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Jathniel
G I A N T
EoN.
779
   |
Posted - 2013.08.18 16:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
I was a defender of the forge gun as it currently works, but after using it... Something is off.
The weapon is too precise.
I took a small piece of clear tape, and balled it up. I made it small like an aim reticule dot, and I placed it right in the center of the forge gun box reticule.
This made using the forge gun SO incredibly easy.
CQC? No problem. Just line up the dot.
Mid-range? Line up the dot.
Long-range? Head the target by a fraction of the space, and line up the dot.
When it doubt, line up the dot on their feet.
This is as easy done as said.
THIS is a PROBLEM. Not a feature.
I was of the understanding that the space within the forge gun reticule indicated a margin of error; as in, 'the forge gun round can hit a specific point anywhere within this box.'
It DOES not, and that is a problem, especially for faster shooting Assault Forge Guns with larger blast radius.
If the forge gun is supposed to be the "same" as the sniper rifle, why doesn't it require as much effort and commitment to use?
Let the charge sniper rifle have PERFECT hip fire accuracy and see people cry, and it's not even a guaranteed kill like the forge.
The forge gun aiming mechanics need a margin of error, by sheer function. |
Lynn Beck
Granite Mercenary Division
118
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 17:07:00 -
[2] - Quote
Back in chromosome, we had a feature:
Standing still? Point right in the middle.
Movin to the side? Point the forge to the other part of the inside reticule, example: strafe right, aim left to compensate rigt spin.
Hittingjump or walking forwards? Aim down.
Even then i had a few problems forge sniping, but i found at that point crouching makes it insta-precise.
Please return chromosome aiming. |
Beeeees
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
121
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 17:28:00 -
[3] - Quote
They are long range anti material rifles. Ofcourse they are precise. Working as intended. |
FLAYLOCK Steve
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
378
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 17:37:00 -
[4] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:I was a defender of the forge gun as it currently works, but after using it... Something is off.
The weapon is too precise.
I took a small piece of clear tape, and balled it up. I made it small like an aim reticule dot, and I placed it right in the center of the forge gun box reticule.
This made using the forge gun SO incredibly easy.
CQC? No problem. Just line up the dot.
Mid-range? Line up the dot.
Long-range? Head the target by a fraction of the space, and line up the dot.
When it doubt, line up the dot on their feet.
This is as easy done as said.
THIS is a PROBLEM. Not a feature.
I was of the understanding that the space within the forge gun reticule indicated a margin of error; as in, 'the forge gun round can hit a specific point anywhere within this box.'
It DOES not, and that is a problem, especially for faster shooting Assault Forge Guns with larger blast radius.
If the forge gun is supposed to be the "same" as the sniper rifle, why doesn't it require as much effort and commitment to use?
Let the charge sniper rifle have PERFECT hip fire accuracy and see people cry, and it's not even a guaranteed kill like the forge.
The forge gun aiming mechanics need a margin of error, by sheer function.
Or in the very least, if you WANT the forge gun to shoot as perfectly as it does, then change the reticule to match that. lol
Nerf logic you used something to help you aim. Guess what the assault rifle is still better.
|
Jathniel
G I A N T
EoN.
779
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 18:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
Lynn Beck wrote:Back in chromosome, we had a feature:
Standing still? Point right in the middle.
Movin to the side? Point the forge to the other part of the inside reticule, example: strafe right, aim left to compensate rigt spin.
Hittingjump or walking forwards? Aim down.
Even then i had a few problems forge sniping, but i found at that point crouching makes it insta-precise.
Please return chromosome aiming.
If that's how it worked before, then good.
It's not something everyone was able to do. That's what made it such a great weapon in the right hands.
I haven't touched a forge gun in 6 months. Right until yesterday.
Had some trouble using it.
Figured, "well the complainers have no reason to complain, the people using the forge gun are just skilled players, like always."
Noticed I got a body shot on someone with it, and said, "wow. that's never happened with a forge gun before. O_O"
Then I did it, again and again. Figured something is up.
Had a theory, placed the tape in the center of the reticule. Just started popping peeps consistently.
I mean not even walking throws it off. No margin of error when it shoots? Something that's OHK should be a little harder to use than that... maybe like how it was in Chromosome.
