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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
186
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:30:00 -
[1] - Quote
So after acknowledging that armor and shields were imbalanced after reading a 16 page post you guys haven't learned jack squat. Did you know that the only way for armor and shields to be balanced was for it to be possible for armor suits to stack reactive plates without a penalty? Did you know that because armor has no passive regen and since reppers take low slot we willalways be inferior? No you didn't. When those plates come out are tou aware at how far stronger shield tankers will be by stacking ferroplates? No you didn't. Im not even going to waste my time adding up numbers to show how idiotic this balance is. Enjoy this build my fellow Gallente and Amarr, its only going to get worse.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_LlH2c5dyA |
Lilah Silverstone
The Arrow Project
79
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:32:00 -
[2] - Quote
Regular frames are getting per level bonuses IIRC Gallente and Amarr will probably get a speed increase per level. Also calm the F down son. |
J-Lewis
Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation
119
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:34:00 -
[3] - Quote
Unless there's a massive overhaul in racial bonuses and stats, I fear OP may have a point. |
RKKR
The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION
52
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:39:00 -
[4] - Quote
Well, one can hope they adjusted numbers since they made that vid |
StubbyDucky
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
187
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:40:00 -
[5] - Quote
Ohh look someone who still cares and will still be playing this game. Rare breed you are. |
Cosgar
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
1346
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:43:00 -
[6] - Quote
J-Lewis wrote:Unless there's a massive overhaul in racial bonuses and stats, I fear OP may have a point. I think you're onto something. Gallente and Amarr suits need a bonus to %Armor regen and/or efficiency. |
Anarchide
Greedy Bastards
73
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:44:00 -
[7] - Quote
StubbyDucky wrote:Ohh look someone who still cares and will still be playing this game. Rare breed you are.
Sir, next to you, Grumpy Cat is a party animal. |
IamI3rian
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
160
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:44:00 -
[8] - Quote
StubbyDucky wrote:Ohh look someone who still cares and will still be playing this game. Rare breed you are.
Doubt it. |
J-Lewis
Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation
120
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:44:00 -
[9] - Quote
Cosgar wrote:J-Lewis wrote:Unless there's a massive overhaul in racial bonuses and stats, I fear OP may have a point. I think you're onto something. Gallente and Amarr suits need a bonus to %Armor regen and/or efficiency. IKR! I'd like to know who thought Amarr should have equal shields and armor... |
Xander Mercy
SVER True Blood Public Disorder.
142
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:45:00 -
[10] - Quote
you ppl complain too much |
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Chunky Munkey
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
544
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:45:00 -
[11] - Quote
Armour deserves a module for high slots to increase its effectiveness. Perhaps a passive damage resistance module, or maybe even moving the armour reppers into the high slots. |
xLTShinySidesx
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
391
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:50:00 -
[12] - Quote
Chunky Munkey wrote:Armour deserves a module for high slots to increase its effectiveness. Perhaps a passive damage resistance module, or maybe even moving the armour reppers into the high slots.
Shield extenders and rechargers are both high slots just like armour and repair are both low slots, yeah I know shields have auto recharge. |
Leither Yiltron
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
538
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:54:00 -
[13] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:So after acknowledging that armor and shields were imbalanced after reading a 16 page post you guys haven't learned jack squat. Did you know that the only way for armor and shields to be balanced was for it to be possible for armor suits to stack reactive plates without a penalty? Did you know that because armor has no passive regen and since reppers take low slot we willalways be inferior? No you didn't. When those plates come out are tou aware at how far stronger shield tankers will be by stacking ferroplates? No you didn't. Im not even going to waste my time adding up numbers to show how idiotic this balance is. Enjoy this build my fellow Gallente and Amarr, its only going to get worse. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_LlH2c5dyA
I think you're overreacting (dat pun).
