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ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1058
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Posted - 2013.07.20 03:43:00 -
[1] - Quote
THEAMAZING POTHEAD wrote:One thing that pisses people off more than anything is devaluing SP.
Ive been trying to say this same thing.
Wasted SP = Waste time... and no one wants to feel their SP is wasted. A game that feels like youre wasting youre time is not fun and if a game isn't fun.. you end up with a playerbase as small as Dust.
In before the "NO MOAR RESPECS EVAR" idiots come in here. |
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1059
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Posted - 2013.07.20 04:21:00 -
[2] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:For me the average gun takes me two months to unlock in planetside as a casual player.
In Dust 514 I had just about every gun type, base suit, module, base vehicle, unlocked by week one after reset.
Good players don't need prototype gear.
Also I am probably a different sort of player, I generally gravitate towards weapons that I feel better in use, for example my favorite type of sniper rifle in most games is generally the closest thing to a bolt action rifle they have because the way the function usually is a very peculiar. I just find it upsetting that they would go to lengths to nerf a sniper rifle to do less damage than some small caliber pistols in that game.
You literally have no ground to stand on with that argument IWS. You are a terrible player, and I have roflstomped you every single time I've played against you in instant battles.
You wouldn't last a second in PC against some of the opponents I've faced as part of PFBHz and TP.
You cannot say you don't need proto gear in this game, not when you're opponents are rocking all proto and playing as hard as they can. |
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1060
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Posted - 2013.07.20 06:01:00 -
[3] - Quote
Kain Spero wrote:Until a real baseline of balance is established and the game's content is filled out I really think that respects should be allowed with each patch or at least a refund of the skills that a directly impacted by a balance change until we reach that baseline. I believe this would allow CCP to actually have more freedom to perform balance adjustments in a meaningful way.
The only issue is that the respect system really has to be automated (and that would mean coding), so that it doesn't eat up a HUGE chunk of resources in dealing with the respects by hand.
I know a lot of people want to point their fingers at Cal Logis and go "HA HA", but quite frankly there is no reason to punish players for using the resources given to them to the best of their ability. It's so important that we move forward together as a community to improve this game.
For me that means Devs communicating to the community changes that they plan BEFORE they are locked in and giving those optional respecs (character or skill specific) to allow both the developers and the community the freedom to test and find the game balance that we are all looking for.
The only CPM member with half a clue.
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ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1060
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Posted - 2013.07.20 06:15:00 -
[4] - Quote
Xero The Mishima wrote:Link plz? I have not seen this.
http://dust514.com/news/blog/2013/07/logistics-dropsuit-changes-in-uprising-1.3/
Near the bottom... its all they've said on 1.4 logi bonuses. |
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1061
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Posted - 2013.07.20 06:17:00 -
[5] - Quote
SERPENT-Adamapple wrote:Every FPS Developer ALWAYS changes stats for balancing purposes. You people need to grow up. The last respec was needed to because of a change in the skill tree. There is no change in the skill tree this time, only stats. So either stop the QQing and leave or MTFU. No player with real skills need to hear that your clutch suit and gun got nerfed so your going to leave with your BFF.
And every FPS developer has provided a means for players to adapt to the changes they make.
In dust? You get complete silence from CCP and HTFU from the community. |
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1069
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Posted - 2013.07.20 15:06:00 -
[6] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Demanding a respec simply because theyre changing your playstyle isnt a good thing, in fact its unhealthy for the game as it removes lasting decision-making, worthwhile investment and completely negates specialization. Whining has nothing to do with it, the Caldari Logi was insanely powerful and not being used forits intended purpose as players were running Assault Logis, hence the terminology.
In the future, all Logis will be changed to provide bonusesto their gear - which CCP has stated. This is important for them to be played for their intended purpose, which is support.
This is just something youre going tohaveto get used to. Instead of demanding a respec, why not suggest changes youd find appealing?
So generally you have good ideas Aeon and are pretty level headed and I agree with most of your points.
