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Zero Harpuia
Turalyon 514
Turalyon Alliance
1171
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Posted - 2013.11.17 22:55:00 -
[1] - Quote
This is not a good idea. Beyond the logic of making a suit that can only fir a sidearm because reasons... no, lets keep going there. The only reason Heavy weapons can only be used by Heavy's is because the other suits can't handle their weight and bulk. If Logistics are limited to sidearms, so should scouts because hey, they're even slighter than Logistics. The whole reason Logis do not have a sidearm slot is because they use all the room on their person for equipment. The Amarr designers decided to not convert the sidearm slot into an equipment slot, so it still has a sidearm but not a full equipment set. It's stupid to give the suit just a sidearm because reasons.
Now, for gameplay reasons. Give the Logi sidearms only, and more than half the players that use them will demand respecs or leave the game, and rightly so. Such a major and sudden change is more than anything before seen in DUST, rivaled only by the removal of Marauders. We don't even have a full set of sidearms yet, so the poor weapons development of the game will have the weapons choices parred down even farther than you think. The slow Logi suit would make the Nova Knives useless, the Scrambler Pistol doesn't have the ammo capacity to survive beyond the first few firefights, and has far too short a range for a laser weapon in my opinion, the Flaylock is... the Flaylock. The SMG is the only reasonable choice, and even then as a PDW it isn't a reliable deterrent. As your only gun the Assault version would waste ammo too fast, the Breach wouldn't have the DPS to be anywhere near competitive with other suits, and the standard has both problems to lesser degrees. The new sidearm, the Magsec SMG, will probably fall into a similar rut, but with more armor bias.
You are asking an entire suit class to use weapons inferior to the overused Assault Rifle in every way. As it is overused, chances of fighting it in any one match are near 100%. In a 1v1 fight, it makes the outcome almost assured. In a team fight of equal numbers, it makes you a weak link.
IF we were to do this, then EVERY SUIT IN THE GAME needs to have their equipment slots removed. ALL of them. Otherwise, there would be no reason to use the Logi if you have at least two friends. Alex brings the hives, Bob has the Triage, and Clem brings the Injectors. Derp has all three, but gets slaughtered whenever his glowing yellow posterior breaks wind.
ECM Equipment
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Zero Harpuia
Turalyon 514
Turalyon Alliance
1174
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Posted - 2013.11.17 23:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
ACE OF JOKERS wrote:IMO the best way to balance logis is:
1-Give them THE EXACT same amount of high and low slots as Assaults.The extra CPU-PG is for equipment,not Assault mode.
2-Change their bonus to the Gallente logi bonus:
-Logi default bonus: 5% CPU-PG cost reduction on equipment
Specific racial:
-GAllente Logi: +1 Armor rep per level (so this one stays the same)
-Cal Logi:15% Shield regen rate per level (For a maximum of +75% = 35 Shield per sec)
-Amarr Logi: 5% CPU-PG cost reduction on Active Scanners and Drop Uplinks per level
-Minmatar Logi: 5% Hacking speed per level
I might even post this with its own thread later....
Work on those bonuses then. The Logistics wide bonus is nice, but the new individual ones make some weak links. Hacking, for example, is almost useless in two of three game modes so Minmatar would be right out. Amarr have limited equips already, so giving them further reductions to the Scout-type equipment is nice but having lost their tank bonus to the Gallente it is far from good. The Cal and Gal Logi both have survivability bonuses, good in every situation.
ECM Equipment
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Zero Harpuia
Turalyon 514
Turalyon Alliance
1178
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Posted - 2013.11.18 05:11:00 -
[3] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:Shadow Archeus wrote:I support restricting logos to a sidearm.......but here's an alternative rather lengthy but would add a little more diversity
Make a medium weapon class......this would include mass drivers.....sniper rifles......swarm launchers......scrambler rifles....and the new rifles
All suits can use medium weapons but logistics suits
Future suits could limit weapons in this manner
I.e. a scout suit that can't use medium weapons but in turn is faster and more durable....or a heavy that is the same(faster than a commando but with 1000hp but can only use light weapons
There's a lot that it could open up I proposed something similar awhile back. The difference being that I proposed a "Logi" Weapon slot which would fit between Light and Sidearm. The "Logi Weapon" class would include Laser Rifle, Mass Driver, Plasma Cannon, Shotgun, Sniper Rifle and Swarm Launcher. It was shouted down by the Assport Logis.
I believe the reason it was shouted down is because it sounds asstarded. Why would you give the situational weapons, the ones that need a SIDEARM, to the only suit WITH NO SIDEARM. What do you do when someone gets right up on you with a Sniper Rifle? What do you do when you have a Shotgun and someone shoots at you at 30 meters out? What do you shoot at someone when they aren't in your Laser Rifle's five meters of effectiveness?
ECM Equipment
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Zero Harpuia
Turalyon 514
Turalyon Alliance
1179
|
Posted - 2013.11.18 05:19:00 -
[4] - Quote
XxGhazbaranxX wrote:Atiim wrote:XxGhazbaranxX wrote:Why don't I need a light weapon? This is simple. My work is to keep my teammate alive. If I cannot do this then I am no logi. Every engagement, every battle comes down to communication and having a partner with which you can refine your tactics.
I have a partner and together we have a very different play style than most would think. First off we take it slow. We use cover. He doesn't run off like a crazy person trying to get kills. The goal is to win not to get KDR as high as he can.
Second we communicate. As I have my rep tool on him 24/7 he has to guard me. I am his lifeline and he is mine. In no moment does my Light weapon come into the equation. HE IS MY WEAPON.
