DUST Search - Armor VS Shields (Vehicles)

Harpyja wrote:

Back in Chromosome, once I literally lost 3/4 of my shields in less than a quarter of a minute driving in reverse over bumpy terrain.

For those that say that we get damage mods, you're just plain ignorant. In order for my Gunnlogi to have a heavy azeotropic shield extender, a heavy clarity shield booster, and advanced missiles, I need a local power diagnostic system and a local power grid expansion module in both my lows (that's +22%). I haven't even trained up turret upgrades now because I can't fit a god **** damage mod.

Plus, my Falchion requires two local powergrid expansion modules and a local power diagnostic system (+37%) to fit the same fit as my Gunnlogi but with proto missiles. Again, I have no room for a damage mod because I have something like 20 PG left.

Also, may I add that armor reps are much better than shield boosters. An armor tank can rep back full health with one activation, while if I run away with my shields nearly depleted, I need multiple activations of my booster. Also, you can increase the amount an armor reps heal with skills, but with the shield booster you can't; it only increases recharge rate. Yes, thank you CCP, my shields recharge at a rate of .6 hp/s faster.

Shield tanking needs to be like it is in EVE. I should be able to get from 0 to full shields in a matter of seconds, during which time I'll have fled or destroyed my threat and then I can wait before I can burst tank again. Armor needs to be the slow and steady one, not shields.


