DUST Search - Remove Damage and Shield/Armor enhancers

Colonel Killar wrote:

Chinduko wrote:

Colonel Killar wrote:

Draco Dustflier wrote:

Health and damage increases don't add depth to dust. They're nothing but a crutch for the unskilled. At least with the other mods the advantage is situational. Profile dampening or extra stamina won't help much if you just run at people like you can ith a shield tank. More health means that you don't have to react as quickly whilst being shot at, and more damage means you can get away with missing your shots more often. Also, extra health or damage outweighs any other bonus possible, in all games. We see it with stopping power in mw2 and magnum ammo in bad compwny 2, and we see it with the hewvy suits in MAG.

Systems like these cater to the unskilled, allowing a **** poor proto player to do as well as an mlg pro in militia armor. When you cater to the unskilled, the people who are actually decent at fps will melt through all opposition (Aldin Kan is a perfect example) once they get their hands on it.

To the Op: You will never convince these people on these forums to give up their precious health increases. They don't realize how much of an effect it has on gameplay. All they know is that if they had to compete on the same level as all other suits, they would die, over and over and over again. The good news is that in a few months, the game will die and we intelligent people will be able to laugh at them as they get obliterwted in any modern fps they try to play!

but it's also a RPG and in RPGs the ablity to buff health and damage is not uncommon

Dust's main website Dust514.com advertises Dust as an MMO Shooter which is a massive multiplayer online shooter which isn't the same as an MMORPG like FFXIV. CCP made the game and MMO shooter is what they state is it's genre.

