DUST Search - For all you Ass hole tankers

pegasis prime wrote:

Master Jaraiya wrote:

I just want to throw this in.

The whole rendering "issue" is complete nonsense! I have been instapopped by redline rail tanks that were a good 400 - 500 m out. They were in fact so far out that they did not turn my Forge Gun reticule's color indicating they were in range. No, before you talk smack, I was NOT in a tower sniping position. I was on the ground holding an objective, trying to push the tank off of our installations while getting sniped, dodging murder taxis, core locus grenades, mass driver spam, and everything else that is the bane of my existence as a heavy!

So let me ask you, how did the rail tank hit me from so far away if, like many claim "forge gunners don't render at long distances"

WAHHHHH BOOOO HOOOOOO.

I agree 100% with the OP. There are too many tankers who just want invincibility while sitting in their nice cozy little death machine.

My corp has several tankers who never-NEVER complain about tanks being UP. In fact these guys score 1st place on end of match every time they play with 2500+ WP without even trying very hard! I have seen them score 3500+ WP with like 50 - 60 kills.

Just yesterday I was playing in a squad with one of our tankers, and the ENTIRE match he was LAUGHING at the AV guys with swarms because they could not take his tank down!

Tankers need to seriously learn how to play their role and HTFU or go find another game that they can be more successful at. Perhaps something like this would better suit you crybabies!

You will have renderd at that distance because of 1 of 3 things

1 his squad leafer was on the ball and put an attack order on you.

2 someone in his squad acctivly scanned you.

3 some in in his squad was using passive scanners and was ib range of you.

Other than these 3 things I havent found any other way to see objects beyond 250m in my tank . The rendering hard stops at 250m when im in my rail. I have had enemy havs dissapear infromt of me because they rolld back 2 or 3 m . Get in a sica with a rail and try it yourself the rendering distance is the same for all pikots inside the tank. I will add you can see enimy instalations up to about 500m away but only see infantry within 250m


