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Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State
186
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 04:42:00 -
[1] - Quote
I've always chocked my inability to kill someone behind the wheel of a LAV to how difficult it would be to hit a small fleshy target moving at top speed.
But an experience just now has shown me that thanks to some entirely f'd up occlusion it's damn near impossible to hit the driver.
I was sitting in the middle of a skirmish map when this guy pulls up to the objective in a LAV and tries to drive it up the hill the objective is on. He can't figure out that he either doesn't have enough speed or there's something blocking him so he just slowly pushed up the hill before slowly reversing and trying again and again and again.
He was the easiest target you could find in a LAV that wasn't parked and he had SIX people that were at the objective emptying magazine after magazine right into him. His personal shield dropped by maybe 1/6 during the entire time. I stood straight in front of the LAV shooting directly at his head until he was so close he killed me going 1mph and his shield didn't even budge.
I know object occlusion is a problem in this game but come on. You have to give people not using AV gear even the slightest fighting chance instead of leaving the open drivers seat of a LAV covered in invisible bulletproof glass. |
Allah's Snackbar
Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic
78
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Posted - 2013.06.08 04:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
Quote:How the hell can it be so hard to shoot someone driving a LAV? Heh heh heh. I don't think CCP know either. |
Bytrine Prototype
Shoot it Strip it.INC
2
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 04:44:00 -
[3] - Quote
This game is hugely unbalanced currently.
It needs to be fixed, that's assuming the Devs realize this. |
True Adamance
Ametat Security Amarr Empire
95
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 04:46:00 -
[4] - Quote
Its not hard at all I've nabbed 3 drivers in the last two days alone. |
Allah's Snackbar
Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic
79
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 04:54:00 -
[5] - Quote
Bytrine Prototype wrote:This game is hugely unbalanced currently.
It needs to be fixed, that's assuming the Devs realize this. I think the Devs are far too busy worrying what their current "restructure" will mean to their job prospects to be honest.
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Doc Noah
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
105
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 05:09:00 -
[6] - Quote
Hitboxes in this game is horrid. Even if you have a direct line of sight, the vehicle hitbox can easily cover most of the driver.
Just look at Null Cannons, you can pump someone full of bullets while they hack and the null cannon will eat every shot. |
GRIM GEAR
The Enclave Syndicate
1
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 05:12:00 -
[7] - Quote
Next time try using a forge gun to shoot your target out of the LAV; if you miss the driver enough your bound to blow up the LAV sooner or later. |
Ignatius Crumwald
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
549
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 05:25:00 -
[8] - Quote
Hitboxes in this game have always been a travesty. I'm not sure why they insist on making the basically indestructible objectives bullet sponges but I'm sure it has something to do with their five year plan to make this game die in 1 year. |
Shion Typhon
Intara Direct Action Caldari State
26
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 05:54:00 -
[9] - Quote
Doc Noah wrote: Just look at Null Cannons, you can pump someone full of bullets while they hack and the null cannon will eat every shot.
OMG, this drives me absolutely crazy-ape$%!T-demented. Whoever did the hitboxes on the null cannons needs to never work in this industry again. |
Crash Monster
Snipers Anonymous
520
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 12:07:00 -
[10] - Quote
Doc Noah wrote:Hitboxes in this game is horrid. Even if you have a direct line of sight, the vehicle hitbox can easily cover most of the driver.
Just look at Null Cannons, you can pump someone full of bullets while they hack and the null cannon will eat every shot.
Hmm, true at times.
As someone in software, but sadly not games, the first thing that comes to mind is having a higher priority on the hitbox for people instead of objects. But, that might have to be based on the weapon type and it would still need to detect blockage. |
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Spec Ops Cipher
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
87
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 12:45:00 -
[11] - Quote
I know snipers, shotguns and grenades excell at removing lav drivers. Enemies are better at giving me LogiLavs than RDV's! |
Spec Ops Cipher
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
87
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 12:50:00 -
[12] - Quote
Crash Monster wrote:Doc Noah wrote:Hitboxes in this game is horrid. Even if you have a direct line of sight, the vehicle hitbox can easily cover most of the driver.