then no bounuses at all, and everyone has to use an AR too


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 239	Posted - 2013.06.26 16:11:00 - [1] - Quote Remove damage, shield/armor enhancers from modules and skill points. This will balance the game for new and experienced players by allowing everyone the same potential for kills. This will make Dust a game that is based on individual player skill and not from equipment and SP bonuses. The damage and HP enhancers are great but when new players are put at a huge disadvantage when competing, they will not likely remain. This is your balance. Experienced players and teams will still have the experience to kill while new players will not be nearly as overwhelmed by players with overly high HP and damage enhancement. Logi suits will no longer be more powerful than assault. Heavy suits will always be the highest HP suit. Scouts will become more useful, even with fewer module slots and low HP. The number of modules on any suit could even be increased while not giving an unfair advantage of OP damage or HP. Edit moved to feedback and requests
Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 239	Posted - 2013.06.26 16:24:00 - [2] - Quote Fearless Speech wrote: How many people in academy fights are running fully tanked proto suits? New players only face other new players / SPless alts. Extend academy (my understanding is its currently to 1mil sp) to 2 or 3 mil. /done It's hard on new players, indeed. I received 3 alt respecs and finally used the points on one alt. With 3.6 million SP, I was only able to get proto uplinks and still couldn't get a prototype gallente Scout suit. Not the Basic but the Scout. I can see why new players have it extremely difficult and are not likely to stay.
Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 239	Posted - 2013.06.26 16:45:00 - [3] - Quote I understand some concern. It's not easy to want to give up an obvious advantage. But, it is a huge advantage to have all the extra HP and damage CCP allows, nonetheless. CCP can either attempt to attract new players or push them away by allowing such overly advantageous enhancements to high SP players. If damage and shield/armor enhancements is what makes Dust what it is, then I was mistaken. I thought Dust was more. Damage and HP are not the only skills that players can place skill points. They are only a fraction of what is available. CCP will likely not remove this advantage but it will not attract new players. I for one like casual players. I can usually beat them without damage and HP enhancements and I'm not a highly skilled player. But I suppose for those that may lack skill, you may need the enhancements to compete.
Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 241	Posted - 2013.06.26 17:56:00 - [4] - Quote CCP, you can see that, quite possibly, the majority of forum participants are not likely to want a removal of the advantage they have with damage and HP enhancements. This is not a surprise. It is completely expected As for match making; PC was your first attempt at matchmaking. It failed. Before that, militia or standard only gear modes were an option given by players. I'm all for militia/standard only modes but it would possibly split up the already small player base. It is worth a shot, however. If you want to make an attempt to keep new players, militia/std game mode is a good option and I would enjoy seeing this. Removing damage and HP enhancers is also a good option but will not reduce game modes player counts. If you make a militia/std mode, it would be preferable to create one for Ambush and Skirmish at least, but some players also enjoy Domination. This splits the players up, potentially increasing longer wait times to find a match, in the long run especially. Removing all damage and hp enhancement will not split the player base and will still put all players on equal ground with killing capacity while skill becomes the most important quality. This will help increase new player retention by giving them a much better chance to compete while more skilled players will still dominate. This is the way a FPS should be. This is how popular FPS games are. The game will still have the variety of skills to put SP in such as different weapons, boitics, electronics, and engineering which still allows players to create many numerous types of individualized builds. You can have you cake and eat it too. It's an old saying meaning you can have the best of both worlds. In reference to Dust you'd have increased player retention and better balanced matches.
Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 243	Posted - 2013.06.26 19:53:00 - [5] - Quote Dust Project 514 wrote: Dear, CCP. Please buff all weapons to perform one hit kills, due to players surviving too long from weak weapons. I don't think that would be a good idea. If it only took one bullet to kill that would make the shotgun useless when an AR has much better range. Unless, every single pellet in a shotgun shell could kill, that could make the shotgun very powerful against groups if it has a high spread.
Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 243	Posted - 2013.06.26 21:24:00 - [6] - Quote Eriknaught wrote: Chinduko wrote: Remove damage, shield/armor enhancers from modules and skill points. This will balance the game for new and experienced players by allowing everyone the same potential for kills. This will make Dust a game that is based on individual player skill and not from equipment and SP bonuses. The damage and HP enhancers are great but when new players are put at a huge disadvantage when competing, they will not likely remain. This is your balance. Experienced players and teams will still have the experience to kill while new players will not be nearly as overwhelmed by players with overly high HP and damage enhancement. Logi suits will no longer be more powerful than assault. Heavy suits will always be the highest HP suit. Scouts will become more useful, even with fewer module slots and low HP. The number of modules on any suit could even be increased while not giving an unfair advantage of OP damage or HP. Edit moved to feedback and requests Why stop with Damage Modifiers and Shield/Armor Extenders? ALL modules give an advantage. Isn't it unfair to you if I have 40ish% Profile Dampening? Maybe this kind of game immersion isn't for you, just saying. That is all. Eriknaught out. END TRANSMISSION. You get an advantage from every skill but the damage and hp enhancement gives the most advantage. I would argue that it takes more to be able to sneak up on a player or group and get the kills while wearing a dampener. Since most scanning doesn't work or only works a partial amount of time, HP and damage are much more useful. I used the precision enhancer, dampener, and active scanner. They're good for recon or intel but they won't kill faster if you don't have the damage enhancement which you could have while also wearing the dampener.
Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 245	Posted - 2013.06.26 21:53:00 - [7] - Quote A'Real Fury wrote: I think that a militia/std match would resolve many of the new starter problems after leaving the academy and it will them a chance to speak to the vets without being faced with protobears. However, significant improvements need to be made to the academy particularly in respect of educating the new player about the options available to them, what the objectives are in each mode and how to survive. I agree. A militia/std only idea would possibly be a perfect solution but CCP has failed to move this idea along. They've had plenty of time for matchmaking. They failed with PC matchmaking and they failed with the Academy. They may not have many options left. I'd truly would prefer to have a militia/std game mode over my idea but CCP haven't mentioned anything about this so I assume they don't like it. I will say that I like my idea but the majority of forum goers don't. CCP does seem to do things that the community doesn't like so why not put my idea in. After all, we didn't need these but they nerfed the HMG range MD splash, Laser focus damage and added a bluky sight, heavy and scout suit with too few modules while over buffing the medium suits with extra modules. When they said we needed more HP to move to Uprising, they eventually increased all weapon damage to compensate. We didn't need the extra HP, otherwise they wouldn't have felt the need to increase weapon damage. I'd prefer to totally go back to Chromosome or have a militia/std mode but that won't happen so something has to give or the player base will continue to diminish.
Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 246	Posted - 2013.06.26 23:32:00 - [8] - Quote Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Paran Tadec wrote: Fearless Speech wrote: Chinduko wrote: Remove damage, shield/armor enhancers from modules and skill points. This will balance the game for new and experienced players by allowing everyone the same potential for kills. This will make Dust a game that is based on individual player skill and not from equipment and SP bonuses. The damage and HP enhancers are great but when new players are put at a huge disadvantage when competing, they will not likely remain. This is your balance. Experienced players and teams will still have the experience to kill while new players will not be nearly as overwhelmed by players with overly high HP and damage enhancement. Logi suits will no longer be more powerful than assault. Heavy suits will always be the highest HP suit. Scouts will become more useful, even with fewer module slots and low HP. The number of modules on any suit could even be increased while not giving an unfair advantage of OP damage or HP. Edit moved to feedback and requests How many people in academy fights are running fully tanked proto suits? New players only face other new players / SPless alts. Extend academy (my understanding is its currently to 1mil sp) to 2 or 3 mil. /done Again, its only the cal logi that is a problem. this This isn't to secretly nerf the caldari logi. Removing damage and HP enhancements affects us all in order to give new player a fighting chance increasing the likelihood they might actually continue playing Dust.
Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 246	Posted - 2013.06.27 01:07:00 - [9] - Quote Draco Dustflier wrote: Health and damage increases don't add depth to dust. They're nothing but a crutch for the unskilled. At least with the other mods the advantage is situational. Profile dampening or extra stamina won't help much if you just run at people like you can ith a shield tank. More health means that you don't have to react as quickly whilst being shot at, and more damage means you can get away with missing your shots more often. Also, extra health or damage outweighs any other bonus possible, in all games. We see it with stopping power in mw2 and magnum ammo in bad compwny 2, and we see it with the hewvy suits in MAG. Systems like these cater to the unskilled, allowing a **** poor proto player to do as well as an mlg pro in militia armor. When you cater to the unskilled, the people who are actually decent at fps will melt through all opposition (Aldin Kan is a perfect example) once they get their hands on it. To the Op: You will never convince these people on these forums to give up their precious health increases. They don't realize how much of an effect it has on gameplay. All they know is that if they had to compete on the same level as all other suits, they would die, over and over and over again. The good news is that in a few months, the game will die and we intelligent people will be able to laugh at them as they get obliterwted in any modern fps they try to play! I knew this from the beginning but a thread of this nature has never been done before to my knowledge. I figured someone should bring it to light. I do agree that if Dust stays the path it's on, it won't last near the 7-10 years it's projected. A familiar game is MAG. It lasted about 3 years. Even thought people still play it, the player base extremely small. It did however start with a much greater player base than Dust and had the same type of passionate community support Dust has. After maybe 2 years, MAG's player base may have been where Dust's is now. Technically Dust has only been released for a couple of months. I'm not excited to see the player base in a mere two years.
Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 246	Posted - 2013.06.27 01:11:00 - [10] - Quote Colonel Killar wrote: Draco Dustflier wrote: Health and damage increases don't add depth to dust. They're nothing but a crutch for the unskilled. At least with the other mods the advantage is situational. Profile dampening or extra stamina won't help much if you just run at people like you can ith a shield tank. More health means that you don't have to react as quickly whilst being shot at, and more damage means you can get away with missing your shots more often. Also, extra health or damage outweighs any other bonus possible, in all games. We see it with stopping power in mw2 and magnum ammo in bad compwny 2, and we see it with the hewvy suits in MAG. Systems like these cater to the unskilled, allowing a **** poor proto player to do as well as an mlg pro in militia armor. When you cater to the unskilled, the people who are actually decent at fps will melt through all opposition (Aldin Kan is a perfect example) once they get their hands on it. To the Op: You will never convince these people on these forums to give up their precious health increases. They don't realize how much of an effect it has on gameplay. All they know is that if they had to compete on the same level as all other suits, they would die, over and over and over again. The good news is that in a few months, the game will die and we intelligent people will be able to laugh at them as they get obliterwted in any modern fps they try to play! but it's also a RPG and in RPGs the ablity to buff health and damage is not uncommon Dust's main website Dust514.com advertises Dust as an MMO Shooter which is a massive multiplayer online shooter which isn't the same as an MMORPG like FFXIV. CCP made the game and MMO shooter is what they state is it's genre.

