DUST Search - Armor plates, ferroscale plates, armor reps and reactive plates need their value...

Killar-12 wrote:

Michael Cratar wrote:

D legendary hero wrote:

you for get 1 thing. everything does close to double damage to armor. even doubling the numbers on all armor modules wouldn't make it balanced.

if you have 2 complex armor repairs thats only 20 hp per second. a caldari milita suit gets 20 shield back by default. the shiled enegizer's make it so that shields come at impossible speeds. and seriously, doudes running around with 500+ shields that regenarate almost insantly and that are resistant to almost everything can't be good. especially since they can also armor tank because armor is a low slot acomplishment.

everyone screams "OMG...THROW FLUX NADES DATZ WAT DEY DER 4...HERPIDDY DERP DERP". seriously, flux grenades are not that effective because its hit or miss, and these guys have no speed penalty they are moving rediculously fast thanks to the movement speed increase that CCP ninja'd into the game. worse yet we have the fact that even from full depletion shields recover extremely fast.

scrambler rifles do wonders on shields but the semiauto one is hit or miss because people move so fast with their shields, the only real way to combate shields is to use an assault scrambler rifle, because the regular AR outguns the semi-auto everytime (which makes sense, the problem lies in that scramblers are the only practical way to combat the shield tanking)

even if the values of all armor mods were doubled armor repairs slower and takes 50% more damage to everything. in fact these values should be doubled.

reactive plates the basic give you 15 armor and repair your armor at 1 hp per second. thats pathetic. i round from an HMG (one bullet) does more than that.

reactive plates in order to be worth anything need to be at least quadrupled otherwise there is no point to having them in the game. (60 armor and 4hp per second) keeping the 1% movement penalty the same.

complex armor plates when 2 doubled would give you 230 additional armor. but think all the explosives and plasma weaponry does extra damage to armor, so it would on begin to help break even.

the solution to the armor verse shield problem lies in give great values to armor modules. (the reactive plates have to be quadrupled or quintipled to even be consideed useful)

60 armor and 4hp a second, with a 1% movement penalty at basic? Im an armor tanker and even I think that is op as fk.

