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Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
156
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 23:14:00 -
[91] - Quote
That's gold right there Jadu. Like you said earlier it would be tremendously helpful and necessary to have a high quality virtual range finder (expanding circles on the ground plane) when 'working' near and around these dangerous but necessary battle harvesters. |
MySpaceTom
Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.10.19 23:17:00 -
[92] - Quote
Hey are you forgetting about spawning in? The smart spawn mechanic might not sit well with players when it's sending them into irradiated regions. |
Jadu Wen
Xer Cloud Consortium
4
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Posted - 2013.10.19 23:24:00 -
[93] - Quote
MySpaceTom wrote:Hey are you forgetting about spawning in? The smart spawn mechanic might not sit well with players when it's sending them into irradiated regions. It wouldn't be very smart then. I guess to alleviate problems of spawning in blind to 'death zones,' a current visual status of an irradiated area should be visable from the spawn map. I do have to say that an irradiated zone would certainly affect how players choose where to place their spawn pads. The usefulness of a spawn pad becomes next to null if it is located in a death trap radiation zone.
Hey, there's your fix to spawn pads being thrown down en-mass around an objective. Just place a harvester near an objective CCP. |
Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
156
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 00:05:00 -
[94] - Quote
Jadu Wen wrote:There's some good points there, but I guess I'm still torn about this license to TK in this context. Anyhow, going back to Ghost's post on the radiation period, I could see it being set anywhere between 20 and 30 seconds. Catching that theorycrafting bug from Jadek, I'd like to play around with the idea of radiation buildup. This means that if an enemy player rehacks a harvester while in the radiation period, and subsequently another friendly player rehacks the harvester the gamma blast and radiation fallout damage increases exponentially. Also each hack adds an additional 5m - 10m to the radiation fallout zone and 20 to 30 seconds while the radiation damage cools down to zero.
With this mechanic teams involved in a violent rally of switching control of a harvester would temporarily make a section of the map no mans land.
Lore wise it makes a bit of sense that you're getting all of this radiation when fluxing around with a micro wormhole generator.
So exponential damage growth would looks like this for the radiation fallout. Hack 1: 30hp/s , 15m radius zone , 30 seconds Hack 2: 60hp/s , 25m radius zone , current timer + 30 seconds Hack 3: 120hp/s , 35m radius zone , - - Hack 4: 240hp/s , 45m radius zone , - -
I think there has to be some type of damage dropoff as you move farther from the harvester. These radiation figures should be representative of the damage a player would take standing right next to the harvester during this radiation period. This would give daisy chained repair healers a better chance of getting a player up to the controls of a harvester while in radiation cool down. |
Jadu Wen
Xer Cloud Consortium
4
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Posted - 2013.10.20 00:11:00 -
[95] - Quote
Daisy chained logibros. That's sight to imagine, lolz! Technically, if they get a guy attached to the harvester control panel, they don't need to keep a repair beam on him anymore. Radiation does wonders to speed up the deconstruction phase process. |
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui
Kinsho Swords Caldari State
19
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Posted - 2013.10.20 03:05:00 -
[96] - Quote
Jadu Wen wrote:Jadek Menaheim wrote:MySpaceTom wrote:So how many clones are we talking about for this siphoned transport container business? I was thinking 4 (small) and 8 (large container) clones per transport. The powergrid requirement of the large container would relegate it to being used on a logistics based tank for example. I'd actually be interested in seeing foot solider couriers added into that mix. It would be similar to the Mass Effect Multiplayer retrieval objectives. A merc picks up a vat and it highly diminishes their walking and running speed. Vehicles would most likely be needed to assist mercs in travel time. Object Retrieval ObjectiveI would also argue for some type of HUD notification to identify when clone containers are on the move.
You guys have been at work since the last time I seen this post . I love it when a plan comes together and I loved Mass Effect. You guys have been at work with great ideals might I add and I hope that CCP will roll with this. This could be the " Other " game mode that people have been asking for. It could be the training ground , a place to work on one's tactics because this sounds like that type of mode with all you have to think about and the strategic importance of the Biomass Sphere coupled with the fact that now YOU HAVE TO WORK AS A TEAM to achieve a goal because everyone has an interest. You guys are on to something !!!!
