As someone who didn't come from EVE I don't know much more about the racial lore than is provided in Dust, but the most self-centered of all the races is pretty clearly spelled out as Amarr.

They take what they want because its their deity given right and duty to do so.


With that said I had to rally behind minmatar, as they seem to fight for [i]something that matters,[/i ]what had been denied them by their oppressors/owners.

Actually the use of those tools in the practice of oppression is actually common. For example schools have (in the real world) been used as a tool of assimilation and genocide. When the Amarr build a school, is the intended use teaching or indoctrinating? Would an enslaved race be taught to only see things in the "Light" of the Empire.

They can be from a perspective. If the Gal schools are not teaching critical thinking and openness and acceptance of beliefs and ideas, teaching only one approach or ideology then yes. In essence, without freedom of choice and the ability to dissent then oppression is part of the process. The Federation has cultural variability, and diversity in beliefs so it indicates less oppression than say the Amarr one doctrine one truth method of "education"

Edit> Was assimilation ever considered oppressive? I suppose the oppressor rarely see's at such.

lol link goes to a blank page
Though I must say not a big fan of the Gal either, really on a personal level none of the factions really appeal to me.

The only reason you view the amarr as evil is because you see "slavery" and immediately assume "mistreating" "harsh" "disrespect" and harmful acts upon those lines.

This is not true. We of the amarr respect our slaves. We don't mistreat them but rather enlighten them. We give them housing, education, health, work. So that they may live a truly righteous life. For freedom gained through hard work is more meaningful than meaningless freedom gained through nothing.

If by enlighten, you mean indoctrinate.
You know where else we had housing, education, health, and work? In the beautiful peaceful land of Matar. Until the Amarr came that is.

But you're right about freedom gained through hard work. And we Matari will work hard to free all our brothers and sisters who have been enslaved.
Down with the Amarr.

Basically, Gallente and Caldari were friends, until Gallente started being a bad friend, and Caldari wanted out of the relationship. Gallente then bullied Caldari for not being their friend, until big strong Amarr showed up and scared Gallente, who whispered lies into the ears of Amarr's friend Matari, and turned them against one another. The Gallente are the truly evil ones IMHO.

Or so your amarrian indoctrination would lead you to believe?
You think you helped out by destroying what we had and making us slaves?
No. We were fine as we were. We never asked for your "help", nor did we want it. Nor was it helpful in the slightest.

Again, still talking about history.

The Earth had countries that started wars with others and then were able to be accepted back into the world community. I don't think starting a war counts as truly evil.

That is reserved for those that impose ideology or lack of freedom on others.

The Gallente did not manipulate us. They gave us an opportunity to earn back our freedom and we did. The Amarr are the great evil. Never forget the day of darkness.

Fool, you are describing the path... yesterday is not today.

Slavery and ideology are alive and well in your society while the Caldari are no longer "under the boot" of the Gallente by any stretch of the imagination.

Officially? Hahahaha. They are repressed how?

The Amarr are in fact oppressors. Just accept it.

I was saying that out of character.
I haven't found anything in Evelopedia that would suggest the living improvement is all that great. Or any of the things you listed.

You linked me to one about the Anmatar mandate. Which I did read. But that was only about the Mandate. It didn't say anything about Matar.

And I like how both of you skipped this part:

And I don't see how kidnapping someone from their planet, or killing someone for not accepting your God is NOT cruel, unjust, or burdensome? What do you guys do to slaves who don't want to follow orders? You either kill them or stick 'em with Vitoc. I know you read about Vitoc. How is that not oppressive?


:p

Pretty sure it's also used on mining colonies.

But still, my point being that the amarr are oppressive. Not saying the other races don't have their oppressive sides. I'm just saying that reading you guys try to argue that the Amarr are not AT ALL oppressive despite:

And I don't see how kidnapping someone from their planet, or killing someone for not accepting your God is NOT cruel, unjust, or burdensome? What do you guys do to slaves who don't want to follow orders? You either kill them or stick 'em with Vitoc. I know you read about Vitoc. How is that not oppressive?

Hurts my head a little.

[quote=Aero Yassavi]
What? It wasn't just a few who decided to invade Matar. The Empire as a whole decided that.

Gallente are the evil ones obviously, stealing peoples homelands, persecuting those they claim are allies
Isnt it obvious?

I don't agrue that case because that's between the Gallente and the Caldari. Caldari RPers can argue it. My character is more focused on Minmatar issues. Which while the Gallente might eventually be an issue, for the moment they're more focus on the Caldari, and the Amarr and the more pressing problem.

But they're our friends friends because the Gallente didn't take us from our home. They never enslaved us. (And yes, I'll admit Amarr slavery is better than real world slavery. It's still a negative thing though.) They never made us worship their God. They didn't use Vitoc on us, they didn't attack our planet, and they helped us break free. Keep in mind before you agree the breaking us free part, it was something we wanted.

But also keep in mind my earlier "Amarr are monsterous" talk is just role play stuff i say as a fierce matari freedom fighter.
Also, for the meantime, the Gallente are more focused on the Caldari.

Fixed that

Someone add more evil things the list I'm too lazy to. :\

Hmm, if that is so, was all of 1400's Europe evil? Because...you know....it was all catholic and biased as such....

its not the religious society that has granted you the title, it is your methods, much like the Christian crusades and the current muslim jihad.

the main goal may be of good will, but your image will be forever tainted by your methods.


people outside of the Christian faith saw the crusades as nothing but mindless killing much like how we outside of the empire see your war against the minmitar to be. Christian faith holders saw it as an upbringing to other people, either they accept god or they burn forever in hell, much like you amarr beliefs.

but the muslim example is far worse.

they see anyone who doesn't join their religion to be non-human and will not hesitate to kill anyone in their way.. all in the name of their god, much like the amarr...

basically, the amarr are the combination of the past Christianity and the current islam. however, they do not see themselves as that, much like how the past Christians did not see themselves as biased murderers and the current muslim extremists see themselves as holy warriors.

main difference between all 3 is that Christianity never had slaves and was in fact created by slaves, the muslims just kill and take no prisoners unless they convert, the amarr take slaves and convert them.


for the amarr, they are forever tainted by the religious fanatic title because they invaded minmatar space, nearly destroyed all their civilization and took their prisoners to be enslaved, no matter the slavery type, violent or non-violent, slavery is already a evil word that gives the holder the worst view from anyone who hears of it.

that is why people view the amarr as evil, because they enslaved the minmatar..... violent slavery and non-violent slavery, its still slavery.

So very true. I mean, I used to squad with them. But then they go and attack me so easily. Proof of Amarr evil right there.