Just look at Null Cannons, you can pump someone full of bullets while they hack and the null cannon will eat every shot. Hmm, true at times. As someone in software, but sadly not games, the first thing that comes to mind is having a higher priority on the hitbox for people instead of objects. But, that might have to be based on the weapon type and it would still need to detect blockage.
The null cannons have a simple circle around the console, that just covers everything, but can leave gaps where the central pillar is recessed. It's easier for ps3's to use a simple vector circle than to use a bespoke shape that is identical to the null cannon. Bandwidth. |
Stefan Stahl
Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State
111
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 13:29:00 -
[13] - Quote
Spec Ops Cipher wrote:The null cannons have a simple circle around the console, that just covers everything, but can leave gaps where the central pillar is recessed. It's easier for ps3's to use a simple vector circle than to use a bespoke shape that is identical to the null cannon. Bandwidth. Thanks for sharing. It's absolutely okay to work around technical limitations, but they should make sure that the visual design reflects the technical implementation. As players we're mostly going by what we see on the screen. When I start Dust I'm generally not in the mood for a first person impression of Platon's cave allegory. |
DigiOps
Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State
348
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 13:40:00 -
[14] - Quote
I've done it multiple times with a sniper rifle and an assault rifle and witnessed it with a shotgun. Its not that hard. |
Big Popa Smurff
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
232
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 13:42:00 -
[15] - Quote
Allah's Snackbar wrote:Quote:How the hell can it be so hard to shoot someone driving a LAV? Heh heh heh. I don't think CCP know either. Several times iv forged a guy out of the driver seat of a LAV leaving the LAV intact and undamaged, rare but extremely funny. |
Crash Monster
Snipers Anonymous
525
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 13:45:00 -
[16] - Quote
Spec Ops Cipher wrote: The null cannons have a simple circle around the console, that just covers everything, but can leave gaps where the central pillar is recessed. It's easier for ps3's to use a simple vector circle than to use a bespoke shape that is identical to the null cannon. Bandwidth.
There might be ways to optimize this somewhat and maybe they already do.
For example, the circle around the null cannon could/would be used to indicate that further processing is required to determine what exactly was hit. Of course, I don't know what kind of hooks are available for identifying possible collisions in the path of the shot (stopping when an actual hit occurs).
Alternately, you could simply grab the pixels on the screen where the shot is aimed. Having distinct color shades used for objects and landscape versus suits/vehicles might give you an on/off for direct hits. It might even be possible to determine rough distance, or ranges, based on dot patterns that resolve (invisible to the naked eye) at closer distances.
Anyhow, just some things I'd find interesting to explore if I was in the gaming world. Of course, since I know nothing about it I could be 100% out to lunch on this stuff.
It wouldn't be the first time. |
Natu Nobilis
BetaMax Beta CRONOS.
367
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 13:50:00 -
[17] - Quote
Psttt, over here.
I-¦l tell you a secret, but you got to promise not to tell anyone, ok?
Here it is:
There-¦s this magic free fitting called "AV Starter Fit", and it comes with a super bazooka of guided missiles that go straight to this LAV that-¦s bothering you. Don-¦t worry about shooting the driver, with this, you kill the driver, the ride, and the gunner all at once!
You don-¦t even have to use your assault/logistic protosuit with AV granades for this.
Now go try it out! |
EnglishSnake
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
1188
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 13:52:00 -
[18] - Quote
But it requires aiming and players are bad at that
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Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State
187
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:00:00 -
[19] - Quote
Natu Nobilis wrote:Psttt, over here.
I-¦l tell you a secret, but you got to promise not to tell anyone, ok?
Here it is:
There-¦s this magic free fitting called "AV Starter Fit", and it comes with a super bazooka of guided missiles that go straight to this LAV that-¦s bothering you. Don-¦t worry about shooting the driver, with this, you kill the driver, the ride, and the gunner all at once!
You don-¦t even have to use your assault/logistic protosuit with AV granades for this.
Now go try it out!
I'll tell you a secret... you're an idiot...
This isn't a complaint like "omg i was shootin this truck and its so hurd to kill!"
If you have a squad worth of people shooting the fleshy bits inside a nearly stationary LAV at as close a range as possible without standing on top of the hood the problem is the horrid hitboxes, not the lack of any AV equipment. |
Surt gods end
Demon Ronin
246
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:02:00 -
[20] - Quote
LAV has shield that in case the driver. You can weaken that spot, and eventually kill driver but yeah he has extra shield.
