DUST Search - what reason is there really to run anything but a logi suit?

All Channels

Feedback/Requests

what reason is there really to run anything but a logi suit?

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1026	Posted - 2013.10.29 17:27:00 - [1] - Quote I keep asking myself this question... if I want a side arm ill run amar logi if I want to have the ehp of a heavy ill go gallente or caldari if I want to be fast (like a scout) kinkats ftw and hell, lets put on the minmitar logi suit for the hack bonus as a logi I have more equipment slots then any other suit so uplink/hive spam is no problem. I can be a slayer, a medic, support, I can scout, I can even be a heavy to a degree minus the heavy weapon, but aside from proto forge guns am I really missing out on anything? I really love playing this game, but lets face it, unless your trying to be different or made an honest mistake when applying sp to your tree, running anything other than a logi suit is a self inflicted nerf to your merc....
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1026	Posted - 2013.10.29 17:46:00 - [2] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Your logi will never be able to compete with the scout's passive scan range, and profile dampening. but is that really going to change the tide of the battle... and how many wp are you going to get for yourself scanning? so you can scan farther... I can still scan well enough to find reds and then go toe to toe with them... yeah you can be more sneaky as a scout but the minute your presence becomes known youre a dead scout. im sorry but scan range and dampening just isn't enough of an advantage to pick that over a logi... plus I can just jump in an lav and use that to traverse the map looking for reds and jump out of it kill you and jump back in and ride off...
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1026	Posted - 2013.10.29 17:56:00 - [3] - Quote Oswald Rehnquist wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Your logi will never be able to compete with the scout's passive scan range, and profile dampening. Profile dampening is easily negligible, all they need is to get that below 28, which is doable if they wanted a scout build Now the new changes to passive scans will not be able to be breached by the logi Also the new buff the heavy armor will help the heavy separate itself from the logi, but not by enough to make a real impact on the field... scout scanning doesn't win battles or accrue many WPs heavies may have more ehp now but they are still slow as turtles... and the only place turtles win races is in the storybooks... ill take my caldari tanked suit I fit with all complex extenders 1 enhanced dmg mod and all bpo militia plates for a total of 1029 ehp or fit a few enhanced plates and eek out about 1200 ehp over the heavies extra few hundred, plus I can fit triage hives and some remotes for an even larger advantage over the heavy... Im just not seeing a convincing argument to run anything but a logi unless youre a masochist...
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1027	Posted - 2013.10.29 18:15:00 - [4] - Quote Cosgar wrote: If you're asking this question, you have no attention for detail. see this is one of those "profound" internet comments that suggests the author has some deep understanding of the game the reader will never attain... try posting in some details yourself since you pay such close attention to them...
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1027	Posted - 2013.10.29 18:59:00 - [5] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: If you're asking this question, you have no attention for detail. see this is one of those "profound" internet comments that suggests the author has some deep understanding of the game the reader will never attain... try posting in some details yourself since you pay such close attention to them... Just check my post history. I have better comments in better logi vs assault topics, I'm getting a bit tired of repeating myself. if youre getting tired of talking about the topic then what are you doing posting in my thread... either add something to the conversation or don't waste your time... but I cant take you seriously with your nose stuck so far up in the air...
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1027	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:07:00 - [6] - Quote Kristoff Atruin wrote: Or you could just read any of the last dozen logi whine threads instead of making a new one and rehashing the same tired old arguments. or I could add my voice to the cacophony cries for better balance in this game... that's what the forums are for, and if you agree with me then your just being a troll. if you disagree then you should tirelessly defend your stance... you've been around for awhile, you know how things work here... flood the forums with threads of a topic and you have a 50/50 chance ccp does something... remain silent .... and you have a 50/50 chance ccp does something....lol we are on the same side, we want an awesome game here, so quit being patronizing and participate...btw the links to your posts isn't working on my pc...
