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D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1191
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 17:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
I mean honestly:
- you don't get extra money at the end of each game for playing with members of your corp
- you don't earn extra SP
- PC is hit or miss, and 3 ambush matches if you do well can earn you the same amount of money
- you get taxed.
- only the best players get paid, and that's only if the CEO is rich and has an eve player.
- Your sacrifices don't really get compensated. (if you lose 3 tanks worth 5 million isk, who pays that back?
- you need at least 500 million Isk to start PC (wthout an aliance) and sustain a defense of your territory.
- to be successful in PC you need an eve aliance
- corp roles do not give you anymore money or WP
there is really no incentive to joining a corporations. all the things mentioned above only happen with the big corps in PC, that will care for their players. smaller corps, or new corps dont stand a chance and have nothing to offer. Even with big corps there is no guarantee that you can get anything.
on top of that:
- you can find squads without a corp using either A. the squad finder OR B. getting the right chat channels. (hell you can even form your own chat channel and invite people until you start filling it in)
- you don't get taxed in a starter corp.
- you can be invited to PC if a corp in PC has played with you before and think your good. (you only get consistent PC when in a big corp or aliance)
- almost everything you can do with a corp you can do without.
Basically my point is this: What benefit does the individual players of a corporation get for being in one?
Real mercenaries get paid by their PMCs. Real mercenaries get alot of money for what they do, and of course that experence goes on their resume (file).
Players playing with people from their corp should be getting paid extra for their WP earned as a team and getting a bonus fro winning a battle. etc |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1191
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 18:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
Michael Arck wrote:As human beings, we tend to flock towards groups with similar goals, thoughts, likes and such to fight towards a common goal. In the real world, you have civil activist groups, gay right groups, feminist groups and such. So its not strange for us mercenaries in New Eden to have a corporation where friendships are built. Where the hope and dream of being the most feared, the most rivaled corporation comes to mind.
Yes, you can do all those things solo. But also as human beings, we want to share that end goal with someone. To stand with brothers and sisters and say, "hey we accomplished this together". To recall our moments of war, remembering when we needed aid, our corp mate was there to help. Or to come to the aid of another.
That's the beauty of being in a corporation. It increases the worth of the game and the mercenary.
All those people flock together for a common cause... what common goal or cause do corporations have other than PC? and what does PC even accomplish? it won't give civil right s to anyone. hell, FW doesn't free more minmintar every time we win... |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1191
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 18:46:00 -
[3] - Quote
General John Ripper wrote:It is easy to play with my best friend cubs everyday and the corp name = our gang name.
Thats my point. you are unarguably (this is a fact btw) in one of the most powerful corps and the most powerful aliance in the game. So, you guy are seeing tons of cash and great players on the regular. but your average corp, what do they have that they can't get with a chat channel? |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1191
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 18:47:00 -
[4] - Quote
JL3Eleven wrote:For many people being in a corp is about talking with your friends. Its also one of the only reasons some people log on to play.
Again, you can do the same thing with a chat channel, and you dont need 1million ISK or SP into corporation skills to do that. hell you can eve donate money to players now. so if you want to give your friend money you can.
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D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1191
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 18:49:00 -
[5] - Quote
Chunky Munkey wrote:If you don't like/can't see what corporations offer, don't join them.
This adds nothing to the question in the OP. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1191
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 02:21:00 -
[6] - Quote
God Hates Lags wrote:D legendary hero wrote:I mean honestly: [list]stuff Sounds like your corp sucks. Red Star players don't get taxed, we get compensated for lost fittings and tanks lost in PC. Our CEO regularly drops 20 mill isk on new recruits, we're not in an Eve alliance and still dominate PC and when you squad in corp you know you're going to be with quality players you know and not with blueberries. On top of that we almost always fill PC battles in corp, even when we have to pull from our feeder corp.
my corp doesnt suck, your corp is just plain great. But how many Red stars are out there? How many corporations do that? Not many.
So, Yes your corporation is great indeed. Yes, your corporation literally counters all my points. but, what incentive do Ceo's have for generosity like, this. nothing your corp does is mandated, or obligatory. Today or tommorrow your ceo could decide not to do this. Thats not to say he will do that, but really how many other corps have someone like that who regularly helps his people out? |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1191
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 02:26:00 -
[7] - Quote
Michael Arck wrote:D legendary hero wrote:Michael Arck wrote:As human beings, we tend to flock towards groups with similar goals, thoughts, likes and such to fight towards a common goal. In the real world, you have civil activist groups, gay right groups, feminist groups and such. So its not strange for us mercenaries in New Eden to have a corporation where friendships are built. Where the hope and dream of being the most feared, the most rivaled corporation comes to mind.