*you pulled that out of your ass!*
YES. YES I DID.
But I do know that If your firing AT THE LAV ITSELF with a rifle and thinking "this is how its going to happen! ladies prepare to open your flood gates!!"
then well don't get surprise when you get hit by that lav.. Nor when he rides off with said ladies. |
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Natu Nobilis
BetaMax Beta CRONOS.
367
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:04:00 -
[21] - Quote
Mike Poole wrote: I'll tell you a secret... you're an idiot...
This isn't a complaint like "omg i was shootin this truck and its so hurd to kill!"
If you have a squad worth of people shooting the fleshy bits inside a nearly stationary LAV at as close a range as possible without standing on top of the hood the problem is the horrid hitboxes, not the lack of any AV equipment.
Psssst, over here.
I-¦ll tell you another secret.
If you-¦re at point blank and not killing the people, then improve your aiming.
See, no need for name calling, that it-¦s just rude. |
A'Real Fury
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
119
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:07:00 -
[22] - Quote
Walk to the side and shoot the driver on the driver side rather than from the front. I have managed to kill drivers from the front with an AR but it helps to have a bit of elevation. It is much easier from the side or with a lot of elevation. |
Cosgar
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
1227
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:09:00 -
[23] - Quote
It can't be that hard, instillations seem to snipe the driver instead of blowing up their LAV all the time. |
Abron Garr
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
399
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:10:00 -
[24] - Quote
Natu Nobilis wrote:Mike Poole wrote: I'll tell you a secret... you're an idiot...
This isn't a complaint like "omg i was shootin this truck and its so hurd to kill!"
If you have a squad worth of people shooting the fleshy bits inside a nearly stationary LAV at as close a range as possible without standing on top of the hood the problem is the horrid hitboxes, not the lack of any AV equipment.
Psssst, over here. I-¦ll tell you another secret. If you-¦re at point blank and not killing the people, then improve your aiming. See, no need for name calling, that it-¦s just rude.
Gets mad after someone shoots down his labored passive-aggressive baiting. |
Natu Nobilis
BetaMax Beta CRONOS.
367
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:17:00 -
[25] - Quote
Abron Garr wrote: Gets mad after someone shoots down his labored passive-aggressive baiting.
Narrative is important, there is no bait in a ludic way of telling things.
And if people missed the reference, then they-¦re too young, if they-¦re to young, then they-¦re most likely part of a group that is used to a certain way of gaming that older people have. With one reference we can estimate a little bit of anthropological context of the reader.
And i don-¦t know what you were taught, but name calling is just rude.
|
Abron Garr
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
399
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:21:00 -
[26] - Quote
Natu Nobilis wrote:Abron Garr wrote: Gets mad after someone shoots down his labored passive-aggressive baiting.
Narrative is important, there is no bait in a ludic way of telling things. And if people missed the reference, then they-¦re too young, if they-¦re to young, then they-¦re most likely part of a group that is used to a certain way of gaming that older people have. With one reference we can estimate a little bit of anthropological context of the reader. And i don-¦t know what you were taught, but name calling is just rude.
You could have saved yourself a paragraph of sperg by just typing "hurf blurf grr mad". |
Crash Monster
Snipers Anonymous
525
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:24:00 -
[27] - Quote
A'Real Fury wrote:Walk to the side and shoot the driver on the driver side rather than from the front. I have managed to kill drivers from the front with an AR but it helps to have a bit of elevation. It is much easier from the side or with a lot of elevation.
^^ this
If you can get beside a slow moving LAV the driver's head is sitting there for target practice. Problem is nobody seems to want to stay still in a LAV for any length of time. |
Natu Nobilis
BetaMax Beta CRONOS.
367
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:33:00 -
[28] - Quote
Abron Garr wrote:Natu Nobilis wrote:Abron Garr wrote: Gets mad after someone shoots down his labored passive-aggressive baiting.
Narrative is important, there is no bait in a ludic way of telling things. And if people missed the reference, then they-¦re too young, if they-¦re to young, then they-¦re most likely part of a group that is used to a certain way of gaming that older people have. With one reference we can estimate a little bit of anthropological context of the reader. And i don-¦t know what you were taught, but name calling is just rude. You could have saved yourself a paragraph of sperg by just typing "hurf blurf grr mad".