Someone inexperienced with a forge gun, shouldn't just pick up a militia forge gun and suddenly start raping face.
lol if we don't have a problem with this, why not eliminate the sway from sniper rifles? that's a high alpha low dps weapon as well. |
Jathniel
G I A N T
EoN.
779
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 18:32:00 -
[6] - Quote
Beeeees wrote:They are long range anti material rifles. Ofcourse they are precise. Working as intended.
Then change the reticule. Or don't. Doesn't change the fact, that this weapon as it currently is, is going to become a problem unless it's firing pattern is reflected with the current reticule. Give it the margin of error shown in the reticule, or don't. If it shoots as it does now, the numbers of people using it are going to jump and it's going to start controlling matches more and more.
A forge gun can be placed ANYWHERE on the battlefield. Up high. In the midst of combat. It's still effective. |
Trey Hardin
REAPERS REPUBLIC
19
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 18:45:00 -
[7] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:I was a defender of the forge gun as it currently works, but after using it... Something is off.
The weapon is too precise.
I took a small piece of clear tape, and balled it up. I made it small like an aim reticule dot, and I placed it right in the center of the forge gun box reticule.
This made using the forge gun SO incredibly easy.
CQC? No problem. Just line up the dot.
Mid-range? Line up the dot.
Long-range? Head the target by a fraction of the space, and line up the dot.
When it doubt, line up the dot on their feet.
This is as easy done as said.
THIS is a PROBLEM. Not a feature.
I was of the understanding that the space within the forge gun reticule indicated a margin of error; as in, 'the forge gun round can hit a specific point anywhere within this box.'
It DOES not, and that is a problem, especially for faster shooting Assault Forge Guns with larger blast radius.
If the forge gun is supposed to be the "same" as the sniper rifle, why doesn't it require as much effort and commitment to use?
Let the charge sniper rifle have PERFECT hip fire accuracy and see people cry, and it's not even a guaranteed kill like the forge.
The forge gun aiming mechanics need a margin of error, by sheer function.
Or in the very least, if you WANT the forge gun to shoot as perfectly as it does, then change the reticule to match that. lol
Your logic unlike some FG haters is , wouldn't u know it, logical but I see two flaws.
Flaw 1: You had to make an aim assist to get your kills try it without the tape.
Flaw 2: The FG does not have the ability to look down sight making long range shots increadbly difficult without your Amin assist.
I do agree that the ridicule is misleading. |
Harpyja
DUST University
Ivy League
526
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 19:00:00 -
[8] - Quote
Last time I used a FG, which was a long time ago, I believe that there was some deviation to the projectile so you couldn't be as precise as it is now.
Also, not being able to aim with sights should suggest that it's not intended for long range in the first place... |
ladwar
Dead Six Initiative
Lokun Listamenn
1173
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 19:05:00 -
[9] - Quote
Trey Hardin wrote:Jathniel wrote:I was a defender of the forge gun as it currently works, but after using it... Something is off.
The weapon is too precise.
I took a small piece of clear tape, and balled it up. I made it small like an aim reticule dot, and I placed it right in the center of the forge gun box reticule.
This made using the forge gun SO incredibly easy.
CQC? No problem. Just line up the dot.
Mid-range? Line up the dot.
Long-range? Head the target by a fraction of the space, and line up the dot.
When it doubt, line up the dot on their feet.
This is as easy done as said.
THIS is a PROBLEM. Not a feature.
I was of the understanding that the space within the forge gun reticule indicated a margin of error; as in, 'the forge gun round can hit a specific point anywhere within this box.'
It DOES not, and that is a problem, especially for faster shooting Assault Forge Guns with larger blast radius.
If the forge gun is supposed to be the "same" as the sniper rifle, why doesn't it require as much effort and commitment to use?
Let the charge sniper rifle have PERFECT hip fire accuracy and see people cry, and it's not even a guaranteed kill like the forge.
The forge gun aiming mechanics need a margin of error, by sheer function.
Or in the very least, if you WANT the forge gun to shoot as perfectly as it does, then change the reticule to match that. lol Your logic unlike some FG haters is , wouldn't u know it, logical but I see two flaws. Flaw 1: You had to make an aim assist to get your kills try it without the tape. Flaw 2: The FG does not have the ability to look down sight making long range shots increadbly difficult without your Amin assist. I do agree that the ridicule is misleading.
lol... |
Jathniel
G I A N T
EoN.
