DUST Search - The Duvolle Tac is stronger than Tank Blasters and Proof

Gunner Nightingale wrote:

Okay nerds let me explain the concept of a confounding variable.

A hidden unseen variable that masks the true effect of the desired variable.

The caldari logi suit and damage mod stacking are 2 of these in your justification maple.

Moreover to all you spreadsheet my MATH is MATH(numbers don't lie crowd) out there let me explain this in simple terms

FPS =\= MAGIC THE GATHERING ; i dont't simply turn my card and magically do full DPS on an enemy, there is a difference between theoretical DPS and actual/realized DPS.

Moreover DPS is meaningless because it operates under the assumption of continued un-interrupted fire over a 60s interval and yet people forget to factor in the clips of weapons, as well as recoil, weapon accuracy vs user accuracy, and the fact that you simply aren't outputting all that damage at once.

See this is why we can't have nice things in Dust, a bunch of pseudo-intellectuals who come in and say oh look at my numbers they are MATH so they MUST be correct, WRONG numbers can lie if you are operating under crap assumptions which is exactly what DPS is in an FPS a crap assumption.

Im not going to waste my time lecturing people on statistical analysis methodologies and sources of error, I simply don't have the patience or the time. Suffice to say if CCP is going to be monitoring the TAR (as they should all weapons) they best be monitoring the most successful teams in PC and the not so successful teams in PC and see if it is just TAR or if there are other variable at play too.

That said the ONLY real issue on TAR is its hipfire dispersion and it being far too easy to kill while hipfiring the weapon and possibly its ROF in conjuction with hipfire but its hard to isolate the 2 from each other which is why CCP needs to tweak one and leave the other before they tweak both; confounding variable this is how they work and you control for one to test the other that is what is known as multivariate analysis

Professor Nightingale out,

Class dismissed


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Nathan Daemon DUST University Ivy League 0	Posted - 2013.05.21 07:49:00 - [1] - Quote As a dedicated assault player with only 4.5 million SP, I use the GEK something or other advanced assault rifle, with an advanced Caldari assault suit. I run all middle of the line mods, and I believe that I am an average skilled FPS player. I POOP all over most of these fools who are running around with the rifle y'all are whining about. Honestly, take a note from Halo's plabook- jump. Gator your opponent (zig zag, for those who are unfamiliar with the term), run forward and back while jumping. Changing distance to the target while moving parallel to your adversary will jack up his aim, and force him to much more actively track you. I say this to reinforce my next point... The balance of the Duvoll is the cute little excuse for a magazine that it has. My advanced rifle has a 60 round mag. The Duvoll has half of that. With my middle of the line gear, he has to hit me with almost every shot, or else my shields start repping and he can't kill me. If I get in a potshot or two while be unloads his glass cannon, I knock down 25% of his shields and wait for him to run out of ammo. Now I've got around 30-40 rounds left while be has to reload. It really isn't tough. I'm coming from a perspective where I HAVE NO OTHER OPTION but to go toe to toe with joe ******* and his Duvoll, equipped with my John smith everyman's average joe gear with much more limited range, and I'm winning. Often. The Duvoll doesn't need to be nerfed. You all need to QQ and step up your game. -Irish
Nathan Daemon DUST University Ivy League 1	Posted - 2013.05.21 13:52:00 - [2] - Quote Gunner Nightingale wrote: Okay nerds let me explain the concept of a confounding variable. A hidden unseen variable that masks the true effect of the desired variable. The caldari logi suit and damage mod stacking are 2 of these in your justification maple. Moreover to all you spreadsheet my MATH is MATH(numbers don't lie crowd) out there let me explain this in simple terms FPS =\= MAGIC THE GATHERING ; i dont't simply turn my card and magically do full DPS on an enemy, there is a difference between theoretical DPS and actual/realized DPS. Moreover DPS is meaningless because it operates under the assumption of continued un-interrupted fire over a 60s interval and yet people forget to factor in the clips of weapons, as well as recoil, weapon accuracy vs user accuracy, and the fact that you simply aren't outputting all that damage at once. See this is why we can't have nice things in Dust, a bunch of pseudo-intellectuals who come in and say oh look at my numbers they are MATH so they MUST be correct, WRONG numbers can lie if you are operating under crap assumptions which is exactly what DPS is in an FPS a crap assumption. Im not going to waste my time lecturing people on statistical analysis methodologies and sources of error, I simply don't have the patience or the time. Suffice to say if CCP is going to be monitoring the TAR (as they should all weapons) they best be monitoring the most successful teams in PC and the not so successful teams in PC and see if it is just TAR or if there are other variable at play too. That said the ONLY real issue on TAR is its hipfire dispersion and it being far too easy to kill while hipfiring the weapon and possibly its ROF in conjuction with hipfire but its hard to isolate the 2 from each other which is why CCP needs to tweak one and leave the other before they tweak both; confounding variable this is how they work and you control for one to test the other that is what is known as multivariate analysis Professor Nightingale out, Class dismissed If I wasn't already married, I'd be down on one knee right now. I... I think I love you dude. Anyway, I LOVE how there hasn't been a SINGLE response to my original post, all the way back on page one. Lol Pathetic. -Irish
Nathan Daemon DUST University Ivy League 1	Posted - 2013.05.21 14:39:00 - [3] - Quote ladwar wrote: brown noser... You're... well, kinda stupid. This guy reinforced my original point. It's not brown nosing, HE agreed with ME. Do you HAVE to wear that helmet, or do you just wear it because your flavored bite guard attaches to the face protector? -Irish
Nathan Daemon DUST University Ivy League 1	Posted - 2013.05.21 21:33:00 - [4] - Quote ZiwZih wrote: Paran Tadec wrote: Gunner Nightingale wrote: That said the ONLY real issue on TAR is its hipfire dispersion and it being far too easy to kill while hipfiring the weapon and possibly its ROF in conjuction with hipfire but its hard to isolate the 2 from each other which is why CCP needs to tweak one and leave the other before they tweak both; confounding variable this is how they work and you control for one to test the other that is what is known as multivariate analysis Professor Nightingale out, Class dismissed https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=80138&find=unread ^ The problem. Also, Maple, you might want to apply to CCP, they also like to balance the game using their infamous math and data. They have done great job so far, haven't they? OH NOES!! MATHS and SCIENCES?!?! And I suppose that you'd rather CCP fine-tune their games with the well informed, omnipotent opinions of the incredibly intellectually superior individuals that populate their forums, who of course represent EVERY LAST DUST 514 player. Sounds legit. Lets do it. -Irish