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Cal logi CPU nerf was too much

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Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL 89	Posted - 2013.08.15 16:21:00 - [1] - Quote Just use a different suit to lay down your uplinks and take your proto uplink off of your combat proto suit. Proto uplinks take up way too much CPU unless you are using Allotek Stables. Gotta love how people say you should downgrade the weapons/grenades/whatever on the Cal Logi to deal with the nerf when all the other logi classes can use the same weapons/grenades and have equitable or better tank.
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL 89	Posted - 2013.08.15 17:34:00 - [2] - Quote Assuming all skills are Level 5, and after the plate buff: Amarr Logi - Duvolle, Core Flaylock, Core Locus Grenade, 3x Complex Shield Extenders, 3x Basic Armor Plates, Complex Armor Repairer, Six Kin Triage Repair Tool, Wiyrkomi Nanite Injector, Ishukone Gauged Nanohives. 873 EHP, 368 Shield 505 Armor, 12.81 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.33 movement 6.37 sprint. Uses 511/512 CPU and 94/94 PG. Minmatar Logi - Duvolle, Core Locus Grenade, 4x Complex Shield Extenders, 2x Basic Armor Plates, Enhanced Armor Repairer, Militia CPU Upgrade, Ishukone Gauged Nanohive, Wiyrkomi Nanite Injector, Six Kin Triage Repair Tool, Remote Explosive. 777 EHP, 403 Shield 374 Armor, 8.75 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.81 movement 7.08 sprint. Uses 544/563 CPU, 102/102 PG. Note that one slot is used for CPU fitting but it is barely needed - the militia version works fine. PG was the main limiting factor on this build. Caldari Logi (shield tanked for delay/regen) - Duvolle, Core Locus Grenade, 4x Complex Shield Extenders, 1x Complex Shield Energizer, 2x Complex Shield REgulators, Enhanced CPU Upgrade, Basic CPU Upgrade, Six Kin Triage Repair Tool, Wiyrkomi Nanite Injector, Ishukone Gauged Nanohive. 614 EHP, 502 Shield 112 Armor, 5 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.7 movement 6.91 sprint. Uses 628/654 CPU and 95/102 PG. Note that two slots are used for CPU modules; one Complex CPU doesn't cut it so I downgraded to basic/enhanced, but two are needed. Caldari Logi (dual tanked for max buffer) - Duvolle, Core Locus Grenade, 5x Complex Shield Extenders, 2x Enhanced Armor Plates, Complex PG Upgrade, Complex CPU Upgrade, Six Kin Triage Repair Tool, Wiyrkomi Nanite Injector, Ishukone Gauged Nanohive. 942 EHP, 588 Shield 354 Armor, 5 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.44 movement 6.53 sprint. Uses 580/620 CPU and 112/116 PG. Both CPU and PG upgrades are required to fit this, and with long shield delays and poor regen rates for both armor and shield, it's not an ideal dual tank (42.4 sec for full shield regen, 70.8 sec for full armor regen). This can fit a Wiyrkomi Triage Hive but not an Allotek, therefore will have to rely on someone else for ammo if the triage hive is used. Gallente Logi - Duvolle, Core Locus Grenade, 3x Complex Shield Extenders, 4x Basic Armor Plates, Complex Armor Repairer, Six Kin Triage Repair Tool, Wiyrkomi Nanite Injector, Ishukone Gauged Nanohive, Wiyrkomi Triage Nanohive. 929 EHP, 330 Shield 599 Armor, 11.25 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.45 movement 6.54 sprint. uses 508/512 CPU and 97/102 PG with no slots wasted for fitting. Full shield regen in 36 seconds and full armor regen in 53.3 seconds (faster with hive). So yes, it is possible to fit Proto weapons/grenades and maintain proto equipment, but as you can see, the Caldari needs the most slots devoted to fitting in order to do so.
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL 89	Posted - 2013.08.15 19:07:00 - [3] - Quote They are all dual tanks. Caldari is the worst when it is dual tanked because although it can reach a high EHP, it's regenerative qualities suck. Let me summarize for you: Amarr - 873 EHP, 368 Shield 505 Armor, 12.81 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.33 movement 6.37 sprint, 34.65 sec shield regen after flux, 39.42 sec armor regen. Passive shield regen of 2.83 HP/s (under fire). Minmatar - 777 EHP, 403 Shield 374 Armor, 8.75 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.81 movement 7.08 sprint, 34.15 sec shield regen after flux, 42.74 sec armor regen. Passive shield regen of 3.33 HP/s (under fire). Caldari Dual Tanked - 942 EHP, 588 Shield 354 Armor, 5 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.44 movement 6.53 sprint, 42.4 sec shield regen after flux, 70.8 sec armor regen. Passive shield regen of 4 HP/s (under fire). Gallente - 929 EHP, 330 Shield 599 Armor, 11.25 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.45 movement 6.54 sprint, 36 sec shield regen after flux, 53.24 sec armor regen with Triage option. Passive shield regen on 2.5 HP/s (under fire). As you can see, the dual tank is not ideal on the Caldari because trying to tank it this way renders your shield tanking regen ineffective while replacing it with armor buffer only (also hard to regenerate without additional reppers). Since two low slots are taken up by fitting modules, you could only fit a single plate and repper if you wanted to increase armor regen, further decreasing tank. I tried to make a dual tanked Caldari fitting that downgraded to a BDR-8 to use energizers/reppers/regulators/plates and it was kind of interesting: Caldari Logi Regen Tank: Duvolle, Core Locus Grenade, 4x Complex Shield Extenders, Enhanced Shield Energizer, Complex Shield Regulator, Enhanced Armor Plates, Enhanced Armor Repairer, Complex CPU Upgrade, BDR-8 Triage Repair Tool, Wiyrkomi Nanite Injector, Ishukone Gauged Nanohive. Uses 611/620 CPU and 99/102 PG. 739 EHP, 506 Shield 233 Armor, 8.75 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.56 movement 6.7 sprint, 25.75 sec shield regen after flux, 26.63 sec armor regen. Passive regen of 9.25 HP/sec under fire. Kind of interesting but i'm not sure if the armor buffer will be effective enough or if you'll die as soon as your shields are gone as most shield tanked Cal Logis do. By the way, here are the regen stats of the purely shield tanked Cal Logi: 614 EHP, 502 Shield 112 Armor, 5 HP/s Armor Repair, 4.7 movement 6.91 sprint, 21.56 sec shield regen after flux, 22.4 sec armor regen. Passive shield regen of 14.7 HP/sec (under fire).