...and to everyone who's hating on my posts and saying im mad my crutch is removed, its not the case really. I've already adapted to the changes before 1.3 hits. I have regulator builds in place ready to go and -30 CPU from max. The only thing that sucks for me is I just finished putting in 2.5 million SP in biotics to get kin cats and cardiac regulators, which are now pretty much worthless to me as I will have to run shield regulators to make use of this new bonus. Its a bummer and I would love to be able to move some of that SP into something more relevant since I now won't be able to use kin cats for a good 4-5 months now. At which point I can't even say i'll still be playing this game.
I'm only here fighting for this now for other people I know who's play style has pretty much been completely nerfed. Caldari Shotgun Logi? Between the stamina regen nerf, and now essentially a 83 EHP reduction right off, Caldari logi is probably no longer the class to use for shotguns. Sure it may not have been intended but it was the only halfway decent suit for it since scouts are so bad. You look at the suits we have now and you make your choice. How can you make a meaningful choice when you have no idea what these suits will be like in 2-3 months? You can't. Theres no such thing as 'worthwhile SP investment' as at any point in the next 2 months millions of SP you've invested towards a build becomes pointless once they make balance changes.
Even then, I'm sure those shotgun logis could compensate with skill and die more times as a result. But why should they have to? They didn't ask for a change, they essentially have no way to compensate for it. You can't change your playstyle or dropsuit specialization now... by the time they can make the 9 week grind for a new suit, we'll have had 2 more balance patches since then.
If this game wasn't constantly changing each month, you would be absolutely correct, make your choice and live with it. But 100% agree with Kain Spero on this one. Just give out refunds while we're still beta testing this content. Once these major changes are out of the way, then we won't need them or get them as there won't be major changes left right?
The underlying problem here is probably much deeper. And it probably starts with the fact that prototype gear is around twice as powerful as advanced gear which is around 50% more powerful than standard gear. Due to this, it pretty much makes anything but prototype gear relevant in competitive play, forcing those who want to play competitively in PC to pay 2-3x as much SP as anyone else who plays this game.
"Oh... PC is only 1% of this game... they shouldn't ruin it for the other 99% of us"
That true.. but when I refer to PC, I mean in a more theoretical way. As in any sort of competitive 1v1 you will need to use prototype gear, as the power differential is too great not to.
If they brought advanced gear closer in power to prototype gear, then none of this might matter, as you can partially adapt to the changes by making much small SP investments into the advanced variant of whatever new thing you'll need to spec into to make it work.
This is why there is very little QQ about weapons, as adv variant weapons are so close to their prototype counterparts its all the same.
But there is and always will be floods of QQ about dropsuit changes, cause prototype dropsuits are WAAAAAAY more powerful with their increased slot count, and they are gated behind a MASSIVE SP sink. Its frustrating, its extremely frustrating.
And imagine whats going to happen once matchmaking is in place. Its going to be even worse then... as people with high 'scores' or whatever the metric will be, will be placed in matches with exclusively higher SP prototype wearing players... can you imagine how bad that's going to be without a complete build to compete with?
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ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1088
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Posted - 2013.07.21 01:07:00 -
[7] - Quote
Pikachu Power wrote:I was there and he does not lie. In fact, almost all of the vets help noobs out, now that i think of it.
No we don't. All we do is stack our best proto fits, go into IB and crutch our way to victory and then whine on the forums that our KDRs aren't above 10.
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ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1091
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Posted - 2013.07.21 01:28:00 -
[8] - Quote
KING SALASI wrote:I have a funny feeling that sony will cut ties with ccp. They did it with ligjtbox the dev thst made starhawk. This game is not making money, and the playerbase keeps shrinking. No respecs lack of content, constant tweaks are killing this dieing game.
CCP needs to put Dust on PC and just forget about the console platform. I love CCP and i quit this game makes no sense. Video games are meant to be fun when did it turn into a job?
The grinding got to me i have 10 mill SP and im bored respecs would make the game fresh and fun. It will also help CCP with constant tweaks.
If they break something no biggie i could just respec into something else.
So true... hot fixes, client patches, etc all so easy on the PC.
