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Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1819
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 01:42:00 -
[1] - Quote
Really. With the lower splash radius I could at least evade if I was very very erratic and unpredictable. Now no matter what I do I get hit, and I get hit hard.
Thanks for the triple SP week CCP, because I'm going Caldari logi.
Bye Gallente suit, I will miss looking bad ass :( |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 01:50:00 -
[2] - Quote
Don't worry |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1819
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 01:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
Year 2039: CCP is proud to announce the long awaited buff to armor! We are adding 1hp to all plates.
In addition, we are increasing Caldari speeds to scout speeds. |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 01:53:00 -
[4] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Year 2039: CCP is proud to announce the long awaited buff to armor! We are adding 1hp to all plates. In addition, we are increasing Caldari speeds to scout speeds.
CCP just hasn't played a armor suit. I am sure their response (Instead of fixing) is welcome to New Eden, HTFU and pick the right suit! |
Mobius Wyvern
BetaMax. CRONOS.
2177
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 01:55:00 -
[5] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Year 2039: CCP is proud to announce the long awaited buff to armor! We are adding 1hp to all plates. In addition, we are increasing Caldari speeds to scout speeds. CCP just hasn't played a armor suit. I am sure their response (Instead of fixing) is welcome to New Eden, HTFU and pick the right suit! I think a few of their team have mentioned playing armor exclusively in IRC. |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 01:57:00 -
[6] - Quote
Mobius Wyvern wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Year 2039: CCP is proud to announce the long awaited buff to armor! We are adding 1hp to all plates. In addition, we are increasing Caldari speeds to scout speeds. CCP just hasn't played a armor suit. I am sure their response (Instead of fixing) is welcome to New Eden, HTFU and pick the right suit! I think a few of their team have mentioned playing armor exclusively in IRC.
Well if they haven't seen how weak it is then I wanna know what fitting they use. |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1819
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 01:57:00 -
[7] - Quote
Mobius Wyvern wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Year 2039: CCP is proud to announce the long awaited buff to armor! We are adding 1hp to all plates. In addition, we are increasing Caldari speeds to scout speeds. CCP just hasn't played a armor suit. I am sure their response (Instead of fixing) is welcome to New Eden, HTFU and pick the right suit! I think a few of their team have mentioned playing armor exclusively in IRC. I'm pretty sure only FoxFour is armor. Besides, devs they don't know their own game :P |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1819
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 01:57:00 -
[8] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Year 2039: CCP is proud to announce the long awaited buff to armor! We are adding 1hp to all plates. In addition, we are increasing Caldari speeds to scout speeds. CCP just hasn't played a armor suit. I am sure their response (Instead of fixing) is welcome to New Eden, HTFU and pick the right suit! I think a few of their team have mentioned playing armor exclusively in IRC. Well if they haven't seen how weak it is then I wanna know what fitting they use. dev hax |
Scheneighnay McBob
Bojo's School of the Trades
1920
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:02:00 -
[9] - Quote
Bad modules aren't a reason to nerf a semi-broken (as in, bad for the user) weapon. |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1819
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:03:00 -
[10] - Quote
Scheneighnay McBob wrote:Bad modules aren't a reason to nerf a semi-broken (as in, bad for the user) weapon. TBH get a flux grenade and it wrecks. This weapon (and all explosives in general) does 135% damage to armor, which is nutz when you consider that we are the slowest and these weapons have splash damage. |
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:04:00 -
[11] - Quote
The Mass Driver is actually one of many nails, if you direct your attention here you will see that every shield killing weapon except for two have already been released. There are 7 new weapons to be release SOON (TM) 5/7 are made to kill armor. Also all of the strongest weapons are made to kill armor, there is no high damage weapon that hurts shields, we have the forge gun, grenades, flaylock pistols, remote explosives, mass drivers, and the HMG. All of these weapons should just do 100/100 because its BS that the majority of weapons are made to kill the weakest fking suit. |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1819
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:06:00 -
[12] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:The Mass Driver is actually one of many nails, if you direct your attention here you will see that every shield killing weapon except for two have already been released. There are 7 new weapons to be release SOON (TM) 5/7 are made to kill armor. Also all of the strongest weapons are made to kill armor, there is no high damage weapon that hurts shields, we have the forge gun, grenades, flaylock pistols, remote explosives, mass drivers, and the HMG. All of these weapons should just do 100/100 because its BS that the majority of weapons are made to kill the weakest fking suit. I said final, not the only nail. I gave up, I did, I helped co-write the most detailed armor thread with Arkena, explaining in detail the problems and possible fixes. CCP's response? Buff shields with shield energizers and make the worst plates you can imagine for armor. |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:07:00 -
[13] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:The Mass Driver is actually one of many nails, if you direct your attention here you will see that every shield killing weapon except for two have already been released. There are 7 new weapons to be release SOON (TM) 5/7 are made to kill armor. Also all of the strongest weapons are made to kill armor, there is no high damage weapon that hurts shields, we have the forge gun, grenades, flaylock pistols, remote explosives, mass drivers, and the HMG. All of these weapons should just do 100/100 because its BS that the majority of weapons are made to kill the weakest fking suit. I said final, not the only nail. I gave up, I did, I helped co-write the most detailed armor thread with Arkena, explaining in detail the problems and possible fixes. CCP's response? Buff shields with shield energizers and make the worst plates you can imagine for armor.
