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Surt gods end
Demon Ronin
167
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Posted - 2013.05.29 08:20:00 -
[1] - Quote
At least maybe getting some new found appreciation as to why the other exists.
THE MMO
The FPS
And finally something that someone else brought up, (Cosgar's Alt) so I'll put it up here as well cause that video really needs it's own thread.
Combining genres |
Cosgar's Alt
Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic
8
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Posted - 2013.05.29 08:32:00 -
[2] - Quote
You forgot the most important part of the argument: Aesthetics of Play based on the Mechanics, Dynamics and Aesthetics of Game Design dissertation by Robin Hunicke, Marc LeBlanc, and Robert Zubek. |
The Robot Devil
BetaMax. CRONOS.
314
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Posted - 2013.05.29 09:41:00 -
[3] - Quote
Very nice link. Seems to be thought out by someone who knows what they are talking about and not based off of emotion.
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S0LlD SNAKE
PLAYSTATION4
69
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Posted - 2013.05.29 10:57:00 -
[4] - Quote
lol @ thinking dust514 is an mmo , its set in the universe of an mmo but that doesnt make it an mmo
its just an FPS with matches 16 vs 16 |
Cosgar's Alt
Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic
15
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Posted - 2013.05.29 10:58:00 -
[5] - Quote
S0LlD SNAKE wrote:lol @ thinking dust514 is an mmo , its set in the universe of an mmo but that doesnt make it an mmo
its just an FPS with matches 16 vs 16 Riiiigh, so those 31 other people you're playing with and against are just bots that you have no social interaction with? |
S0LlD SNAKE
PLAYSTATION4
69
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:07:00 -
[6] - Quote
Cosgar's Alt wrote:S0LlD SNAKE wrote:lol @ thinking dust514 is an mmo , its set in the universe of an mmo but that doesnt make it an mmo
its just an FPS with matches 16 vs 16 Riiiigh, so those 31 other people you're playing with and against are just bots that you have no social interaction with?
do u know what MMO means?
31 ppl is MASSIVE ?
have u ever played an MMO?
and plz dont squize all of them just to add up to the nr
"bu bu 32 pipalzz"
LMFAO
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AndyPandy Puschel
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
17
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:08:00 -
[7] - Quote
Cosgar's Alt wrote:S0LlD SNAKE wrote:lol @ thinking dust514 is an mmo , its set in the universe of an mmo but that doesnt make it an mmo
its just an FPS with matches 16 vs 16 Riiiigh, so those 31 other people you're playing with and against are just bots that you have no social interaction with?
Obviously not, but Dust is not an MMO, since this would make BF3 and MW3 or Borderlands2 also an MMO. As long as the core game mechanic are 3 simple gamemodes, played on static maps. One of the main feature associated with an MMO is a huge persistant world, where u can freely travel around. In this regard Dust fails miserably, since all i see are a couple of maps and gamemodes and even the "preparation" room is a generic tiny lobby, without any actual meaning.