it's only 2hp/s not 4 hp


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D legendary hero Strong-Arm 254	Posted - 2013.07.02 21:30:00 - [1] - Quote I won't both putting the math here but you can do it in your head. adding 1/2 the value of these as a hot fix, will just barely help make armor tanking a viable option. right now its abit ridiculous the reactive plates especially need a major buff, those things are almost pointless. but they are still a good idea. reactive plates should be giving you at least 30-45 armor and heal at a rate of 2 hp per second, with the 1% movement speed penalty.
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 254	Posted - 2013.07.02 21:56:00 - [2] - Quote what would happen if armor plates where moved to be H modules?
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 257	Posted - 2013.07.03 07:54:00 - [3] - Quote i want this to be a petition to double and/o triple the effectives of all armor modules. its the only way to make armor tanking effective) (remember everything does more damage to armor anyway)
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 267	Posted - 2013.07.03 17:49:00 - [4] - Quote you for get 1 thing. everything does close to double damage to armor. even doubling the numbers on all armor modules wouldn't make it balanced. if you have 2 complex armor repairs thats only 20 hp per second. a caldari milita suit gets 20 shield back by default. the shiled enegizer's make it so that shields come at impossible speeds. and seriously, doudes running around with 500+ shields that regenarate almost insantly and that are resistant to almost everything can't be good. especially since they can also armor tank because armor is a low slot acomplishment. everyone screams "OMG...THROW FLUX NADES DATZ WAT DEY DER 4...HERPIDDY DERP DERP". seriously, flux grenades are not that effective because its hit or miss, and these guys have no speed penalty they are moving rediculously fast thanks to the movement speed increase that CCP ninja'd into the game. worse yet we have the fact that even from full depletion shields recover extremely fast. scrambler rifles do wonders on shields but the semiauto one is hit or miss because people move so fast with their shields, the only real way to combate shields is to use an assault scrambler rifle, because the regular AR outguns the semi-auto everytime (which makes sense, the problem lies in that scramblers are the only practical way to combat the shield tanking) even if the values of all armor mods were doubled armor repairs slower and takes 50% more damage to everything. in fact these values should be doubled. reactive plates the basic give you 15 armor and repair your armor at 1 hp per second. thats pathetic. i round from an HMG (one bullet) does more than that. reactive plates in order to be worth anything need to be at least quadrupled otherwise there is no point to having them in the game. (60 armor and 4hp per second) keeping the 1% movement penalty the same. complex armor plates when 2 doubled would give you 230 additional armor. but think all the explosives and plasma weaponry does extra damage to armor, so it would on begin to help break even. the solution to the armor verse shield problem lies in give great values to armor modules. (the reactive plates have to be quadrupled or quintipled to even be consideed useful)
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 267	Posted - 2013.07.03 17:52:00 - [5] - Quote ChromeBreaker wrote: \o/ more wild numbers and changes. Anything close to doubling numbers would bring the letters O and P together! Example from above... enhanced armour plat + complex rep = 174hp + 10ar/s -5% speeeed Dat there be crazy talk! your effectivly strapping a scout to your chest chromebreaker, you have responed to several of my threads, and i find you to be a very reasonable and inquisitive individual. however, in this case i must disagree. behold: sheild enegizer's 60% sheild recharge rate, 6% penalty to max shield. no skill requirement...lol besides with all the weapons that are designed to do 50% more damage to armor, armor tanking must have a purpose. people get mad at flaylocks (which need a slight increase in blast radius, but a longer reload speed because people spam them to easily), MD, HMGs (although utter garbage still do more to armor than sheidls) SMGs, grenades,...etc, etc these weapons are doing their job well. the problem lies in the fact that for the cost the armor tanking doesn't compensate for the additional damage that is being taken, and for a movement penalty like that its rediculous
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 270	Posted - 2013.07.04 03:06:00 - [6] - Quote man i really wish we could just get these tripled or doubled already. because right now its really pathetic
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 270	Posted - 2013.07.04 07:20:00 - [7] - Quote Ronan Elsword wrote: D legendary hero wrote: you for get 1 thing. everything does close to double damage to armor. even doubling the numbers on all armor modules wouldn't make it balanced. Because this is really double the damage- http://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/news.control/64862/1/damageprofiles.jpg and this description of a heavy is actual true then "...with armor designed to withstand concentrated small arms fire and explosives..." doesn't happen obviously certain numbers aren't right. in fact you want to tell me CCP doesn't make mistakes with their numbers go to the market place in game, and then check out the Advanced scrambler pistols. the basic aurum one costs 4000 aur right now...lol (thank you Disfool for pointing it out) explosives actually do 50% more damage to armor.
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 273	Posted - 2013.07.05 05:16:00 - [8] - Quote that could do the trick. increasing raw armor for galentes, minmintar and heavies could help as armor ends up taking large amounts of damage from everything anyway. increasing base armor and doubling (in the reactive plates case tripling or quadrupling) the values of armor mods can help balance things out a bit.
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 279	Posted - 2013.07.07 02:22:00 - [9] - Quote but if armor values were doubled or in the case of reactive plates quadrupled, you could still be effective by stacking complex damage mods. shield tankers can't stack damage mods. the speed penalty although it makes logical and realistic sense, should be removed for the sake of balance. Balance in this case is such an extreme issue that the speed reduction should be removed.
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 279	Posted - 2013.07.07 02:40:00 - [10] - Quote Killar-12 wrote: Here a more comprehensive post that the earlier ones I've made on my alt Colonel Killar Armor Reps and the reps on Reactives are fine but the problem is how slow armor is and how little armor HP is given. It's not that I want my armor to regen in ten seconds It should take a few minutes but I should be harder to kill compared to a shield tanker one on one but if his buddy comes afterwards then I'll be screwed but if he and his friend take turs their superior regen will allow them to continue coming back at full health But for in-game values Don't mess with any regen values Plate Type-----------------------------------HP-------------------------------------Movement Penalty Basic Armor Plates 100 3% Enhanced Armor Plates 150 5% Complex Armor Plates 200 7% Basic Ferroscale Plates 40 N/A Enhanced Ferroscale Plates 80 N/A Complex Ferroscale Plates 120 N/A Basic Reactive Plates 50 2% Enhanced Reactive Plates 90 4% Complex Reactive Plates 140 6% ^^this is a brilliant idea. in fact i applaud it. reparing armor by percentage is a great idea. and those values for the reactive plates gives them a purpose as right now they are inferior tech, but if this^^ were implimented things could improve. with careful monitering this could temporarily fix the shield tanking problem. againt yes shield tankers can tank harder using these, but the complex damage mods combined with this^^ and scrambler rifle tech can imporve over all galente performance