Yes, you can do all those things solo. But also as human beings, we want to share that end goal with someone. To stand with brothers and sisters and say, "hey we accomplished this together". To recall our moments of war, remembering when we needed aid, our corp mate was there to help. Or to come to the aid of another.
That's the beauty of being in a corporation. It increases the worth of the game and the mercenary. All those people flock together for a common cause... what common goal or cause do corporations have other than PC? and what does PC even accomplish? it won't give civil right s to anyone. hell, FW doesn't free more minmintar every time we win... LOL it seems that you are responding sarcastically due to some negative occurences with you and corporation. I say that because you say "it won't give civil rights to anyone" Of course it wouldn't. What I did in a long form was explain that its a natural human thing to do to join groups or in this case, corporations. Some folks don't look at it short sighted as you do. You expected immediate rewards and something tangible. While there's folks like me who just get a kick out of organized, tactical warfare. Or just to have good times with friends. Or to smoke a bowl together while they storm districts on Molden Heath (not necessarily in PC). You asked a question and I answered, its to share experiences with like minded people. Now if you don't understand that, you either are trying to knock folks for being in corporations or you had many bitter experiences with corporations.
Mercenaries get paid by their PMCs. Im not questioning the validity of your argument. But, if you get the same amount of cash for playing non-corp battles as for playing with your corp mates whats the point? You can squad up with all your friends anyway. My point is if you are not in a ubber powerful corporation what benefit do YOU individually receiver that YOU CANNOT get without a corp?
Im not accussing anyone. Did I name an corps? Did I insult you personally? did I insult you at all? i hope not. i want an answer that has nothing to do wit metagame. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1191
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 02:28:00 -
[8] - Quote
Luk Manag wrote:D legendary hero wrote:
only the best players get paid, and that's only if the CEO is rich and has an eve player.
Nope. I just wanted to call you out on this one. As it stands, there's no financial support flowing down from space players. Any paycheck comes from Dust ISK, not Eve ISK.
Eve players can transfer Isk to DUST with a 90% tax. which is then used. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1192
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 02:30:00 -
[9] - Quote
Rogatien Merc wrote:You can be a loner out in bummfuk nowhere living in the woods IRL too.
strength in numbers + creates an ingroup with intangible social value allowing one to strive against the implied 'other' or outsider.
^--- random 3-cent words.
L2sociology
Dude I dont have to join the police force to be freidns with coprs. I dont have to join the army to be friends with soldiers. In fact you dont have to be a politician to have stakes in politics. this has nothing to do with this conversation. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1192
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 02:31:00 -
[10] - Quote
God Hates Lags wrote:D legendary hero wrote:I mean honestly:
- you don't get extra money at the end of each game for playing with members of your corp
- you don't earn extra SP
- PC is hit or miss, and 3 ambush matches if you do well can earn you the same amount of money
- you get taxed.
- only the best players get paid, and that's only if the CEO is rich and has an eve player.
- Your sacrifices don't really get compensated. (if you lose 3 tanks worth 5 million isk, who pays that back?
- you need at least 500 million Isk to start PC (wthout an aliance) and sustain a defense of your territory.
- to be successful in PC you need an eve aliance
- corp roles do not give you anymore money or WP
there is really no incentive to joining a corporations. all the things mentioned above only happen with the big corps in PC, that will care for their players. smaller corps, or new corps dont stand a chance and have nothing to offer. Even with big corps there is no guarantee that you can get anything. on top of that:
- you can find squads without a corp using either A. the squad finder OR B. getting the right chat channels. (hell you can even form your own chat channel and invite people until you start filling it in)
- you don't get taxed in a starter corp.
- you can be invited to PC if a corp in PC has played with you before and think your good. (you only get consistent PC when in a big corp or aliance)
- almost everything you can do with a corp you can do without.