I have to catch up and read more. |
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui
Kinsho Swords Caldari State
21
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Posted - 2013.10.20 03:24:00 -
[97] - Quote
Jadek Menaheim wrote:Artificer Ghost wrote:I couldn't understand the OP very well, but I got the gist of it. When the person goes up and hack the thing, and starts the suicide process, what is the clones killed in the "harvest" were transferred to the friendly team?
Example: TeammateLover123 hacks the thingy. 6 people die. And now 6 clones are added to the friendly team. It would prolong battles, and if you're able to get in behind a team and activate one, it would be a game-changer in gamemodes like Ambush, and even Skirmish, it'd be quick to clear an objective.
Also, maybe afterwards, there'd be a "Radiation Period", where enemies that enter the area start losing a set amount of HP per second, and the HP/s decreases per second? Clones are not stored within the harvester themselves. Clones are either diverted to the MCC or if a transport container courier is within range (5m) then the clones are diverted there. What I love about your idea is the radiation period tied to a hacked harvester. What I would love to see from that is an initial high intensity gamma burst of about 450hp damage that fires out about 10m from a harvester once a hack is complete. There would be an audible rising tone signal that lets players know in the immediate area of a harvester when a suicide hack is about to complete. Opposing players and friendly teammates have the indication to abandon the area or stay and fight. However, in doing so they are likely going to die from the blast and fallout (this fallout damage being equivalent to ~50hp/s damage in the 15m radius zone). What works about that scenario is you can have a friendly high EHP tanked suit holding the transport container next to harvester scooping up players that die from the gamma burst and the immediate fallout. The reason this tanked suit has the ability to survive the fallout is with the help of a long beam repair tool person on the periphery of the fallout zone healing the courier of most radiation damage.
Not to be late on the issue , but I think you gave the reason that the person survived the blast who was equipped with the transporter container as being helped by a long beam repair tool , but why not have that type of equipment added to the container as an extra incentive to carry such a heavy tool that prohibits movement. It not only transports the mass that is collected but it protects the wearer from the blast.
Is that too far off ???? Bad ideal ???? |
Jadu Wen
Xer Cloud Consortium
10
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Posted - 2013.10.20 03:37:00 -
[98] - Quote
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote:Not to be late on the issue , but I think you gave the reason that the person survived the blast who was equipped with the transporter container as being helped by a long beam repair tool , but why not have that type of equipment added to the container as an extra incentive to carry such a heavy tool that prohibits movement. It not only transports the mass that is collected but it protects the wearer from the blast.
Is that too far off ???? Bad ideal ????
Shinobi, you've got something good there. I think what should happen is the container unit has some type of integrated bubble shield that activates when the user is stationary and has a certain amount of protective charge. |
Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
160
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 03:38:00 -
[99] - Quote
I'm glad to have you guys here to keep the ball rolling on expanding these ideas. It's amazingly helpful! |
Jadu Wen
Xer Cloud Consortium
10
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Posted - 2013.10.20 03:41:00 -
[100] - Quote
Jadek Menaheim wrote:I'm glad to have you guys here to keep the ball rolling on expanding these ideas. It's amazingly helpful! Now you just need a Dev or CPM tag to draw some more attention to the topic.
Just be careful with talking about lasers around CCP Mintchip. She can take you off on quite a tangent. |
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MySpaceTom
Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.10.20 03:43:00 -
[101] - Quote
Jadu Wen wrote:Jadek Menaheim wrote:I'm glad to have you guys here to keep the ball rolling on expanding these ideas. It's amazingly helpful! Now you just need a Dev or CPM tag to draw some more attention to the topic. Just be careful with talking about lasers around CCP Mintchip. She can take you off on quite a tangent.
LAZoRZ!!!!
inb4 Mintchip
lol |
pyramidhead 420
Carbon 7 CRONOS.