779
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 19:30:00 -
[10] - Quote
Trey Hardin wrote:Jathniel wrote:I was a defender of the forge gun as it currently works, but after using it... Something is off.
The weapon is too precise.
I took a small piece of clear tape, and balled it up. I made it small like an aim reticule dot, and I placed it right in the center of the forge gun box reticule.
This made using the forge gun SO incredibly easy.
CQC? No problem. Just line up the dot.
Mid-range? Line up the dot.
Long-range? Head the target by a fraction of the space, and line up the dot.
When it doubt, line up the dot on their feet.
This is as easy done as said.
THIS is a PROBLEM. Not a feature.
I was of the understanding that the space within the forge gun reticule indicated a margin of error; as in, 'the forge gun round can hit a specific point anywhere within this box.'
It DOES not, and that is a problem, especially for faster shooting Assault Forge Guns with larger blast radius.
If the forge gun is supposed to be the "same" as the sniper rifle, why doesn't it require as much effort and commitment to use?
Let the charge sniper rifle have PERFECT hip fire accuracy and see people cry, and it's not even a guaranteed kill like the forge.
The forge gun aiming mechanics need a margin of error, by sheer function.
Or in the very least, if you WANT the forge gun to shoot as perfectly as it does, then change the reticule to match that. lol Your logic unlike some FG haters is , wouldn't u know it, logical but I see two flaws. Flaw 1: You had to make an aim assist to get your kills try it without the tape. Flaw 2: The FG does not have the ability to look down sight making long range shots increadbly difficult without your Amin assist. I do agree that the ridicule is misleading.
Well here's the thing. I don't hate the forge gun. People were complaining getting caught in it's splash back in Chromosome, and lol "I'm sorry, chump. You got caught in its splash."
This was perfectly fine, because the weapon in fact had deviation.
When engaging infantry at like 20-40m, you always used the splash, because direct hits were very difficult with the deviation, and this was perfectly reasonable. The splash does damage higher than a sniper rifle.
It's kinda greedy therefore to say you should be able to land 1k-2k+ damage on infantry via direct shot with flawless accuracy, when everyone else can only pull off that alpha or comparable dps with a headshot...
Forge Sniping is still mostly an acquired skill, Chromosome-era forge gunners were keenly aware of their deviation and splash, and that's what made them so potent and noteworthy. A piece of plastic on your screen didn't change a damn thing (I tried back then too.)
The logic is both flawed and valid because of the piece of tape. It's flawed in that, the weapon is less accurate in my inexperienced hands without the tape, but it's valid because there's no reason to assume that other people aren't doing the same.
Either or, we need a little deviation within the reticule, or this can potentially become a problem in the long run. Hope CCP keeps good track of its metrics. |
|
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Top Men.
1164
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 20:24:00 -
[11] - Quote
games should not be balanced around the potential of someone using an erasable marker or tape to designate a sweet spot.
People who do that should be mocked and derided for needing a crutch.
As to the accuracy, railguns are meant to be long-range, precision weapons. past 100m it's ridiculously difficult to hit a target that isn't larger than an LAV. that's why the reticle is so damn big. If the reticle is filled by a tank, you're pretty much guaranteed a hit barring hit detection glitching.
It does not have an ADS PRECISELY because with some practice it can be lethal, and I am personally of the opinion that the forge gun should never receive ADS because it would require a nerf 30 minutes after implementation.
If you want to survive a forge gun follow a simple rule.
Do not stand still in an open space. this is what forge gunners are specifically looking for, stationary targets in the open.
How do I know this? Because i'm a forgegunner. I'm just that guy who's not in a high place where you're looking. You will find me on the ground re-adjusting my aim to blap you while you scan rooftops and ridges. I know how to lead a scout running perpendicular at 100m and kill him.
It's not HARD if you have a good feel for the forge, but the precision most of us have comes from having used a forge gun as a primary weapon since chromosome or earlier. I've been forge gun primary for over a year because burning vehicles make me giggle. Blapping infantry is easy because you all run right at me, in a straight line and don't zig-zag to throw my aim off. |
KING CHECKMATE
Bragian Order
Amarr Empire
575
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 22:04:00 -
[12] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:I was a defender of the forge gun as it currently works, but after using it... Something is off.