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1032	Posted - 2013.10.29 23:58:00 - [7] - Quote Oswald Rehnquist wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Oswald Rehnquist wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Your logi will never be able to compete with the scout's passive scan range, and profile dampening. Profile dampening is easily negligible, all they need is to get that below 28, which is doable if they wanted a scout build Now the new changes to passive scans will not be able to be breached by the logi Also the new buff the heavy armor will help the heavy separate itself from the logi, but not by enough to make a real impact on the field... scout scanning doesn't win battles or accrue many WPs heavies may have more ehp now but they are still slow as turtles... and the only place turtles win races is in the storybooks... ill take my caldari tanked suit I fit with all complex extenders 1 enhanced dmg mod and all bpo militia plates for a total of 1029 ehp or fit a few enhanced plates and eek out about 1200 ehp over the heavies extra few hundred, plus I can fit triage hives and some remotes for an even larger advantage over the heavy... Im just not seeing a convincing argument to run anything but a logi unless youre a masochist... I"m not disagreeing that the scale is tipped towards the logi, it is. Heavies, assaults, and scouts in their respective threads all complain about their role being invaded by the logi, which is why logi defenders are tired, because they get it from all sides. I'm all for an equipment based class that can fight, I'm no light weapon slot thief Assault vs Logi in my mind is fine once you fix Assault racials by giving them a free light weapon complex damage mod or equivalent offensive utility. Heavy v Logi is on a per see basis after the changes, heavy racials need work too Scout v Logi is mainly the scout lacking unique utility to have any specific need for one I really like your idea of giving a passive +10 to dmg that would help make a viable difference between salts and logis still, even with a passive boost like that, as a logi stands now, ill still take 3 equipment slots and 10% less dmg, if that's the only difference... logis need a defining draw back that make running them or not a real choice based on advantage to disadvantage... I challenge anyone to name one disadvantage of running a logi suit....
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 00:50:00 - [8] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Oswald Rehnquist wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: [quote=Oswald Rehnquist] but not by enough to make a real impact on the field... scout scanning doesn't win battles or accrue many WPs heavies may have more ehp now but they are still slow as turtles... and the only place turtles win races is in the storybooks... ill take my caldari tanked suit I fit with all complex extenders 1 enhanced dmg mod and all bpo militia plates for a total of 1029 ehp or fit a few enhanced plates and eek out about 1200 ehp over the heavies extra few hundred, plus I can fit triage hives and some remotes for an even larger advantage over the heavy... Im just not seeing a convincing argument to run anything but a logi unless youre a masochist... I"m not disagreeing that the scale is tipped towards the logi, it is. Heavies, assaults, and scouts in their respective threads all complain about their role being invaded by the logi, which is why logi defenders are tired, because they get it from all sides. I'm all for an equipment based class that can fight, I'm no light weapon slot thief Assault vs Logi in my mind is fine once you fix Assault racials by giving them a free light weapon complex damage mod or equivalent offensive utility. Heavy v Logi is on a per see basis after the changes, heavy racials need work too Scout v Logi is mainly the scout lacking unique utility to have any specific need for one I really like your idea of giving a passive +10 to dmg that would help make a viable difference between salts and logis still, even with a passive boost like that, as a logi stands now, ill still take 3 equipment slots and 10% less dmg, if that's the only difference... logis need a defining draw back that make running them or not a real choice based on advantage to disadvantage... I challenge anyone to name one disadvantage of running a logi suit.... If you payed attention to the 520345380 logi vs assault topics before you: -More expensive -More reliant on modules than base stats -More SP intensive -Slower -Less stamina -Less base stats -No sidearm on 3 suits (Amarr assault has better offensive bonus than logi) -Bright yellow -Limited weapon selection more expensive... my cal logi 5 with 1029 ehp a triage hive rd 9 link and re is LESS than 100k... more reliant on mods blah blah... and makes excellent use of them making them superior to any other roles suit. more sp intensive...not much more and only if you mean the sp to get the use of good equipment... and equipment isn't exclusive to the logi. slower... not with a kinkat and with over 1000 ehp, who cares. less stam...not enough to make it a a real draw back and again it can be compensated with biotics. less base stats... who cares when your modded up... I can still out tank an assault. no side arm... but I cancarry 3 - 4 hives if I wanted... im a walking supply depot... and if I fit complex dmg mods in highs and run a duvolle, do I really need a pistol? bight yellow... now you just sound desperate... ok sure in the grass and forest I stick out like a sore thumb... oh wait... what grass and forest? limited weapon selection...I can use anything except heavy weapons...ridiculous.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 00:52:00 - [9] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Jrakraa5 wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: either add something to the conversation or don't waste your time... but I cant take you seriously with your nose stuck so far up in the air... well said Notice that the OP would rather make his own topic instead of using the search function. Don't be like the OP. now who doesn't pay attention to detail... I post in a lot of those threads buddy.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 01:06:00 - [10] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: Meeko Fent wrote: Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: If you're asking this question, you have no attention for detail. see this is one of those "profound" internet comments that suggests the author has some deep understanding of the game the reader will never attain... try posting in some details yourself since you pay such close attention to them... Just check my post history. I have better comments in better logi vs assault topics, I'm getting a bit tired of repeating myself. Yup, because, ya'know, logis NEED the health of a heavy to support the team. Please explain to me WHY logis need that much potential HP/speed/scanning/support capabilities? Makes a brick tanked logi build w/ active scanner That takes care of the heavy and scout scout class! Calls in militia LAV Well, there you go! A logi build that encompasses the entirety of all the classes in DUST! Cosgar, look. Normalize slot count between the assault and logi, give logis a blanket bongs that actually helps true logibros such as yourself, and we are all happy. The super salts go back to normal salts, true logis get a befitting bonus, scouts and heavys maintain their niche. Even if the scouts and heavies need a little buff in their own niche, at least they are the only ones who can preform that niche. Make logis fill their equipment slots. Problem solved, now a Logi can't be a better assault, or a better heavy. Scouts need a buff anyway, and even assaults can make better scouts than scouts. they already can and still with over 1k ehp..

Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 01:09:00 - [11] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: If you payed attention to the 520345380 logi vs assault topics before you: -More expensive -More reliant on modules than base stats -More SP intensive -Slower -Less stamina -Less base stats -No sidearm on 3 suits (Amarr assault has better offensive bonus than logi) -Bright yellow -Limited weapon selection more expensive... my cal logi 5 with 1029 ehp a triage hive rd 9 link and re is LESS than 100k... more reliant on mods blah blah... and makes excellent use of them making them superior to any other roles suit. more sp intensive...not much more and only if you mean the sp to get the use of good equipment... and equipment isn't exclusive to the logi. slower... not with a kinkat and with over 1000 ehp, who cares. less stam...not enough to make it a a real draw back and again it can be compensated with biotics. less base stats... who cares when your modded up... I can still out tank an assault. no side arm... but I cancarry 3 - 4 hives if I wanted... im a walking supply depot... and if I fit complex dmg mods in highs and run a duvolle, do I really need a pistol? bight yellow... now you just sound desperate... ok sure in the grass and forest I stick out like a sore thumb... oh wait... what grass and forest? limited weapon selection...I can use anything except heavy weapons...ridiculous. I'm going to call bull **** based on that underlined portion. CaLogi has the lowest CPU/PG out of all the logistics suits. There's no way that you can have EHP that high, with a Duvolle, Triage Hives, Kin Cat, Regulator, all at the same time. You have to give something up and most likely fit an CPU and/or PG enhancer in your lows to even pull off a portion of that. You just confirmed that there isn't an issue with balance because to fit something, you have to give something up- even if you leave your equipment slots empty, you're just a gimped assault with no sidearm that's barely faster than a heavy. If you equip speed mods, you don't have enough PG for all complex shields and probably have to downgrade that Duvolle to a GEK, and most likely have to give up some armor- good luck against a SCR. But if you want to prove me wrong, put your ISK where your mouth is or show me this amazing logistics fit that does everything or don't bother responding anymore. heres my fit young grasshopper.. all complex shield extenders minus 1 slot for an enhanced dmg mod... all militia plates... gek.... locus nade... rd9 link compact hive remote explosive.... all core skills to 5...
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 01:21:00 - [12] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: If you payed attention to the 520345380 logi vs assault topics before you: -More expensive -More reliant on modules than base stats -More SP intensive -Slower -Less stamina -Less base stats -No sidearm on 3 suits (Amarr assault has better offensive bonus than logi) -Bright yellow -Limited weapon selection more expensive... my cal logi 5 with 1029 ehp a triage hive rd 9 link and re is LESS than 100k... more reliant on mods blah blah... and makes excellent use of them making them superior to any other roles suit. more sp intensive...not much more and only if you mean the sp to get the use of good equipment... and equipment isn't exclusive to the logi. slower... not with a kinkat and with over 1000 ehp, who cares. less stam...not enough to make it a a real draw back and again it can be compensated with biotics. less base stats... who cares when your modded up... I can still out tank an assault. no side arm... but I cancarry 3 - 4 hives if I wanted... im a walking supply depot... and if I fit complex dmg mods in highs and run a duvolle, do I really need a pistol? bight yellow... now you just sound desperate... ok sure in the grass and forest I stick out like a sore thumb... oh wait... what grass and forest? limited weapon selection...I can use anything except heavy weapons...ridiculous. I'm going to call bull **** based on that underlined portion. CaLogi has the lowest CPU/PG out of all the logistics suits. There's no way that you can have EHP that high, with a Duvolle, Triage Hives, Kin Cat, Regulator, all at the same time. You have to give something up and most likely fit an CPU and/or PG enhancer in your lows to even pull off a portion of that. You just confirmed that there isn't an issue with balance because to fit something, you have to give something up- even if you leave your equipment slots empty, you're just a gimped assault with no sidearm that's barely faster than a heavy. If you equip speed mods, you don't have enough PG for all complex shields and probably have to downgrade that Duvolle to a GEK, and most likely have to give up some armor- good luck against a SCR. But if you want to prove me wrong, put your ISK where your mouth is or show me this amazing logistics fit that does everything or don't bother responding anymore. heres my fit young grasshopper.. all complex shield extenders minus 1 slot for an enhanced dmg mod... all militia plates... gek.... locus nade... rd9 link compact hive remote explosive.... all core skills to 5... That's a horrible fit, even by assault logi standards. I would do the math to make sure it's not invalid, but it's not worth it. lol... run it before you say its horrible... it does me fine... I can go toe to toe with a heavy, I have link support, small team or personal armor regen and ammo supply. remotes to cover objective/ set traps, and its less then 100k... bout 92k I believe (I use the bpo plates) put me in a lav ( bpo ishukone saga) and I have high mobility and a moving shield from fire ( as long as theres no av) I can jump in take out a few mercs and some of their equipment drop my own and get out... I have high survivability, if I switch out any equip slot for a repper or a stick im medic that can take quite a beating....