Yeah I got really pissed of writing that post... |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1820
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:08:00 -
[14] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Cat Merc wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:The Mass Driver is actually one of many nails, if you direct your attention here you will see that every shield killing weapon except for two have already been released. There are 7 new weapons to be release SOON (TM) 5/7 are made to kill armor. Also all of the strongest weapons are made to kill armor, there is no high damage weapon that hurts shields, we have the forge gun, grenades, flaylock pistols, remote explosives, mass drivers, and the HMG. All of these weapons should just do 100/100 because its BS that the majority of weapons are made to kill the weakest fking suit. I said final, not the only nail. I gave up, I did, I helped co-write the most detailed armor thread with Arkena, explaining in detail the problems and possible fixes. CCP's response? Buff shields with shield energizers and make the worst plates you can imagine for armor. Yeah I got really pissed of writing that post... I thank you for the help. You were even more active than me after the main thread was published. |
Scheneighnay McBob
Bojo's School of the Trades
1920
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:09:00 -
[15] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Scheneighnay McBob wrote:Bad modules aren't a reason to nerf a semi-broken (as in, bad for the user) weapon. TBH get a flux grenade and it wrecks. This weapon (and all explosives in general) does 135% damage to armor, which is nutz when you consider that we are the slowest and these weapons have splash damage. Armor needs a serious buff, and the resistance values need a change. I don't blame this weapon specifically, flaylock, grenades, any explosive in general, just demolishes us before we can even react. It takes real skill to use, and still misfires all the time. |
Azura Sakura
Militaires-Sans-Frontieres
192
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:09:00 -
[16] - Quote
Armor tank for life... |
TheAmazing FlyingPig
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
1433
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:10:00 -
[17] - Quote
Final nail? Nah.
Now, once those flaylocks get homing capabilities... |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1820
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:10:00 -
[18] - Quote
Scheneighnay McBob wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Scheneighnay McBob wrote:Bad modules aren't a reason to nerf a semi-broken (as in, bad for the user) weapon. TBH get a flux grenade and it wrecks. This weapon (and all explosives in general) does 135% damage to armor, which is nutz when you consider that we are the slowest and these weapons have splash damage. Armor needs a serious buff, and the resistance values need a change. I don't blame this weapon specifically, flaylock, grenades, any explosive in general, just demolishes us before we can even react. It takes real skill to use, and still misfires all the time. Not against Gallente suits. Against Gallente suits we're just meat puppets for slaughter. |
Mobias Wyvern
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
11
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:10:00 -
[19] - Quote
Be your own Judge. What game looks like more fun to you? Dust.........Or this.........
Planetside 2
Coming to PS4 this year
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:12:00 -
[20] - Quote
Scheneighnay McBob wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Scheneighnay McBob wrote:Bad modules aren't a reason to nerf a semi-broken (as in, bad for the user) weapon. TBH get a flux grenade and it wrecks. This weapon (and all explosives in general) does 135% damage to armor, which is nutz when you consider that we are the slowest and these weapons have splash damage. Armor needs a serious buff, and the resistance values need a change. I don't blame this weapon specifically, flaylock, grenades, any explosive in general, just demolishes us before we can even react. It takes real skill to use, and still misfires all the time.
