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OZAROW
WarRavens League of Infamy
976
|
Posted - 2013.10.26 04:03:00 -
[1] - Quote
Drapedup Drippedout wrote: refer to CCP's own description of the suits: (http://dust514.com/universe/dropsuits/)
Assault: The Assault dropsuit is a versatile frontline combat suit that combines excellent protection, good mobility, and sufficient versatility for mission-specific alterations. Assault dropsuits are intended for standard combat operations or those in which objectives are likely to change at a momentGÇÖs notice. Able to carry anything from small arms and explosives to heavy anti-vehicle munitions and deployable support gear, this is the most adaptable suit on the battlefield.
Logistics: The Logistics dropsuit is outfitted with the latest in diagnostic technology, to help the wearer maintain the condition and efficiency of squad-mates and their equipment. A soldier in a logistics dropsuit can greatly improve the overall effectiveness of his group, and fills a vital tactical role in small-unit operations and full-scale warfare by providing both medical and mechanical support.
Now we'll look at the proto suit variants for each as this represents the 'end game' builds: (Highs/Lows/Equip)
Assault: Gk0 - 3/4/1, 60pg/300 cpu. 120/210 EHP =330 Ck0 -4/3/1, 60pg/300 cpu. 210/120 EHP = 330 Mk0 - 5/2/1, 64 pg/320 cpu. 150/135 EHP = 285 Ak0 - 3/3/1, 70pg/350cpu 180/180 EHP = 360
Logistics: Gk0 -3/5/4, 78pg/390cpu. 90/180 = 270 EHP Ck0 - 5/4/3, 78pg/350 cpu. 180/90 = 270 EHP Mk0 - 4/4/4, 78pg/390 cpu. 90/150 = 240 EHP Ak0 - 3/4/3, 72pg/390 cpu. 120/180 = 300 EHP
Here's what I don't understand...No where in CCP description of the Logi does it say, adapted for optimal slaying and WP production. And the assault, "most adaptable suit on the field", are you ******* kidding me?
My beef is that logis are not required to fill equip slots, so if you don't fill the slots....3 out of the 4 logi suits have more total Highs and Lows than the assault variants, with a significant boost to pg and cpu to fit proto mods/weaps/grenades.
The logistics role by definition is not a slayer build, but due to CCP's infinite wisdom they have allowed the base suit to be more adept at the 'slayer' role than the assault variant.
Now, people will argue that oh logis don't get a side-arm so its fair. Right, because when I watch the battlefeed it always says "Ishukone assault submachine gun", you hardly ever see "Duvolle assault rifle". SMH. The sidearm argument is played out.
Yes the assault variants have more base EHP but its really not that significant unless you are Amarr Assault or Min Logi, as those two lie on the ends of the spectrum.
Here's my QQ, Why does a logi have the ability to 'change' roles from logistics, to assault, to scout, to tank....when no other class especially the class that boasts the "most adaptable suit on the battlefield" is unable to cross into another role?
And to respond to Jack Mcready.....take the equip slot from the Minmatar assault, give me another low slow and I'll be happy as a pig in ****. The equip slot on an assault is not necessary, if I am supposed to slay, then let me slay. If I am supposed to provide "medical and mechanical" support, then give me 4 equip slots!
Go 20 million sp in proto scout, wait for months while ccp promises to fix your class a cqc weapons then Bi!TCH! Lol I have a logi now. Don't cry nerf be a man a save sp |
OZAROW
WarRavens League of Infamy
977
|
Posted - 2013.10.26 07:31:00 -
[2] - Quote
Any logi I know fills all equip with proto hives links an a scanner an can fit 4 basic armor, 2 comp shields an two damage mods. What did you expect? Range mods an speed mods? Profile damps? If your skills are at 5 you can fit most suits except scouts an possibly heavies properly. |
OZAROW
WarRavens League of Infamy
977
|
Posted - 2013.10.26 23:01:00 -
[3] - Quote
emtbraincase wrote:best compromise i've seen is the following, stated by many individuals too numerous to mention:
Assault Suit Bonus: +2% damage bonus per level with "Hybrid" Light weapons (Hybrid or whatever the AR is, basically free complex at proto. Not limiting to hybrid/whatever would make Amarr Assault + AScr/Viziam = God Mode, so limited to non-duplicating bonuses like Lt DMG and racial Laser bonus.)