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 01:26:00 - [13] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Fizzer94 wrote: Make logis fill their equipment slots. Problem solved, now a Logi can't be a better assault, or a better heavy. Scouts need a buff anyway, and even assaults can make better scouts than scouts. they already can and still with over 1k ehp.. Now try to fit a proto weapon along with that...you can't. Now it's worse at assaulting than an assault. EHP isn't everything. If it was heavies would be OP. to fit a duvolle with 5 in pg/cpu you still need a cpu upgrade... but that's running 3 equip slots still and youre just shy of 1k by maybe 60 ehp...
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 01:37:00 - [14] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Fizzer94 wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Fizzer94 wrote: Make logis fill their equipment slots. Problem solved, now a Logi can't be a better assault, or a better heavy. Scouts need a buff anyway, and even assaults can make better scouts than scouts. they already can and still with over 1k ehp.. Now try to fit a proto weapon along with that...you can't. Now it's worse at assaulting than an assault. EHP isn't everything. If it was heavies would be OP. to fit a duvolle with 5 in pg/cpu you still need a cpu upgrade... but that's running 3 equip slots still and youre just shy of 1k by maybe 60 ehp... Yes, an assault can get to about that HP, have a Proto weapon, and a sidearm, an 1 equipment. Balanced. but you don't need the proto weapon on a logi...with a gek I can out last a tanked out proto assault with a duvolle plus I can drop a link and get back up to help me, and the repair and replenish our ammo with the hive... get me in CQC and I can have a trap set with an explosive to take multiple aggressors out... with over a 1k tank and a gek and a triage hive to stand in I can be Rambo for a short time... and if I have an lav close by I can jump in I could survive it to do it again... this is what a logi on his own can do... in a squad of them... we are unbeatable by any other team composite... 6 logies can fit their suit uniquely to cover every role needed for a well rounded team.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 01:53:00 - [15] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: Seymore Krelborn wrote: but you don't need the proto weapon on a logi...with a gek I can out last a tanked out proto assault with a duvolle plus I can drop a link and get back up to help me, and the repair and replenish our ammo with the hive... get me in CQC and I can have a trap set with an explosive to take multiple aggressors out... with over a 1k tank and a gek and a triage hive to stand in I can be Rambo for a short time... and if I have an lav close by I can jump in I could survive it to do it again... this is what a logi on his own can do... in a squad of them... we are unbeatable by any other team composite... 6 logies can fit their suit uniquely to cover every role needed for a well rounded team. I know you don't need proto weapons on a Logi. I hardly ever use them. I think a proto assault with a proto weapon would beat that fit assuming skill levels are equal. How many equipment do you have fitted? The point here isn't to make the Logi less effective at everything but equipment usage than an assault, but to make it worse at slaying than an assault. My solution would do just that. I certainly dont want to make the logi useless... I am one! what I think is that a logi should be the best suit to use for triage/support... make an assault best for slaying. right now a logi can do almost everything efficiently... it can even out preform other roles meant for those tasks. my whole point here isn't nerf the logi as much as it is make every suit do something really awesome that only that suit can do... right now those line are not defined with the logi in its current build.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:13:00 - [16] - Quote Cosgar wrote: See, your problem, like everyone before you is that you don't listen to reason. I've said my peace, proven you wrong because you still won't disclose this fabled logistics fit that's better than an assault in all areas- at the same time and you continue to prattle on like you're the resident expert on dropsuit balancing and defined roles. Worst of all you didn't use any kind of evidence that a logistics may be better than an assault, like everyone before you. The ones that did, proved it was the Caldari suit, CCP stepped in and that's the reason why you can't equip everything proto on your suit anymore. In fact you were satisfied with the changes according to this post. Seymor Krelborn wrote: no one deserves a respec.... no one should get a respec the assaults especialy don't deserve it these tears are good for the rainforests.... In fact you did your fair share of trolling after the CaLogi nerf and suddenly they're better assaults again. Yeah, I'm going to have to conclude that you're full of it. I gave you my fit... and your quote of me doesn't prove any point.... that QQ was ridiculous, and I trolled it. but im not looking for a nerf im looking for balance... the truth is ALL logi suits have an extreme amount of versatility to all other suits and they shouldn't... they should be really good at triage/support and not so good at assault, or scouting, period. and I never said one fit does it all... im saying 1 suit does it all... the logi suit... and it does.