You can do better than this mate. |
Vethosis
Purgatorium of the Damned League of Infamy
225
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:49:00 -
[29] - Quote
Mike Poole wrote:I've always chocked my inability to kill someone behind the wheel of a LAV to how difficult it would be to hit a small fleshy target moving at top speed.
But an experience just now has shown me that thanks to some entirely f'd up occlusion it's damn near impossible to hit the driver.
I was sitting in the middle of a skirmish map when this guy pulls up to the objective in a LAV and tries to drive it up the hill the objective is on. He can't figure out that he either doesn't have enough speed or there's something blocking him so he just slowly pushed up the hill before slowly reversing and trying again and again and again.
He was the easiest target you could find in a LAV that wasn't parked and he had SIX people that were at the objective emptying magazine after magazine right into him. His personal shield dropped by maybe 1/6 during the entire time. I stood straight in front of the LAV shooting directly at his head until he was so close he killed me going 1mph and his shield didn't even budge.
I know object occlusion is a problem in this game but come on. You have to give people not using AV gear even the slightest fighting chance instead of leaving the open drivers seat of a LAV covered in invisible bulletproof glass.
Assuming each time you hit a driver it does headshot damage to them, that is a lot right there. LAV turrets for some reason hit me hard when i'm driving my lav, same with tanks. The only reason I die from driving my lav if a tank shoots my lav, it somehow reaches me, or if a blaster/railgun turrets hits me, only if i'm facing it. |
Novawolf McDustingham The514th
The Official Mintchip Fanclub
177
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:51:00 -
[30] - Quote
There a slight bloom on the hit from a blaster turret that seems to bite through the thick invisible armor around the driver. |
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Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State
188
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 14:59:00 -
[31] - Quote
Vethosis wrote:Mike Poole wrote:I've always chocked my inability to kill someone behind the wheel of a LAV to how difficult it would be to hit a small fleshy target moving at top speed.
But an experience just now has shown me that thanks to some entirely f'd up occlusion it's damn near impossible to hit the driver.
I was sitting in the middle of a skirmish map when this guy pulls up to the objective in a LAV and tries to drive it up the hill the objective is on. He can't figure out that he either doesn't have enough speed or there's something blocking him so he just slowly pushed up the hill before slowly reversing and trying again and again and again.
He was the easiest target you could find in a LAV that wasn't parked and he had SIX people that were at the objective emptying magazine after magazine right into him. His personal shield dropped by maybe 1/6 during the entire time. I stood straight in front of the LAV shooting directly at his head until he was so close he killed me going 1mph and his shield didn't even budge.
I know object occlusion is a problem in this game but come on. You have to give people not using AV gear even the slightest fighting chance instead of leaving the open drivers seat of a LAV covered in invisible bulletproof glass. Assuming each time you hit a driver it does headshot damage to them, that is a lot right there. LAV turrets for some reason hit me hard when i'm driving my lav, same with tanks. The only reason I die from driving my lav if a tank shoots my lav, it somehow reaches me, or if a blaster/railgun turrets hits me, only if i'm facing it.
Are some people even reading the OP?
Really? If I want to kill someone in a LAV the solution is to shoot them? It's no wonder I never came up with such a complex strategy before.
It doesn't matter how many headshots you line up dead center if unless you're at some optimal angle the hitbox for the LAV occludes the players hitbox.
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Rob Retzger
Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 15:34:00 -
[32] - Quote
It is difficult to shoot them, no doubt. I generally try hitting them from the side, seems to work better (for me at least). |
J'Jor Da'Wg
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
779
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 16:30:00 -
[33] - Quote
This.
This thread is the kittening reason I hate the DUST forums and 75% of the forum goers on it.
THE MAN COMPLAINS ABOUT VEHICLE HITBOXES FOR PASSENGERS, AND YOU REPLY TO JUST GET OUT AV AND DESTROY THE ENTIRE VEHICLE.
HOW. DOES. THAT. PERTAIN TO ANYTHING HE IS SAYING?!?!