D legendary hero Strong-Arm 283	Posted - 2013.07.08 02:36:00 - [11] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: To be honest, I think they should keep reactive plates as they are and make them a high-slot module, since armor tankers still don't have a high slot armor module. Just a thought. EDIT: Since I completely neglected to read your edit: I disagree with doubling any of the plates, but rather scale them with their movement penalty, this is hardly an original idea, but it goes like this. Basic armor plates- 68 armor, 3% penalty Enhanced armor plates- 87 armor, 5% penalty But after you change it to scale with the movement penalty Basic armor plates- 68 armor, 3% penalty Enhanced armor plates- 108 armor, 5% penalty Complex armor plates- 216 armor, 10% penalty I am going off of complete memory, and I can't remember the current complex armor plate amount, but you get the idea, the 3% to 5% penalty increase is a 1.6 multiplier, so you multiply the 68 armor bonus by 1.6 and get the above amount, then the 5% to 10% increase is a 2 multiplier, so you do just that. And I think the ferroscale plates are fine as is. this could work but reactive plates are still garbage unless fixed
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 284	Posted - 2013.07.08 02:45:00 - [12] - Quote Bettie Boop 2100190003 wrote: The worst thing about the new plates is their drain on CPU & PG is way more than it should be. I understand that armor is supposed to be harder to get through at the expense of speed, though I don't see that much of a difference. The new plates with the ridiculous consumption of PG makes anything but regular plates not worth running. The only use I see for them is to put the Ferroscale on a Gallente scout so your speedie, survivable, and a surprise to the people trying to kill you. It is frustrating that these plates (long awaited by me at least) are a huge let down, because at proto level the CPU and PG consumption used by the plates make them bad alternatives at best un-useable most of the time. ^^even further reason for a buff. the CPU/PG values should be changed in such a way that it is difficult to hybrid tank (unless your minmintar, but minmintar have lower base stats and are by design supposed to be speedy and versitile). but even if the CPU/PG values stayed the same the reward you get verses the penalty of the armor, repair mods and reactive plates is all around pathetic. think about it the sacrifices you must make to armor tank, all the armor freindly mods are low power slots. granted you have the advantage of using damage mods and other speed boosters in the high slots, but at what cost? increasing the beneficial values by 100% on all mods (reactive plates by 400%) would give them a purpose. you may take a hit to speed, but you can compensate with complex damage mods, other shield extenders and the like. think about it the current basic reactive plate gives you 15 armor and 1 hp per sec. 2 of those give you 30 armor and 2 hp per second. even 1 militia armor plate and repair mod is more effective and the disparity becomes wider as you aproach proto level. if the basic reactive plates gave you 60 armor and 4 hp/s then there would be a point to using them. shields without any mods still recharge at 20hp/s anyway so there is no harm done to shield tankers this just makes armor tanking more effective.
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 284	Posted - 2013.07.08 02:49:00 - [13] - Quote XxWarlordxX97 wrote: D legendary hero wrote: I won't bother putting the math here but you can do it in your head. adding 1/2 the value of these as a hot fix, will just barely help make armor tanking a viable option. right now its abit ridiculous the reactive plates especially need a major buff, those things are almost pointless. but they are still a good idea. reactive plates should be giving you at least 60 armor and heal at a rate of 4 hp per second, with the 1% movement speed penalty. EDIT: all armor values should be doubled. all armor plates, repair modules, reactive plates (except the penalty), ferroscale, all these should have their values and bonuses doubled. What if a AR Shield and armor tank then, Is the 1 question I have well they sacrifice damage mods, for the sake of tanking. caldari can do it, minmintar can do it, galente can do it... but caldari do it better. the core issue is the base stats of the galente verses the base stats of the caldari. the galente suits can't tank as hard because they dnt have enough CPU/PG, slots and base armor to compensate for the disparity. moreover, their base movement speed should be higher than a caldari's by 33% so that after armor tanking starts their speed reduction isn't to the point of becoming a heavy.* *this is a discusion about medium frames only however. as the heavy suit has a variety of tasks it is desinged to perform but still plays a support role it needs to be treated differently as well. i discuss this in the thread entitled "heavies should have resistance to small armrs fire by 30%"
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 293	Posted - 2013.07.09 16:05:00 - [14] - Quote bump
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 340	Posted - 2013.07.10 06:23:00 - [15] - Quote ^^the point is that when a galente armor tank completely they should have the same base speed as a caldari, so untanked they should move fast. galente and minmintar = fast, amar and caldari = slow
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 341	Posted - 2013.07.10 18:13:00 - [16] - Quote remember im puttting this out as a temp fix, the issues go deep than this, down to the fundamental concepts behind sheild and armor tanking. CCP needs to look over that, but in the mean they can do this...