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:26:00 - [17] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: See, your problem, like everyone before you is that you don't listen to reason. I've said my peace, proven you wrong because you still won't disclose this fabled logistics fit that's better than an assault in all areas- at the same time and you continue to prattle on like you're the resident expert on dropsuit balancing and defined roles. Worst of all you didn't use any kind of evidence that a logistics may be better than an assault, like everyone before you. The ones that did, proved it was the Caldari suit, CCP stepped in and that's the reason why you can't equip everything proto on your suit anymore. In fact you were satisfied with the changes according to this post. Seymor Krelborn wrote: no one deserves a respec.... no one should get a respec the assaults especialy don't deserve it these tears are good for the rainforests.... In fact you did your fair share of trolling after the CaLogi nerf and suddenly they're better assaults again. Yeah, I'm going to have to conclude that you're full of it. I gave you my fit... and your quote of me doesn't prove any point.... that QQ was ridiculous, and I trolled it. but im not looking for a nerf im looking for balance... the truth is ALL logi suits have an extreme amount of versatility to all other suits and they shouldn't... they should be really good at triage/support and not so good at assault, or scouting, period. and I never said one fit does it all... im saying 1 suit does it all... the logi suit... and it does. And with all the logi hate going on, yet no response, even the devs think you're wrong. Less base stats, no sidearm and more slots vs better base stats, a sidearm but less slots. Can't spell it out any more for you. You just choose not to listen. amar logi has a side arm.... look im talking THE WHOLE LOGI LINE... not just one race... logistics as in all suits between the 4 races cover everything... this takes me back to my original question.. why would I spec into any other role when I can just spec into the 4 races logi suits and have everything... no assault suit, no heavy and no scout is this versatile... I don't think you really even need to give the suit a nerf as much as they need to increase the cpu/pg needs of equipment. its those equipment slots + being able to have a 1k tank that makes the suit to flexible...
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:44:00 - [18] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: See, your problem, like everyone before you is that you don't listen to reason. I've said my peace, proven you wrong because you still won't disclose this fabled logistics fit that's better than an assault in all areas- at the same time and you continue to prattle on like you're the resident expert on dropsuit balancing and defined roles. Worst of all you didn't use any kind of evidence that a logistics may be better than an assault, like everyone before you. The ones that did, proved it was the Caldari suit, CCP stepped in and that's the reason why you can't equip everything proto on your suit anymore. In fact you were satisfied with the changes according to this post. [quote=Seymor Krelborn]no one deserves a respec.... I gave you my fit... and your quote of me doesn't prove any point.... that QQ was ridiculous, and I trolled it. but im not looking for a nerf im looking for balance... the truth is ALL logi suits have an extreme amount of versatility to all other suits and they shouldn't... they should be really good at triage/support and not so good at assault, or scouting, period. and I never said one fit does it all... im saying 1 suit does it all... the logi suit... and it does. And with all the logi hate going on, yet no response, even the devs think you're wrong. Less base stats, no sidearm and more slots vs better base stats, a sidearm but less slots. Can't spell it out any more for you. You just choose not to listen. amar logi has a side arm.... look im talking THE WHOLE LOGI LINE... not just one race... logistics as in all suits between the 4 races cover everything... this takes me back to my original question.. why would I spec into any other role when I can just spec into the 4 races logi suits and have everything... no assault suit, no heavy and no scout is this versatile... I don't think you really even need to give the suit a nerf as much as they need to increase the cpu/pg needs of equipment. its those equipment slots + being able to have a 1k tank that makes the suit to flexible... And again, a logistics suit might match or surpass another role in one aspect, but they can't all at the same time. The CaLogi used to, but was re-balanced, the other suits can't be better than another aspect that another suit without being severely gimped in another. 1k HP is nothing if you can't move worth a **** when you need to, and you're pretty much dead once you have to reload. Again, balanced. no they cant do everything in one fit... but a squad of 6 can... and yes you may be slower... so you keep an lav and/or cover near by... the suit isn't supposed to do it all for you, the player's skill is a big part of it... but theres no real choice right now, logis are the best suits, that's why scouts and heavies are so upset and why most assaults are logies...
