehicle changes thread and never got an answer. It is confirmed. Level 5 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution Supporter of CCP raRaRa.
Xender17 Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 934	Posted - 2013.11.25 21:48:00 - [38] - Quote When gunnlogi shields drop... insta manganite to any weapon. What the fox say?
pseudosnipre DUST University Ivy League 361	Posted - 2013.11.25 21:49:00 - [39] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: negative49er wrote: a concentrated fire from AR, SCR, Flaylocks, and Mass driver do **** ton of damage to a tank Small arms should do absolutely zero to vehicles. My efficiency always says ~20% for vehicles. And I agree on reduced damage for armor, but not shields. Your shield are not special and should melt from laser fire. Also, a full squad working on 6000k armor shouldn't take long if using energy weapons and explosives, but shouldn't be possible using projectiles and hybrids (SG, AR, etc). With that said I've seen a lot fewer av in pubs...everyone just shoots the tank hoping to get +75 assist points.
Borne Velvalor Endless Hatred 1025	Posted - 2013.11.25 22:01:00 - [40] - Quote I've probably had several dozen of my Somas popped by now. I don't think I can honestly say I've ever had small arms fire contribute enough damage that I wouldn't have died without it. Most weapons deal 10%-20% damage to vehicles. In the case of a Duvolle with proficiency 5 and 2 complex mods, that would be 60-120 DPS. We're looking at 300-600 damage a clip. With my hardeners on, it's about 150-300 damage a clip. If 5 guys each unload a clip over 5 seconds, that's 750-1500 damage. So, it only takes 5-10 seconds of a whole squad firing at me to deal the same damage as a swarm. I don't know about you, but unless I'm boosting into a dozen guys and not killing any of them and they all decide to focus their infantry weapons on me at the same time, I'm not going to care. Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn. Panda.

Medic 1879 Forsaken Immortals Top Men. 1271	Posted - 2013.11.25 22:05:00 - [41] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Medic 1879 wrote: Roger Cordill wrote: Medic 1879 wrote: Yeah and its incredibly stupid that small arms damage tanks (with the exception of PLC swarms and MD obviously,a nd heavy weapons should damage them.) vehicles in 1.7 will be getting shield recharge delays which means one guy with an AR taking a shot at you every few seconds will completely halt passive regen. Although I must admit firing 1 random ScR shot at a nearly dead tank and getting 150 wp is always amusing. Message from Godin: I've heard otherwise.... Is it confirmed that small arms wont reset the recharge delay because I have seen a few people claim it wont but no confirmation. Hopefully your right but I asked in the vehicle changes thread and never got an answer. It is confirmed. Thank you. TEST signature please help me think of a better one.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1353	Posted - 2013.11.25 22:18:00 - [42] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Zero Harpuia wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: negative49er wrote: a concentrated fire from AR, SCR, Flaylocks, and Mass driver do **** ton of damage to a tank Small arms should do absolutely zero to vehicles. No, they shouldn't. Could you imagine if LAVs were immune to all small weapons fire? Vehicles should have great resistances, as that is what sets them apart from infantry. The vehicles should be able to be harassed by people with light arms. In New Eden, the smallest Rifter can still tickle an Avatar's shields and armor, so why should Light weapons not effect vehicles? The divide isn't nearly as wide. Furthermore, how does it make logical sense? If I fire, say, a Scrambler Rifle at an HAV, it's shields intercept the blast. It isn't like the shields aren't USED, you can see them flash. They are therefore drained due to the power output required to block the shot and re-energize the defensive layer. In any case, its not like the AR or ScR or any anti-infantry weapon will out-do an Anti-Vehicular weapon in any way, shaoe, or form for anti-vehicular warfare. But arbitrarily making them do no damage is just silly. You have high resistances, those are tallied into things when small arms fire hits you, so it is really nothing to worry about. In the OP's example, it was a mass of players doing a significant amount of damage, the OP specifically stating they were just an irritation at best. See, in EVE, all turrets are anti-ship turrets. Those are the only weapons. The only platform you have is a space ship. In Dust, we have more than one platform. Why should something designed for taking out people, also do damage to an 80 ton vehicle? That doesn't make sense. Even a .50cal doesn't do anything to a tank. Why should an SMG damage a tank? So you're saying that a 50 caliber round doesn't even tickle a tank? For some reason I highly doubt that. Would it hurt it much? No not at all. Would it still damage the vehicle? Yes. So why shouldn't our small arms do minimal damage that can barely even be noticed. It's a .50 cal... vs a tank. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Virtual Riot The Vanguardians 78	Posted - 2013.11.25 23:17:00 - [43] - Quote I'm thinking of World Of Tanks Small arms should be able to damage shields, it makes sense. But small arms should not be able to damage armor, the rounds are way too small to even penetrate the thick plating of an HAV. In the online game World of Tanks, smaller guns do absolutely no damage to a heavy tank with very thick armor, unless its shooting at its backside or underside. The shooter is met with the response "It didn't even penetrate!" This seems reasonable to me
KING CHECKMATE AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS 2426	Posted - 2013.11.25 23:20:00 - [44] - Quote negative49er wrote: a concentrated fire from AR, SCR, Flaylocks, and Mass driver do ** ton of damage to a tank WOW TANKER QQ is endless..like SRSLY. The Best Damage Mod, its a Headshot....**
Monkey MAC killer taxi company 1071	Posted - 2013.11.25 23:25:00 - [45] - Quote negative49er wrote: a concentrated fire from AR, SCR, Flaylocks, and Mass driver do **** ton of damage to a tank Tankers 80 dps from an AR is too much, Also Mass Driver and Flaylock are explosives, which means they get AV damage profiles! Technically the Mass Driver is the Minmatar AV weapon. The pen is mightier than the sword The gun is mightier than both Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
Monkey MAC killer taxi company 1071	Posted - 2013.11.25 23:32:00 - [46] - Quote Virtual Riot wrote: I'm thinking of World Of Tanks Small arms should be able to damage shields, it makes sense. But small arms should not be able to damage armor, the rounds are way too small to even penetrate the thick plating of an HAV. In the online game World of Tanks, smaller guns do absolutely no damage to a heavy tank with very thick armor, unless its shooting at its backside or underside. The shooter is met with the response "It didn't even penetrate!" This seems reasonable to me We are shooting plasma that's so hot, it melts any armour it comes into contact with. We are shooting fission based fragmentation rounds, it disintegrates any armour it comes to contact with. We are shooting super concentrated photons, that destroy armour on a molecular. We are shooting hyper-accelerated slugs with so much momentum, it should flip a tank. Just Sayin The pen is mightier than the sword The gun is mightier than both Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1


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