Yes, might as well kill the forge too. The HMG and now the forge guns, while we are at it we might as well cut the heavies shield and armor by half.

It's an accurate anti-vehicle weapon.

I mean, unless you're intending they do idiotic magic-balance like the Lancer in Planetside 2, which does almost no damage to infantry while hammering vehicles with no explanation or anything, I'm not sure how you're proposing that we nerf accuracy on it without making it less effective at long-range AV, which is what it was designed for.

As an anti infantry weapon it requires really good aiming.

a. Why shouldn't AV weapons be able to kill infantry?
I just don't see why that would be the case. Swarms, yes, they need to lock and swarm, etc, but the forge gun is a big 'ol railgun, using the same tech as a sniper rifle- of course it damages infantry.
b.
Have you ever tried FG sniping? I'm not saying it's impossible or even extremely difficult, but it does take skill. You get no ADS and the fattest, ugliest reticule ever, which doesn't stay perfectly steady but continuously vibrates slightly. Hitting with a 2.5m splash radius from 200m with a reticle that covers probably a 10+ meter radius is tricky, so while they're technically very accurate, making use of that accuracy is tough.
3 second refire is hardly madness, and don't forget that it's limited to 16 shots without squad support (since no heavies can carry nanohives). A good forge can kill infantry, but it's not easy, and any sort of flank/rush or a missed CQC shot and the FG loses due to the slow refire rate. Plus, the FG lights up like a signal beacon for any snipers/tacs/other FGs, so sniping with it from high ground is a good way to die.

Your QQ holds no water.

So a gun designed to damage vehicles should not be able to damage a dropsuit? Quit crying, probably just mad you lost a proto suit.

And that's the point.

If you have good aim, you deserve to blap anyone on the map.

The point about the Lancer is that it's very similar to the Forge Gun, but having the skill to hit infantry with it - which isn't easy - is unfairly penalized.

If it was a problem, I think it would show up on these lists:

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=92678

As it is, it makes sense that something that can punch a tank and make him feel it would one-shot infantry. I've tried using it as anti-infantry in the past, and it's very difficult. If you can chew dropsuits up with it, good for you...you're some combination of very skilled and talented with it. In general, it's not a problem, though.

What are you doing that's getting you forge sniped enough to complain about it? I rarely get hit with a forge gun as infantry, are you standing still with an MD on a roof or something? Getting FG'd sucks, but it doesn't need to be nerfed at all.

Free fire means it's a hybrid of AV and vehicle.

I use the forge gun against everything, and it has its flaws. Sure, a direct hit OHKs, but I have to charge it for what- 2 and a half seconds? In that time you can just run out and kill me.

You have 550 shields. You are well protected from a fully proto'd sniper build but there is still a ranged weapon that can OHK you. The Forge gun is not OP simply because you can be OHK.

It is only king of the hill if you let it get up high, and if you then let it stay up there.

Both of which are failures on the part of your team.

If you want to call the forge gun king of antiinfantry then it would regularly pop you on even ground while you dump AT then FLP the fatty.

If you want to call something that requires a dropship, logi, and a heavy OP instead of admitting you refuse to alter your playstyle to facts on the ground, why shouldn't we just laugh at you?

Two hits with a forge gun takes a relatively long time to fire. I think this is a huge reason why many people won't take this seriously.

Not at all.

Is the FG a good anti infantry weapon on the ground? Hell no, unless you suck or they are exceptional.

So what you are complaining about is someone minimizing the drawbacks of their weapons system. That is tactics. Just because you as an assault troop have no reply means the the FG isn't an idiot.

Don't be mad that you got outsmarted just think some more.

So, even though it wouldn't change what you are crying about, you would be ok qith current situation as long as you had a seeking OHK nade for the slowest suit?

I wouldn't care if you have better gungame than everyone, you are now a scrub.

Keep crying while you throw thukker nades and show your sweet bunny hopping ar skills.

I swear the AR guys wont be happy until there is nothing but themselves to fight.

I've said a fun change would be to do reduced dmg to infantry but knock them back as the shockwave of the energy wave hits them before the blast. But the reason it does more dmg to tanks is because the shockwave doesn't move the tank away from the true dmging blase. A direct hit would still likely want to one shot infantry, but OHKs in general would be less and knocking people back is always fun.

It is only op if you refuse to counter it. Which means it isnt op.

Stop crying.

There is clearly something wrong with this kid, or he is just trolling. Your argument has more holes than swiss cheese, done with this clown.