In this regard Planetside2 or even Borderlands2 is more of an MMO than DUST. Dust atm is basically World of Tanks in space, without gold ammo and a working matchmaking system. U have gamemodes and matches and can pimp your toon, while there is some "secret" meta map game going on, most players don't care about. |
Cosgar's Alt
Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic
16
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:12:00 -
[8] - Quote
S0LlD SNAKE wrote:Cosgar's Alt wrote:S0LlD SNAKE wrote:lol @ thinking dust514 is an mmo , its set in the universe of an mmo but that doesnt make it an mmo
its just an FPS with matches 16 vs 16 Riiiigh, so those 31 other people you're playing with and against are just bots that you have no social interaction with? do u know what MMO means? 31 ppl is MASSIVE ? have u ever played an MMO? and plz dont squize all of them just to add up to the nr "bu bu 32 pipalzz" LMFAO
Quote: MMO: (video games) A massively multiplayer online game. A computer game in which a large number of players can simultaneously interact in a persistent world or can potentially play against a large number of players in matchmaking. (colloquial) A massively multiplayer online role-playing game. And to answer your other question, I've been playing MMOs since Ultima Online, back when you had to pay by the KB for internet access. Take your internet tough guy act and shove it. |
S0LlD SNAKE
PLAYSTATION4
69
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:16:00 -
[9] - Quote
Cosgar's Alt wrote:S0LlD SNAKE wrote:Cosgar's Alt wrote:S0LlD SNAKE wrote:lol @ thinking dust514 is an mmo , its set in the universe of an mmo but that doesnt make it an mmo
its just an FPS with matches 16 vs 16 Riiiigh, so those 31 other people you're playing with and against are just bots that you have no social interaction with? do u know what MMO means? 31 ppl is MASSIVE ? have u ever played an MMO? and plz dont squize all of them just to add up to the nr "bu bu 32 pipalzz" LMFAO Quote: MMO: (video games) A massively multiplayer online game. A computer game in which a large number of players can simultaneously interact in a persistent world or can potentially play against a large number of players in matchmaking. (colloquial) A massively multiplayer online role-playing game. And to answer your other question, I've been playing MMOs since Ultima Online, back when you had to pay by the KB for internet access. Take your internet tough guy act and shove it.
32 is NOT an large number
Dust514 is NOT an MMO
going with your logic EVERY game that has online is an MMO
stop dreaming
why u so mad?
"bu bu teh utim onlin "
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Cosgar's Alt
Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic
16
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:18:00 -
[10] - Quote
Bad trolling is bad |
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AndyPandy Puschel
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
17
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:19:00 -
[11] - Quote
Cosgar's Alt wrote:Quote: MMO: (video games) A massively multiplayer online game. A computer game in which a large number of players can simultaneously interact in a persistent world or can potentially play against a large number of players in matchmaking. (colloquial) A massively multiplayer online role-playing game. And to answer your other question, I've been playing MMOs since Ultima Online, back when you had to pay by the KB for internet access. Take your internet tough guy act and shove it.
We can throw definitions around all day long like this one:
Quote:A massively multiplayer online game (also called MMO and MMOG) is a multiplayer video game which is capable of supporting large numbers of players simultaneously. By necessity, they are played on the Internet. Many games have at least one persistent world, however others just have large numbers of players competing at once in one form or another without any lasting effect to the world at all.
This don't change the fact that most MMO's are directly associated with a large persistent world and ofc there is no 100% definite answer on what definition is more correct. In the end i don't call Dust a MMO, since im not seeing "large" numbers of players like in Planetside2 nor do i see a persistent world or even a sandbox of any kind. It would make no sense to me calling Dust a MMO, since than i also have to call BF3 an MMO, but i use the word "online/Multiplayer FPS/Shooter" for those games not MMO. |
S0LlD SNAKE
PLAYSTATION4
69
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:20:00 -
[12] - Quote
so when someone doesnt agree with you and is proving you WRONG is trolling?
srsly?
thats your comeback?
oh well not like there is a comeback to that anyway
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Cosgar's Alt
Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic
16
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:25:00 -
[13] - Quote
S0LlD SNAKE wrote:so when someone doesnt agree with you and is proving you WRONG is trolling? srsly? thats your comeback? oh well not like there is a comeback to that anyway See? That's where you're wrong, this isn't about who has the best quips and one liners. It's about having a coherent articulate discussion on a subject. Since you obviously can't do so, let alone use proper punctuation while writing in some kind of lethargic haiku format, I'd rather not waste my time. |
Natu Nobilis
BetaMax Beta CRONOS.
330
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 11:40:00 -
[14] - Quote
And instead of a good discussion about the common element of the genres, and the excellent video references about the esthetics and the cultural differences on the guns and their use, we get a shitstorm of people arguing about the user level that makes an MMO.