Basically my point is this: What benefit does the individual players of a corporation get for being in one? Real mercenaries get paid by their PMCs. Real mercenaries get alot of money for what they do, and of course that experence goes on their resume (file). Players playing with people from their corp should be getting paid extra for their WP earned as a team and getting a bonus fro winning a battle. etc Sounds like your corp sucks. Red Star players don't get taxed, we get compensated for lost fittings and tanks lost in PC. Our CEO regularly drops 20 mill isk on new recruits, we're not in an Eve alliance and still dominate PC and when you squad in corp you know you're going to be with quality players you know and not with blueberries. On top of that we almost always fill PC battles in corp, even when we have to pull from our feeder corp.
also, dude you are in EoN that is an official aliance... its posted right under your name. |
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D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1192
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 02:32:00 -
[11] - Quote
Boot Booter wrote:I have friends in my Corp that I get to squad up with frequently.. That alone is worth it. After all, it's a game and it's here for us to play so we can have fun. If all you care about is making fake money and not getting fake taxed then Idk.. I guess you have a point. Plus it's fun to get a full squad of Corp members and stomp a pub match filling the top 6 spots.
But you can squad up with your friends and do the samething without a corp. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1192
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 02:37:00 -
[12] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:D legendary hero wrote:I mean honestly:
- you don't get extra money at the end of each game for playing with members of your corp
- you don't earn extra SP
- PC is hit or miss, and 3 ambush matches if you do well can earn you the same amount of money
- you get taxed.
- only the best players get paid, and that's only if the CEO is rich and has an eve player.
- Your sacrifices don't really get compensated. (if you lose 3 tanks worth 5 million isk, who pays that back?
- you need at least 500 million Isk to start PC (wthout an aliance) and sustain a defense of your territory.
- to be successful in PC you need an eve aliance
- corp roles do not give you anymore money or WP
You get extra money at the end of each match because you do better and die less thanks to the support of your corpmates. You're much more likely to play well with people you know well and play with regularly - corpmates. Tax isn't much of a concern. Does a couple of percent really make that much difference? Often corps don't have tax at all either. On having an EVE player - that doesn't give you any benefits other than making administration easier. You can't transfer EVE isk to Dust, so it's not like having an EVE player makes any difference to financing. Your sacrifices might well be compensated if you're in a good corp. But what were you expecting, magical replacement from nowhere because you're in a corp? If you lost something, it's probably your fault. You're going to lose less things with corp support though. Needing a load of isk to start PC hardly has an effect on the average player thinking about joining a corporation. That's more of a thing for directors to worry about. Why would corp roles give you more money or SP? I assume you meant SP, because WP wouldn't really work. If that were the case, then loads of people would just make one man corps, assign themselves all the roles, and go out and make isk/SP. What's the logic behind people with roles getting free stuff from nowhere?
I'm not ure if your the guy i normally disagree with. but, you have some valid arguments here. Still, Im trying to figure out the benefit of corps other than a PC battle, that the individual player can't get with a good chat. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1193
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 03:30:00 -
[13] - Quote
Luk Manag wrote:D legendary hero wrote:Luk Manag wrote:D legendary hero wrote:
only the best players get paid, and that's only if the CEO is rich and has an eve player.
Nope. I just wanted to call you out on this one. As it stands, there's no financial support flowing down from space players. Any paycheck comes from Dust ISK, not Eve ISK. Eve players can transfer Isk to DUST with a 90% tax. which is then used. That has been suggested, but it hasn't been implemented.
i stand corrected. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1193
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 03:32:00 -
[14] - Quote
deepfried salad gilliam wrote:I made a post about this a few days ago, my solution was a corporation skill tree that increase salvage, decrease prices from market, increases passive wp,then increases active sp in that order of skills
This makes sense. Please post your link here. This sounds reasonable if the precentages are significant but still small, you can give a mercenary a monetary incentive to joining a corp. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1193
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 03:37:00 -
[15] - Quote
This is the point. WE ARE MERCENARIES.
If we were just soldiers, then money probably wouldn't even be mentioned. In fact in COD and BATTLEFIELD money isn't even mentioned or used (except in black ops 1) and that's because it is generally understood that those guys are soldiers of a given country therefore taxes pay for their equipment etc (all though the vets on here know that sometimes you gotta pay for your equipment, and body armor).
Mercenaries fight for money. they have no incentive other than fighting for the highest bidder. Therefore, mercenaries teaming up and donating money without a payout makes no sense. honestly... if you want to fight for people of the same side FW does that choose one side and queue them.