116
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 03:50:00 -
[102] - Quote
MySpaceTom wrote:Jadu Wen wrote:Jadek Menaheim wrote:I'm glad to have you guys here to keep the ball rolling on expanding these ideas. It's amazingly helpful! Now you just need a Dev or CPM tag to draw some more attention to the topic. Just be careful with talking about lasers around CCP Mintchip. She can take you off on quite a tangent. LAZoRZ!!!! inb4 Mintchip lol you're a blast from from the past
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Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
160
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 03:57:00 -
[103] - Quote
Getting back on topic. I want to address a point Shinobi brought up about this being the "other" game people are asking for. I think its important to strive for integration of game modes rather than their separation by dividing the available player base and making match making more difficult.
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: You guys have been at work since the last time I seen this post . I love it when a plan comes together and I loved Mass Effect. You guys have been at work with great ideals might I add and I hope that CCP will roll with this. This could be the " Other " game mode that people have been asking for. It could be the training ground , a place to work on one's tactics because this sounds like that type of mode with all you have to think about and the strategic importance of the Biomass Sphere coupled with the fact that now YOU HAVE TO WORK AS A TEAM to achieve a goal because everyone has an interest. You guys are on to something !!!!
I have to catch up and read more.
To offer an initial stepping block I would suggest these installations be incorporated into a game mode like ambush initially. The installation would be placed in an area that is normally the focal point of battle engagements. Players would fight for control of the unit in order to restock clones. In Ambush every clone counts for securing a win, and being able to boost up those numbers with recycled biomass would be huge. |
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui
Kinsho Swords Caldari State
22
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 04:09:00 -
[104] - Quote
I know right. Then you guys might get snatched up and become part of the team. NEVER TO HEAR FROM YOU AGAIN. MMMMMMUUUUUHHHHOOOOOHHHAAAAA !!!!!!!!!!!!. Don't forget about the little guys. |
MySpaceTom
Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire
1
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 12:42:00 -
[105] - Quote
Jadek Menaheim wrote:Jadu Wen wrote:Hey, how does a suicide hacks and their potential greifing play into a player team kill counter? That might end particularly badly in the new factional warfare if you kill a bunch of friendlies in the initial blast wave while trying to capture that harvester. Yeah, that could be an issue. You could draw a comparison to how friendlies killed in precision strikes count against your friendly fire count. An argument could be made that while both systems give you warning sound before their area of effect damage takes effect, harvesters are stationary objects that you approach at your own risk. You have a better sense of battlefield awareness with a harvester's when a gamma blast is likely to occur. The two main red flags are the solider approaching a terminal and the subsequent sound of a player in deconstruction phase building up to a gamma blast. That should give you enough warning if you are vigilant to get out of the blast area.
Not having those harvesters count toward your TK meter in faction warfare would have to be the case. Besides the harvester gamma blast, that cloud of radiation would be too damn ripe for players to intentionally suicide TK themselves into. Instead, deaths would simply read, clone died. You do make a good point that a player should have the awareness to recognize that approaching a harvester is dangerous business. On the same coin, if that clone dies, they're simply recycled. That's not always going to be the case with an intentional orbital death.
I've got to say that adding a new suicide greifing technique is going to be risky with overall forum disposition. On the other hand, some people are going to love that freedom of choice. |
Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
161
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 13:43:00 -
[106] - Quote
The single suicide hack per unit per match reduces a lot of that potential for team griefing. Also any players that die are added to the MCC cargo bank if they are not being diverted to a transport canister. The means the team is having a potential isk bonus added to battle's profits if they can win and keep their MCC.
At the same time, if that team loses a percentage of the cargo on board the MCC can now picked up by the enemy team. This allows for a more subtle type of AWOXing where you sway the flow of battle if your timing and placement of hacks is just right. |
Jadu Wen
Xer Cloud Consortium
11
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 13:58:00 -
[107] - Quote
Jadek Menaheim wrote: So exponential damage growth would looks like this for the radiation fallout. Hack 1: 30hp/s , 15m radius zone , 30 seconds Hack 2: 60hp/s , 25m radius zone , current timer + 30 seconds Hack 3: 120hp/s , 35m radius zone , - - Hack 4: 240hp/s , 45m radius zone , - -
I think there has to be some type of damage dropoff as you move farther from the harvester. These radiation figures should be representative of the damage a player would take standing right next to the harvester during this radiation period. This would give daisy chained repair healers a better chance of getting a player up to the controls of a harvester while in radiation cool down.
