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Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
67
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Posted - 2013.05.30 04:22:00 -
[1] - Quote
Even if just temporarily it's desperately needed in a game as incomplete and imbalanced as this.
Slap a price tag on it, hell make it cost aurum if you want to be a **** about it. Even toss on a time limit so someone can only do it once a week or month or something so it isn't abused.
Even at this "release" stage of the game there are too many missing pieces of critical equipment and items that may be nerfed into oblivion one day or buffed out of it.
Forcing your players to either gimp themselves waiting for an addition/update that may never come or punishing those that invest just to find that next week they've wasted everything is just a **** move. There's enough grinding in this game as it is, people shouldn't be needing to grind even more to make up for trying to enjoy the game before a new addition takes a crap on all they've done so far.
Someone wants to try playing as a logi or a heavy? Well they're going to have to invest a load of sp into it just to get to a point where they are actually built like one just to find out that they're horrible at it and now get to either quit the game in rage or play a game they hate until they can dump more sp into the next specialty just to toss the dice again.
Quit dicking around and playing with these partial respecs already and just add a self respecing system. |
Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
75
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Posted - 2013.05.30 11:16:00 -
[2] - Quote
1. This isn't EVE, this may be a hard concept to grasp for some people but it's true. What works for EVE doesn't mean it's going to be a golden rule here.
2. You're always going to end up with people that horde SP and are able to take advantage of a new addition, respecs or not. They may not be able to jump head first into it but it's going to happen.
3. Why are people so afraid of flavors of the month? It's called variety, people are able to switch up the game and keep it interesting. If someone takes advantage of a flavor of the month and starts destroying other people with their build then guess what, everyone else can respec as well to take advantage of that build and take the fun out of it or find a means of counterin
Not allowing respecs in a game like this is going to lead to one thing, stagnation. With limited SP accrued over long periods people aren't going to experiment anywhere outside low sp alts and spreadsheets. Everyone works toward an optimized build without deviating, without trying out something new that could catch on and make the game more interesting.
Lose interest in the game in a no-respec system? You're screwed, you either enjoy playing as specialty X or you spend the next few months climbing back up from the bottom of the barrel or you quit.
Lose interest in the game with a respec system? Well why not try out playing a heavy this week? Or since you have more SP than when you started out how about something that you never thought you'd have the SP/funds for?
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Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
92
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Posted - 2013.06.01 00:30:00 -
[3] - Quote
Green Living wrote:If they are going to continue to change items and their effectiveness, then yes allow purchasable respecs.
That would be the rational thing to do.
Instead they're just going to continue radically tweaking things every other week and it's our fault for not being mind readers.
Just wait for the rest of the heavy/light armors to come out and anyone that didn't intentionally gimp themselves by only using basic suits and invested in the available skills gets to eat their loss because there are no more respecs.
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Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
101
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Posted - 2013.06.04 00:38:00 -
[4] - Quote
Rachoi wrote:Cross's early post says it all in a rather firm nut shell. its far too long to quote effectively, but its all true none the less.
live with your choices, dont decide 'oh, i have to undo this' just because something happened to kick you around. its a cheap gameplay mechanic, and not worth it, since a respec does lead to Flavor of the Month abuse, and that would absolutely destroy the game
Yea... because what totally won't destroy the game is having people invest weeks or months into developing a particular weapon or dropsuit or anything else just to find out that after a quick patch and zero warning it's now a worthless piece of crap.
I can totally see loads of players eager to throw away all that time spent and start all over without knowing what will arbitrarily get the hatchet next. |
Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
101
|
Posted - 2013.06.04 00:42:00 -
[5] - Quote
Buster Friently wrote:
waah why do players want to play how they want NOW they should have to wait months waah waah waaaaaaaaaah
Because they're entitled bitches who don't understand the nature of this game, or of the concept of effort and consequences.
Dust is about risk vs reward. If you could respec all the time, no matter the cost, the risk vs reward aspect of the strategic game would be severely watered down.
Respecs on any common availability are a bad idea.[/quote]
I'd have to wager that those entitled bitches are under the insane idea that the purpose of the game is to enjoy themselves.
You for instance may find that investing weeks or months into a game just to find out that the core mechanics you've enjoyed have been arbitrarily changed rendering your entire setup worthless but others would tend to see that as a slight bit of an inconvenience.