You freaking DUST fanboi sploogers are the absolute worst. A kittening CCP-labeled bowling ball could hit you in the face because you didn't move but you would blame lack of protective headgear as to why it hit you instead of the fact that you didnt move. This game is consistently screwed because of ******** like you that make excuses and pat CCP on the back and try to ignore the heaping pile of dung that is DUST 514.
I cannot stand this game in the first place because of how intolerably bad it is (I would rather fry my brain to mush on freaking **** of Doody than this crap), but the players and forumites who defend and distract from the problems at hand make it truly masochistic to play or try and give relevant helpful feedback.
Alright. Deep breath.
/rant |
Abron Garr
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
407
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 16:46:00 -
[34] - Quote
J'Jor Da'Wg wrote:This.
This thread is the kittening reason I hate the DUST forums and 75% of the forum goers on it.
THE MAN COMPLAINS ABOUT VEHICLE HITBOXES FOR PASSENGERS, AND YOU REPLY TO JUST GET OUT AV AND DESTROY THE ENTIRE VEHICLE.
HOW. DOES. THAT. PERTAIN TO ANYTHING HE IS SAYING?!?!
You freaking DUST fanboi sploogers are the absolute worst. A kittening CCP-labeled bowling ball could hit you in the face because you didn't move but you would blame lack of protective headgear as to why it hit you instead of the fact that you didnt move. This game is consistently screwed because of ******** like you that make excuses and pat CCP on the back and try to ignore the heaping pile of dung that is DUST 514.
I cannot stand this game in the first place because of how intolerably bad it is (I would rather fry my brain to mush on freaking **** of Doody than this crap), but the players and forumites who defend and distract from the problems at hand make it truly masochistic to play or try and give relevant helpful feedback.
Alright. Deep breath.
/rant
I understand your frustration, but it would be a lot more productive, and subsequently, a lot more satisfying to simply call out bad posters by name. Nothing inspires reform like shame. |
J'Jor Da'Wg
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
784
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 16:50:00 -
[35] - Quote
Abron Garr wrote:J'Jor Da'Wg wrote:This.
This thread is the kittening reason I hate the DUST forums and 75% of the forum goers on it.
THE MAN COMPLAINS ABOUT VEHICLE HITBOXES FOR PASSENGERS, AND YOU REPLY TO JUST GET OUT AV AND DESTROY THE ENTIRE VEHICLE.
HOW. DOES. THAT. PERTAIN TO ANYTHING HE IS SAYING?!?!
You freaking DUST fanboi sploogers are the absolute worst. A kittening CCP-labeled bowling ball could hit you in the face because you didn't move but you would blame lack of protective headgear as to why it hit you instead of the fact that you didnt move. This game is consistently screwed because of ******** like you that make excuses and pat CCP on the back and try to ignore the heaping pile of dung that is DUST 514.
I cannot stand this game in the first place because of how intolerably bad it is (I would rather fry my brain to mush on freaking **** of Doody than this crap), but the players and forumites who defend and distract from the problems at hand make it truly masochistic to play or try and give relevant helpful feedback.
Alright. Deep breath.
/rant I understand your frustration, but it would be a lot more productive, and subsequently, a lot more satisfying to simply call out bad posters by name. Nothing inspires reform like shame.
Theres too many of them. I spent the better part of the closed beta writing out threads full of feedback and ideas onky to have most ignored and at the worst trashed completely. I am done. I jusr need to calm down a bit... And watch this game fall to pieces in front of my eyes as I hoped it never would... |
Abron Garr
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
407
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 16:50:00 -
[36] - Quote
Natu Nobilis wrote:Abron Garr wrote:Natu Nobilis wrote:Abron Garr wrote: Gets mad after someone shoots down his labored passive-aggressive baiting.
Narrative is important, there is no bait in a ludic way of telling things. And if people missed the reference, then they-¦re too young, if they-¦re to young, then they-¦re most likely part of a group that is used to a certain way of gaming that older people have. With one reference we can estimate a little bit of anthropological context of the reader. And i don-¦t know what you were taught, but name calling is just rude. You could have saved yourself a paragraph of sperg by just typing "hurf blurf grr mad". You can do better than this mate.
I'm sure I could. The question, however, is why would I put in the effort when you couldn't be asked to actually read the OP and fully comprehend it. Low effort trolling deserves low effort responses.
Pearls before swine and all that. |
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