Next qq thread please.

Because unlike the flaylock and MD... you know what this is is too obvious you use your brain and find the difference between the flaylock/MD and forge guns.

With Forge Gun Proficiency at level 5, you get a 15% bonus to damage. Throw on two complex heavy damage modifiers and you get another 20%, minus the stacking penalty. For the purposes of this post, I'll lower it to 15% (if someone could give me the actual number, it would be much appreciated). In total, that gives you a 30% damage bonus. Base splash damage for all proto forge guns is 277.2 (advanced and standard tiers have lower splash damage). 277.2 times 1.30 equals 360.36. 2 shots equal 720.72, 3 shots equal 1081.08 and four shots equal 1441.44. If your EHP (armor + shields) was higher than 720.72 at the time, then you were probably hit by splash damage followed by a direct hit. However, I did not factor in the reduced damage to shields and increased damage to armor.

Like I said earlier, you have to keep in mind that reducing the forge gun's splash damage also decreases its effectiveness against fast-moving vehicles.

LOL I CAN USE CAPS TOO!!!

WHO
SAID
THE FORGE
IS
AN
ANTI-VEHICLE
WEAPON ONLY????

The max range is 300 meters, not FROM ANY DISTANCE. stop making **** up to support your flawed logic.

720 in a couple of seconds? A couple is 2... pretty sure the charge up time for the assault variant is 2.5 seconds for 1 shot. Again, you are exaggerating a point to support your flawed logic.

Scroll back a few posts, I already posted the DUST 514 description of the Forge Gun. Nowhere in that description does it say "anti-vehicle only". developer descriptions dont lie. Numbers dont lie either, if you only knew how to be sporadic in your movement you wouldnt get hit with 3-4 straight splash hits. You need better situational awareness, communication and teamwork in your squad. Learn to counter the tactic.

Just because YOU think in YOUR little brain that this weapon is AV only does not make that a fact. This seems to be the only basis for your argument, that in YOUR OPINION an AV weapon should not be able to kill infantry. your opinion is wrong, many of us have said this already, yet you keep flailing your arms in a feeble attemp to get this weapon nerfed.

you are a troll, a tool, and nothing more.

Learn 2 play, scrub.

Go back in the thread and see my earlier posts for a list of options. Actually, since the backspace key might be too much for you to operate, here is a short list:

1. Sniper
2. Rail tank
3. DS full of Assault troops, approaching from the blind side, with a sniper to keep the fatty away from the approach.
4. OB the rooftop.

Would you say that Cubs is a competent forge gunner? Because I came back from a DC in a Zion vs TP match to see void echo pick him off a roof with a rail gun from the deployment.

So stop crying, because you just make yourself look bad.

For the third time, making it less effective against infantry by lowering the splash damage and/or radius would also make it less effective against certain vehicles. If anything needs to be reworked, it's the map designs that allow us to do this.

You claimed that the forge gun can deal over 720 points of splash damage in less than two seconds, but the truth is that it's only half of that.

Well, take into account time for the shot to land, and it takes around four seconds to get two hits with the Ishukone FG. So it is in fact more than a couple seconds, but that is a mild distinction.




I do not agree, and have seen no dev posts on the matter to confirm such a thing. You may think it is AV only, whereas most of us classify it as an AM weapon. Which is what it really is.



Forge gun has many counters, you just refuse to use them. That is your teams fault, not the people using the FG. Tell your team to focus on the fundamentals and you won't be getting forged so much.

I'm talking about LAVs, but splash damage does help against tanks. As a matter a fact, I killed a tank with splash damage yesterday.


I was also killed by an orbital on the tallest tower in the game yesterday.

You do know that you can't hold a charge with the assault forge gun, right? Also, during the match in which I was killed by the orbital, the enemy was keeping me suppressed with sniper rifles. I only got one kill that match.

I can vouch for Gem Cutter. He has unerring accuracy. Incidentally, he was one of the snipers keeping me suppressed during the match in which I got killed by an orbital.

So you must think the sniper rifle is broken as well right? I mean I can kill guys with that much health from hundreds of meters away with a headshot
Hell the bullet even travels faster and I get to zoom in on my target making it even easier

If you have the best snipers, then they can suppress an enemy heavy on a roof. Otherwise they are not worth being called the best anything.

The only way you are getting killed in less than two seconds with 700 hp is if you get direct hit. Otherwise it takes at least two shots, which takes at least four seconds. How you have not gotten this yet is amazing.