The mass driver takes skill at the low levels, but the radius is just so big at proto levels. They should nerf the radius and buff the damage. Same with flaylocks except don't buff the damage. Explosives need a equivalent for shields that can 2 shot them, and the HMG should do 100/100 unless they release a HMG type heavy weapon to kill shields, if not make the forge gun do massive damage to shields, enough to 1 shot the little roaches. |
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Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1823
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:13:00 -
[21] - Quote
Mobias Wyvern wrote:Be your own Judge. What game looks like more fun to you? Dust.........Or this......... Planetside 2
Coming to PS4 this year Just **** off you PoS!
I can't wait for when they have a requirement of time played before you can post on the forums. |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:19:00 -
[22] - Quote
The most disappointing thing of all is that CCP has not replied to any more armor threads except that ONE time in Arkenas first thread. They probably gave up on us, since the problems with armor is not just the modules but also racially, and apparently they just don't know how to apply proper racial bonuses. |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1823
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:19:00 -
[23] - Quote
Sigh, and to think anti armor weaponry is the easiest to use of all. Heck the SMG is anti armor, and it has more DPS than an AR and it's a sidearm. Because why not right? |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1823
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:20:00 -
[24] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:The most disappointing thing of all is that CCP has not replied to any more armor threads except that ONE time in Arkenas first thread. They probably gave up on us, since the problems with armor is not just the modules but also racially, and apparently they just don't know how to apply proper racial bonuses. There are 101 ways to fix armor without touching the racial bonuses. They are just stupid, the new plates are the proof, they're garbage for armor tankers but a dream come true for shields tankers -_- |
TheAmazing FlyingPig
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
1433
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:21:00 -
[25] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Mobias Wyvern wrote:Be your own Judge. What game looks like more fun to you? Dust.........Or this......... Planetside 2
Coming to PS4 this year Incomprehensible Wordvomit Just **** off you PoS! I can't wait for when they have a requirement of time played before you can post on the forums. They added a 10-minute in-game time requirement. Not a clue why. |
The dark cloud
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
1599
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:22:00 -
[26] - Quote
in fairness the most used weapon in the game (the AR) does 10% less against armor dropsuits. However grenades and other explosives dealing more damage against armor is just stupid. |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1823
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:23:00 -
[27] - Quote
TheAmazing FlyingPig wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Mobias Wyvern wrote:Be your own Judge. What game looks like more fun to you? Dust.........Or this......... Planetside 2
Coming to PS4 this year Incomprehensible Wordvomit Just **** off you PoS! I can't wait for when they have a requirement of time played before you can post on the forums. They added a 10-minute in-game time requirement. Not a clue why. I say give it a 10k WP requirement. |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1823
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:24:00 -
[28] - Quote
The dark cloud wrote:in fairness the most used weapon in the game (the AR) does 10% less against armor dropsuits. However grenades and other explosives dealing more damage against armor is just stupid. 10% is not much when you consider that ALL explosive anti armor weaponry does +35%. And they are the easiest to use thanks to their high splash radius and the fact that Gallente are slowest.
Also, shields beat armor in every possible respect except for rare edge cases, so that +35% I would say is more like +50%. |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:29:00 -
[29] - Quote
Although mass driver being "fixed" is the armor tanks coffin final nail, it is not the final nail for the death of the Gallente. WHY? Because our HAV makes the Caldari HAV look like a pin cushion. |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1823
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:30:00 -
[30] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Although mass driver being "fixed" is the armor tanks coffin final nail, it is not the final nail for the death of the Gallente. WHY? Because our HAV makes the Caldari HAV look like a pin cushion. I'm talking about infantry. Besides, armor is much more vulnerable to AV. Try shooting a Gallente LLAV and a Caldari LLAV with a swarm launcher or throwing AV nades at it. Tell me which one drops first. |
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:31:00 -
[31] - Quote
I know your talking about infantry, I am just saying at least our race isn't dead. Also even though armor is weak to AV they can repair their armor lightning fast. |
TEBOW BAGGINS
Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN.