Assault suit Loses: No equipment slots on any racial suit (makes them a true slayer, no support options at all )
Logistics Suit Bonus: Leave alone (we rep everyone else, we gotta be able to keep our own armor up without drawing away more weapons. basically a free complex repper at proto)
Logistics Suit Loses: Must use all available equipment slots before fitting becomes valid (this forces a logi to carry items into battle that assist the team whether they want to or not, thus reducing the complaint that they are ignoring equipment slots to become Billy Badass.)
Both gain something useful. Trust me, most logi would consider leaving it alone to be gaining something. Both lose something, in the ability to effectively use the suit for more than it's intended purpose. 4 compact nano hives only uses the equivalent of one proto hive or less, so a smart logi slayer guys would just use that, go to the depot, switch out to uplink fits an good hive fits, dump those then back to a tanked fit with compacts, your still gonna have the same problem.
The real problem is AR tanked fits, I think is what people are moaning about, but if you take away light weapons a logo can't use a cqc like a sg? To me that's wrong.
I'm a scout that went logi, for the hack speed an team support for equipment an to be more usefull in pc, I can get in with my scout an switch at the depot spam equip than use either fit to defend, personally I'd say if you have a problem with logies destroy the depots then kill the logis, you don't wanna be a assault with no equip, no depot an a dead logi an no needle. That logic would ruin the game. |
OZAROW
WarRavens League of Infamy
977
|
Posted - 2013.10.27 00:16:00 -
[4] - Quote
OZAROW wrote:emtbraincase wrote:best compromise i've seen is the following, stated by many individuals too numerous to mention:
Assault Suit Bonus: +2% damage bonus per level with "Hybrid" Light weapons (Hybrid or whatever the AR is, basically free complex at proto. Not limiting to hybrid/whatever would make Amarr Assault + AScr/Viziam = God Mode, so limited to non-duplicating bonuses like Lt DMG and racial Laser bonus.)
Assault suit Loses: No equipment slots on any racial suit (makes them a true slayer, no support options at all )
Logistics Suit Bonus: Leave alone (we rep everyone else, we gotta be able to keep our own armor up without drawing away more weapons. basically a free complex repper at proto)
Logistics Suit Loses: Must use all available equipment slots before fitting becomes valid (this forces a logi to carry items into battle that assist the team whether they want to or not, thus reducing the complaint that they are ignoring equipment slots to become Billy Badass.)
Both gain something useful. Trust me, most logi would consider leaving it alone to be gaining something. Both lose something, in the ability to effectively use the suit for more than it's intended purpose. 4 compact nano hives only uses the equivalent of one proto hive or less, so a smart logi slayer guys would just use that, go to the depot, switch out to uplink fits an good hive fits, dump those then back to a tanked fit with compacts, your still gonna have the same problem. The real problem is AR tanked fits, I think is what people are moaning about, but if you take away light weapons a logo can't use a cqc like a sg? To me that's wrong. I'm a scout that went logi, for the hack speed an team support for equipment an to be more usefull in pc, I can get in with my scout an switch at the depot spam equip than use either fit to defend, personally I'd say if you have a problem with logies destroy the depots then kill the logis, you don't wanna be a assault with no equip, no depot an a dead logi an no needle. That logic would ruin the game. WAIT! Did I just notice at the top that you want a built in 10% damage mod to a assault, plus a 15% damage mod built into the gun,PLUS THE ABILITY TO PUT A 10% DAMAGE MOD ON BEFORE STACKING PENALTIES OCCUR! ARE YOU FUKKING CRAZY! |
OZAROW
WarRavens League of Infamy
978
|
Posted - 2013.10.27 00:58:00 -
[5] - Quote
John Demonsbane wrote:OZAROW wrote:OZAROW wrote:emtbraincase wrote:best compromise i've seen is the following, stated by many individuals too numerous to mention:
Assault Suit Bonus: +2% damage bonus per level with "Hybrid" Light weapons (Hybrid or whatever the AR is, basically free complex at proto. Not limiting to hybrid/whatever would make Amarr Assault + AScr/Viziam = God Mode, so limited to non-duplicating bonuses like Lt DMG and racial Laser bonus.)