Shield tankers are starting to hit a very clear line where the CPU/PG requirements of modules are relevant determining factors, even with skills. The proliferation of logistics suits as an acceptable fulfillment of the assault role have made that less apparent as of late, but to put it into perspective, here's what a standard high-level shield tanker typically "needs":
(1) 3-4 shield extenders in high slots (2) 2-3 pieces of equipment. Even stable equipment counts (3) At least 1 armor repper (4) Proto grenades (5) Proto sidearm (?)
The PG/CPU starts to count up, and the low slots are the ones that support CPU/PG extenders as well.
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Cosgar
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
1348
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:56:00 -
[14] - Quote
J-Lewis wrote:Cosgar wrote:J-Lewis wrote:Unless there's a massive overhaul in racial bonuses and stats, I fear OP may have a point. I think you're onto something. Gallente and Amarr suits need a bonus to %Armor regen and/or efficiency. IKR! I'd like to know who thought Amarr should have equal shields and armor... And Minmatar are known for their great shield tanking right? |
True Adamance
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
133
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Posted - 2013.06.11 20:58:00 -
[15] - Quote
Leither Yiltron wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:So after acknowledging that armor and shields were imbalanced after reading a 16 page post you guys haven't learned jack squat. Did you know that the only way for armor and shields to be balanced was for it to be possible for armor suits to stack reactive plates without a penalty? Did you know that because armor has no passive regen and since reppers take low slot we willalways be inferior? No you didn't. When those plates come out are tou aware at how far stronger shield tankers will be by stacking ferroplates? No you didn't. Im not even going to waste my time adding up numbers to show how idiotic this balance is. Enjoy this build my fellow Gallente and Amarr, its only going to get worse. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_LlH2c5dyA I think you're overreacting (dat pun). Shield tankers are starting to hit a very clear line where the CPU/PG requirements of modules are relevant determining factors, even with skills. The proliferation of logistics suits as an acceptable fulfillment of the assault role have made that less apparent as of late, but to put it into perspective, here's what a standard high-level shield tanker typically "needs": (1) 3-4 shield extenders in high slots (2) 2-3 pieces of equipment. Even stable equipment counts (3) At least 1 armor repper (4) Proto grenades (5) Proto sidearm (?) The PG/CPU starts to count up, and the low slots are the ones that support CPU/PG extenders as well.
True I would love the see Shield Regulators become High Slot items, then there will be less stacking of such extender modules. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
887
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:00:00 -
[16] - Quote
>Threadnaught on armour vs shield >CCP ignores all points and does what they were doing anyway
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5069
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:06:00 -
[17] - Quote
Ahem,
As it stands now the bonusing system that determines how and what effect each other is bare bones. That is why none of the logi-suits have bonuses that affect equipment as you think they would.
This is getting fixed so hopefully gallente can be more gallente and amarr be more amarr ect ect.
ETA on this will be ongoing however. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
887
|
Posted - 2013.06.11 21:24:00 -
[18] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Ahem,
As it stands now the bonusing system that determines how and what effect each other is bare bones. That is why none of the logi-suits have bonuses that affect equipment as you think they would.
This is getting fixed so hopefully gallente can be more gallente and amarr be more amarr ect ect.
ETA on this will be ongoing however.
That does not solve the armour issue, at all. It instead encourages another group of dropsuits to use an inferior type of tank, and becomes effectively a nerf when the core armour system is this bad. |
Novawolf McDustingham The514th
The Official Mintchip Fanclub
226
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:29:00 -
[19] - Quote
Anyone using a sheild recharger is doing it wrong.
It's all about dem regulators, son. And also about them Ferroscale plates. Like, I used to have a hard time deciding what to put in the low slot after I piled shield extenders in the high, a rep, and a regulator, but now I have my answer...
The more I see what they have in mind for this game the more I thin that maybe Mintchip is the answer we're all looking for.
Save us Mintchip, *Bzzzt* you're our only hope. |
Gunner Nightingale
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
722
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:33:00 -
[20] - Quote
Novawolf McDustingham The514th wrote:Anyone using a sheild recharger is doing it wrong.
