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Urukabarr
D3ath D3alers
11
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 08:09:00 -
[1] - Quote
Just curious what you guy's think of this...
In Eve online you start off doing level 1 missions until you gain enough standing with a certain faction to do higher level missions. Why can't Dust do the same thing except with sp and warpoints? You'd start off at the bottom tier which is basically the academy. You wouldn't get much loot and the payout wouldn't be all that great. However, as you progress through sp/wp a player can advance to the next level of pvp missions which would pay more and dish out better gear. This could justify bringing out the more expensive stuff for these matches
The key difference between the eve and dust system would be that once a person advances to the next level of play, he/she can no longer do the previous level of missions. By doing this it would give a new player some breathing room before having to deal with all the pubstompers with all their proto stuff.
Also, if there aren't enough games available in the higher tier of play, matchmaking would automatically put a player into a level below what he or she is for the sake of at least finding a game. I believe by doing all this it would resolve alot of the problems for matchmaking. I imagine when they come out with pve it'd work the same way. |
Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion
1058
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 09:24:00 -
[2] - Quote
All this matchmaking talk, I feel its implementation would be a step backwards in terms of getting DUST where it should be.
Note: where I think DUST should be is probably not where CCP thinks DUST should be. Although, they haven't made it clear what they want of DUST... -hinthint-
So yeah. Matchmaking. When I heard about EVE-DUST integration, I imagined me, a mercenary, with a group of close friends who also like to shoot things for money, fighting for enigmatic space men, doing all the logistics stuff behind the scenes.
Because I was on the stage. My actions mattered, my actions were what determined the outcome of a battle. My actions, also, got me my pay.
I imagined contracts on a contract board in my mercenary quarters, and selecting one would send me to the far reaches of New Eden, to further my reputation as a reliable mercenary who will do whatever it takes to win, for the right price.
I imagined bounties placed on my head by rivals in EVE who don't want to see my contractor making so much progress on the ground, on planets. I imagined third parties crashing battles, turning it into confused 3-way conflicts, with me in the center of the chaos, laughing my head off and blowing **** up.
I fantasised about flying dropships across huge districts, flaming wreckage of vehicles and structures below me, installations destroying installations, tanks destroying installations, installations destroying tanks. But me, I was safe in the fog of war, the haze which was produced by all the stirred dust and machinery. Invisible, deploying my precious cargo of fellow mercenaries onto a point to capture, to hold, to win.
Because I wanted ISK.
And in the end, I'd be back in my quarters, counting my ISK, spending my SP carelessly because SP doesn't matter, because all that matters is the ISK, and the contract board, and the fact that there will always, ALWAYS be a contract on that board, and it won't pit me against people of equal skill, no. It'll pit me against people who want that ISK reward listed for the other side. People who have the desire to win that ISK as much as I want the ISK offered by my side's contractor.
If things are going to be matchmade, then they should be matchmade by players because THE BEST PLAYERS go for contracts that give THE MOST ISK.
New Eden is about the player's choices, no? CCP's ingenious move with EVE was that a player's choices balanced themself, through SP specialisation.
They're trying to use SP to do the same thing here, but it won't work. DUST isn't EVE. Balance matches with ISK. |
Urukabarr
D3ath D3alers
11
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 18:16:00 -
[3] - Quote
Quote:All this matchmaking talk, I feel its implementation would be a step backwards in terms of getting DUST where it should be.
Note: where I think DUST should be is probably not where CCP thinks DUST should be. Although, they haven't made it clear what they want of DUST... -hinthint-
So yeah. Matchmaking. When I heard about EVE-DUST integration, I imagined me, a mercenary, with a group of close friends who also like to shoot things for money, fighting for enigmatic space men, doing all the logistics stuff behind the scenes.
Because I was on the stage. My actions mattered, my actions were what determined the outcome of a battle. My actions, also, got me my pay.
I imagined contracts on a contract board in my mercenary quarters, and selecting one would send me to the far reaches of New Eden, to further my reputation as a reliable mercenary who will do whatever it takes to win, for the right price.
I imagined bounties placed on my head by rivals in EVE who don't want to see my contractor making so much progress on the ground, on planets. I imagined third parties crashing battles, turning it into confused 3-way conflicts, with me in the center of the chaos, laughing my head off and blowing **** up.
I fantasised about flying dropships across huge districts, flaming wreckage of vehicles and structures below me, installations destroying installations, tanks destroying installations, installations destroying tanks. But me, I was safe in the fog of war, the haze which was produced by all the stirred dust and machinery. Invisible, deploying my precious cargo of fellow mercenaries onto a point to capture, to hold, to win.
Because I wanted ISK.
And in the end, I'd be back in my quarters, counting my ISK, spending my SP carelessly because SP doesn't matter, because all that matters is the ISK, and the contract board, and the fact that there will always, ALWAYS be a contract on that board, and it won't pit me against people of equal skill, no. It'll pit me against people who want that ISK reward listed for the other side. People who have the desire to win that ISK as much as I want the ISK offered by my side's contractor.
If things are going to be matchmade, then they should be matchmade by players because THE BEST PLAYERS go for contracts that give THE MOST ISK.