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 17:39:00 - [19] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: And again, a logistics suit might match or surpass another role in one aspect, but they can't all at the same time. The CaLogi used to, but was re-balanced, the other suits can't be better than another aspect that another suit without being severely gimped in another. 1k HP is nothing if you can't move worth a **** when you need to, and you're pretty much dead once you have to reload. Again, balanced. no they cant do everything in one fit... but a squad of 6 can... and yes you may be slower... so you keep an lav and/or cover near by... the suit isn't supposed to do it all for you, the player's skill is a big part of it... but theres no real choice right now, logis are the best suits, that's why scouts and heavies are so upset and why most assaults are logies... Just underlined the point that matters. They can't do everything in one fit. Fit the suit to tank, it's going to be slow, fit it with speed mods, it's going to be squishy, damage mods and armor? Might hit hard, but still no weapon to fall back on and still slow. You fit something, something has to be given up. Basic dropsuit fitting 101. Also, 6 of anything can be overpowered. Have you ever seen 6 shotgun scouts running in a pack? 6 shotty scouts would be a joke in the present build... you only underlined the part that matters to you and you still fail to comprehend my point... so I will type it in caps... A LOGI SUIT CAN COVER ALMOST EVERY ROLE IN THE GAME MAKING IT THE ONLY SUIT TRULLY WORTH SPENDING SP ON. what I want from CCP is to make every suit amazing at doing something so there's a real choice between them. ill use eve as an example here... if I want to tackle I don't use a battle ship if I want DD, say, in an incursion, im not bringing a frigate. and certainly if I want to do either job with a logi ship I could but nowhere near as well as say a tackle rifter or a DD dominix are you getting it yet? I don't want a logi nerf. I want a buff to other suits that would give me a real choice about speccing in them... someone mentioned a passive 10% boost to dmg with assault suits... that would be awesome. or get those cloaks in the game and make scout suits the only one that can use them... that kind of stuff.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1035	Posted - 2013.10.30 18:11:00 - [20] - Quote Talos Alomar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: A LOGI SUIT CAN COVER ALMOST EVERY ROLE IN THE GAME MAKING IT THE ONLY SUIT TRULLY WORTH SPENDING SP ON. AND IT CAN'T DO IT AS WELL AS A MORE SPECIALIZED SUIT. It can be a brick tank with a massive buffer, but the Heavy suit can beat it in terms of damage and the quality of the buffer. It can hold its own in combat, but the assault will be able to beat it in terms of speed, stamina and damage. It can be fit to be low profile, but a scout will be able to beat the crap out of it when it comes to speed, stamina, and has better a better native profile meaning that it will take fewer profile mods to drop it to a good level. Even though it can do all of those things, it also can't do all of those things at once. Seymor Krelborn wrote: I don't want a logi nerf. I want a buff to other suits that would give me a real choice about speccing in them... This I do agree with. I just don't think that there is all that grievous of a problem with the logi as some of these threads claim. The assault class bonus is not all that good, TBH. Buffing speed or damage instead of shield recharge rate would really help make the logi assault divide more visible. And CCP needs to give sweet sweet love to light frames, but we'll see how the scan range increase will change things. this guy gets what im saying...while the logi cant do other suits roles perfectly it can do them much better than it should be able to. this doesn't mean nerf the logi... it means make the other suits so much better at their roles that a logi cant compete with filling those roles... right now a logi can do any job well enough that its the only real choice, for versatility and survivability.

Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1036	Posted - 2013.10.30 23:17:00 - [21] - Quote Cosgar wrote: So now you're about buffing assaults instead of nerfing logistics to save face. I've been saying that since May. cosgar... for someone who said they were so acutely aware of detail, you failed miserably at identifying them in my post. im promoting balance here... im saying why would I choose any suit but logistics when its the best at servicing a multitude of purposes adequately. the other suits don't have that versatility and on a living battlefield, where the suit you needed 5 minutes ago no longer serves in as useful a capacity versatility wins the day. with 3 - 4 equipment slots, plus fitting for either speed, tank, or dmg or a decent combo, my logi suit is never the wrong suit to deploy in. lets say im running an amar logi... I can fit a swarm launcher or md plus an smg, and take care of vehicles, then use my repper/hives /stick or links to provide excellent triage support PLUS have an smg for assaulting or defending. what other suit can be av/ assault/ medic all in one? or I go full brick tank on a cal or gal and go assault/medic/support or run a mini for quick hacks with kinkats and scans, still run a beast tank with links and go scout/assault WHAT OTHER SUIT CAN DO ALL THIS???? WHY WOULD I WANT TO WEAR ANY OTHER SUIT??? this is what my thread is about...give me real choices. give me paper rock scissors. or just have one effing suit...