Tell me who YOU individually GAIN from your corp |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1194
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 03:47:00 -
[16] - Quote
DJINN Marauder wrote:D legendary hero wrote:Boot Booter wrote:I have friends in my Corp that I get to squad up with frequently.. That alone is worth it. After all, it's a game and it's here for us to play so we can have fun. If all you care about is making fake money and not getting fake taxed then Idk.. I guess you have a point. Plus it's fun to get a full squad of Corp members and stomp a pub match filling the top 6 spots. But you can squad up with your friends and do the samething without a corp. You can but its not the same. Being together in a group, a real group, is more fun. Maybe fun isn't the right word but it feels better when you and friends are under the same tag.
i think your a good example. When people see the ancient exiles name, many quiver with fear I have had blue berries leave the game because they saw your corp name.
But, is that really worth the millions of isk in sacriface you and others like you make?
So, yeah you make blues drop their seeds when they see you. but what more do you gain?
In fact, without the ancient exiles corp name, when people see DJINN just as many **** bricks, so you get the same effect without the corp. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1194
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 03:53:00 -
[17] - Quote
Another important point is that individual players can become just as famous as corporations.
Think when you see players in a match the person that killed you last has their name highlighted.
when you see someone with the DJIIN in their name you know something is about to go down.
Judge rathsmeus, chicago cubs, lance2ballzstrong, master jaraya, calamity jane (havent seen her in a while), etc are all famous DUST players.
When you think of dropships you think of judge, shotguns, jane, HMGs lance, cubs and master jaraya.
The players became famous and their corps not so much. I can't even remember jane's corp. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1194
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 03:54:00 -
[18] - Quote
Chimichanga66605 wrote:I just wanted my own interstellar Taco Shack with Lord Vader's name on it....that's about the only reason I'm in a corp.
-Chimi out, o7 Impressive. however, I find your lack of burritos most disturbing. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1194
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 03:58:00 -
[19] - Quote
DJINN Marauder wrote:D legendary hero wrote:DJINN Marauder wrote:D legendary hero wrote:Boot Booter wrote:I have friends in my Corp that I get to squad up with frequently.. That alone is worth it. After all, it's a game and it's here for us to play so we can have fun. If all you care about is making fake money and not getting fake taxed then Idk.. I guess you have a point. Plus it's fun to get a full squad of Corp members and stomp a pub match filling the top 6 spots. But you can squad up with your friends and do the samething without a corp. You can but its not the same. Being together in a group, a real group, is more fun. Maybe fun isn't the right word but it feels better when you and friends are under the same tag. i think your a good example. When people see the ancient exiles name, many quiver with fear I have had blue berries leave the game because they saw your corp name. But, is that really worth the millions of isk in sacriface you and others like you make? So, yeah you make blues drop their seeds when they see you. but what more do you gain? In fact, without the ancient exiles corp name, when people see DJINN just as many **** bricks, so you get the same effect without the corp. I don't know what you mean by millions of isk sacrifice..? And it's not just what we gain from making people scared its more than that. A corp helps you make bonds with people you would have otherwise not made. The friends I have on this game are ALL met through corps. If I didn't join a corp I wouldn't have met my friends.
by millions of Isk I mean, when someone encounters a jinn they are normally in full proto. Losing proto suits over time will cost you millions of isk. If you die 1 times every 7 matches even thats still a million isk within 3 hours (if every match is 15mins or less).
if each suit costs you 150k ISK that is.
your latter arguments are honorable. however, do you honestly believe that you could not have met the same individuals by means of a chat channel, etc.? they play regularly enough. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1195
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 04:09:00 -
[20] - Quote
Chimichanga66605 wrote:D legendary hero wrote:Chimichanga66605 wrote:I just wanted my own interstellar Taco Shack with Lord Vader's name on it....that's about the only reason I'm in a corp.
-Chimi out, o7 Impressive. however, I find your lack of burritos most disturbing. Oh we got burritos, we package them in Grenades. Ever wonder what's REALLY packed in those things? Hmmmm? Also, our Nanohives are really just a convenient way to deploy nachos on the battlefield.... ....the menu goes on & on... -Chimi out, o7
hmmm..HMHMMMM most impressive. we gotta squad up sometime. join the chat channel "warrior chat". Vader is a good host. He treated han solo to a meal before freezing him. lol |
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D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1197
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 17:20:00 -
[21] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:D legendary hero wrote:Luk Manag wrote:D legendary hero wrote:
only the best players get paid, and that's only if the CEO is rich and has an eve player.