You are right that the flaylock doesn't kill people in 4 seconds, it actually does it much faster.

Do you complain this much when you get killed by the mass driver? Because any tactic you use for dodging MD rounds would work just as well for evading a FG trying to peg you.

What this really boils down to is that you don't like the fact that someone can mess you up from beyond AR range. Whereas if your team had done their job, the guy with the FG never would have gotten up there in the first place.

Kobrah, is the FG too good on the ground?

Is your AR unable to drop a heavy before he charges and fires?

Are heavies all dropping their HMG to use a forge?

What you are complaining about is tactics, but instead of countering the tactic you want to need the forge.

Less QQ, more swwwwwwwwwphwm boom.

so the average requirement of 3-4 shots to kill an infantryman makes it too good? this is if you don't instablap them in the first two shots. instablap is a skillshot.

I'm not taking about the hail mary **** where you hit three damaged guys clustered in a corner.

Go use the forge gun. Do not reload from a hive or a supply depot.

tell me how many kills you get for each load of ammunition. how often do you die?

does your KD go up or down?

not a properly fit advanced or proto assault or logi.

if you're talking about shitfits, cheapfits and freefits, you lose all credibility with me

If you're complaining about a breach forge gun you have lost all credibility with me. if you hold still or stay in the open long enough to get hit with two breach shots you have lost all right to call yourself anything but free warpoints.

two shots will hit for around 750 damage if you only get splash. most two-shot hits with an ishukone assault forge (which I use) involve a ranging shot for splash, and a direct hit for the killshot if you do it right. I'm stupidly good at this combo between 40 and 70 meters.

Caldari assault and logi have in excess of 800 HP when fit properly. still have 50 HP left after two splashes.

Gallente assault and logi have potentially much higher, but if they go that way, they get instablapped by direct hits because they farking SLOW.

Oh dear God if you believe that I want you in every single game on the opposing team so I can farm you for easy warpoints with everything from a MLT assault rifle to a boundless HMG to a Forge Gun to a cheap seat plasma cannon.

You are nothing more than free warpoints to all comers. I have no sympathy for you, nor will I lend your complaints any further credence.

And my assault scrambler. must not forget my assault scram.

277 x 1.2 (we shall assume that the stacking penalty got removed and heavies can only have two)

why that comes to...332.4 so 2 shots =

664.8 splash damage.

tankable on anything but a scout.

Oh by the way, Kobrah, you are quick to dismiss people as scrubs who can't hack it.

Here's a hint: No one cares what you think. You're mad because someone figured out how to use a weapon you're incapable of using to smear you all over the battlefield and now you want it screwed because you're offended that heavies can be relevant. It's a common problem.

It's a shocker, I know, that not everyone considers your opinion relevant. But I'm sure you will cope somehow.

Your little temper tantrums undermine your position when people use LOGIC to derail your arguments. It's a given that you can fit to tank forge gun splash.

I'm sorry you think doing so is beneath you. I'll call Free Beers to hold your Hand. He won't nova knife you I promise.

that flash of light followed by the respawn screen was my forge gun killing you.

I'm so bad at the game I have to resort to scrub tactics to fish for 1-2 kills a game

The Gastuns FG has a 2.1 sec base, Assault is 2.5 sec base. Still not less than 1 second. It's main advantage is a 6 round mag and increased ammo capacity.

Op changes the basis for his argument every other page... Even his beloved sniper buddy comes in here with completely inaccurate information. Have either of these guys even picked up a forge gun in the last 6 months?

Do they even lift?

The Gastuns FG has a 2.1 sec base, Assault is 2.5 sec base. Still not less than 1 second. It's main advantage is a 6 round mag and increased ammo capacity.

Op changes the basis for his argument every other page... Even his beloved sniper buddy comes in here with completely inaccurate information. Have either of these guys even picked up a forge gun in the last 6 months?

Do they even lift?

I don't know about you, but I have never seen anyone use the officer forge gun, even in PC matches. I do see a lot of Ishukone Assault Forge Guns though.

Officer weapons are often much better than regular weapons, hence their rarity.

EDIT: My bad, I guess you were referring to the assault FG. Yes, it's still less than 2 seconds with maxed skills, but only for 360 splash damage.

It is never 2 seconds. Just because the targeted player wasn't aware of the forge gun doesn't mean that the two seconds it took to charge up the first shot don't count.