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 343	Posted - 2013.07.10 20:08:00 - [17] - Quote Michael Cratar wrote: D legendary hero wrote: you for get 1 thing. everything does close to double damage to armor. even doubling the numbers on all armor modules wouldn't make it balanced. if you have 2 complex armor repairs thats only 20 hp per second. a caldari milita suit gets 20 shield back by default. the shiled enegizer's make it so that shields come at impossible speeds. and seriously, doudes running around with 500+ shields that regenarate almost insantly and that are resistant to almost everything can't be good. especially since they can also armor tank because armor is a low slot acomplishment. everyone screams "OMG...THROW FLUX NADES DATZ WAT DEY DER 4...HERPIDDY DERP DERP". seriously, flux grenades are not that effective because its hit or miss, and these guys have no speed penalty they are moving rediculously fast thanks to the movement speed increase that CCP ninja'd into the game. worse yet we have the fact that even from full depletion shields recover extremely fast. scrambler rifles do wonders on shields but the semiauto one is hit or miss because people move so fast with their shields, the only real way to combate shields is to use an assault scrambler rifle, because the regular AR outguns the semi-auto everytime (which makes sense, the problem lies in that scramblers are the only practical way to combat the shield tanking) even if the values of all armor mods were doubled armor repairs slower and takes 50% more damage to everything. in fact these values should be doubled. reactive plates the basic give you 15 armor and repair your armor at 1 hp per second. thats pathetic. i round from an HMG (one bullet) does more than that. reactive plates in order to be worth anything need to be at least quadrupled otherwise there is no point to having them in the game. (60 armor and 4hp per second) keeping the 1% movement penalty the same. complex armor plates when 2 doubled would give you 230 additional armor. but think all the explosives and plasma weaponry does extra damage to armor, so it would on begin to help break even. the solution to the armor verse shield problem lies in give great values to armor modules. (the reactive plates have to be quadrupled or quintipled to even be consideed useful) 60 armor and 4hp a second, with a 1% movement penalty at basic? Im an armor tanker and even I think that is op as fk. how so? 60 armor is 2 shots from a militia AR bro. almost everything in the game does double damage to armor. 60 armor at 4hp/s doesnt mean anything to a locus grenade, a flaylock, mass driver, SMG, HMG (even though they still suck), a militia AR or any rail gun tech... in one clip a militia AR does 1600+ damage (wihout including 10% or damage mods). so under direct fire you will still die. what tis will do is allow you to survive longer while playing tactically taking cover, and help bridge the gap between dshied tankers recharge and armor repair. and reactive plates now suck ass... they need a boost like this to even be a viable option. if you double basic plates numbers from 65 to 130, the enhanced from 85 to 170 and the complex from 115 to 230 things will begin balancing out. remember, the penalty makes you an easier target and most weapons in the game right now make you take extra damage to shields. do you know holw long 230 extra ehp makes you last under direct fire? .5 of a second. a militia AR does 425 dps. so 2 complex plates will give an extra second of life. if you are playing tactically you will survive longer, and that is the point to armor tanking.
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 345	Posted - 2013.07.10 22:26:00 - [18] - Quote Killar-12 wrote: Michael Cratar wrote: D legendary hero wrote: you for get 1 thing. everything does close to double damage to armor. even doubling the numbers on all armor modules wouldn't make it balanced. if you have 2 complex armor repairs thats only 20 hp per second. a caldari milita suit gets 20 shield back by default. the shiled enegizer's make it so that shields come at impossible speeds. and seriously, doudes running around with 500+ shields that regenarate almost insantly and that are resistant to almost everything can't be good. especially since they can also armor tank because armor is a low slot acomplishment. everyone screams "OMG...THROW FLUX NADES DATZ WAT DEY DER 4...HERPIDDY DERP DERP". seriously, flux grenades are not that effective because its hit or miss, and these guys have no speed penalty they are moving rediculously fast thanks to the movement speed increase that CCP ninja'd into the game. worse yet we have the fact that even from full depletion shields recover extremely fast. scrambler rifles do wonders on shields but the semiauto one is hit or miss because people move so fast with their shields, the only real way to combate shields is to use an assault scrambler rifle, because the regular AR outguns the semi-auto everytime (which makes sense, the problem lies in that scramblers are the only practical way to combat the shield tanking) even if the values of all armor mods were doubled armor repairs slower and takes 50% more damage to everything. in fact these values should be doubled. reactive plates the basic give you 15 armor and repair your armor at 1 hp per second. thats pathetic. i round from an HMG (one bullet) does more than that. reactive plates in order to be worth anything need to be at least quadrupled otherwise there is no point to having them in the game. (60 armor and 4hp per second) keeping the 1% movement penalty the same. complex armor plates when 2 doubled would give you 230 additional armor. but think all the explosives and plasma weaponry does extra damage to armor, so it would on begin to help break even. the solution to the armor verse shield problem lies in give great values to armor modules. (the reactive plates have to be quadrupled or quintipled to even be consideed useful) 60 armor and 4hp a second, with a 1% movement penalty at basic? Im an armor tanker and even I think that is op as fk. it's only 2hp/s not 4 hp if its quadrupled it would become 4hp/sec but even that is not alot.
D legendary hero Strong-Arm 345	Posted - 2013.07.10 22:27:00 - [19] - Quote Booby Tuesdays wrote: Was messing around with fits the other day and I discovered either a glitch or a perk to ferroscale plates. Using my minmitar logi fit and my dragonfly scout fit I noticed something strange. I put a basic armor plate on both dropsuits, giving me a 3% movement penalty. I then began stacking ferroscale plates, both basic and enhanced. The results were the same, each time I added a ferroscale plate, a little of my movement penalty was diminished. Eventually I was down to a 2% movement penalty, and had an extra 130 armor. Anyone else notice this? shhhhh
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 354	Posted - 2013.07.12 15:38:00 - [20] - Quote bump