True logi's look at a post like this and the only thing thy see is, as the OP hinted to, all my wasted SP into light weaponry and they would be correct to care about that. But a true logi doesn't give a rats ass about his weapon because Like i said earlier "YOUR PARTNER IS YOUR WEAPON" You are an idiot. How exactly do you think your friend is gonna guard you? By being your meatshield? I'll just gun you down and then work on your friend afterwards. Everyone doesn't always need a repair or resupply 24/7. And I shouldn't be restricted to only being a medic. That would kill most of the fun out of the logistics class. What happens when your partner is down but there is an enemy nearby? Are you gonna revive him and hope that you and him don't get gunned down in the process? You shouldn't even bother trying to kill that enemy because after all, Logis don't need weapons do they? LOL you sir don't know how to logi. You can't touch this when I doing tactics. people don't play smart. All they want to do is run and gun... Then when something different comes in the field they get steamrolled. I see this all the time. People going after me they don't go after the person I'm repping. But squad play get it done. Playing slowly rewards the player . Since I didnt rush in, I didn't get surropunded. Since I didnt get surrounded My tam got the kills. Since MY team got the kills We won the match. You insult me but I have got the logi down to a T. If you want to slay with your logi then Hats off for being a leach on the system
Not to put too fine a point on it, but this isn't TF2. I'm a pro-level Medic in TF2, and what you're doing fits that to a T, but in here you're a damned moron. If he's at full HP and you still have your rep tool on him you are wasting everyone's time, mostly your own. You are far more effective in a fight aiming your gun than healing a target under fire. A Core Repair tool does 180-odd HP a second. An unskilled militia AR does 425 damage a second, 383 to the armor layer you are attempting to heal. There is QUITE the discrepancy, and you REALLY aren't helping much. You would be alot more effective if you countered the 425 with your own 425.
ECM Equipment
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Zero Harpuia
Turalyon 514
Turalyon Alliance
1179
|
Posted - 2013.11.18 05:53:00 -
[5] - Quote
XxGhazbaranxX wrote:Zero Harpuia wrote:XxGhazbaranxX wrote:Atiim wrote:XxGhazbaranxX wrote:Why don't I need a light weapon? This is simple. My work is to keep my teammate alive. If I cannot do this then I am no logi. Every engagement, every battle comes down to communication and having a partner with which you can refine your tactics.
I have a partner and together we have a very different play style than most would think. First off we take it slow. We use cover. He doesn't run off like a crazy person trying to get kills. The goal is to win not to get KDR as high as he can.
Second we communicate. As I have my rep tool on him 24/7 he has to guard me. I am his lifeline and he is mine. In no moment does my Light weapon come into the equation. HE IS MY WEAPON.
True logi's look at a post like this and the only thing thy see is, as the OP hinted to, all my wasted SP into light weaponry and they would be correct to care about that. But a true logi doesn't give a rats ass about his weapon because Like i said earlier "YOUR PARTNER IS YOUR WEAPON" You are an idiot. How exactly do you think your friend is gonna guard you? By being your meatshield? I'll just gun you down and then work on your friend afterwards. Everyone doesn't always need a repair or resupply 24/7. And I shouldn't be restricted to only being a medic. That would kill most of the fun out of the logistics class. What happens when your partner is down but there is an enemy nearby? Are you gonna revive him and hope that you and him don't get gunned down in the process? You shouldn't even bother trying to kill that enemy because after all, Logis don't need weapons do they? LOL you sir don't know how to logi. You can't touch this when I doing tactics. people don't play smart. All they want to do is run and gun... Then when something different comes in the field they get steamrolled. I see this all the time. People going after me they don't go after the person I'm repping. But squad play get it done. Playing slowly rewards the player . Since I didnt rush in, I didn't get surropunded. Since I didnt get surrounded My tam got the kills. Since MY team got the kills We won the match. You insult me but I have got the logi down to a T. If you want to slay with your logi then Hats off for being a leach on the system Not to put too fine a point on it, but this isn't TF2. I'm a pro-level Medic in TF2, and what you're doing fits that to a T, but in here you're a damned moron. If he's at full HP and you still have your rep tool on him you are wasting everyone's time, mostly your own. You are far more effective in a fight aiming your gun than healing a target under fire. A Core Repair tool does 180-odd HP a second. An unskilled militia AR does 425 damage a second, 383 to the armor layer you are attempting to heal. There is QUITE the discrepancy, and you REALLY aren't helping much. You would be alot more effective if you countered the 425 with your own 425. who ever said I dont do anything else but rep if he is full... Last I heard I had 4 equipment slots to do whatever the hell I want. Deducing That I'm just repping is basically ignorant. Just so you know Guardian 35 points scan bonus 15 points total 50 points without defend order. You decide whether I'm the one doing it wrong ^^
If you are, in fact, 'healing 24/7', you are 'doing it wrong'. Healing in combat is also 'doing it wrong.' If you're both behind cover and you are trying to heal him before the enemy rounds the corner that's one thing, but in combat, as demonstrated above, you are a waste of life healing instead of shooting. Furthermore, I am not ignorant for trusting what you said to be true. Is it my fault you lied to us about how you play the game? We were going off faulty information from an unreliable narrator if that was the case. In any case, I have mathematically proven that the most unskilled newberry can lay down more damage than the most skilled logistics player can heal, and by a minimum factor of THREE. Your turn.
Also, FOUR equip slots? Nice protosuit Mr. Serious.
As a special note, just because it gives more WP doesn't mean it's right. People used to get more WP ramming a car into a wall than actually fighting. Plus, in a 2v2 situation, battlehealing logis will lose every time :3
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