The weapon is too precise.
I took a small piece of clear tape, and balled it up. I made it small like an aim reticule dot, and I placed it right in the center of the forge gun box reticule.
This made using the forge gun SO incredibly easy.
CQC? No problem. Just line up the dot.
Mid-range? Line up the dot.
Long-range? Head the target by a fraction of the space, and line up the dot.
When it doubt, line up the dot on their feet.
This is as easy done as said.
THIS is a PROBLEM. Not a feature.
I was of the understanding that the space within the forge gun reticule indicated a margin of error; as in, 'the forge gun round can hit a specific point anywhere within this box.'
It DOES not, and that is a problem, especially for faster shooting Assault Forge Guns with larger blast radius.
If the forge gun is supposed to be the "same" as the sniper rifle, why doesn't it require as much effort and commitment to use?
Let the charge sniper rifle have PERFECT hip fire accuracy and see people cry, and it's not even a guaranteed kill like the forge.
The forge gun aiming mechanics need a margin of error, by sheer function.
Or in the very least, if you WANT the forge gun to shoot as perfectly as it does, then change the reticule to match that. lol
SO what if its easy to aim. ITS NOT EASY to aim when you have 3+ reds shooting at you in the face. Its a situation dependant weapon.
I DONT EVEN USE Forge guns anymore since im playing as a looser commando and im STILL agains Nerfing it.
People are crying way too much and forget.
-YOU HAVE TO BE HEAVY TO USE IT
-Slow Rof
-Slow Reload
-Useless in CQ situations
Plus the only weapon that does abuse the Splash damage is the ASsault FG. Point taken.
But... SO?
I mean , you can drop a Heavy with 10 seconds of steady AR fire!
dont want to get forge gunned? dont let that fatty get to a roof/mountain. Thats all. |
CLONE117
Planetary Response Organization
Test Friends Please Ignore
148
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 22:31:00 -
[13] - Quote
theres no problem with the std or mlt varients that i can see.. |
CLONE117
Planetary Response Organization
Test Friends Please Ignore
148
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 22:35:00 -
[14] - Quote
i did pwnage to kill ppl in cqc with a mlt forge once though..went on an epic 10kill kill spree with it in cqc!
and thats because the enemy teams were stupid idiots that where chasing me all over that and i has getting lots of help from my fellow team members... killed several enemy heavies with hmgs and a sniper with it!...
also shot down a red derpship..it landed on a another enemy team member... it was epic...
but not op in any way that i can tell..im just very..very lucky...
so no reason to nerf it into ground..
i dont care about those proto and adv varients u can nerf those all u want just leave std and mlt alone...
they r balanced.. |
Thurak1
Psygod9
44
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 22:52:00 -
[15] - Quote
Here is the thing the forge gun is a weapon on a drop suit that limits mobility. There has to be SOME up side to this gigantic disadvantage. The shields and armor dont come close to making up for it. So thankfully we at least have a anti materials weapon that is semi effective against infantry and very effective against vehicles.
As others mentioned you are using a aim assist the reticle itself does not give such precise shooting. Snipers get a very nice zoomed scope to line up a shot and a charged sniper can 2 shot any heavy. You can probably 2 shot a heavy before the heavy can even turn around.
Someone with a AR can also take out a heavy at medium range even with an assault forge gun. Granted if the forge hits them they are toast but the heavy only gets 1 chance to do that unless the person with a AR REALLY cant aim to save their life.
Forge guns are by no means OP our opponents just cry a lot.
Also lets not forget the other limitation. Forge guns carry very little ammo and heavys cant carry nanohives. A sniper can get into a good spot drop a hive and stay there the entire game if they are good.
While we are on the subject lets make it so that headshots dont count unless shields are down :) that way i can survive maybe 3 sniper rounds :) After all my shields dont have a head they should provide full protection no matter what part of my body they cover right :)?
|
Arcturis Vanguard
Pure Innocence.
EoN.
69
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 23:52:00 -
[16] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:I was a defender of the forge gun as it currently works, but after using it... Something is off.
The weapon is too precise.
I took a small piece of clear tape, and balled it up. I made it small like an aim reticule dot, and I placed it right in the center of the forge gun box reticule.
