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Longshot Ravenwood
Algintal Core
Gallente Federation
712
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Posted - 2013.06.09 18:07:00 -
[1] - Quote
They should have an increase in profile to make players easier to scan.
When you're a shiny, sparkling ball of energy capable of deflecting enemy attacks, it should show up on my radar more easily. |
Longshot Ravenwood
Algintal Core
Gallente Federation
715
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Posted - 2013.06.09 18:53:00 -
[2] - Quote
Thanks Malkai :)
Eris Ernaga wrote:Longshot Ravenwood wrote:They should have an increase in profile to make players easier to scan.
When you're a shiny, sparkling ball of energy capable of deflecting enemy attacks, it should show up on my radar more easily. There is no penalty like armor because armor is 2/1 of a shield extender thats the nice part about shields they receive no penalty. So for less shield you get no minus to speed and no stacking penalty enjoy.
There is no penalty because no penalty was programmed in. Shields can and should have a signature radius penalty simply for the fact that stronger shields would have a stronger em signature & as a result be easier to pick up on a scan. |
Longshot Ravenwood
Algintal Core
Gallente Federation
726
|
Posted - 2013.06.10 09:38:00 -
[3] - Quote
Completely forgot to make this thread into a basic argument like the rest of them...
"You nubs using shield extenders to soak up damage suk. I want you to be easier to spot on my radar so I know who to shoot with my scrambler rifle. I'm looking at you Caldari Logi. You want to tank big like a heavy? Your sig radius can be big like a heavy too."
Anyway, I think shield extenders should apply a sig radius penatly. |
Longshot Ravenwood
Algintal Core
Gallente Federation
728
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Posted - 2013.06.10 10:27:00 -
[4] - Quote
Chilled Pill wrote:The increase to sig profile is useless because no one has enough scan radius to pick you up anyway. Gallente scouts have a maximum of 20meters with max skills and a proto mod.
20meters is basically 3-4 seconds of sprint for anyone except a heavy. Passive scan skills are broken, and if they're not broken, then they're just dumb. So this sig radius increase to shield extenders isn't an inconvenience at all.
I'm not going to call you a shrubbery, but I believe that you, sir, may be doing it "wrong".
We'll start with the math:
Scout suit scan radius (any) 10m +
scan bonus - Galente Scout (50%) 5m+
scan bonus - range amplification (50%) 5m+
Total scan range available before adding mods to a Gallente scout suit is 20 meters
Complex range amplifiers add 45% to the scan radius (4.5 meters if it's going off of the initial range, 9 meters if it's going off of the adjusted -- description does not mention a stacking penalty.
If we're being conservative about stacking then a scout with militia modules (25% bonus) & max skills could have a scan range of 25 meters (two low slots).
While if we take the conservativeness away it's possible that the bonuses from skills stack, rather than combine, meaning the base bonuses go scout suit 10m > Gallente scan bonus 15m > Range amplification bonus 22.5m > Complex Range Amplifier > 32.625m > etc...
But that's not the problem. Signature radius has nothing to do with scan radius & everything to do with scan precision vs scan profile. A heavy has a scan profile of 65 and a scan Precision of 60, which means it's hard for it to aquire targets and easy for others to aquire it as a target on their scaners. A medium suithas a scan profile of 50 and a scan precision of 55, which makes a medium suit harder to spot on the battlefield. Light suits are 45/45 which makes them the best scanners and hardest to scan.
The idea behind a reduced scan profile is to avoid enemy detection until you can get into an advantageous position. The idea behind increasing scan profile for shield extenders is that a big shiny dot of electomagnetic energy wouldn't be very easy to conceal & as such would more easily be detected on scannners.
If you don't stealth on maps, I can see why you wouldn't understand -- it's not about seconds, it's about tactics. About being able to see what direction your opponent is facing, walking up behind them, then cutting their advantage down or distracting them as a squad moves in. It makes a difference. |
Longshot Ravenwood
Algintal Core
Gallente Federation
730
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Posted - 2013.06.10 12:23:00 -
[5] - Quote
Chilled Pill wrote:Secondly, I was already a few steps ahead of you with regard to your whole tirade about how scan profile and scan precision works. What you failed to derive from my statement that it wont matter if I'm trying to scan something that has a profile of 1,000,000db and my precision is .0000001db if whatever I'm trying to scan isn't within 20m. 20m which is a ridiculously tiny radius in a game where people sprint at 7-10m/sec.
The fact that you're measuring radius as a "sprint distance" is the problem.
"The idea behind a reduced scan profile is to avoid enemy detection until you can get into an advantageous position. The idea behind increasing scan profile for shield extenders is that a big shiny dot of electomagnetic energy wouldn't be very easy to conceal & as such would more easily be detected on scannners.
If you don't stealth on maps, I can see why you wouldn't understand -- it's not about seconds, it's about tactics. About being able to see what direction your opponent is facing, walking up behind them, then cutting their advantage down or distracting them as a squad moves in. It makes a difference."
As a stealth scout I've located, and broken a squad that was holding an objective. I couldn't have done that if I hadn't been able to scan them down, nor could I have done it if they had been able to scan me down while I was maneuvering to get into position.
Chilled Pill wrote:Thirdly, I play as a Gallente Scout. A pretty good one, if I'm allowed to sing my own praises. Many times have heavies seemed to pop out of no where and even around small obstacles that didn't even appear as a blip on the tacnet radar until I actually see them. And even if everyone appeared as a blip there, that would mean they're inside your 20-32.625m (that you pulled out of your ...) which will mean you're most probably going to die.
Me and gameplay experience > that your maths.
Just trying to use math to help explain my gameplay experience and why it might be different from yours. It sounds to me like you're playing a speed-tank scout rather than a stealth-tank scout. I use stealth to sneak up on targets and headshot them repeatedly to death (or as near as I can manage). How do you use your stealth advantage?
PS.
Chilled Pill wrote:Aren't we Mr. Pedantic.
First of all, how are you even so sure that the scan range bonuses are calculated and stacked like that?
...
Me and gameplay experience > that your maths.
So again, it doesn't matter if people get double their profile per shield extender they slap on, they won't be picked up on passive scan until they are uber close to you. Which will make the proposed draw back negligible.
Run along now.
The math is based on how skills, bonuses, and modules work in EVE, which has seemed to be rather similar to the way we should expect them to work in Dust. The ranges 25m to 32.625m+ that I pulled out were based on the principles of base bonuses (100+50%+50% is 200) versus stacked bonuses (100+50%+50% isn't 200, it's 225).
And if I sound Pedantic it's because I was always taught in school that misinformation should be Educated. Pardon me for trying to explain how I came to my decision regarding how wrong you are about the terrible input you've provided.
In the future I'll just add a dismissive phrase to the end of my post, because you know -- that's constructive. |
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