Thanks for the initial posting folks, it-¦s becoming harder and harder to try to play chess with pidgeons. |
Onesimus Tarsus
GamersForChrist
183
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:43:00 -
[15] - Quote
AndyPandy Puschel wrote:Cosgar's Alt wrote:S0LlD SNAKE wrote:lol @ thinking dust514 is an mmo , its set in the universe of an mmo but that doesnt make it an mmo
its just an FPS with matches 16 vs 16 Riiiigh, so those 31 other people you're playing with and against are just bots that you have no social interaction with? Obviously not, but Dust is not an MMO, since this would make BF3 and MW3 or Borderlands2 also an MMO, as long as the core game mechanic are 3 simple gamemodes, played on static maps. One of the main feature associated with an MMO is a huge persistant world, where u can freely travel around. In this regard Dust fails miserably, since all i see are a couple of maps and gamemodes and even the "preparation" room is a generic tiny lobby, without any actual meaning. DUST even fails at the most basic level for an MMO, which is character creation and diversification. Its the same crappy "u are an anonymous Suit" than in Planetside2 or Halo. In this regard even Borderlands2 is more of an MMO than DUST. Dust atm is basically World of Tanks in space, without gold ammo and a working matchmaking system. U have gamemodes + a few static maps and can pimp your toon, while there is some "secret" meta map game going on, most players don't care about or have no access to.
If this were a real MMOFPS, the star map would be front and center, and everyone involved would have to be slinging lead constantly just to keep up. I never look at the star map. It sort of discourages me that they don't push the roll out of EvE integration as hard they hype giving you the Spoonator Slaplock Guncraven V.ok. |
dustwaffle
Ill Omens EoN.
28
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:45:00 -
[16] - Quote
Cosgar's Alt wrote:See? That's where you're wrong, this isn't about who has the best quips and one liners. It's about having a coherent articulate discussion on a subject. Since you obviously can't do so, let alone use proper punctuation while writing in some kind of lethargic haiku format, I'd rather not waste my time.[
Not taking sides in this, but just thought i'd point this out.
Cosgar's Alt wrote:Riiiigh, so those 31 other people you're playing with and against are just bots that you have no social interaction with?
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dustwaffle
Ill Omens EoN.
28
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:47:00 -
[17] - Quote
Natu Nobilis wrote:And instead of a good discussion about the common element of the genres, and the excellent video references about the esthetics and the cultural differences on the guns and their use, we get a shitstorm of people arguing about the user level that makes an MMO.
Thanks for the initial posting folks, it-¦s becoming harder and harder to try to play chess with pidgeons. This is the New Eden forums, what do you expect vOv You always have Troll A vs Troll B and then the peanut gallery chimes in to add fuel to the fire. |
40glow 40glow
DUST CORE DARKSTAR ARMY
1
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:48:00 -
[18] - Quote
RELEASE THE TRAM SYSTEM !! (which is closed for routine maintenance)
GIVE US ANY SANDBOX !! (even if its small the QQ will decrease)
MAKE PC BETTER !!
YOU ARE AWESOME CCP. DUST RULES !! |
Surt gods end
Demon Ronin
170
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 11:53:00 -
[19] - Quote
I fall asleep and this thread reverts to FPS vs MMO like cats and dogs. lol
IMO. DUST is a poorly executed FPSMMO (very poorly executed FPSMMO)
That's trying very hard to incorporate mmo elements, and thus become MMO first and FPS second.
But did I just say that dust is FPS? Yup. cause that is in heart of what was made first. rather other way. So it's like a genetic hybrid gone wrong, still trying to be what it was imprinted to be.
Anyway, vid was suppose to show some one who never really cared about MMO, why others find MMO games cool. as thus the FPS video was to show why those that never touched a fps game before this why people love FPS games.
