You do realize that for the three AV weapons, there are numerous Anti Personnel weapons? That Grenades are a threat to everyone, especially someone in Standard level attire? That your 'slow' is a scout's fast? That if we made cost of fitting a viable whine, we'd need to make the Logi's head and shoulders above everyone in everything and like it?

Tanks need to give up something to get something, and that means a tangible inmatch asset, not prefight fitting costs. You cannot have a SINGLE player suddenly gain immense power with no losses beyond 'can't cap no more'. No other vehicle can be manned effectively with one single player, and as such are balanced against being a one man force multiplier. A LAV or Dropship both need players to ferry around the map or they aren't doing their job, and both need other players aside from the pilot to operate their weapons systems, and you don't see LAV players cry for turret control. Tanks already HAVE something, they can be piloted and gunned from the same seat. THAT is your bonus. Don't like it? Ask to trade it in for something else and stop whining for more.

Right now I only AV when its convenient. (Lai Dai AVs instead of infantry nades). LAVs trying to run me over or a tank pinning me down in a complex.

If tanks are buffed and AV is nerfed I'll have to go dedicated AV or maybe start dumping points into tanks for anti-tank combat. I really don't want to join the ranks of the tanker class, but without a corp with dedicated AV squads, like many have suggested should be necessary, I'll have to find some way to stop the tanks. Otherwise I feel I can't be effective at anti infantry since, ARs from one side and tank shells from another is a lose lose situation.

In the end, I'll do what I always do when something is kicking my ass. Adapt...or die trying.

I wouldn't mind a tank buff or a price of module decrease if it would allow the AV to stay near the same level. Tankers seem to fear the Lai Dais but I can never kill anything with 3 nades or less other than a mlt fit tank or a basic LAV. I'm really suprised AV nades that need to be tossed in close proximity to a tank seem to be more of an issue than forge guns with ******** range and damage and swarms.

That was my thinking. I used to run the M1s, and plenty of times I wish I had them. For me, being able to defend myself against LAVs was more valuable though.

I wouldn't even mind having to be soley and AV player, except that you're so handicapped against infantry then what's it matter if they kill you or a tank kills you. Much like dual tanking, i.e. shields and armor, you lose something when you try to do both. You are master of neither.

How does it feel when your tank get killed by a Freedom Mass Driver?

I can see tanks getting a buff only if they require a full crew to operate. At least driver and main gunner should be separate.

I understand not wanting to depend on others. I'm horrible at the social aspect and tend to run lone wolf myself. But, there needs to be some form of drawback other than ISK because at some point ISK will be irrelevant.

An LAV (once their bumpers are fixed) require a driver and a gunner. An Assault Dropship is a decent balance because the main gun is small. People jump into AV to take out tanks because they know that one person in a tank can go 40/0 unless they are stopped. Maybe give the tank driver a small gun?

How would you balance tanks so they aren't one man killing machines but also have increased survivability?

I'll watch the matches more closely to see how the tankers are doing. Running solo I tend to get placed with the side against the good teams and we get stomped. Maybe I'm mistaking the guys at the top for the tankers and they are not. But, I've been in a fair number of matches lately where there are two blaster tanks running the field together and just dominating. My advanced swarm does little to scare them off.

I do feel for you guys and your expensive gear. Hopefully Wolfman and Remnant have a plan for 1.5 to fix things.

Until Pilot Dropsuits come out, that is a useless and pointless argument. I haven't got any points in destroyers, so my Battlecruisers should be more powerful. Is that really your argument? Your Dropsuit is completely unrelated to your vehicle piloting ability. If you decided to not get any footsoldier skills, or pilot with a shitfit suit, it is your own fault for overspecializing. The Titan pilots all know how to fly a decent frigate. And also, they don't bring their Titan into every little fight

lol, really... you're complaining about not being able to fight outside of the tank? Well how the hell do you think AVers feel when we have to gimp ourselves against other infantry just to get a shot at taking out annoying vehicles terrorizing the team?

The only AV class that is somewhat effective against infantry while still having a lot of AV brute-force, is the heavy with a forge.

Otherwise:

Medium suit that has swarms for main, a sidearm, and AV nades = Going to get owned most of the time if they run across other infantry players. Or even worse, a logi with no sidearm decides to use swarms because nobody else on the team is doing AV. At that point their ONLY defense is locus nades, which means they have to dump off some AV so they arent completely helpless against infantry.


This, IMO, is one of the biggest annoyances with vehicles in general. I play this game to shoot infantry, it is a FPS after all. And I find it extremely annoying that I have to switch to AV gear just because some tanker, dropship, or LLAV decides to terrorize my team. Add insult to injury when those vehicle players have decent ground-pounders, making the AVers life a nightmare while the vehicles roam free and effortlessly slaughter ground troops who are not equipped with any decent AV.

This also means that each and every infantry player has to cross-train and waste SP into AV, otherwise they just have to take all the vehicle abuse, which is extremely frustrating.

It may be a fact that you sacrificed your ability to play a dropsuit, but that is YOU and only YOU. By choosing to spend every point on gear you cannot afford to replace or gear that no cautious player would bring into every match you have indeed hobbled yourself into using standard and militia level dropsuit modules. But the problem with that logic is this: Does a player have to exclusively skill into either Vehicles or Dropsuit skills? When I went into Infantry Electronics, did Vehicle Electronics suddenly become inaccessible? No. You, by choosing to spend your points inefficiently, have doomed yourself to slogging through cheapo suits whenever you cannot bring an HAV onto the field, either by limited ISK or a judgement call. This is not, however, the fault of the other players or the DEVs; the blame rests squarely on you. So what was your point again? That my Swarm launcher skills crosstrain well for my Logistics role? Maybe, but not one of those skillpoints helps me drive a tank or pilot a dropship.

And I am ok with that.

So why aren't you?

I am going to do a commentary and post a video of your typical tanker at this current juncture in dust 514... the Rambo mentality that some have, how EASY it is to destroy these tanks, and for good reason which I will show and PROVE.

Great thing about doing Youtube videos.... the devs may not acknowledge that you are alive... but they do watch the videos when it comes to their game... lord knows if they had to RELY on the forums only...we would all be screwed.

man.. no offense, but I could do a TANK montage of me just blowing up Rambo tank drivers that would be out of this world... even some of the posters on here.

I agree that there is a RIGHT and a WRONG way to drive a tank and being prepared, such as having a squad with you that takes out av.

The main problem I see is greediness, players wanting to get HIGH K/D like in chromo every round and it is not working.

Manus Peak...Chromo... easy to see tankers go 30-50/0 ratio..... far and few between now unless they roll as a squad.

You know why AV hasn't been "nerfed" yet?

Because CCP KNOWS that there will be a major disadvantage on the battlefield and it will turn into "world of tanks" once more, and player base will drop.

But I will msg you, I enjoy tankers on my team, I try to take care of them and destroy their av problems if I can