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 355	Posted - 2013.07.14 05:58:00 - [21] - Quote 2-Ton Twenty-One wrote: +1 Im a heavy and ignore all the armor plates. i do too... i move slow enough moving slow with extra armor that takes extra damage and only gives approximately 2 seconds more of life verses a militia AR isn't worth the effort
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 355	Posted - 2013.07.14 06:01:00 - [22] - Quote also default galente suit stats need to be increased so that when the armor plates are added they are slowed down to an average speed, but not to a painfully slow speed. 1. since galente according to lore use mostly armor, it is ludicrous that they do not have a base armor repair rate and get bonuses that benefit armor repairing. this should be implimented. 2. their starting speed is too slow, either caldari suits need a lower speed or galentes need a speed buff.* *amar speed as a suit is fine, and minmintar must be the fastest so no ones speed should come near theirs.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 368	Posted - 2013.07.16 12:46:00 - [23] - Quote Vavilia Lysenko wrote: D legendary hero wrote: I won't bother putting the math here but you can do it in your head. adding 1/2 the value of these as a hot fix, will just barely help make armor tanking a viable option. right now its abit ridiculous the reactive plates especially need a major buff, those things are almost pointless. but they are still a good idea. reactive plates should be giving you at least 60 armor and heal at a rate of 4 hp per second, with the 1% movement speed penalty. EDIT: all armor values should be doubled. all armor plates, repair modules, reactive plates (except the penalty), ferroscale, all these should have their values and bonuses doubled. Silly OP, these armour plates are designed for shield tankers, didn't you not know that? If they made them any use for Armour Tankers that would not be fair, now would it. they need to adjust the CPU/PG requirements for shield mods to prevent hybrid tanking
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 368	Posted - 2013.07.16 13:02:00 - [24] - Quote 2-Ton Twenty-One wrote: XxWarlordxX97 wrote: 2-Ton Twenty-One wrote: +1 Im a heavy and ignore all the armor plates. Why? Because you realize while your fighting other suits your ability to move in and out of cover quickly is probably one of your most important skills, If you load up on plates that means your going to get to cover that % slower, and because your FOV is less then your heavy suit hitbox IE your heavy suit is firing from beside a wall then takes fire and moves its body fully behind said wall you will be taking that % more dmg before your Hitbox is fully behind cover, that % of hit based fire is MORE then the amount of tank you are going to get out of the Plates! that is the problem, if you move 10% slower and you need to move your body behind a wall OB is going to take you 10% more time to get there, and seeing as how the plates are not absorbing 10% more damage for the Heavy suit you end up handicapping yourself!! MATH people MATH! BTW this should be its own thread as to WHY doing armor plates in any major capacity as a heavy is Worthless! Its far less noticeable with the faster suits because the enemy weapon ROF is the constant! see? basic, this is another good reason. you can start the post ill respond to it. another is simply the fact that i doesnt increase your life expectance by any significant length of time. if i had 2 complex armor plates, thats 230 hp... a militia AR does a dps of 425 so i survive .5 of a second longer than if i didnt have it. but my actual life expectancy decreases because realistically: 1. when enemies see a heavy they all concentrate fire on him. 2. your surviva time underfire do to your inate low monbility eans you only take 1-2 more shots from an AR.