Assault suit Loses: No equipment slots on any racial suit (makes them a true slayer, no support options at all )
Logistics Suit Bonus: Leave alone (we rep everyone else, we gotta be able to keep our own armor up without drawing away more weapons. basically a free complex repper at proto)
Logistics Suit Loses: Must use all available equipment slots before fitting becomes valid (this forces a logi to carry items into battle that assist the team whether they want to or not, thus reducing the complaint that they are ignoring equipment slots to become Billy Badass.)
Both gain something useful. Trust me, most logi would consider leaving it alone to be gaining something. Both lose something, in the ability to effectively use the suit for more than it's intended purpose. 4 compact nano hives only uses the equivalent of one proto hive or less, so a smart logi slayer guys would just use that, go to the depot, switch out to uplink fits an good hive fits, dump those then back to a tanked fit with compacts, your still gonna have the same problem. The real problem is AR tanked fits, I think is what people are moaning about, but if you take away light weapons a logo can't use a cqc like a sg? To me that's wrong. I'm a scout that went logi, for the hack speed an team support for equipment an to be more usefull in pc, I can get in with my scout an switch at the depot spam equip than use either fit to defend, personally I'd say if you have a problem with logies destroy the depots then kill the logis, you don't wanna be a assault with no equip, no depot an a dead logi an no needle. That logic would ruin the game. WAIT! Did I just notice at the top that you want a built in 10% damage mod to a assault, plus a 15% damage mod built into the gun,PLUS THE ABILITY TO PUT A 10% DAMAGE MOD ON BEFORE STACKING PENALTIES OCCUR! ARE YOU FUKKING CRAZY! Some people are not so good at maths. 2% is clearly too high. Sounds like peeps are mad they didn't go logi because they didn't want to spec the equipment, now they see that a logi can have more HP which it should an it can rep itself an have all it needed to have lone wolf abilities an stack more damage which it should so that if it's team drops it can fight back to needle a teammate then pick up the next an essentially they can be the life force of the squad.
An that's how it should be |
OZAROW
WarRavens League of Infamy
978
|
Posted - 2013.10.27 01:10:00 -
[6] - Quote
I use the logi as a passive team support. I use my scout to get the depot, switch an spam equip, switch again an speed hack an scan as much as I can, switch out again to my shotgun "HERCULES SCOUT LOGI" built just like a scout with 600 HP an mad equipment, best way to use a logi IMO if you have proto 'd the scout skills |
OZAROW
WarRavens League of Infamy
980
|
Posted - 2013.10.27 03:40:00 -
[7] - Quote
The problem is people expected the assaults to be the best suits, any smart player would skill into a logi because it has more benifits hands down cuz it's supposed too. The thing is it will make everyone skill it because their are no benifits being anything else an nothing to stop everyone in the game from being logis.
A logi can mimic any roll in the game, even if it was mandatory to use a scanner, rep tool an hives an links it couuld still dual tank, it needs regen cuz it needs to heal itself.
Ccp made a roll that has no battle cap on how many can be on a team or a squad.
I'd rather build a team of 14 lOgis than 2 logis an 14 assaults. |
OZAROW
WarRavens League of Infamy
989
|
Posted - 2013.10.29 01:58:00 -
[8] - Quote
I have always been a scout an my secondary choice is logi. I chrome it had a real purpose because heavies were amazing! They travelled in pairs, assaults carried needles an logis supplied needles, rep tools links an hives, an a lot of scouts carried either a needle, links or a rep tool, because scouts had enough HP to stay close to a squad.