This made using the forge gun SO incredibly easy.
CQC? No problem. Just line up the dot.
Mid-range? Line up the dot.
Long-range? Head the target by a fraction of the space, and line up the dot.
When it doubt, line up the dot on their feet.
This is as easy done as said.
THIS is a PROBLEM. Not a feature.
I was of the understanding that the space within the forge gun reticule indicated a margin of error; as in, 'the forge gun round can hit a specific point anywhere within this box.'
It DOES not, and that is a problem, especially for faster shooting Assault Forge Guns with larger blast radius.
If the forge gun is supposed to be the "same" as the sniper rifle, why doesn't it require as much effort and commitment to use?
Let the charge sniper rifle have PERFECT hip fire accuracy and see people cry, and it's not even a guaranteed kill like the forge.
The forge gun aiming mechanics need a margin of error, by sheer function.
Or in the very least, if you WANT the forge gun to shoot as perfectly as it does, then change the reticule to match that. lol
+1 for you on this post and for creativity.
Now after reading this post I jumped on dust to try this out. Now I have a few observations I'd like to post.
I only played one quick game and where I posted up wasn't ideal for a thorough test but here is what I found. Putting a reticule in the center adds a focal point that helps add aiming. This much cannot be disputed.
Now as far as the flawless boast, I will need to run more maps in more situations. I had a moment where it seemed that my dot was on the body and the shot blasted past the targets upper right shoulder, missing the target and received minor splash. Now this could be the fact that I did not measure the exact center or that there might be some slight deviation within the short, just not as dramatic as your wanting to see. I will post more on this after more tests and feedback from other heavies I know.
|
Garth Mandra
The Southern Legion
73
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 00:37:00 -
[17] - Quote
I think that the place where the forge gun projectile is going to go should bounce around with the reticule.
The reticule should be a true representation of where the shot is going. If there is random dispersion then the reticule should be larger.
And you DO need to balance the game around "exploits" such as a bit of tape on your screen. |
KEROSIINI-TERO
Seraphim Initiative..
669
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 00:41:00 -
[18] - Quote
Beeeees wrote:They are long range anti material rifles. Ofcourse they are precise. Working as intended.
Nope, they are supposed to have wild shake while charged up. Reason being 'hand held use of usually mounted weapon'.
The shake is only cosmetic which is wrong, pin-point accuracy it creates is very very wrong.
IF the shake is implemented, it balances the forge nicely:
AI sniping can be done on occasion but not consistently.
Dropships gain new life as their big silhouette won't be 2-shot without exception. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
653
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 00:45:00 -
[19] - Quote
there is absolutely nothing wrong r OP about the forgun it is totally fine. it does exactly what it needs to do, and could use a small range buff, but even without that it is perfectly fine.
the AR on the other hand out ranges everyother light weapon save the sniper. it must be nerfed. |
Thurak1
Psygod9
46
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 00:56:00 -
[20] - Quote
KEROSIINI-TERO wrote:Beeeees wrote:They are long range anti material rifles. Ofcourse they are precise. Working as intended. Nope, they are supposed to have wild shake while charged up. Reason being 'hand held use of usually mounted weapon'. The shake is only cosmetic which is wrong, pin-point accuracy it creates is very very wrong. IF the shake is implemented, it balances the forge nicely: AI sniping can be done on occasion but not consistently. Dropships gain new life as their big silhouette won't be 2-shot without exception.
Then why on earth am i walking around in this very slow moving suit that is created specifically for the only 2 weapons in the game that require this suit if its going to be hard for the suit to use these weapons?
Such a nerf would make the forge gun about as useful as a HMG which is now nearly useless.
It is a energy projectile. I cant remember the last time i saw anything no matter how large the battery was shake while charging up. Imagine how funny that would be with electric cars.
Forge guns already get the following disadvantages.
1: poor aiming sights (not going to go into someone making a custom sight on their screen )
2: they all have a relatively slow ROF at what 1.5 on the best one
3: movement. You have to be a heavy so it applies.
4: low ammo capacity.