Result? despite what video may show, like cat walking into the path of a dog. sometimes the fur just flies up huh? |
Panther Alpha
Commando Perkone Caldari State
326
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 11:57:00 -
[20] - Quote
Cosgar's Alt wrote:S0LlD SNAKE wrote:lol @ thinking dust514 is an mmo , its set in the universe of an mmo but that doesnt make it an mmo
its just an FPS with matches 16 vs 16 Riiiigh, so those 31 other people you're playing with and against are just bots that you have no social interaction with?
Massively Multiplayer Online....
31 people is not Massive.
Counter Strike Source is not a MMO... yet some servers can host 44 players, 22 v's 22. |
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Cosgar's Alt
Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic
18
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Posted - 2013.05.29 11:59:00 -
[21] - Quote
Surt gods end wrote:I fall asleep and this thread reverts to FPS vs MMO like cats and dogs. lol
IMO. DUST is a poorly executed FPSMMO (very poorly executed FPSMMO)
That's trying very hard to incorporate mmo elements, and thus become MMO first and FPS second.
But did I just say that dust is FPS? Yup. cause that is in heart of what was made first. rather other way. So it's like a genetic hybrid gone wrong, still trying to be what it was imprinted to be.
Anyway, vid was suppose to show some one who never really cared about MMO, why others find MMO games cool. as thus the FPS video was to show why those that never touched a fps game before this why people love FPS games.
Result? despite what video may show, like cat walking into the path of a dog. sometimes the fur just flies up huh? Your intentions were good, but presentation could have used some work. |
Surt gods end
Demon Ronin
170
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 12:07:00 -
[22] - Quote
FPS game. which incorporates mmo element. FPSMMO.
Tho its to go now othwerway.
Anyway any one remembers what the name MAG stood for? Thats the bonus question!
Self.. tell them what they could win!
*weelllll, Today for participating every contest wins a lifetime supply of caldari cereal bars! might give constipation*
Hahaha. Well isn't that awesome? |
BASSMEANT
ZionTCD Unclaimed.
271
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 12:10:00 -
[23] - Quote
you guys don't want an mmo
you want call of duty with shields.
that what this game has become. anything outside of call of duty just doesn't work with the console community.
if it did, this game wouldn't be so bad. as it is now... it's just a clunky meh at best.
Peace B
ps mmo = sandbox
playstation home is more of an mmo then 514 |
Panther Alpha
Commando Perkone Caldari State
326
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 12:11:00 -
[24] - Quote
Surt gods end wrote:FPS game. which incorporates mmo element. FPSMMO.
Tho its to go now othwerway.
Anyway any one remembers what the name MAG stood for? Thats the bonus question!
Self.. tell them what they could win!
*weelllll, Today for participating every contest wins a lifetime supply of caldari cereal bars! might give constipation*
Hahaha. Well isn't that awesome?
Come on!! .. Battlefield 3 incorporates MMO elements .. but you don't hear anyone saying that is a MMO.
Type MMORPG in you google search, and see what happens. |
Natu Nobilis
BetaMax Beta CRONOS.
331
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 12:14:00 -
[25] - Quote
I-¦ll make a shirt tha says "I bought a PS3 just to play CCP-¦s Dust 514 and all i got was this louzy community asking for Call of Fortressfield" |
Surt gods end
Demon Ronin
170
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 12:25:00 -
[26] - Quote
BASSMEANT wrote:you guys don't want an mmo
you want call of duty with shields.
that what this game has become. anything outside of call of duty just doesn't work with the console community.
if it did, this game wouldn't be so bad. as it is now... it's just a clunky meh at best.
Peace B
ps mmo = sandbox
playstation home is more of an mmo then 514
BASS if I had it my way. ARMA 3 WOULD BE DUST 514. MMO? Yeah it's EVE ONLINE. It's over there. ------->
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Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION
702
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Posted - 2013.05.29 12:55:00 -
[27] - Quote
Fanfest revealed portions of the roadmap CCP has laid out for the near (and far) future. However, everything listed is new content. Whilst it seems awesome on the surface, what's happening is new stuff is being piled on the old, stale stuff without polishing the current mechanics first.