651
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:34:00 -
[32] - Quote
lol even if they nerf mass drivers again i wont care because i rocked a freedom thru the whole nerf
bring on the MD renerf. won't stop me |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1823
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:34:00 -
[33] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:I know your talking about infantry, I am just saying at least our race isn't dead. Also even though armor is weak to AV they can repair their armor lightning fast. And they're going to fix that very very quickly. You know why? Because if armor is underpowered, they will keep it that way. If shields are underpowered, they are going to fix it instantly, can't let Gallente have the upper hand for once now can we? |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:40:00 -
[34] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:I know your talking about infantry, I am just saying at least our race isn't dead. Also even though armor is weak to AV they can repair their armor lightning fast. And they're going to fix that very very quickly. You know why? Because if armor is underpowered, they will keep it that way. If shields are underpowered, they are going to fix it instantly, can't let Gallente have the upper hand for once now can we?
Hell no we can't!
Gallente in CCPs eyes
Gallente in CCPs eyes |
TEBOW BAGGINS
Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN.
651
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:40:00 -
[35] - Quote
they could give shield users a massive sig radius penalty meaning they light up on the radar with the more shields they stack, currently it takes a scanner to light up a caldari or min assault just like most everyone else, perhaps shield stackers should be easy for base suit scan precision to detect...? |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
422
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:44:00 -
[36] - Quote
TEBOW BAGGINS wrote:they could give shield users a massive sig radius penalty meaning they light up on the radar with the more shields they stack, currently it takes a scanner to light up a caldari or min assault just like most everyone else, perhaps shield stackers should be easy for base suit scan precision to detect...?
Sig radius is not nearly as bad as our penalties. |
TEBOW BAGGINS
Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN.
651
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:48:00 -
[37] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:TEBOW BAGGINS wrote:they could give shield users a massive sig radius penalty meaning they light up on the radar with the more shields they stack, currently it takes a scanner to light up a caldari or min assault just like most everyone else, perhaps shield stackers should be easy for base suit scan precision to detect...? Sig radius is not nearly as bad as our penalties.
then u must advocate for anti-grav armor plates |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
423
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:51:00 -
[38] - Quote
TEBOW BAGGINS wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:TEBOW BAGGINS wrote:they could give shield users a massive sig radius penalty meaning they light up on the radar with the more shields they stack, currently it takes a scanner to light up a caldari or min assault just like most everyone else, perhaps shield stackers should be easy for base suit scan precision to detect...? Sig radius is not nearly as bad as our penalties. then u must advocate for anti-grav armor plates
wut? |
Marston VC
SVER True Blood Public Disorder.
426
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 02:57:00 -
[39] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Really. With the lower splash radius I could at least evade if I was very very erratic and unpredictable. Now no matter what I do I get hit, and I get hit hard.
Thanks for the triple SP week CCP, because I'm going Caldari logi.
Bye Gallente suit, I will miss looking bad ass :(
I disagree cat, my suit has enough HP to survive most MD users up to about 4-5 hits before I die. This could be increased if I used shield extenders. To counter the mighty MD ive adopted the tactic of ignoring their MD and aiming for the user. All the while im working on closing the distance. If were at range, the MD users accuracy will drop (unless their roof camping) Therefore making it easy to counter attack them. If there close range, then I immediately go to close the distance. This disturbs them deeply because most MD users are used to their victems running away. So because my SR is so good at killing shields, we end up having a "race" between who dies from the MD first. Either he will, or I will. generally its me that wins. I caused soooo many people to commit suicide today by just charging right up to them. There not like the godlock pistol which three shots me all day, they are, in my opinion, beatable. |
Xender17
Intrepidus XI Omega Commission
206
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 03:00:00 -
[40] - Quote
Mobias Wyvern wrote:Be your own Judge. What game looks like more fun to you? Dust.........Or this......... Planetside 2
Coming to PS4 this year If I join do you promise to leave these forums? |
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Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1824
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 03:07:00 -
[41] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Really. With the lower splash radius I could at least evade if I was very very erratic and unpredictable. Now no matter what I do I get hit, and I get hit hard.
Thanks for the triple SP week CCP, because I'm going Caldari logi.
