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Jaqen Morghalis
Abandoned Privilege
General Tso's Alliance
207
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Posted - 2013.07.24 10:20:00 -
[1] - Quote
Gauder Berwyck wrote:Malkai Inos wrote:Letting go of the Duvolle would pretty much equalize the CPU reduction and allow you to keep most of the rest as it is. Without damage mods you loose a few meters of range and about 6% in damage. Not exactly worth it if you're not going to focus on doing maximum damage.
If you want to prioritize dmg and tank over logistics you can still do that. The changes just made it so that you can't get away with both combat and logistics capabilities at the same time.
A focused logistics would ask "what do i have to change if i want my equipment stay as strong as possible"
You are asking yourself "what do i have to change if i want my tank/gank stay as strong as possible"
Before the changes everyone was like "proto ALL THE THINGS" and that was a big part of the issue. They should have removed a high slot from the CaLogi suit, and balanced CPU/PG because of that. It would have forced people to think about being a logistics even more, since shield AND damage tanking wouldn't be that viable at the same time anymore. Right now you can still shield and damage tank quite well. The ability to be a killer hasn't been dealt with. So what am I left with. Supporting the team or killing and staying alive? EVERY logistics player should ALWAYS go for killing and staying alive first. If you wanna argue this matter, feel free, I'm up for it. The simple answer is "you can't help anyone if you're dead." So yeah, I'm gonna keep my tanking and all that and sacrifice proto logistics equipment to be able to still fit my things. Because after all, I wouldn't be a good logi if I am bleeding out on the ground...
That's fine. That is your perogatve, and your CHOICE to use the suit that way, and that's what this is about: choice.
By removing a high slot instead, they'd basically be limiting the suit to Logi only. By changing it the way they did, it can still be used as a viable Assault suit OR a Logi suit, but not both (and certainly not as an Assault suit with all proto Logi equipment).
They've left it with the versatility that it can be good at one role or the other, but you need to decide choose which role is your primary focus.
As a REAL Logi, I'm placed in a situation of choice with the PGU changes as well. No longer can I carry the best Uplink, Med Kit, AND Nanohive AT THE SAME TIME. I need to choose (there's that word again) which to be more effective at, by sacrificing effectiveness of something else.
So, what are your choices?
A. Become Assault in a Logi suit and give up some equipment to accomodate your high slots.
B. Go REAL Logi, but you'll still have to decide specifically what "branch" of Logi you want to be most effective at, on any given spawn (Spawn-Logi, Medic, or Supply-Logi). Just up multiple fittings, with different combinations of equipment, for different situations.
This really doesn't seem too complicated or unreasonable to me. |
Jaqen Morghalis
Abandoned Privilege
General Tso's Alliance
207
|
Posted - 2013.07.24 10:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
Gauder Berwyck wrote:ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals wrote:The first thought in my head when I read the list was "Probably downgrade on proto weapons and grenade. It's a logistics suit. Duh."
Then when I saw "combat/support hybrid" I thought "Hybrids don't usually have the best of everything."
Then I saw the reasons for not reducing weapons and thought "It's a logistics suit. Sounds like you want to be more assault than anything."
Then I read the bit with reducing prototype equipment and thought "Well there you go. You can still support your team, albeit less effectively, and can be the assault you want to be. Why, it almost sounds like a hybrid."
Then I read the last, bold bit and thought "No, it made you choose between being a slayer or a top-notch support instead of being a master of all trades. You have made your decision." And all he wanted to say with his post was that this change to the logi suit is gonna have the OPPOSITE effect of what CCP intended.
Because he is misunderstanding what CCP intended.
He assumes there intent was to limit the suit to Logi only when, in reality, the intent was to force/allow us to choose one role or the other, while limiting it enough to not be used as both simultaneously.
Choices, not limitations. |
Jaqen Morghalis
Abandoned Privilege
General Tso's Alliance
207
|
Posted - 2013.07.24 11:09:00 -
[3] - Quote
Gauder Berwyck wrote:Jaqen Morghalis wrote:Only because he is misunderstanding what (I believe) CCP intended in the first place.