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Eurydice Itzhak Militaires Sans Jeux 55	Posted - 2013.05.31 22:13:00 - [1] - Quote Please note: Most numbers are pulled from my rear end and need to be corrected but the overall message is still correct. Lets compare modules. They both have access to 15% passive hardeners. Armor has access to 25% hardeners with a much higher uptime. I believe they're up for 30 and down for 15? Shield has 30% hardeners that are up for 10 seconds and down for 30(?) So armor has the better resistances. Armor repairers are also probably around 10 fold as effective as shield boosters are. So they have similar HP with armor having more EHP due to better hardeners and an easier way to recover it with repairers. What exactly is the benefit of shields? Where is the field where I'm supposed to excel compared to armor? I used to be a lot faster but come uprising that isn't so true. Before anyone points to passive shield regen, the shield on my Gunnlogi regenerates at around 30s/s. That is absolutely nothing.
Eurydice Itzhak Militaires Sans Jeux 55	Posted - 2013.06.01 22:32:00 - [2] - Quote gbghg wrote: Shield ADS are far more maneuverable and are clearly superior in air to air combat. That is actually quite nice. I'm glad to hear it. I've only got one point into ADS and I've never been very big on/good at dropship piloting but I like to hear it has a place. Zdub 303 wrote: 30 shields per second... lol thats what my caldari logi's shields recharge at. I know right? Completely ridiculous. Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: As a shielder you are 24/7 "repping" which means you don't have to pull away from the battlefield as often...most infantry weapons that are AV are explosive.... An incorrect statement followed by misinformation. An armor tank repairs so much compared to a booster that they have to run away and hide less. Notice you wont see a shield tank on an ambush map that has little in the way of cover but you'll still see a ton of Madrugars. Also AV is split 50/50 its just people rarely carry flux grenades but they devastate shields way harder than AV grenades damage armor. (But they are rarely carried which is a plus).[/quote] BobThe843CakeMan wrote: my falco tank when i had shield tanks before the respec had 3 damage mods and i had a decent fit. but i couldn't kill a good armor tank. but pretty much destroied any shield tank. As of now i use armor. It would seem like you're an awful tanker then if you fit 3 damage mods on a falcion and it had a "good fit" you cannot fit a Heavy shield extender and a heavy booster without 2 PG extenders. A tank with 4k Shields and what 6k EHP total is not a tank at all, it is a money vacuum.
Eurydice Itzhak Militaires Sans Jeux 55	Posted - 2013.06.01 22:47:00 - [3] - Quote And just another tidbit to anyone who thinks those 30 shields per second matter... I guarantee you I lose one hundred percent more shields to small bumps in the road than I passively regenerate over a whole match.
Eurydice Itzhak Militaires Sans Jeux 55	Posted - 2013.06.01 22:54:00 - [4] - Quote Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: That makes you a ****** driver, and those are not small bumps at that point. You can't tell me that over the course of a minute you've done more then 1800 damage to yourself from bumps alone... Who said anything about a minute? Learn to read? Over the course of a match good sir. Also yes, they are small bumps. You take less damage climbing down mountainsides than you do hitting a small bump in a straightaway. Go figure.
Eurydice Itzhak Militaires Sans Jeux 55	Posted - 2013.06.01 23:03:00 - [5] - Quote Also I would like some ideas to take to the feedback/requests side of things but I don't really have any good ones. Stronger passive resistance modules? Stronger Boosters? Stronger passive regen to make passive tanking possible?
Eurydice Itzhak Militaires Sans Jeux 55	Posted - 2013.06.02 00:04:00 - [6] - Quote knight of 6 wrote: shield tanks are fast and passively rep. shield boosters start instantly armor reps need time to warm up(you have no idea how big a deal this is until you need reps up). armor tanks don't fit damage mods... ever. Armor tanks are faster in uprising, passive rep has been discussed and is laughably small. We lose more to bumps than we rep passively. Shield booster do start immediately which is nice but I would rather get the extra four thousand HP that an armor rep repairs than have it start a second and a half sooner. I had a Madrugar and a Gunnlogi back in Chromosome when I could afford both, I understand how both works and I'm not calling for a nerf to armor just a buff to shield. A field where they excel in.
Eurydice Itzhak Militaires Sans Jeux 55	Posted - 2013.06.02 00:11:00 - [7] - Quote Harpyja wrote: Back in Chromosome, once I literally lost 3/4 of my shields in less than a quarter of a minute driving in reverse over bumpy terrain. For those that say that we get damage mods, you're just plain ignorant. In order for my Gunnlogi to have a heavy azeotropic shield extender, a heavy clarity shield booster, and advanced missiles, I need a local power diagnostic system and a local power grid expansion module in both my lows (that's +22%). I haven't even trained up turret upgrades now because I can't fit a god **** damage mod. Plus, my Falchion requires two local powergrid expansion modules and a local power diagnostic system (+37%) to fit the same fit as my Gunnlogi but with proto missiles. Again, I have no room for a damage mod because I have something like 20 PG left. Also, may I add that armor reps are much better than shield boosters. An armor tank can rep back full health with one activation, while if I run away with my shields nearly depleted, I need multiple activations of my booster. Also, you can increase the amount an armor reps heal with skills, but with the shield booster you can't; it only increases recharge rate. Yes, thank you CCP, my shields recharge at a rate of .6 hp/s faster. Shield tanking needs to be like it is in EVE. I should be able to get from 0 to full shields in a matter of seconds, during which time I'll have fled or destroyed my threat and then I can wait before I can burst tank again. Armor needs to be the slow and steady one, not shields. I am glad you have some EVE experience as I have none. Could you further detail how shield tanking is different in EVE? I would like to compile something for feedback/requests forum but I can't put my finger on how it needs to be better. Also the bit about the Armor skill increasing modules effectiveness is too true. Why does armor get better base modules with better efficiency from skills while shields get worse base modules and no benefits from shield skills?
Eurydice Itzhak Militaires Sans Jeux 55	Posted - 2013.06.02 01:06:00 - [8] - Quote I've noted this down to start making something to post on the feedback forums. I appreciate the information Harpyja and Shiro. EVE side has the map laid down for shield tanking, I wonder why they completely abandoned it and screwed everything up? It also made clear how to word the main issue for shield tanking in dust. Armor tanking is better at burst tanking and sustained tanking. Shield is better at nothing.