Nope. I just wanted to call you out on this one. As it stands, there's no financial support flowing down from space players. Any paycheck comes from Dust ISK, not Eve ISK. Eve players can transfer Isk to DUST with a 90% tax. which is then used. Incorrect. This has been discussed, but it is not currently possible.
hey man read before you reply I already sad I was mistaken on this. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1197
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 17:23:00 -
[22] - Quote
Green Living wrote:I get weekly paychecks.
- You are in outter.heavan... I mean come'on
- your are probably a director, TCO, etc
So, basically what i am taking away from this is... "if you aren't in red star, teamplayers, the EoN aliance, or outter heaven AND a famous player in that corp...why bother joining a corp?" |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1197
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 17:31:00 -
[23] - Quote
ChromeBreaker wrote:CORP
... PC = 2mill a match (its more than that but suit losses stack up) + all vehicles refunded + a little extra from the corp... Can happily do 2-3 of an evening, more on a weekend. If i want too, not forced to.
Instantly can find a squad of people i know and have faught with before...
Lots of peeps that have my back, new friends out of game too.
Advise, backing, help, tactics... the question is why wouldnt you join a corp?
Again the only people here with positive responses like this are people in the MOOST powerful and MOST famous corps in all of DUST. I mean your corp has a 10 million SP minimum requierement to join for christ's sake.
Everyone knows Sever true blood, especially if you played MAG. Hell, most of you guys new each other from MAG. So, yeah, if your corp is doing PC and already owns districts (and satelite corps), everyone has full proto, with hundreds of players of course you are going to earn cash.
But you chromeBreaker are a famous player as well. Your known all across these forums, and on the battlefield too. Mostly likely by now your a director or at least a TCO.
TL;DR your in one of the best corps, your a famous player, you probably have a high position and repoire among the members.
But how much does your new recruits even get paid? Hell, they have to have 10 million SP before they can even join and go through a training corp. You only prove my point. The average corporation can't do anything even remotely close to this.
And at that, your CEO is not forced to pay you to keep you in the corp. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1197
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 17:36:00 -
[24] - Quote
Thor Odinson42 wrote:D legendary hero wrote:This is the point. WE ARE MERCENARIES.
If we were just soldiers, then money probably wouldn't even be mentioned. In fact in COD and BATTLEFIELD money isn't even mentioned or used (except in black ops 1) and that's because it is generally understood that those guys are soldiers of a given country therefore taxes pay for their equipment etc (all though the vets on here know that sometimes you gotta pay for your equipment, and body armor).
Mercenaries fight for money. they have no incentive other than fighting for the highest bidder. Therefore, mercenaries teaming up and donating money without a payout makes no sense. honestly... if you want to fight for people of the same side FW does that choose one side and queue them.
Tell me who YOU individually GAIN from your corp In real life mercenaries work for huge corporations. In the past they've always worked for someone. Someone had to take and negotiate contracts. In Dust, I believe the mercenary part of the equation means that the individual is free to fight for whatever faction, join whatever corporation, and use whatever gear they want to use. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to take a look at the mechanics of this game and see that being in a corporation is better than not being in one. I'm not going to go into a long spiel about the benefits of a corporation. It should be obvious. I will say that being in a 15 man corp with an average SP total of 6 million is a HUGE waste of time for all involved, but still better than going at it solo. Some people do not have the social skills necessary to be a part of a group however. You sound like the type of person that would ALWAYS second guess everything that someone else suggests without offering anything of substance in response. I think if you polled the player base you would find yourself in the vast minority.
1. you are completely wrong about me. as can be evidenced by my responses on the forums and especially people the I have played with in game.
2. with your comment you made yourself this person: "the type of person that would ALWAYS second guess everything that someone else suggests without offering anything of substance in response." |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
1206
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 23:34:00 -
[25] - Quote
so what individual benefits do you receive from being in a corp? |
D legendary hero
Ultramarine Corp
1219
|
Posted - 2013.10.24 18:02:00 -
[26] - Quote
now I am in a good corp. So i am abandoning this thread. |
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