Chinduko KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 247	Posted - 2013.06.27 03:16:00 - [11] - Quote Colonel Killar wrote: Chinduko wrote: Colonel Killar wrote: Draco Dustflier wrote: Health and damage increases don't add depth to dust. They're nothing but a crutch for the unskilled. At least with the other mods the advantage is situational. Profile dampening or extra stamina won't help much if you just run at people like you can ith a shield tank. More health means that you don't have to react as quickly whilst being shot at, and more damage means you can get away with missing your shots more often. Also, extra health or damage outweighs any other bonus possible, in all games. We see it with stopping power in mw2 and magnum ammo in bad compwny 2, and we see it with the hewvy suits in MAG. Systems like these cater to the unskilled, allowing a **** poor proto player to do as well as an mlg pro in militia armor. When you cater to the unskilled, the people who are actually decent at fps will melt through all opposition (Aldin Kan is a perfect example) once they get their hands on it. To the Op: You will never convince these people on these forums to give up their precious health increases. They don't realize how much of an effect it has on gameplay. All they know is that if they had to compete on the same level as all other suits, they would die, over and over and over again. The good news is that in a few months, the game will die and we intelligent people will be able to laugh at them as they get obliterwted in any modern fps they try to play! but it's also a RPG and in RPGs the ablity to buff health and damage is not uncommon Dust's main website Dust514.com advertises Dust as an MMO Shooter which is a massive multiplayer online shooter which isn't the same as an MMORPG like FFXIV. CCP made the game and MMO shooter is what they state is it's genre. then no bounuses at all, and everyone has to use an AR too I wouldn't take away all bonuses if I were CCP, only damage and hp enhancement. There are always the skills of hacking, biotics, uplinks. etc.... Even though the AR is the most useful weapon, I wouldn't take away all the other guns. CCP may actually balance the weapons one day.