This game is definitely outside the box. But this means CCP has to forge their own boundaries or they will get lost in the labyrinth of infinite possibilities. They have their own universe, they have money to do whatever they want; DUST is a pampered child whose parents could make into anyone they wanted. A billionaire, debonair, pedophile (yeah I went there), playboy, doctor, teacher, scientist, leader.
I have a feeling this is getting to them. They're letting themselves be swept away by a feeling of invincibility that they aren't looking back to see they're burning their bridges as they progress.
The SP system, for one. The eruption of requests for another skill respec after Uprising shows it all.
This game is meant to live for another decade, at least, no?
So what happens when this current skill tree becomes stale? Give everyone a respec and go on again? Is that what we want? A sandbox where you've got your mummy holding your hand lest reality comes and knocks over your sandcastles?
In EVE SP should be vitally, CRUCIALLY important. But this is DUST.
SP should unlock your equipment. SP should increase your proficiency in equipment. But it shouldn't define your whole character. You're a mercenary. INCOME defines you. MONEY defines you.
Losing battles and contracts should cost insane amounts of money. Everything should cost more. Everything should be worth more. VICTORY is paramount.
SP and AFKing means victory isn't paramount. Lose a battle by sitting in the MCC all game but you're one step closer to finishing your pubstomping fit.
Imagine if SP gain increases by 500%.
Then we see the inherent problem in the skill system.
When everyone has every skill and the best gear and enough money to load out with it every game, what happens to the skill system?
Redundant. Introduce new skills? Oh, but what else can possibly be introduced to negate the lead the top players have?
Why not just give everyone access to everything, and make ISK the restraining element?
SP becomes proficiency training, making you more adept at using a piece of equipment, an INDIVIDUAL piece of equipment. There should be skills for every single bloody item in the game. But everything is unlocked initially.
OMG COD CLONE, you cry.
But wait. Increase ISK prices for everything but militia gear by something in the ballpark of 2000%. What! I can't even by one Duvolle Tactical Assault Rifle!
Yeah, but it's unlocked. You have put all your SP into it. BUT YOU CAN'T AFFORD IT. And this is how a mercenary should live. It is the ISK cost of skill books you should worry about, not the SP investment.
Get SP (and the attempt to try make DUST somewhat similar to EVE) out of the way, and ISK will last in the long-term. Reality has proven this to us. You don't need first-class education to succeed in life, you just need to know where the money is.
Balance the game around ISK, and we have an FPS that will work.
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Talruum Tezztarozza
Seraphim Auxiliaries CRONOS.
139
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Posted - 2013.05.29 15:28:00 -
[28] - Quote
MMO term is corrupted way too much. RPG corruption is quite bad itself. Anything with numerical stat or skill is called RPG even without any story at all. After enduring it for years, I can live with that. But to call any game that have character creation screen with some stat attach to it MMO ? This is still a bit too much for me. Guys, can we please stop at RPG ? Thank you.
Back to topic: Is Borderland an FPS or RPG ? I don't see it has a problem merging the two genre. Is it because it has cooperative multiplayer instead of competitive one ? Is that why there is less bitching ? Face it, No matter what you said, people simply like to win. |
steadyhand amarr
BetaMax Beta CRONOS.
618
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Posted - 2013.05.29 15:56:00 -
[29] - Quote
Shame this thread started off so well :-( |
BASSMEANT
ZionTCD Unclaimed.
272
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Posted - 2013.05.29 21:48:00 -
[30] - Quote
ill keep at it:
it's a PFPS
persistant first person shooter.
nothing more nothing less...
actually, sorry im wrong...
it's starting become a POS FPS
you can figure that out for yourselves.
Peace B |
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