He assumes that the intent was to limit the suit to Logi only when, in reality, it was to force/allow us to choose one role or the other, while limiting it enough to not be used as both simultaneously.
Choices, not limitations. Source: http://dust514.com/news/blog/2013/07/logistics-dropsuit-changes-in-uprising-1.3Quote:As mentioned above, these skill changes are largely to discourage assault-focused players from using the Logistics suit as their frontline choice. They wanna limit, not give choices. And that is where CCP is making a mistake I think.
"discourage" not "prevent".
Big difference.
You can still CHOOSE to use suit effectively as EITHER Assault or Logi. You are not LIMITED to one or the other.
Besides, it's all just temporary anyway, until they are able to add the equipment-specific bonuses, so I don't really see why everyone is getting so worked-up over something we all know is not permanent. |
Jaqen Morghalis
Abandoned Privilege
General Tso's Alliance
207
|
Posted - 2013.07.24 12:09:00 -
[4] - Quote
Another Heavy SOB wrote:DJINN leukoplast wrote:Not sure what I'll do, going to try various fittings until something works once I get the mega CPU/shield nerf. More than likely I'll be dropping 1 or 2 equipment from my rotation. Hope you turkeys are happy, less ammo and/or uplinks for you on the field. I might even start running a troll logi suit, which revives you only so you can die again over and over and over (but I'll be shield/armor tanked and will survive). I'll also place hives somewhere you have to go out of your way to use, only to find out it's a garbage hive that gives you one nade and a handful of ammo.  Either way I'll figure out some way to make players lives miserable in pub matches. Turkeys need to be taught a lesson, and maybe even deep-fried too  . If you are that butthurt that you're hell bent on spreading your buthurtedness to all maybe you should just quit all together?
Agreed.
You're butthurt at CCP. That's fine, I get that.
But throwing a tantrum and taking it out on your fellow players is just stupid, and will accomplish nothing but making yourself look like a jerk. |
Jaqen Morghalis
Abandoned Privilege
General Tso's Alliance
212
|
Posted - 2013.07.24 15:39:00 -
[5] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:Its the same thing I've said all along.
There are probably a lot of changes between 1.4 - 2.0 that will be made to all of the classes. Its inevitable really.
CCP has a vision for what they want each class to be, and I'm sure that the classes are not meeting the mark at all.
Here's the problem for me. CCP keeps making changes (as they need to) and these changes affect a lot of people and can completely nullify choices that have been made.
It makes making 'meaningful decisions' impossible.
CCP should continue to make these changes, yes, definitely. But SP refund should be a matter of fact, period.
I know it kills immersion/the point of the game. But until we can get to a point where the devs are happy with the game... we need to stop pointing and laughing at people that are adversely affected by these changes.
No one will argue cal logis didn't need a change, but these kinds of changes are going to keep happening.
What if 'pure logi' gallenetes get swapped into side arm only? Should the rest of us just point and laugh at the millions of SP that they put into the suit and light weaponry?
Maybe gall logis needed the change to balance them out vs. scenario x, y, and z. And maybe a lot of people will be fine with the change... but a lot of people wont... and they will be royally ****** out of months of grinding.
Its not right.
Ignoring cal logi changes for a second... messing with people's skills and completely changing their playstyle when they have no means to adapt to the changes other than 'grind 6-10 weeks to catch back up, and buy some aurum gear... cause its a 'free' game after all! lulz!!!" is not a good way to treat your player base.
And to answer the OP:
I would drop down to the GEK probably on one fit and dropped some of the equipment on another fit. In PC the only thing you really need is proto uplinks.
I'm working on a build using Imperial Uplinks, Ishukone Nanos, and basic REs. But it'll be using basic nades, and a GEK for sure.
I'll defo be running assault next respec, these changes aren't over for sure. I can guarantee logis in general will be receiving further nerfs, the 5 hp/s will be the first to go I'm sure. Assaults will probably be seeing some buffs too.
The combat potential of each class will be receiving significant changes I'm sure of it.
For this reason, and this reason only, I would be ok with a ONE-TIME ONLY, OPTIONAL respec, but only when ALL the suits are finally where they want them to be. |
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