You could take advantage of the platform to bring updated graphics and 32v32 gameplay to the universe. (and have more than 512MB of shared RAM lulz).
The UI would work so much better with a mouse.
Want real connectivity with eve? Most of them run third party voice chat and don't want to chat using our in game system (which team chat doesn't even let you talk to pilots!)
Could finally have true m/kb support... imagine if modules.equipment could be bound to 1-2-3-4?
raw mouse input aiming!! /drool.
Dust 514... a high potential PC shooter squandered on the POS3. |
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1131
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Posted - 2013.07.22 04:49:00 -
[9] - Quote
Spectre-M wrote:I don't usually post, but it seems that you've put on a nurses uniform but don't want to be a nurse. It's the same idea. If you wanted to be a sniper, you don't spec into heavy armor. I only have 7 mil sp and have invested into the playstyle that suits me, assault. I don't have alot of powerful modules, but have been investing into several things to balance my suits weaknesses. I do not however place all my SP into a suit that doesn't compliment my combat style, as I know the logi suits are made for logistics,not frontline combat. I am also happy with my choice as it is what I wanted to play, not because it had a bonus I thought would give me an edge, that's what modules are for.
A note to everyone - please specialize into what play style suits you. Do not spec into something so you can stack bonuses, as it will only cause you grief when CCP eventually balances it to reflect its intended usage. This game is still going through growth spurts and will change as a result.
That not fair at all. A lot of people specced into logi suits due to their versatility. We all specced into a suit based on the stats and slots it had, as it suited our playstyle.
Just because YOU think that logis aren't supposed to be frontline combatants doesn't mean that they weren't.
Now CCP has stated with their new blog that was their intention for these suits. If they want to change the suits... that's totally fine. However, since those suits are no longer what people put their SP into, they should have that SP refunded so they can spec into a new suit that actually does fit their playstyle. |
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1163
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Posted - 2013.07.22 21:34:00 -
[10] - Quote
Spectre-M wrote:http://dust514.com/news/blog/2013/07/logistics-dropsuit-changes-in-uprising-1.3/
Looking at this it looks like the bonus is actually awesome. It means that you'll have a 25% reduction to shiled recharge delay with lvl 5 into the Cal Logi suit. Combine this with a complex regulator and you'll have a whopping 50% reduction(not including extra regulators with stack penalties). Based of the new stats, that'll be a 2.5/4 second recharge delay. Not bad. I see that it would require a whole new investment (if you dont have regulators), but that doesnt mean you cant still use those complex extenders either. A CPU enhancer will more tham make up for the loss of 20 CPU and allow you to fit better modules in all those slots. Id like to see anyone use this setup and post some feedback about it if they already have it. Also looks like CCP will be doing smaller more rapid updates so we dont have to wait so long for changes. Damn, 2.5/4 is really good, compared to my 5/8.
They aren't additive, its 25% of the 25%.
At regulation 5 its .25*1.1*1.25 = 34.3% per complex regulator. |
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ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1201
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Posted - 2013.07.23 15:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
Bones McGavins wrote:The problem with respecs is it will make everyone flock to the FOTM and reduce diversity. Im not running logi, im not running flaylocks. Why? Because I know both these things are clearly broken and will be nerfed. Everyone knew that. So if you put your sp into something everyone knew would eventually be nerfed, you were "renting" a short term advantage.
Id prefer it this way, where players with half a brain realize that investing in the OP stuff will likely cost them down the road. I could have put my 3x SP into core flaylocks. I would be reaping the rewards right now. But then a month down the road id be all sad that core flaylocks were nerfed and I wasted 700ksp.
Anyone who wanted to play front line pew-pew and saw the Logi OP and went that route kind of deserves the payback now. It was obvious that Logi was better at doing the assualt role than the assault and that it wouldnt last. Should have used your head and realized that. Or, if you did, you should have known youd be renting an advantage with your SP until it got nerfed.
If they could balance their game properly there would be no FOTM.
But there is no hope of any semblance of balance... not with developers as incompetent as this team. |
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