For a forge gunner to be effective they have to be in the right spot at the right time and be able to place the shot. Its not OP
Now on top of that you want to make it even more difficult for a forge gunner to hit a target? Right lets make AR weapons randomly jam . Lets have the AR's just fail every now and then for no given reason. Lets have them also occasionally have ammo issues where the round doesnt clear the barrel. |
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Canaan Knute
Conspiratus Immortalis
Covert Intervention
107
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 01:32:00 -
[21] - Quote
Garth Mandra wrote:And you DO need to balance the game around "exploits" such as a bit of tape on your screen. No, you don't. It would affect players who don't use such exploits. |
Bojo The Mighty
Zanzibar Concept
1508
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 01:38:00 -
[22] - Quote
Yeah I can actually weigh in here
Recently I overhauled my fittings so I had more medium and heavy frame militias. I used my Forge Gun Heavy (both MLT) and that weapon is pretty easy to use. I popped the guy strafing, I popped the stupid shooting a pea shooter, I even popped the guy on a ledge above me with no misses or hesitation.
I can say, that in my opinion it is very easy to shoot.
But I can't vouch for any nerf just yet.
PS: I didn't bother with any tape |
jingle wingle
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
10
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 02:32:00 -
[23] - Quote
The solution is simple: NERF DUCT TAPE! |
Nova Knife
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
1750
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 03:12:00 -
[24] - Quote
I've been saying this for months, and people kept coming back with "Nova, you're crazy! It's not that easy to use, like you say it is! It's okay for it to be so strong because it's really hard to use and the heavy is at such a huge disadvantage at all the ranges while using it!" NOPE.JPG
Honestly, the forge gun is way too powerful against infantry in the hands of anyone who has any skill in aiming. It's not hard to use. Anyone who has good aiming skills can easily track & predict the motion of all but the best of strafers with incredible ease, and blap them with relative impunity from almost any range. It only becomes a problem once they get up inside your turn radius... Which isn't going to be a problem in 1.4 with the turn speed caps gone. (And even then... You can use a sidearm for that)
I don't have a problem with the balancing mentality that a lower ease of use barrier can justify a certain amount of power... But the forge gun has way too much power against infantry in my opinion. It's an AV weapon, and while there have always been those we call a 'rocket ho' who spams OHK anti-vehicle weapons to get easy kills in shooters... The forge gun does not deserve to have this power. Not with how much range it has, and how precise it is.
OHK weapons are pretty lame in any regard... and the forge gun just doesn't have the drawbacks needed to justify how awesome they are.
Jath's method of adding duct-tape only highlights the problem. Most people probably don't need it to pull off the same effect. |
CLONE117
Planetary Response Organization
Test Friends Please Ignore
151
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 03:29:00 -
[25] - Quote
well it has a slow rof unless ur using the assault forge which i have yet to obtain...
i do find it pretty difficult to use at the longer ranges but im pretty sure the higher tiered varieants r the ones that should be getting the nerfs..maybe a drawback of longer charge up time...to counter act that drasticly increased damage per level...
it sucks with cqc so if u r being chased by some1 close to ur area...
ull have to be very lucky in order to kill..its easy to kill with that gun if no1s firing back..come to think of it..its like that for all guns...
although if u get a forge nest on a tower over looking some objectives....uve pretty much crippled the enemy team as well as setting up an av unit in a great position... |
Lynn Beck
Granite Mercenary Division
120
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 05:40:00 -
[26] - Quote
Nova Knife wrote:I've been saying this for months, and people kept coming back with "Nova, you're crazy! It's not that easy to use, like you say it is! It's okay for it to be so strong because it's really hard to use and the heavy is at such a huge disadvantage at all the ranges while using it!" NOPE.JPG
Honestly, the forge gun is way too powerful against infantry in the hands of anyone who has any skill in aiming. It's not hard to use. Anyone who has good aiming skills can easily track & predict the motion of all but the best of strafers with incredible ease, and blap them with relative impunity from almost any range. It only becomes a problem once they get up inside your turn radius... Which isn't going to be a problem in 1.4 with the turn speed caps gone. (And even then... You can use a sidearm for that)
I don't have a problem with the balancing mentality that a lower ease of use barrier can justify a certain amount of power... But the forge gun has way too much power against infantry in my opinion. It's an AV weapon, and while there have always been those we call a 'rocket ho' who spams OHK anti-vehicle weapons to get easy kills in shooters... The forge gun does not deserve to have this power. Not with how much range it has, and how precise it is.