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Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 424	Posted - 2013.08.24 06:20:00 - [1] - Quote were you on a high tower overelooking teh entire battlefield outside his rendering range with an ammo hive at your feet? aka forcing him to sit in a corner immobile behind a rock all game while your invisable and invulnerable to all weapons fire? if not you were doing it wrong, and you have no idea why theres an imbalance in the tank/AV/infantry equasion see thread for details https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1215112#post1215112
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 424	Posted - 2013.08.24 06:25:00 - [2] - Quote Duran Lex wrote: Chances Ghost wrote: were you on a high tower overelooking teh entire battlefield outside his rendering range with an ammo hive at your feet? aka forcing him to sit in a corner immobile behind a rock all game while your invisable and invulnerable to all weapons fire? if not you were doing it wrong, and you have no idea why theres an imbalance in the tank/AV/infantry equasion see thread for details https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1215112#post1215112 I can only lol at you. and why is that?
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 426	Posted - 2013.08.24 06:31:00 - [3] - Quote Duran Lex wrote: Chances Ghost wrote: Duran Lex wrote: Chances Ghost wrote: were you on a high tower overelooking teh entire battlefield outside his rendering range with an ammo hive at your feet? aka forcing him to sit in a corner immobile behind a rock all game while your invisable and invulnerable to all weapons fire? if not you were doing it wrong, and you have no idea why theres an imbalance in the tank/AV/infantry equasion see thread for details https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1215112#post1215112 I can only lol at you. and why is that? You didn't read my post. It's okay though, you were going to comment without reading anyways. i read it. you went up against one of the best tankers int he game who has thrived in an environment that is heavily screwed against him. you are NOT the best forge gunner in the game. and yet you still managed to mess him up pretty good despite having no real knowledge of the mechanics involved. if you DID understand the mechanics involved he would of been rendered immobile. so, now care to anwser my question?
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 427	Posted - 2013.08.24 06:39:00 - [4] - Quote Duran Lex wrote: Alright, ill humour you. No, i wasn't on a tower...because i didn't say i was on a tower. No, i wasn't forcing him into a corner...he decided to stop redline tanking and come in the open. Like i stated. My post wasn't meant to dictate AV philosophies, and it wasn't mean to promote strategies. I simply stated the fact that tanks aren't as weak as so many tankers make themselves out to be, and wanting a buff from it. Whatever else you took from my post, its an opinion of your accord. well if you were on a tower or other suitable position, just outside his rendering distance you would have NUKED HIM OFF THE PLANET, with no available recourse. and he wouldnt of even known where you were. so when we say fix tanks, we are referancing infantrys ability to abuse rendering to make vehicles obsolete so you QQ about tank effectivness is based off you not useing the tools available for you to kill them, not because they are unkillable. aka you couldnt kill him because you suck, not because tanks are fine and AV/tank balance is ok
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 427	Posted - 2013.08.24 06:43:00 - [5] - Quote Duran Lex wrote: Chances Ghost wrote: Duran Lex wrote: Alright, ill humour you. No, i wasn't on a tower...because i didn't say i was on a tower. No, i wasn't forcing him into a corner...he decided to stop redline tanking and come in the open. Like i stated. My post wasn't meant to dictate AV philosophies, and it wasn't mean to promote strategies. I simply stated the fact that tanks aren't as weak as so many tankers make themselves out to be, and wanting a buff from it. Whatever else you took from my post, its an opinion of your accord. well if you were on a tower or other suitable position, just outside his rendering distance you would have NUKED HIM OFF THE PLANET, with no available recourse. and he wouldnt of even known where you were. so when we say fix tanks, we are referancing infantrys ability to abuse rendering to make vehicles obsolete so you QQ about tank effectivness is based off you not useing the tools available for you to kill them, not because they are unkillable. aka you couldnt kill him because you suck, not because tanks are fine and AV/tank balance is ok And a single tank dictating the entire flow of the battlefield, because i was the sole AVer trying to take him out....ISN'T game breaking as well? thats a player problem, not a game balance problem its not the fault of game mechanics that only 1 played attempted to kill the tank, thats the fault of the players. the option was available to them and is HIGHLY effective at getting rid of tanks, they simply CHOSE not to. so no not game breaking, invisable swarms/forge gunners however is as game breaking as the invisable shotgunners were because they was NO COUNTER. so let me make this simple for you. if you have the ability to kill it but chose not to = games fine dont have the ability to prevent death and theres no counter in the game = game broken
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 427	Posted - 2013.08.24 06:48:00 - [6] - Quote i dont have the time to re-explain rendering to you so go to this thread and read https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1215112#post1215112 1 AVer CAN destroy every single vehicle on the field while invisable and therefore invulnerable every shot he takes will also be invisable. the top 10% of players know this an abuse this. and its UNCOUNTERABLE normally when AV hits the field we will use our squad to eliminate the threat and continue, we have a way to COUNTER AV, and that would be balanced. but rendering makes it unbalance due to it not having a counter
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 427	Posted - 2013.08.24 07:04:00 - [7] - Quote Duran Lex wrote: This just became another bullshit "A fully specced AVer cannot solo kill a tank, even though I'm claiming they have the ability to easily kill said tank solo" thread thanks to you die hard god machines. Jesus, no wonder Wang got fed up with you *******. Everyone single one of you "vet" tankers will quit when patch 1.5 releases, because it wont be the god mode you wanted back. /thread on my part the problem isnt numbers, we dont want to nerf you, we just want you to stop being INVISABLE remember all the hate when infantry were running around invisable shotgunning people to the face invulnerable to all but a lucky shot breaking the game? thats whats happening here. most of the time you all invisable to the tankers. uncounterable. its not about the numbers, its about a rendering problem thats making swarms and forge guns invisable instahit machines of vehicle death without a counter
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 427	Posted - 2013.08.24 07:08:00 - [8] - Quote DJINN leukoplast wrote: Void Echo wrote: the state of the game, there are NO advanced or prototype tanks to deal with advanced and prototype AV, so yeah this game is terribly broken on vehicle balance. Advanced and proto are the only effective AV against std tanks (adv swarms are garbage, only adv forge is worthwhile)... that alone should say something. Just imagine if the OP was using std AV to try to take out teds tank... he could have spent all night shooting him and nothing would have ever happened. Also the op had used proto forge and yet he didn't make a dent. Which is BS. Once your invincible noob-proto tanks arrive, there will be nothing in the game powerful enough to take them out unless half the team is using proto AV and is focused 100% on one proto tank. how to kill a tank 101 grad forge or swarm, doesnt matter what level sit outside of rendering distance in a place with the best LOS to the playing field nuke every vehicle untill it either dies or is forced to hide indefinatly laugh as your invisable and therefore invulnerable to al vehicle and infantry fire
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 429	Posted - 2013.08.24 07:19:00 - [9] - Quote doesnt matter if we have ADV or PRO tanks, or weather we nerf swarms and forges rendering distance will still kill all the vehicles in the hands of the top 10%
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 429	Posted - 2013.08.24 08:26:00 - [10] - Quote lets look at the tanks role if it was just as effective as infantry then it wouldnt have a purpose as it would be more benifitial to stay infantry because of the cost involved. so it has to be more effective then being infantry how do we do that? well we can do any number of things make it more survivable than infantry this is done by making it so only AV weapons have any real chance of killing it make it better at killing things then infantry aparently people dont like this fact about tanks specialise its targets, make it better at killing other tanks than infantry AV giving them the ultimate role in anti-tank with infantry based AV support as a tie breaker balance revolves around making it so anyone who has speced into both tanks and infantry, givin that they have no preferance for either or, would find himself torn between running either or not based on effectiveness but rather situation. balance means its a tactical choice rather than a power based choice the problem is CCP hasnt really defined its role properly. do they WANT it to be the king of AV with anti infantry capabilities ont he side? do they want it to specialise its weapon to choose between AV and infantry effectiveness? in wich case it would still have to be more effective at AV then infantry to justify its cost or else theres no point in its exsistance. do they want it to be more effective against infantry then a single infantry unit? well this one is depends on the others. if they want it to be the king of AV with a side of infantry then it can actually be worse against infantry as a tradeoff, BUT if this is the case then infantry AV has to be alot weaker to make room for tank vs tank that would decide weather tanks live or die, infantry only being a support AV role in this case as a way to gain an edge against the other tank this would entail that it would take many infantry AV working together to achieve what tank AV could achieve alone this is what most tankers are talking about when they refer to them wanting it to take multiple infantry to kill them, they want tank vs tank combat to be where the vehicle domanance is decided. currently infantry reign supreme, it takes 1 slightly above average infantry to control the vehicle population down to 0 so infantry is the deciding factor meaning in this metagame a tanks worth is decided not by its AV poential but its infantry killing potential, because it needs to kill off the infantry before it kills him off, and it only takes 1 to get through your teams blockade to you to kill you, (or int he case of our current situation, it takes one guy in a high place abusing rendering glitches to control the entire map AV wise and remain invisable and therefore invulnerable to attack) the problem with placing AV domkinance in the hands of infantry is that it renders vehicles obsolete, and therefore renders infantry AV obsolete (in theory but not in practice since it doesnt matter if they are worth it or not people will still run tanks) the only way to have a healthy tanking metagame is to make TANKS the kings of anti vehicle combat and leave infantry AV in a support role as a means of tie breaking tank stalemates and creating interesting and unpredictable tank engagements. so yes, infantry AV needs to be nerfed, and in return you will see the return of massive tank vs tank combat as we fight each other instead of fighting you guys on the forums for change.

Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 429	Posted - 2013.08.24 08:37:00 - [11] - Quote https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1215397#post1215397 can i get both sides opinion on this?
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 430	Posted - 2013.08.24 08:42:00 - [12] - Quote ultimatly tankers want infantry AV to HELP us rathe rthen RELACE us
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 431	Posted - 2013.08.24 09:23:00 - [13] - Quote DJINN leukoplast wrote: Void Echo wrote: there far too lazy to do that you know Just like tankers are too lazy to get a squad together to protect their "UP" tanks? Mhmmm Mountain man voice the problem is we want to squad with infantry AV and take on tanks together, but you dont need us
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 432	Posted - 2013.08.24 09:33:00 - [14] - Quote https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1215512#post1215512 thread to discuss exactly what gameplay we want to see as far as AV/tank interaction and gameplay do not bring you flame wars here, discuss things like men and not people ignoring the real issues. the problem is how do we make tanks relevant without replacing infantry AV post in there what you want to see and how you would achieve it.
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 434	Posted - 2013.08.24 10:20:00 - [15] - Quote DJINN leukoplast wrote: I wonder what the ratio of tanks soloing infantry players vs infantry soloing tanks? Hmmm i wonder how many instances there are of infantry soloing infantry? assaults soloing heavys? scouts soloing anything? lavs soloing entire squads? thats not actually a helpful measurement. what do YOU want a tank to be able to do and what effect do you think that will have ont he game?
Chances Ghost Inf4m0us 435	Posted - 2013.08.24 10:55:00 - [16] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: Master Jaraiya wrote: I just want to throw this in. The whole rendering "issue" is complete nonsense! I have been instapopped by redline rail tanks that were a good 400 - 500 m out. They were in fact so far out that they did not turn my Forge Gun reticule's color indicating they were in range. No, before you talk smack, I was NOT in a tower sniping position. I was on the ground holding an objective, trying to push the tank off of our installations while getting sniped, dodging murder taxis, core locus grenades, mass driver spam, and everything else that is the bane of my existence as a heavy! So let me ask you, how did the rail tank hit me from so far away if, like many claim "forge gunners don't render at long distances" WAHHHHH BOOOO HOOOOOO. I agree 100% with the OP. There are too many tankers who just want invincibility while sitting in their nice cozy little death machine. My corp has several tankers who never-NEVER complain about tanks being UP. In fact these guys score 1st place on end of match every time they play with 2500+ WP without even trying very hard! I have seen them score 3500+ WP with like 50 - 60 kills. Just yesterday I was playing in a squad with one of our tankers, and the ENTIRE match he was LAUGHING at the AV guys with swarms because they could not take his tank down! Tankers need to seriously learn how to play their role and HTFU or go find another game that they can be more successful at. Perhaps something like this would better suit you crybabies! You will have renderd at that distance because of 1 of 3 things 1 his squad leafer was on the ball and put an attack order on you. 2 someone in his squad acctivly scanned you. 3 some in in his squad was using passive scanners and was ib range of you. Other than these 3 things I havent found any other way to see objects beyond 250m in my tank . The rendering hard stops at 250m when im in my rail. I have had enemy havs dissapear infromt of me because they rolld back 2 or 3 m . Get in a sica with a rail and try it yourself the rendering distance is the same for all pikots inside the tank. I will add you can see enimy instalations up to about 500m away but only see infantry within 250m you forgot "blind shot into whereyou think infantry MIGHT be and getting lucky" thats where all my >250m kills come from