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 368	Posted - 2013.07.17 02:55:00 - [25] - Quote Purona wrote: D legendary hero wrote: basic, this is another good reason. you can start the post ill respond to it. another is simply the fact that i doesnt increase your life expectance by any significant length of time. if i had 2 complex armor plates, thats 230 hp... a militia AR does a dps of 425 so i survive .5 of a second longer than if i didnt have it. but my actual life expectancy decreases because realistically: 1. when enemies see a heavy they all concentrate fire on him. 2. your surviva time underfire do to your inate low monbility eans you only take 1-2 more shots from an AR. it has its damage reduced to 385 as to your second point get a logi ? no its damage is still 425 because of the bonus 10% give all weapons.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 368	Posted - 2013.07.17 02:56:00 - [26] - Quote McFurious wrote: How about high slot armor hardeners? actually this would be a great idea. and a skill that reduced damage to armor by upto 20% for galente suits. minmintar would have a skill that increases resistance to armor, shield damage by 5% per lvl and gives a 2% bonus movement speed. because they are supposed to be versitile and have basically no shield/armor anyway.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 383	Posted - 2013.07.17 19:00:00 - [27] - Quote this is a good solution
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 389	Posted - 2013.07.19 03:56:00 - [28] - Quote the reason why i requested that the reactive plates have their values fixed is because right now there is no benefit to using them. they are worse than preexisting plates. i mean serious 15 hp and 1 per second? 2 x reactive plates = 30 and 2 hp/s 1 basic plate and 1 militia rep = 85 and 2 hp anyone who can add knows that reactive plates are garbage. now if the values were doubled, where 1 reactive plate gives you 30 hp and reps at 2 hp/s then 2 x reactive plates = 60 hp and 4 hp/s which would make them better than preexisting gear but at the cost of the 25 hp. if it where quadrupled. where 1 reactive plate gives 60 hp and 4hp/s, and basic armor mods were doubled, then 1 basic armor plate = 170 and armor rep =4 hp/s; then 2 x reactive plates = 120 hp and 8hp/s 1 basic plate and 1 militia rep = 170 and 4 hp/s these values are nt op considering that dps is always higher than 300 for all weapons, so in the limiting case a breach AR can still kill you if he hits you, explosives will still do the 20% more damage, and projectives will still be sightly more effective, but in this way shield tankers survivablility will be much higher under the pressure of a fire fight.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 389	Posted - 2013.07.19 04:06:00 - [29] - Quote Killar-12 wrote: Why Increase reps? I'm just interested why you would say that. shields have a slight delay before reping, but once they do, they recover at enormus rates 20+ hp/s. if i have 400 shields and they are depleted after my 3-4 second own time, and my hp heals at 20 per second in 24 seconds my shields are full if i have 400 armor and i am at 0 armor (and still alive), with two 4 complex armor repairers i heal at 20 hp/s, so i get to 400 in 20 seconds. may look balanced but there are several things to keep in mind: 1. 20 hp/s for sheilds is a basic level and can be increased, (with shield enegizers you can heal shield at almost 50 hp/s) 2. this is assuming i have complex level amor repairers. even with proficiency it doesn't equal the sheids superiority in this matter 3. when shields are gone you have armor, when armor is gone your dead. 4. due to high dps of most guns under direct fire this will not impact longevity.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 390	Posted - 2013.07.19 15:32:00 - [30] - Quote this is my point^^. than in the most extreme case (using a proto amarr heavy, or proto galente) you can baerly break even with shields on a militia suit. basically if it takes max skills for armor reping to get even with militia level base shield repairing (when unaltered) then there is a serious problem.

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 441	Posted - 2013.07.23 18:52:00 - [31] - Quote which is why im just giving them more armor because in the long run it disappears faster and recovers slower