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Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
101
|
Posted - 2013.06.04 00:47:00 -
[6] - Quote
Rachoi wrote:
oh stop with the whining already. you want to cheapen the game, just so you can go with whatever is most OP at the time with how you are lobbying for this useless, cheap game mechanic. i would rather hear good things [if there are any with these useless respec ideas] that this could do, because yes, they are tweaking lots of things, but then agin, how will you know if you're getting a good or bad tweak if you just change into something else>
Good things respecs could do?
How about providing longevity to the game without requiring the torture of the players?
Without respecs and because of how this game is designed you're forced to specialize into one role if you don't want to get your *** handed to you over and over again. So what happens when you get tired of that role or a core mechanic of your role gets nerfed destroying your play style?
Without respecs you're forced to reinvest weeks and months into starting over from scratch investing in a new line of dropsuits and weapons and modules to outfit yourself in a manner that you can actually enjoy again. How many people do you think are going to just say "**** that" and quit when they're told all the work they put into their initial setup is now a pile of fetid ****?
Respecs allow people to experiment, to try something new, to grow bored with the game and have a multitude of new setups available to try out and enjoy all over again.
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Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
103
|
Posted - 2013.06.04 01:02:00 -
[7] - Quote
What the hell exactly is wrong with a "flavor of the month" exactly?
It means people are trying new things, finding new advantages to particular setups, experiencing them and then experimenting to find something new next month or next week for people to experience.
What do we have now? People so afraid of misplacing a single SP they use their spreadsheets and planners to micromanage every module down to the last SP so they can copy the exact setups described in forums to optimize their gameplay to match every single other person using that setup.
It's the same thing except where "flavors of the month" develop and move on quickly a respecless system sits around and stagnates because people can't experiment outside low sp alts and stick to their same setups for even longer until ccp releases something obviously improved for everyone to slowly move on to. |
Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
104
|
Posted - 2013.06.04 01:24:00 -
[8] - Quote
How many people do you really believe are going to be playing this game for 7.5 years? This isn't an mmo where you have a varied and rich game where people can lose themselves in various aspects and enjoy themselves over long periods.
Dust is not an mmo, it's not the new EVE where people will spend years and years and years playing it. Dust is an FPS, it's complexity boils down to shooting stuff. If suddenly you're nerfed to hell and your ability to shoot stuff suddenly screeches to a halt you don't have many alternatives to fall back on outside starting over from scratch with a new setup. There's no "well I can always fall back on X" or "well I still enjoy the Y aspect of the game" or "well I'll just have fun with Z until they fix this"
Even then an artificial longevity propagated purely by arbitrarily selected point value goals is not a true longevity. If someone really enjoys a game they don't play it for a year because that's how long it takes to unlock their next skill, they do it because over that year they enjoyed it enough to come back over and over again.
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Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
104
|
Posted - 2013.06.04 01:40:00 -
[9] - Quote
Rachoi wrote:Flavor of The Moth builds... where do i begin?
they are nothing but fleeting FADS, and do not stand up to the real tests that people should see in a long time persistant game. there is a point where shifting about is fine, but a total wipe and rebuild on even a bi-monthly basis would lead to making your build, getting tired of the build, and whining for another respec. and it turns into a painful cycle untill you've tried enough things and then walk away. games that have done that have in many ways, just up and died because of a mass loss in player base.
So flavor of the month fads don't stand up to the long term experimentation the stagnant builds we have no do?
How much varied experimentation is there actually going on outside of spreadsheets when it takes weeks and months to work up just a few skills just to find out that the combination you were going for is a total failure?
Few people actually experiment and experience varied game play on their own, everything is dependent on waiting for someone else with time/sp to spare to do all the work and then provide their particular experience on which everyone blindly bases their own and then moves on.
If you're retaining your player base purely by the fact that it takes years to accomplish anything is that superior to having people play for years because they actually enjoy the game? Do you believe that all of the people that might play the game and become bored of it will be the kind of people that sit around for weeks building up SP just to buy a single high tier skill? |
Mike Poole
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
105
|
Posted - 2013.06.04 02:39:00 -
[10] - Quote
Stephen Rao wrote:
CCP has a tendency to balance their games, and not just throw their hands up in the air and say "F it!". If it's OP today, you can bet that it will be brought into line. Your gun won't become useless, it will be balanced. TAC AR's are getting attention as we speak, if you think they weren't a problem, or that they've been nerfed so hard that you want to spec out of AR Operations all together, you are kidding yourself.
Balance that doesn't make a weapon useless? So the Mass Driver and Laser Rifle are really great weapons that can still stand up against all of the AR spam and never had their unique qualities smashed to pieces because a vocal minority got pissy they weren't dominating every range any more? |
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