New Eden is about the player's choices, no? CCP's ingenious move with EVE was that a player's choices balanced themself, through SP specialisation.
They're trying to use SP to do the same thing here, but it won't work. DUST isn't EVE. Balance matches with ISK.
I agree with you for alot of what you just talked about. Balancing a match with isk reward could be a good way to do it as well. Good idea! I still think there should be some requirements to take a contract to at least keep the newest of the new out of the higher rewarding contracts like maybe putting some isk down or some other requirement. Otherwise we may still see these one sided matches we all know and love. |
Aikuchi Tomaru
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
107
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 18:33:00 -
[4] - Quote
Urukabarr wrote:Just curious what you guy's think of this...
In Eve online you start off doing level 1 missions until you gain enough standing with a certain faction to do higher level missions. Why can't Dust do the same thing except with sp and warpoints? You'd start off at the bottom tier which is basically the academy. You wouldn't get much loot and the payout wouldn't be all that great. However, as you progress through sp/wp a player can advance to the next level of pvp missions which would pay more and dish out better gear. This could justify bringing out the more expensive stuff for these matches
The key difference between the eve and dust system would be that once a person advances to the next level of play, he/she can no longer do the previous level of missions. By doing this it would give a new player some breathing room before having to deal with all the pubstompers with all their proto stuff.
Also, if there aren't enough games available in the higher tier of play, matchmaking would automatically put a player into a level below what he or she is for the sake of at least finding a game. I believe by doing all this it would resolve alot of the problems for matchmaking. I imagine when they come out with pve it'd work the same way.
Because the Eve missions are PvE and Dust so far is PvP only. That's why.
What they need is something like Electronic warfare. Something a newbie can do which is annoying for a veteran. Like tackling in Eve online. Everybody can do it but a newbie can even stop a veteran from warping. |
Malkai Inos
Opus Arcana Covert Intervention
800
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 18:38:00 -
[5] - Quote
Aikuchi Tomaru wrote:Urukabarr wrote:Just curious what you guy's think of this...
In Eve online you start off doing level 1 missions until you gain enough standing with a certain faction to do higher level missions. Why can't Dust do the same thing except with sp and warpoints? You'd start off at the bottom tier which is basically the academy. You wouldn't get much loot and the payout wouldn't be all that great. However, as you progress through sp/wp a player can advance to the next level of pvp missions which would pay more and dish out better gear. This could justify bringing out the more expensive stuff for these matches
The key difference between the eve and dust system would be that once a person advances to the next level of play, he/she can no longer do the previous level of missions. By doing this it would give a new player some breathing room before having to deal with all the pubstompers with all their proto stuff.
Also, if there aren't enough games available in the higher tier of play, matchmaking would automatically put a player into a level below what he or she is for the sake of at least finding a game. I believe by doing all this it would resolve alot of the problems for matchmaking. I imagine when they come out with pve it'd work the same way. Because the Eve missions are PvE and Dust so far is PvP only. That's why. What they need is something Electronic warfare. Something a newbie can do which is annoying for a veteran. Like tackling in Eve online. Everybody can do it but a newbie can even stop a veteran from warping. This. The limitations in EVE missions are purely made to prevent battleships from blitzing through easy missions without even a slither of risk of losing anything. PVP is unrestricted in EVE and for a very good reason. Dust should try to achieve the same. There are ways to do proper matchmaking without artificial restrictions like making players constantly fight against equally equipped enemies or even giving them the ability to choose what enemies to face on the battlefield. |
Urukabarr
D3ath D3alers
11
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 18:43:00 -
[6] - Quote
Quote:Because the Eve missions are PvE and Dust so far is PvP only. That's why.
What they need is something like Electronic warfare. Something a newbie can do which is annoying for a veteran. Like tackling in Eve online. Everybody can do it but a newbie can even stop a veteran from warping.
I said similiar and not exactly the same. I'm just throwing ideas out there more or less. And as for electronic warfare...I can't imagine them completing something like that in the near future. I may be wrong but i think i read a dev blog about webifiers a loooong time ago. |
Urukabarr
D3ath D3alers
11
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 18:55:00 -
[7] - Quote
Quote:This. The limitations in EVE missions are purely made to prevent battleships from blitzing through easy missions without even a slither of risk of losing anything. PVP is unrestricted in EVE and for a very good reason. Dust should try to achieve the same. There are ways to do proper matchmaking without artificial restrictions like making players constantly fight against equally equipped enemies or even giving them the ability to choose what enemies to face on the battlefield.
PVP is unrestricted in EVE but when you're new you can choose not to go into low or nullsec and partake in it. In Dust you have no choice but to do pvp. Which is why I'm actually liking vyzions idea about balancing with isk and contracts. You say you don't want artificial restrictions so how bout the various factions put restrictions on their own contracts that they put out. I mean if i was the gallente and i wanted to put out a contract attacking a high value planet, installation, or whatever, I wouldn't want a bunch of scrubs who don't even have the skill to fight taking one of my contracts. And this would be reflected by some sort of restriction like maybe standing or putting some money down before taking a fight. |
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