Tebu Gan
Dem Durrty Boyz
216
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Posted - 2013.11.22 20:28:00 -
[1] - Quote
First off, well put OP. You started a discussion that for the most part isn't a name calling fest. And typically that's what this issue turns into.
What a lot of you are missing, and it's a big one:
BOB GOT A RESPEC
Yet Bob is crying for an end to all respecs. At the end of beta, all players were given a respec.
>So Bob was allowed to make mistakes, then correct said mistakes.
>Bob was able to try out all the different items.
>Bob started the offical relase with a huge advantage.
This of course is assuming Bob is a VET, and a VET comes from beta. I would figure most of the people against respecs fall into this catagory, but understand that there are more than likely others out there that are against respec and don't fall under this vet catagory.
I didn't play much during beta, between the bugs, and insta killing laser rifles, I decided on waiting until official release. My char had gained about 4 mil in sp tho. And guess what I did.
I spent a little in assault rifles and a assault suit, played a bit with it, and found I didn't like it. So I tried the different weapons, standard version. My games were terrible, and I wanted so badly to be better. So I got a advanced weapon, and then another, and before I knew it, points were all over the place.
One thing to note, there are huge differences between standard weapons and proto weapons. But everyone knows that, but I myself did not realize this when I started. It took a good solid month of playing to get an idea of these differences. Longer still to figure out the skill tree, and really understand how to begin forming a good char. By then though I found there were no more respecs and was very upset.
I feel for the new guys, I really do. Dust really isn't big on player retention. Newbs, are slaughtered, relentlessly. Then for those that decide to stick it out, they are punished.
For the Bobs out there saying that somehow you would be rewarding new players, I point to that shiny respec you yourself got.
Afraid of FOTM chasers? So what, there will always be FOTM chasers. Plus, one of these days, CCP will have things much closer in terms of balance. And by then, the vets will have a ton of SP.
Those that say grinding out SP is nothing, It is. Imagine it from the newbies point, as you are slaughtered over and over, maybe earning 150 WP a match. It's going to be a looong while before you are proto ready. Or even me, the casual gamer, who works most of the day, everyday, and only has a hour or 2 for the game. 6 months later and I'm sitting on 11 mil.
I fail to see how respecs, hurt people, or the game. The only things that come to mind are positive:
Player retention(Be nice if people could play with the SP system and LEARN IT before you punish them)
Change of pace(sometimes I tire of running the same tanks, over and over)
Testing ( when ccp makes balance changes, more of the community can try those changes out, and provide feedback.)
Just to name a few. Now I did not mention negatives to a respec, so please lemme know what your negatives to respecs are.
Remember "vets" you did get a respec, and didn't have to LIVE with your choices.
And lets keep in mind, this is a SHOOTER, not a SANDBOX MMO.
Nuff Said
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Tebu Gan
Dem Durrty Boyz
218
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Posted - 2013.11.22 20:36:00 -
[2] - Quote
Awry Barux wrote:Zero Harpuia wrote:Thor Odinson42 wrote:And just to add to my point above.
The FOTM chasers are actually doing the game a favor. They highlight the OPness or the shortcomings of items rather quickly.
Other than holding on to the ideals from Eve I still can't wrap my head around the anti-respec mindset.
I do believe that a lot of vets are worried that all these randoms might get their **** together if their SP were allocated properly. Please cease that easily refuted point. The vets aren't scared of the newbies. If anything, the newbies should be scared that the vets could respec all 10-40 million SP. The anti-respec mindset is pretty easy to understand if you choose to do so. I specced into, let's say Laser Rifle I. I can still spec into ARs, ScRs, SLs, ANYTHING really. That's the point of the game. You can spec into anything given enough time investment. If you let people respec every few months it cuts down both the interest of the new and the repercussions of the permanent. For a personal example, I have enough SP saved up to proto both the new guns being added in 1.7. I chose to save instead of spend, which hurt me in the short term. I could proto them out immediately, but that would be a very Alex thing to do. I could also just put a single level into both and tinker with them. It doesn't cost much and I can get that back from a few quick fights. Then I can pour the banked SP into whichever I end ep liking, if either. But what if we get a respec? Not only will that hurt me, because I chose to bank SP, it also kills any permanence of choice. Why not throw this to level V, enough people will be whining for another respec in a month to get me out of it. Why not put all my points into a single niche, I'm just a respec away from getting a weapon in another category. Why shouldn't I pound all my SP into the new thing, I'll get it back in a month. Why can't I just try a new role every few months until the whole game's intrigue is torn away? I could just do it the way the game intended and unlock everything over time, but why should I when they will always cave for a respec? Until all racial content is released and the balance is ironed out, the "permanence" of choices is meaningless. If you don't see why that's the case, I don't think I'll be able to explain it to you. The pro-respec mindset is pretty easy to understand if you choose to do so. For you, a vet, saving your SP is not even mildly the same as a post-release player saving their SP, and for you to belittle low-SP players for not saving their SP is ridiculous. You saving your SP only hurts your horizontal spread- you lose versatility, but you already have at least one, if not multiple, fully proto-d roles. To players with <12 million SP, who have spent carefully towards a single specialized role, saving SP directly hurts their ability to perform their role in the short term, and in Dust the "short term" means multiple months. Therefore, when new content comes out, it's the veteran players who can freely spec into the new content at no real cost to themselves over the previous months. Respecs when a significant amount of new content is added would negate this issue. edit: I agree that allowing frequent respecs, or generally respecs not related to new content being introduced, would be detrimental to the game, but that's not at all the case here. If you really want a cookie for not wanting/needing a respec, fine- let's have anyone who doesn't take a respec receive 10000 black eagles or 100k free SP or 100 million ISK or whatever would placate you. For the majority of the player base, a respec has far more positives than negatives.
Well put, it's not a huge deal for someone with SP spent into a viable role, to save for another role or weapon. But for Alex, it is a matter of months.
Given they should not give out respecs every month, that would be crazy. What they should do:
3 respecs for a life time. And thats all you get.
Nuff Said
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