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1036	Posted - 2013.10.30 23:34:00 - [22] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: So now you're about buffing assaults instead of nerfing logistics to save face. I've been saying that since May. cosgar... for someone who said they were so acutely aware of detail, you failed miserably at identifying them in my post. im promoting balance here... im saying why would I choose any suit but logistics when its the best at servicing a multitude of purposes adequately. the other suits don't have that versatility and on a living battlefield, where the suit you needed 5 minutes ago no longer serves in as useful a capacity versatility wins the day. with 3 - 4 equipment slots, plus fitting for either speed, tank, or dmg or a decent combo, my logi suit is never the wrong suit to deploy in. lets say im running an amar logi... I can fit a swarm launcher or md plus an smg, and take care of vehicles, then use my repper/hives /stick or links to provide excellent triage support PLUS have an smg for assaulting or defending. what other suit can be av/ assault/ medic all in one? or I go full brick tank on a cal or gal and go assault/medic/support or run a mini for quick hacks with kinkats and scans, still run a beast tank with links and go scout/assault WHAT OTHER SUIT CAN DO ALL THIS???? WHY WOULD I WANT TO WEAR ANY OTHER SUIT??? this is what my thread is about...give me real choices. give me paper rock scissors. or just have one effing suit... And you've missed the concept of incomparables. Incomparables are different game mechanics that players can argue over which is better until the end of time because neither one is better than the other, just better in different areas. A logistics can't be better at slaying than an assault because both use weapons in an FPS. The assaults have better firepower and the logistics have better defense. Assaults can use a better variety of weapons since some are reliant on sidearms to be effective and logistics can only use one weapon. Try using a swarm launcher, plasma cannon, laser, or sniper rifle with your CaLogi and see how much better you are than an assault and get back to me. the amar logi can do what you ask easy... the PLC is LOL. I have a logi fit with swarms... 2 proxies and a hive... works quite well... and im sorry but the mechanics of this game are broken and right now the logi makes the best use of a broken system. lol you are so afraid of losing some phantom crutch that you blindly defend a flawed aspect of a broken game. you honestly think everything with the suits we have to use are fine?
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1037	Posted - 2013.10.30 23:59:00 - [23] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Regardless, I'm still not changing my mind about the scouts. I'm a scout player until the end of time. Period. Even if I'm offered a respec, I'll still be a scout. Why? Because I still see potential in them. I do too... (see potential) I just wish ccp would get around to realizing that potential. for all suits.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1039	Posted - 2013.10.31 01:22:00 - [24] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: cosgar... for someone who said they were so acutely aware of detail, you failed miserably at identifying them in my post. im promoting balance here... im saying why would I choose any suit but logistics when its the best at servicing a multitude of purposes adequately. the other suits don't have that versatility and on a living battlefield, where the suit you needed 5 minutes ago no longer serves in as useful a capacity versatility wins the day. with 3 - 4 equipment slots, plus fitting for either speed, tank, or dmg or a decent combo, my logi suit is never the wrong suit to deploy in. lets say im running an amar logi... I can fit a swarm launcher or md plus an smg, and take care of vehicles, then use my repper/hives /stick or links to provide excellent triage support PLUS have an smg for assaulting or defending. what other suit can be av/ assault/ medic all in one? or I go full brick tank on a cal or gal and go assault/medic/support or run a mini for quick hacks with kinkats and scans, still run a beast tank with links and go scout/assault WHAT OTHER SUIT CAN DO ALL THIS???? WHY WOULD I WANT TO WEAR ANY OTHER SUIT??? this is what my thread is about...give me real choices. give me paper rock scissors. or just have one effing suit... And you've missed the concept of incomparables. Incomparables are different game mechanics that players can argue over which is better until the end of time because neither one is better than the other, just better in different areas. A logistics can't be better at slaying than an assault because both use weapons in an FPS. The assaults have better firepower and the logistics have better defense. Assaults can use a better variety of weapons since some are reliant on sidearms to be effective and logistics can only use one weapon. Try using a swarm launcher, plasma cannon, laser, or sniper rifle with your CaLogi and see how much better you are than an assault and get back to me. the amar logi can do what you ask easy... the PLC is LOL. I have a logi fit with swarms... 