DUST Search - So why does my AR have 60 bullets per magazine??

Tech Ohm Eaven wrote:

Oxskull Duncarino wrote:

Tech Ohm Eaven wrote:

I remember using M-16 AR and those had 30 bullets per banana clip magazine back when the calendar said 1980..
So why does the Dust 514 AR have 60 bullets per magazine??

I notice the reload skills but when I ask AR using folks about them they say why bother when the AR has 60 bullets per magazine??

I was wondering if perhaps its time to make reload skills more relevant by reducing the AR magazine size down to 30 bullets for militia AR and 40 for regular AR.

I am thinking this perhaps help balance the ARs more.

???

This what I really don't get with ye lot. You attempt to make a point or have a debate about balancing in this game, but you more or less ruin it by A: Equating it to real life B: What you equate it to being so out of sync with what is actually real.

Standard mag sizes with standard calibur cased rounds for military assault rifles/carbines come in 30 round mags. Present tech using caseless rounds, different bullet design, and improved magazines easily have 150% of the mag capacities in general usage. Even without using caseless rounds the P90 has a 50 round mag due to cartridge design and the mag design and feed design. If ceaseless rounds were used in the design then even more rounds would go into the same space. Honestly, modern day tech is easily able to field capacities like what we see in Dust. Ya do yourself a disfavor by even comparing the two. I'd expect to have even larger mags again due to bullet design in both material and shape, aswell as the propellant required being miniscule.

Just so we're clear, I've been fully hmg since Christmas, and run a commando suit wit a primary of a laser and a secondary either shotgun or AR. Mag sizes are grand. Now that hit detection is working well, damage can be looked at. Reducing the mag is the wrong way. Reduce the damage, and have set recoil per round, not gradually build over time. And I don't think any balance should be attempt till more racial weapons are in to balance against.

Back to my main point though. Go ahead and use present knowledge to suggest potential directions for Dust weapons, but saying the balance/design of weapons in a sci-fi game based on a space travelling culture far in the future should be done around present day weapon designs that are at an epoch as it is, is idiocy of the highest order. Unfortunately that idiocy is shared by many on this forum. I don't really care if you get offended by what I've typed, but I do hope you have a better think about what you type in future.

So why are 60 bullets at 37 times for over 2200 damage times 1.41(prof/damage mods) for 3080 DAMAGE needed to kill a suit thats 900 HP or LESS??

Pray, pray and spray??


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Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 199	Posted - 2013.09.24 07:51:00 - [1] - Quote Reducing the Clipsize of the GAR is a tricky one as you would need to reduce the Clipsize of all automatic weapons as well. Just because you don't like a weapon does not mean it is totally unbalanced. The AR needs the correct DPS Range profile: High DPS (highest Dps of all AR) and low Range (lowest Range of all ARs) thats it. If you simply reduce the Clipsize of the AR the AsCR would become king: similar DPS, similar Range and similar Dispersion without barrel climb (all in all a stupid concept to make both weapons that similar). And if you are afraid of DPS or Damage per clip have a look at the other Automatic weapons: Scrambler Rifle (std): DPS: 840+ Damage per Clip: 3240 Clipsize: 45 AsCR (adv): DPS: 444 Damage per Clip: 2721 Clipsize: 72 TAR (adv) DPS: 500 Damage per Clip: 1350 Clipszie: 18 Assault Rifle Std: DPS: 425 Damage per Clip: 2040 Clipsize: 60 HMG (std) DPS: 533 Damage per Clip: 6800 Clipsize:450 SMG (std) DPS: 350 Damage per Clip:1680 Clipsize: 80 So in general the GAR is in a good place IMHO. Regarding Recoil and Dispersion have a look here the vids show that the GAR isn't that much more accurate than the AsCR unless it comes to skill. People tend to forget how much the GAR benefits from skills in terms of accuracy and of course people have learned to handle the recoil/dispersion the AR has so it becomes a non factor but thats not the fault of the weapon.... On a sidenote I wouldn't mind a bit more Recoil and Dispersion but honestly i think that would change things only for one or two weeks until people have adapted (that was what happened the last time they increased Recoil and Dispersion on that weapon).
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 199	Posted - 2013.09.24 08:25:00 - [2] - Quote Tech Ohm Eaven wrote: Except the scambler overheats and provides feedback damage. HMG overheats and the user is vulnerable for ten seconds. Laser has feedback damage. SMG is terrible versus shields since its a sidearm. The problem with the AR is right now it outperforms a HMG at five paces in CQC. The AR needs a tone down via haveing to pause to reload. I wouldn't say that 95% vs Shield is terrible.... If the AR outperformes the HMG in CQC where the disperion is not a problem its the fault of the HMG user, I encounter plenty of heavies that shred assaults apart in CQC... Overheting does not seem to be a problem for mots heavies and on the Laser rifle its easy to handle btw the LR is not really an automatic weapon so its hard to compare it stat wise... The AsCR overheats after one and a half clip without skills after roughly two clips including skills, so thats not an argument. The overheat on the standard Scramblerrifle is the only thing that keeps that weapon slightly in balance also consider that heatbuildup is per second the faster you shoot the more shots you can place before overheating
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 199	Posted - 2013.09.24 12:31:00 - [3] - Quote Tech Ohm Eaven wrote: Oxskull Duncarino wrote: Tech Ohm Eaven wrote: I remember using M-16 AR and those had 30 bullets per banana clip magazine back when the calendar said 1980.. So why does the Dust 514 AR have 60 bullets per magazine?? I notice the reload skills but when I ask AR using folks about them they say why bother when the AR has 60 bullets per magazine?? I was wondering if perhaps its time to make reload skills more relevant by reducing the AR magazine size down to 30 bullets for militia AR and 40 for regular AR. I am thinking this perhaps help balance the ARs more. ??? This what I really don't get with ye lot. You attempt to make a point or have a debate about balancing in this game, but you more or less ruin it by A: Equating it to real life B: What you equate it to being so out of sync with what is actually real. Standard mag sizes with standard calibur cased rounds for military assault rifles/carbines come in 30 round mags. Present tech using caseless rounds, different bullet design, and improved magazines easily have 150% of the mag capacities in general usage. Even without using caseless rounds the P90 has a 50 round mag due to cartridge design and the mag design and feed design. If ceaseless rounds were used in the design then even more rounds would go into the same space. Honestly, modern day tech is easily able to field capacities like what we see in Dust. Ya do yourself a disfavor by even comparing the two. I'd expect to have even larger mags again due to bullet design in both material and shape, aswell as the propellant required being miniscule. Just so we're clear, I've been fully hmg since Christmas, and run a commando suit wit a primary of a laser and a secondary either shotgun or AR. Mag sizes are grand. Now that hit detection is working well, damage can be looked at. Reducing the mag is the wrong way. Reduce the damage, and have set recoil per round, not gradually build over time. And I don't think any balance should be attempt till more racial weapons are in to balance against. Back to my main point though. Go ahead and use present knowledge to suggest potential directions for Dust weapons, but saying the balance/design of weapons in a sci-fi game based on a space travelling culture far in the future should be done around present day weapon designs that are at an epoch as it is, is idiocy of the highest order. Unfortunately that idiocy is shared by many on this forum. I don't really care if you get offended by what I've typed, but I do hope you have a better think about what you type in future. So why are 60 bullets at 37 times for over 2200 damage times 1.41(prof/damage mods) for 3080 DAMAGE needed to kill a suit thats 900 HP or LESS?? Pray, pray and spray?? You could ask that question for all automatic weapons not just the GAR