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Malkai Inos
Opus Arcana
468
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Posted - 2013.06.26 23:14:00 -
[1] - Quote
This fits oh so nicely
Malkai Inos wrote:
The only possible justification for limited respecs after adding new content that i find actually usefull is "respec for racial symmetry" i.e the notion that any type of gear or niche should be represented in all four races and people should not be penalized for preferring a racial variant that is not yet available. For example, heavy users can opt in to relocate their heavy suit skills to another racial equivalent once it's released.
This should not apply to the release of completely new roles as all players can choose to specialize into that role at the same time, even if it's not their preferred racial variant. It does however apply to any role that gets a racial variant added so once you specced into amarr commando just as everyone else who wanted to play a commando you can have your amarr commando skills changed to your preferred racial variant once. This means that no one is excluded from playing that role from the second it's released and everyone can switch their SP into the preferred race after release so that in effect no one is really penalized in the long run.
So basically +1 even though i would be ok with no respecs aswell |
Malkai Inos
Opus Arcana
473
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 00:15:00 -
[2] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:KEROSIINI-TERO wrote:No please because this game is never supposed to be ready; there is going to always be new stuff behing corner to keep us hooked.
Using the logic that 'if new content is being released everyone DESERVES a respec we would have neverending stream of respecs. Or people petitioning for them.
If you want to max out on day one the brand new suit that's gonna be released, you'd better save some SP. Or wait a bit longer, it isn't that bad. Really. I said ONLY for the variants of existing stuff, NOT for things like MTACs, fighters, and other completely new types of items.
How do you feel about extending this to generally apply to missing racial symmetry, already existing or not. The way i see it we will have this discussion again whenever new content is released without all four racial variants in place. |
Malkai Inos
Opus Arcana
473
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 00:22:00 -
[3] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Malkai Inos wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:KEROSIINI-TERO wrote:No please because this game is never supposed to be ready; there is going to always be new stuff behing corner to keep us hooked.
Using the logic that 'if new content is being released everyone DESERVES a respec we would have neverending stream of respecs. Or people petitioning for them.
If you want to max out on day one the brand new suit that's gonna be released, you'd better save some SP. Or wait a bit longer, it isn't that bad. Really. I said ONLY for the variants of existing stuff, NOT for things like MTACs, fighters, and other completely new types of items. How do you feel about extending this to generally apply to missing racial symmetry, already existing or not. The way i see it we will have this discussion again whenever new content is released without all four racial variants in place. Example? Caldari MTACs beeing released first, others following a few months later => three quarters of users demand a respec because they actually wanted to use a racial equivalent and moan about beeing forced to effectively retrain their current role.
Not that i support this kind of reasoning but it's already clear that this will happen whenever new content is not released with racial symmetry. I think we should account for this if we really have to go down the respec route. My first reply is pretty much identical to your proposal with the only difference beeing that it's designed to become a general rule instead of beeing limited to some point in time. |
Malkai Inos
Opus Arcana
474
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 00:49:00 -
[4] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Malkai Inos wrote:Caldari MTACs beeing released first, others following a few months later => three quarters of users demand a respec because they actually wanted to use a racial equivalent and moan about beeing forced to effectively retrain their current role.
Not that i support this kind of reasoning but it's already clear that this will happen whenever new content is not released with racial symmetry. I think we should account for this if we really have to go down the respec route. My first reply is pretty much identical to your proposal with the only difference beeing that it's designed to become a general rule instead of beeing limited to some point in time. I would be ok if there were more respecs for stuff like that, but I personally don't think its needed.
To be quite honest i don't think any of this is needed as i'm on the "preserve SP, spec when released, done" side of the debate.
What i'm arguing is that if we were to allow respecs for "basic" things like heavies, ARs and others why not for "non-basic" stuff like MTACs? What's the difference between those two anyway, other than that one exists now but only partially and the other beeing released later but still only partially? MTACs and jets will be the primary role for many players just as HAVs wich you included into your list. They will face the same issues that current heavy, LAV, HAV, and DS users face now and for this reason i see no justification for treating them differently just because the one are released and the others aren't.
My proposal boils down to "Grace period for one limited respec from one racial equivalent to another whenever a new racial equivalent gets released".
That locks FOTM abuse right out of the door and gives a clear rules for wether an addition warrants a respec and why. |
Malkai Inos
Opus Arcana
Covert Intervention
482
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Posted - 2013.06.27 16:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
Daxxis KANNAH wrote:Only for the respec because I know its going to be tricky for CCP to pull off giving optional refunds in the respective skills to allow switching to your racial variant.
If I'm wrong and that isnt a technical hurdle, I would prefer that.
Really hoping we get some of the racial stuff in 1.3 and all in by end of the year. Then we can bury this respec talk for good. It's proably just sql or a similar database language so while a fixed system would eat development hours, once finished though it's hardly more than setting a few variables and hitting a button from that point on.
To the last point i completely agree. Racial symmetry is the only reason for limited respecs that i find barely acceptable due to it's limited scope and i'd rather have CCP releases all four versions of gear simultaneously in the future so that we can bury this respec debate once and for all. |
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