It's all about dem regulators, son. And also about them Ferroscale plates. Like, I used to have a hard time deciding what to put in the low slot after I piled shield extenders in the high, a rep, and a regulator, but now I have my answer...
The more I see what they have in mind for this game the more I thin that maybe Mintchip is the answer we're all looking for.
Save us Mintchip, *Bzzzt* you're our only hope.
Actually our only hope is PS4, it will save us from holding onto our PS3's and we can finally be rid of this crap game for good.
Looking forward to see the Dust in my rear view mirror.
#waytoletitallgotoshitCCP |
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Ynned Ivanova
Haul Ass Transportation
4
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:38:00 -
[21] - Quote
Why wait? Sod off now and let those that enjoy it play in peace. |
Reefersmokintaz
Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State
40
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:39:00 -
[22] - Quote
Only suits that have a passive armor regen is Minmatar. Also, Minmatar should be the ones that equal shield and armor. IMHO, Minmatar and Amarr should swap shield, armor and passive armor regen numbers and THEN it would look about right... One reason why I use Minnie suits lol. It has saved my ass MANY times! |
IamI3rian
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
161
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:42:00 -
[23] - Quote
Novawolf McDustingham The514th wrote:Anyone using a sheild recharger is doing it wrong.
It's all about dem regulators, son....
A recharger AND a regulator is pretty nice. Just throwing that out there. IMO anyone NOT using a recharger is doing it wrong... unless you wanna wait a few weeks for your shields to actually finish recharging. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
888
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:49:00 -
[24] - Quote
IamI3rian wrote:Novawolf McDustingham The514th wrote:Anyone using a sheild recharger is doing it wrong.
It's all about dem regulators, son.... A recharger AND a regulator is pretty nice. Just throwing that out there. IMO anyone NOT using a recharger is doing it wrong... unless you wanna wait a few weeks for your shields to actually finish recharging.
Armour repairers repair slower than shields base recharge rate, even if you stack them. Someone told me that the regen was equal earlier. |
Another Heavy SOB
TRUE TEA BAGGERS EoN.
133
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:49:00 -
[25] - Quote
Reefersmokintaz wrote:Only suits that have a passive armor regen is Minmatar. Also, Minmatar should be the ones that equal shield and armor. IMHO, Minmatar and Amarr should swap shield, armor and passive armor regen numbers and THEN it would look about right... One reason why I use Minnie suits lol. It has saved my ass MANY times!
The logistics role bonus is +1 Armor repair per level. That is regardless of race. |
Novawolf McDustingham The514th
The Official Mintchip Fanclub
227
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:53:00 -
[26] - Quote
IamI3rian wrote:Novawolf McDustingham The514th wrote:Anyone using a sheild recharger is doing it wrong.
It's all about dem regulators, son.... A recharger AND a regulator is pretty nice. Just throwing that out there. IMO anyone NOT using a recharger is doing it wrong... unless you wanna wait a few weeks for your shields to actually finish recharging.
Yeah, but why sacrifice the slot for a recharger when it can go to another extender or a weapon mod?
Doing it wrong. |
Reefersmokintaz
Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State
41
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Posted - 2013.06.11 21:54:00 -
[27] - Quote
Another Heavy SOB wrote:Reefersmokintaz wrote:Only suits that have a passive armor regen is Minmatar. Also, Minmatar should be the ones that equal shield and armor. IMHO, Minmatar and Amarr should swap shield, armor and passive armor regen numbers and THEN it would look about right... One reason why I use Minnie suits lol. It has saved my ass MANY times! The logistics role bonus is +1 Armor repair per level. That is regardless of race.
Ah not a logi lol Havent really looked into them either. |
knight of 6
SVER True Blood Public Disorder.