2 proxies and a hive... works quite well... and im sorry but the mechanics of this game are broken and right now the logi makes the best use of a broken system. lol you are so afraid of losing some phantom crutch that you blindly defend a flawed aspect of a broken game. you honestly think everything with the suits we have to use are fine? And here we go with more ad homienem. I never said that all the suits are balanced. The medium suits are in most cases aside from some of the assaults needing better bonuses. But you keep trying to perpetuate this misplaced ideal that a racial logistics suit is better than its assault counterpart but what it really comes down to is player preference. I have a Minmatar logi and I have a Minmatar assault- both at proto level. I like both suits equally but prefer the logi because I like the equipment dynamic. I use the assault because I'm one of the smart ones that runs sidearms as primaries. Neither one is outright better than the other, they just play different. notice there are no threads about salts scouts or heavies being too good? theres a reason ... they aren't notice how even logies make logi are too good threads? theres a reason... they are no balance. you can go down with the ship if you want but the minority of players who take your stance are either secretly happy with the advantage their suit has, or simply get gun shy when they think their stuff might get the community nerf bat request. or both.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1040	Posted - 2013.10.31 02:57:00 - [25] - Quote Cosgar wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: Cosgar wrote: Are you going to try to convince me that somehow logistics suits are the best in the game or are you going to continue your artful dodging? Well put. The logis who put out nerf logi threads are trying to head off the nerf talk. They didn't initiate it. Example: Tech likes his SMGs and is a beast with them, so if there's going to be a nerf he's trying to spin the argument so his style of play is less affected. He said himself he doesn't want a nerf but if there is one he is going to try and soften the blow, like a college football team that suspends a player before the NCAA cracks down on them harder then they do themselves. It's a protective mechanism. Of note, I managed to convince him that a sidearm only change was too damaging to the class as a whole so he is no longer advocating it. I used actual facts, you should try it sometime. In the end, it matters less than you think. Contrary to popular belief, CCP doesn't reflexively nerf everything that the river of tears on the forums leads them to, at least not anymore. The upcoming nerf to forge guns is quite mild and comes months after the QQ started. Remember the constant whining about MDs after the flaylock nerf? Seen any major changes to the MD lately? While they don't necessarily take the subtle approach to their adjustments every time, they do actually gather some data first. Like, actual numerical data, not the "data" people vomit out from their addled minds on the forums. I'm practicing using every sidearm on my Minmatar logi. That's how much faith I have in CCP. Been here since beta and slowly seen just about everything FPS related slowly decaying away from this game update after update, I'm surprised this isn't a turned based RPG yet. im in strong support of dust becoming a turn based rpg
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1041	Posted - 2013.10.31 03:44:00 - [26] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Cosgar wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: Cosgar wrote: Are you going to try to convince me that somehow logistics suits are the best in the game or are you going to continue your artful dodging? Well put. The logis who put out nerf logi threads are trying to head off the nerf talk. They didn't initiate it. Example: Tech likes his SMGs and is a beast with them, so if there's going to be a nerf he's trying to spin the argument so his style of play is less affected. He said himself he doesn't want a nerf but if there is one he is going to try and soften the blow, like a college football team that suspends a player before the NCAA cracks down on them harder then they do themselves. It's a protective mechanism. Of note, I managed to convince him that a sidearm only change was too damaging to the class as a whole so he is no longer advocating it. I used actual facts, you should try it sometime. In the end, it matters less than you think. Contrary to popular belief, CCP doesn't reflexively nerf everything that the river of tears on the forums leads them to, at least not anymore. The upcoming nerf to forge guns is quite mild and comes months after the QQ started. Remember the constant whining about MDs after the flaylock nerf? Seen any major changes to the MD lately? While they don't necessarily take the subtle approach to their adjustments every time, they do actually gather some data first. Like, actual numerical data, not the "data" people vomit out from their addled minds on the forums. I'm practicing using every sidearm on my Minmatar logi. That's how much faith I have in CCP. Been here since beta and slowly seen just about everything FPS related slowly decaying away from this game update after update, I'm surprised this isn't a turned based RPG yet. im in strong support of dust becoming a turn based rpg Go play EVE and let FPS players play Dust. Dust needs to be an FPS with RPG elements, not the other way around. lol.. I was joking... I want this to be a great fps.

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online/DUST514, the EVE/DUST514 logo, EVE/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to OMG Labs to use EVE Online/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, OMG Labs. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.