I wanted to experiment a little with how average suit meta levels affected both the size of radiation zones and how much the biomass is worth when recycled.
I was thinking the meta level would act as a multiplier, where meta 1 would = 1.0x, meta 5 = 1.5, and meta 10 would = 2.0x. In the context of radiation fallout ranges, this score would impact the original radius number. The original value of Hack 1 would also be 15m, and Hack 2 would be 25m, and likewise with other values. A meta 9 suit hack would follow as 15m x 1.9 = 28.5m. If another meta 9 hacked the terminal again it would be 25m x 1.9 = 47.5m.
However, as you go higher it will be possible to overcharge the range of the harvester with the radiation fallout if one's team is savvy enough to get a player that far into the radiation zone. After hack 3 with a meta 8 suit you've broken the harvester's collection range.
As before there is a falloff to the level of radiation damage as you move further from the harvester. That could mean that on the very periphery of the fallout zone a player would be taking at most 1hp/s second of damage. |
Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
161
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 14:02:00 -
[108] - Quote
I don't see anybody getting past a hack 5 with 480hp/s of radiation damage at the minimum 55m range. I see no worry in being able to irradiated the whole battlefield. |
Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
161
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 22:40:00 -
[109] - Quote
Jadu I think it might be helpful to introduce a new Gallente designed module type here. One of us brought up the usefulness before to use repair modules to increase survivability in the radiation zone. What if there was a module that provided radiation resistance up to certain levels. For example std modules would protect against 16hp/s fallout. The proto version would fully protect against 47 hp/s og fallout. Stacking penalties do not occur. This mean if you stacked all five proto radiation protection modules on a prototype Gallente logistics they would have a full protection buffer of 225 hp/s. This means that a properly fitted prototype Gallente logistics would have room for longer surviability in a hack 4 radiation zone when they are taking 5hp/s of damage per second. With 210hp of based armor this would give a solider 42 seconds of livable time in a hack 4 zone. |
Jadu Wen
Xer Cloud Consortium
11
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 22:43:00 -
[110] - Quote
Woah that last bit, so you're saying radiation only damages armor then? Not shields? That might be more unfortunate for Gallente armor tankers. |
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Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
161
|
Posted - 2013.10.20 22:55:00 -
[111] - Quote
Jadu Wen wrote:Woah that last bit, so you're saying radiation only damages armor then? Not shields? That might be more unfortunate for Gallente armor tankers.
Sure, armor tanker might be more receptive to damage, but at least Gallente soldiers would have the greatest ability to resist radiation levels for longer if they changed their fitting schema. That fits with their lore goals for preservation of the solider in harmful scenarios.
I would image that radiation modules would be bundled in with the armor repair skill. |
Jadu Wen
Xer Cloud Consortium
11
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 02:14:00 -
[112] - Quote
At least for armor-centric fitting styles, you're proposing a very niche fitting role. It still useful if it gets to the point where key battle objectives lay in irradiated zones. I'm glad you offered the idea of putting these modules in the same category as armor repair modules. Double dipping into the skill tree here is a nice thing. |
Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
161
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 17:21:00 -
[113] - Quote
Jadu I brought his up in your topic. How do you think Caladari players are going to manage if their armor levels are low to begin with? |
Jadu Wen
Xer Cloud Consortium
12
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 17:26:00 -
[114] - Quote
Well they still have the shield buffer to protect them in small battle engagements and enough low slot potential to make use of radiation modules. The players I worry about are commandos, and Minmatar assaults who hardly have any useful low slot capabilities to remain viable in radiation zones. I guess duct tape is a poor substitute for real protection. |
Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
161
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 17:30:00 -
[115] - Quote
Ouch, that's low. I run Winmatar, and I take that strike against me as a badge of resolve. I'll find a way to survive and thrive despite going up against invisible particles which will kill me without hesitation or feeling.
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Jadu Wen
Xer Cloud Consortium
12
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Posted - 2013.10.22 01:10:00 -
[116] - Quote
deepfried salad gilliam wrote:Neat idea but seems like an extreme amount of coding Shouldn't be a priority till atleast all weapons are implemented
Probably won't see any Dev or CPM attention at all to this topic with community attention on BPOs, core mechanics, and FanFest content. |
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