193
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Posted - 2013.06.11 22:00:00 -
[28] - Quote
okay, I don't really know where to go with this but I can say that shield/armor fairly balanced in eve and I trust them to fix it in dust. there are a lot of eve items that don't have dust equivalents yet. that fact that there is balance in eve shows that in time there will be balance here too.
going from thousands of hitpoints in a slowly paced game to hundreds in a fast paced shooter will have it's hicups and the ratios wont always translate as expected.
that said both the new types aren't implemented in eve, I have no idea how it will work out. |
PonyClause Rex
TRAMADOL KNIGHTS
71
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Posted - 2013.06.11 22:19:00 -
[29] - Quote
This looks like the right place to ask my question
Why do the galente assault suit skill have a bonus to sheild regen? |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
889
|
Posted - 2013.06.11 22:20:00 -
[30] - Quote
PonyClause Rex wrote:This looks like the right place to ask my question
Why do the galente assault suit skill have a bonus to sheild regen?
This is getting changed, but essentially it's a mistake. |
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Laurent Cazaderon
What The French CRONOS.
1556
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Posted - 2013.06.11 22:44:00 -
[31] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:So after acknowledging that armor and shields were imbalanced after reading a 16 page post you guys haven't learned jack squat. Did you know that the only way for armor and shields to be balanced was for it to be possible for armor suits to stack reactive plates without a penalty? Did you know that because armor has no passive regen and since reppers take low slot we willalways be inferior? No you didn't. When those plates come out are tou aware at how far stronger shield tankers will be by stacking ferroplates? No you didn't. Im not even going to waste my time adding up numbers to show how idiotic this balance is. Enjoy this build my fellow Gallente and Amarr, its only going to get worse. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_LlH2c5dyA
been saying a few times ferroscale plates were a bad idea. Will mostly benefit shield tankers.
As long as shield wont have its own penalty, and each race a mean to lower penalty linked to their favorite defense type, things will remain imbalance one way or another. Using a defense your suit isnt intended for should be more penalizing.
Rough example, a complex plate for gallente should only have a 3-4% penalty at max skills when it would be 10-12 for a caldari suit.
Otherwise, people will only use buff, buff and some more buff to their base HP.
Also, any penalty should be possible to compensate through a module. if sprint speed can be upped through biotics, base movement cannot (and shouldnt). So the penalty linked to plates should lower sprint and stamina. Not base movements. Let's be honest, the worst part of the armor penalty is the one to the strafe speed. As hit detection still isnt spot on, any difference there makes the slow guy an actual sitting duck.
But overall, quit bitching. This isnt a simple thing to fix or balance. Anyone saying otherwise hasnt actually thought this through. |
Gunner Nightingale
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
722
|
Posted - 2013.06.11 22:50:00 -
[32] - Quote
Ynned Ivanova wrote:Why wait? Sod off now and let those that enjoy it play in peace.
Nah I prefer to remain on these forums as a reminder that we've told CCP what needed to be done for well over a year and yet we are seeing games who basically have implemented our feedback without having told us so.
Oh and I can't in good conscious let people keep their head buried in the sand thinking they have a good game. I've taken it upon myself to deliver the sheep to the light and break free from their bondage of a FFF game. |
Cosgar
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
1368
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Posted - 2013.06.11 22:52:00 -
[33] - Quote
PonyClause Rex wrote:This looks like the right place to ask my question
Why do the galente assault suit skill have a bonus to sheild regen? Same reason why Amarr are better hybrid tankers than Minmatar. |
PonyClause Rex
TRAMADOL KNIGHTS
72
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Posted - 2013.06.11 23:04:00 -
[34] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:PonyClause Rex wrote:This looks like the right place to ask my question
Why do the galente assault suit skill have a bonus to sheild regen? This is getting changed, but essentially it's a mistake.
Thanks for the info |
TEBOW BAGGINS
Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN.
601
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Posted - 2013.06.11 23:09:00 -
[35] - Quote
Reefersmokintaz wrote:Only suits that have a passive armor regen is Minmatar. Also, Minmatar should be the ones that equal shield and armor. IMHO, Minmatar and Amarr should swap shield, armor and passive armor regen numbers and THEN it would look about right... One reason why I use Minnie suits lol. It has saved my ass MANY times!
keep the dirty dev paws off my min |
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