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL 89	Posted - 2013.08.15 19:12:00 - [4] - Quote Scrappy Bernard wrote: Max CPU any of the logi's can get without cpu enhancer is 502..this makes your fitting on the gallente unfeasible. I am going by the Dust Fitting Tool, so I'm not sure how it's calculated but it has been spot on for me in the past. Are you sure your Core Upgrades are at Lvl 5? According to said tool, you would be at 502 CPU if you had Electronics 5 but only Core Upgrades 3.
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL 92	Posted - 2013.08.16 12:38:00 - [5] - Quote As pure shield tanks go, a shield tanked proto Cal Assault is better than a shield tanked proto Cal Logi (in an assault role). Due to the role bonus, the Cal Assault doesn't need to equip a shield energizer, because he starts off at 31.25 HP/s shield regen. A Cal Logi must use a shield energizer or regulator to beef up their standard shield regen of 20 HP/s, and even with a complex energizer, the regen rate is at max 33.8 HP/s, only 2.55 HP/s more than the assault (at the cost of 96 CPU). With 4x complex shield extenders, your total shield HP (assuming all skills at Lvl 5) is 553 HP as a Cal Assault, compared to 588 HP as a 5x extended Cal Logi. That's only 35 HP less than the Cal Logi, but with 56% more effective shield regen than the 5x extended Cal Logi. If the Cal Logi is using 4x extenders and the energizer, then the Cal Logi will have only 502 HP in shields (51 HP less than the assault) but with the slightly better shield recharge rate noted above. If both suits are equipping 2 complex shield regulators, then the Cal Logi will have a slightly shorter delay due to their racial bonus, but we're talking a half second or so. To use 4x complex extenders and a complex regulator or 5x complex extenders together with a proto weapon, proto grenades, and an advanced nanohive, the Cal Logi is obligated to use a CPU extender, leaving it 3 low slots. The Cal Assault must also use a CPU extender, leaving it two low slots (taken by regulators in my example). A Cal Logi could use the remaining low slot for a speed or stamina boost, but its base movement speed would still be slower than an assault. Or it could use it for plates, but even with a complex plate, the max armor HP would be 261 HP, which is 111 HP more than the assault but with .5-.7 m/s slower speeds. So in summary, a Cal Assault built for HP/regen/regulation has more HP, nearly equivalent regen, and nearly equivalent shield delays than its Cal Logi counterpart but with faster movement speeds, more stamina without modules, and the use of a sidearm.
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL 95	Posted - 2013.08.16 14:11:00 - [6] - Quote A number of suits can use all proto if their low slots use proto CPU/PG extenders. Shield tanks benefit more from this because their tank consumes high slots. For example, a Minmatar Assault with all skills Lvl 5 can use a Duvolle, Ishukone Assault SMG, Core Locus Grenades, Ishukone Gauged Nanohives, 4x Complex Extenders, 1x Complex Energizer, 1x Complex Shield Regulator, and 1x Complex CPU upgrade. Usage is 566/567 CPU and 82/84 PG. Total of 636 EHP (467 Shield 169 armor), 38.02 HP/s shield recharge rate, 4.35/7.25 shield delays and 5.3 m/s movement 7.39 m/s sprint.
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL 96	Posted - 2013.08.16 15:10:00 - [7] - Quote If I have the money and skills to run a proto weapon and proto grenades on my proto Cal Logi and still have the equipment I want on it, why shouldn't I? Because of some higher moral principle that logis shouldn't use proto weapons?
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL 104	Posted - 2013.08.17 09:20:00 - [8] - Quote I thought I debunked the claim that you couldn't run proto weapons and proto equipment after the nerf with the fits I posted. It just takes more in fitting to do so compared to all other logi classes, after the CPU nerf. As long as you aren't running high CPU items like proto drop uplinks, fitting shouldn't be much of an issue. What is lame is that due to the nerf, almost every logi that wants to run equipment is forced to use a CPU upgrade, and maybe a PG upgrade as well. If you are only running nanohives as a "logissault" then you might not have to sacrifice a slot for fitting modules.
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL 104	Posted - 2013.08.17 10:50:00 - [9] - Quote Isn't the issue that the CPU nerf is too much and was unnecessary? I believe that it was, and ultimately had a more detrimental effect on real logis instead of logissaults. What I don't understand is why other people insist that the Cal Logi is now in line with all the other logis, despite having 40 CPU less than the others at Proto level. And the real kicker is, the module that requires the most CPU out of any piece of equipment/module is the Complex Shield Energizer (96 CPU), something that the Cal Logi will benefit more from using than any other suit.

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