OHK weapons are pretty lame in any regard... and the forge gun just doesn't have the drawbacks needed to justify how awesome they are.
Jath's method of adding duct-tape only highlights the problem. Most people probably don't need it to pull off the same effect.
I read. Until the 2nd paragraph. Then i read 'it's an av weapon' wrong cpm. Anti. MATERIAL. Meaning!:
Installations, vehicles, and dropsuits. If they're stupid enough, we've added a blue trail flying through the air. About the only thing i would change is more range, in exchange for a hipfire accuracy rating. It has to be minute though, like 2 dropsuit widths at a range of 200 meters. But even then, we need to allow gimmicks to negate, as to allow ranged av. So crouching/notmoving should alleviate the problem. Charge time should really not drop below 3s, per se the proto assault variant. Blast radius needs to be homogenized among tiers, and splash damage maybe dropped by 40-50 points. But a direct hit should always drop ANY dropsuit. Because it's a handheld railgun shooting at mach 3. No brick wall can survive that, let alone a human body. Even if that body is cybernetic, the impact shock from a railgun will shatter all of the internal organs within your body, hemmotidge the brain, and sever your intestines/spinal cord. |
Paran Tadec
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1335
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 05:47:00 -
[27] - Quote
As I said back during the E3 build, FG should be a shortish range high dmg assualt version for tank/vehicle killing, long range low dmg version for "sniping". The current FG's make it too easy to rack up kills by sitting on a high point. |
Lynn Beck
Granite Mercenary Division
120
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 06:08:00 -
[28] - Quote
So then you're saying two completely different forges? One that's an av gersion of ar and another thats a heavy sniper rifle? |
Thurak1
Psygod9
48
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 06:29:00 -
[29] - Quote
Nova Knife wrote:I've been saying this for months, and people kept coming back with "Nova, you're crazy! It's not that easy to use, like you say it is! It's okay for it to be so strong because it's really hard to use and the heavy is at such a huge disadvantage at all the ranges while using it!" NOPE.JPG
Honestly, the forge gun is way too powerful against infantry in the hands of anyone who has any skill in aiming. It's not hard to use. Anyone who has good aiming skills can easily track & predict the motion of all but the best of strafers with incredible ease, and blap them with relative impunity from almost any range. It only becomes a problem once they get up inside your turn radius... Which isn't going to be a problem in 1.4 with the turn speed caps gone. (And even then... You can use a sidearm for that)
I don't have a problem with the balancing mentality that a lower ease of use barrier can justify a certain amount of power... But the forge gun has way too much power against infantry in my opinion. It's an AV weapon, and while there have always been those we call a 'rocket ho' who spams OHK anti-vehicle weapons to get easy kills in shooters... The forge gun does not deserve to have this power. Not with how much range it has, and how precise it is.
OHK weapons are pretty lame in any regard... and the forge gun just doesn't have the drawbacks needed to justify how awesome they are.
Jath's method of adding duct-tape only highlights the problem. Most people probably don't need it to pull off the same effect.
If you count charge up time a AR can kill faster than a forge gun. Whats your response to that?
Also if OHK weapons are so lame why are snipers in the game? For most suits they are OHK they also have better scopes lower profile signatures better ammo capacity better run speed / menuverability on the BF and can carry a nanohive. |
Thurak1
Psygod9
48
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 06:31:00 -
[30] - Quote
Paran Tadec wrote:As I said back during the E3 build, FG should be a shortish range high dmg assualt version for tank/vehicle killing, long range low dmg version for "sniping". The current FG's make it too easy to rack up kills by sitting on a high point.
if turned into short range the speed of the heavy would be a huge limiting factor. I would have to somehow corner a tank into a CQC situation to take one out otherwise they could easily outrun me and my weapons range. |
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Paran Tadec
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1335
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 12:17:00 -
[31] - Quote
The sniper rifles are harder to use than the forge still, doing far less damage . All you gotta do with the forge to get kills is wait for the reticule to turn red. Boom poof instawin. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmCnFVIFx3A
As far as sniping with the forge across the map, its too easy atm. I made a new character, got it out of academy and then went 20-1. Thats a problem. Limiting the effective rage will still allow it to "shotgun" tanks and vehicles, but not destroy infantry with impunity from across the map. |
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