Now!
THE GAME CHANGED
1. HEAVIES SUCK AND ARE NOT FEARED= squads leave th behind an don't lead with them Infront like before. Used to be a heavy leading the pack, logistics getting guardian points , assaults surrounding the logi an a scout orbiting the pack like the moon.
2. Needles suck, because noobs do the quick 60 militia point thing in a fire fight so now nobody trusts it they respawn ASAP .
3. Logies cant see your Health bar so they carry links an rep hives for you to monitor your own life an give you a spot to spawn. So just cuz they have pro 5 on a gun an can stack HP an damage an equip that is the game makers fault for removing the HP bar. Their is less risk involved an the logi is now forced to lead than follow because heavies drop to fast the heavy now backs the logi
4. Scouts had a equipment and slot removed, they have no specific role other than lone wolfing it away from danger an the CPU hardly allows room for links because their scanning is hardly better than anyone else's so they need a scanner.
Fix this don't nerf anything! |
OZAROW
WarRavens League of Infamy
990
|
Posted - 2013.10.29 02:33:00 -
[9] - Quote
INFINITE DIVERSITY IDIC wrote:OZAROW wrote:I have always been a scout an my secondary choice is logi. I chrome it had a real purpose because heavies were amazing! They travelled in pairs, assaults carried needles an logis supplied needles, rep tools links an hives, an a lot of scouts carried either a needle, links or a rep tool, because scouts had enough HP to stay close to a squad.
Now!
THE GAME CHANGED
1. HEAVIES SUCK AND ARE NOT FEARED= squads leave th behind an don't lead with them Infront like before. Used to be a heavy leading the pack, logistics getting guardian points , assaults surrounding the logi an a scout orbiting the pack like the moon.
2. Needles suck, because noobs do the quick 60 militia point thing in a fire fight so now nobody trusts it they respawn ASAP .
3. Logies cant see your Health bar so they carry links an rep hives for you to monitor your own life an give you a spot to spawn. So just cuz they have pro 5 on a gun an can stack HP an damage an equip that is the game makers fault for removing the HP bar. Their is less risk involved an the logi is now forced to lead than follow because heavies drop to fast the heavy now backs the logi
4. Scouts had a equipment and slot removed, they have no specific role other than lone wolfing it away from danger an the CPU hardly allows room for links because their scanning is hardly etter than anyone else's so they need a scanner.
Fix this don't nerf anything! You left one thing out that changed since the precious, closed and open betas, REAL SHOOTERS GOT IN YOUR GAME, and the eve nerds and their qqing alts started realizing how much they sucked compared to shooters of my age and generation, the shooters of quake, doom, halo, cod, arrived and you nerds with your spreadsheets and your domimation of the cpm with people playing eve for 9 years like JENZA who are not shooters have been using that influence to continue to nerf whatever makes them sad, everytime they face off in combat, thats why when you have people come up with great combos like 2 bad ass minjas running together with dual core flaylocks and owning, they cried foul, and nerf because the chaos they created disrupted the set piece warfare mentality that was carried over from eve, which is beautiful and free and nerfed not because it was op but because these glorified pc RISK players couldnt figure out how to counter the terrible tandem minja flaylocks. You people who cried about that are the same nubs crying now, the answer is still the same you suck and any variation of this shooter will still make you suck. Even with aa and crazy hit detection still here you are crying again...... rrrrrraaaaaggggghhhhhhh And I dont care about people named LOGI BRO with his 9000000000 likes trying to define what a logi suit is or isnt, the suit is what we make it if your happy with your tool stuck up a amarrs skirt then do it you failhard but dont come here and tell a grown ass man thats spent hundreds of dollars on this game how to play his suit or his style, there are plenty of games that limit and define your role with no ability to deviate from that GO THERE.. AHHHHMEN |
OZAROW
WarRavens League of Infamy
993
|
Posted - 2013.10.29 02:36:00 -
[10] - Quote
Six scouts with knives an shotties an bombs makes med frames feel like their bleeding in a pond full of piranhas ! |
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