Bye Gallente suit, I will miss looking bad ass :( I disagree cat, my suit has enough HP to survive most MD users up to about 4-5 hits before I die. This could be increased if I used shield extenders. To counter the mighty MD ive adopted the tactic of ignoring their MD and aiming for the user. All the while im working on closing the distance. If were at range, the MD users accuracy will drop (unless their roof camping) Therefore making it easy to counter attack them. If there close range, then I immediately go to close the distance. This disturbs them deeply because most MD users are used to their victems running away. So because my SR is so good at killing shields, we end up having a "race" between who dies from the MD first. Either he will, or I will. generally its me that wins. I caused soooo many people to commit suicide today by just charging right up to them. There not like the godlock pistol which three shots me all day, they are, in my opinion, beatable. 5 shots eh? Does that mean your suit has 700 armor? |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
424
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 03:09:00 -
[42] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Marston VC wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Really. With the lower splash radius I could at least evade if I was very very erratic and unpredictable. Now no matter what I do I get hit, and I get hit hard.
Thanks for the triple SP week CCP, because I'm going Caldari logi.
Bye Gallente suit, I will miss looking bad ass :( I disagree cat, my suit has enough HP to survive most MD users up to about 4-5 hits before I die. This could be increased if I used shield extenders. To counter the mighty MD ive adopted the tactic of ignoring their MD and aiming for the user. All the while im working on closing the distance. If were at range, the MD users accuracy will drop (unless their roof camping) Therefore making it easy to counter attack them. If there close range, then I immediately go to close the distance. This disturbs them deeply because most MD users are used to their victems running away. So because my SR is so good at killing shields, we end up having a "race" between who dies from the MD first. Either he will, or I will. generally its me that wins. I caused soooo many people to commit suicide today by just charging right up to them. There not like the godlock pistol which three shots me all day, they are, in my opinion, beatable. 5 shots eh? Does that mean your suit has 700 armor? 783 if you don't count shields, this is based on splash damage only with a basic weapon. |
Johnny Guilt
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
135
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 03:12:00 -
[43] - Quote
explosive 514,burst damge FTW |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1824
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 03:12:00 -
[44] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Marston VC wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Really. With the lower splash radius I could at least evade if I was very very erratic and unpredictable. Now no matter what I do I get hit, and I get hit hard.
Thanks for the triple SP week CCP, because I'm going Caldari logi.
Bye Gallente suit, I will miss looking bad ass :( I disagree cat, my suit has enough HP to survive most MD users up to about 4-5 hits before I die. This could be increased if I used shield extenders. To counter the mighty MD ive adopted the tactic of ignoring their MD and aiming for the user. All the while im working on closing the distance. If were at range, the MD users accuracy will drop (unless their roof camping) Therefore making it easy to counter attack them. If there close range, then I immediately go to close the distance. This disturbs them deeply because most MD users are used to their victems running away. So because my SR is so good at killing shields, we end up having a "race" between who dies from the MD first. Either he will, or I will. generally its me that wins. I caused soooo many people to commit suicide today by just charging right up to them. There not like the godlock pistol which three shots me all day, they are, in my opinion, beatable. 5 shots eh? Does that mean your suit has 700 armor? 783 if you don't count shields, this is based on splash damage only with a basic weapon. yup |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1824
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 03:24:00 -
[45] - Quote
meow |
Thor McStrut
Reckoners
47
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 03:39:00 -
[46] - Quote
Lol! They actually fix MDs and the QQing runs rampant. I run an Adv. Gal suit double plated with MD and Flux. I've done so since Chromo. While armor tanking does need to be addressed, the MD is hardly the root of the problem.
Honestly, the races suits need race specific bonuses appropriate to there established lore. Secondly, armor drawbacks need to be re-evaluated, and shield modules need their own drawbacks installed.
These problems have nothing to do with the FIX that the MD desperately needed after CCP broke it. |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1824
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 03:41:00 -
[47] - Quote
Thor McStrut wrote:Lol! They actually fix MDs and the QQing runs rampant. I run an Adv. Gal suit double plated with MD and Flux. I've done so since Chromo. While armor tanking does need to be addressed, the MD is hardly the root of the problem.
Honestly, the races suits need race specific bonuses appropriate to there established lore. Secondly, armor drawbacks need to be re-evaluated, and shield modules need their own drawbacks installed.
These problems have nothing to do with the FIX that the MD desperately needed after CCP broke it. ... I said the MD is the final nail in the coffin. I never said it was the root of the problem. |
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