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Kazeno Rannaa
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
175
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Posted - 2013.05.26 07:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
What would be nice on this thread is a bit of Dev input and those from the CPM. ANYONE HERE??? |
Kazeno Rannaa
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
176
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Posted - 2013.05.26 08:12:00 -
[2] - Quote
Zeylon Rho wrote:I don't know about a range increasing skill. I think the optimum range for a pulse-laser should be higher than a blaster, but that seems like it would be a lot more unbalancing as a passive than something like heat-build up reduction (which is a pretty balanced change, given the current Amarr example).
I'd say to correct the ranges and passives, and balance from there.
ARs besides being plasma require practically nothing in light weapon op to unlock (at rank 1), and give the player a variety of weapons that have short high damage options (Breach), mid range, and super-long range options (Tac AR). So, they've basically made blasters/plasma weaponry the most versatile, flexible, and damaging weapons in the game. It's not even remotely balanced at the moment. It seems like the TAR belongs more in a rail rifle category that doesn't exist yet (and wouldn't or shouldn't have the fire rate it does if it did).
So, on the topic at hand, heat-build-up reduction seems like the safest change balance-wise. Heat reduction shouldn't be restricted to Amarr Assaults as a group anyhow, that's very limiting. It's one thing if they're the best at it, it's another if they're the only ones who can get it.
The range on pulse should be longer than blasters as well - I'm not sure if 4 to 1 like EVE is practical, but it definitely shouldn't be crappier like it is now.
On that note, the scrambler pistol should probably have better range than it does as well, but I guess that one's less likely to get love.
I see the point you bring up, yet I find the passive heat build up for both the ASCR/SCR and the Laser rifle doesn't make any sense at this point, at least not to me and not with the myriad threads that have brought up no other reason than "its a fricking laser, man!". I am still partial to the idea presented by Cinaed because of how it encourages people to fully skill into weapons to really be able to enjoy the true value each piece can bring to the battlefield. I find that since CCP started with ****-poor range on a laser and then nerfed the crap out of the beam laser rifle, the combination and the thinking behind Cinaed's proposal just makes way more sense. |
Kazeno Rannaa
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
181
|
Posted - 2013.05.27 16:30:00 -
[3] - Quote
Zeylon Rho wrote:Kazeno Rannaa wrote:Zeylon Rho wrote:I don't know about a range increasing skill. I think the optimum range for a pulse-laser should be higher than a blaster, but that seems like it would be a lot more unbalancing as a passive than something like heat-build up reduction (which is a pretty balanced change, given the current Amarr example).
I'd say to correct the ranges and passives, and balance from there.
ARs besides being plasma require practically nothing in light weapon op to unlock (at rank 1), and give the player a variety of weapons that have short high damage options (Breach), mid range, and super-long range options (Tac AR). So, they've basically made blasters/plasma weaponry the most versatile, flexible, and damaging weapons in the game. It's not even remotely balanced at the moment. It seems like the TAR belongs more in a rail rifle category that doesn't exist yet (and wouldn't or shouldn't have the fire rate it does if it did).
So, on the topic at hand, heat-build-up reduction seems like the safest change balance-wise. Heat reduction shouldn't be restricted to Amarr Assaults as a group anyhow, that's very limiting. It's one thing if they're the best at it, it's another if they're the only ones who can get it.
The range on pulse should be longer than blasters as well - I'm not sure if 4 to 1 like EVE is practical, but it definitely shouldn't be crappier like it is now.
On that note, the scrambler pistol should probably have better range than it does as well, but I guess that one's less likely to get love. I see the point you bring up, yet I find the passive heat build up for both the ASCR/SCR and the Laser rifle doesn't make any sense at this point, at least not to me and not with the myriad threads that have brought up no other reason than "its a fricking laser, man!". I am still partial to the idea presented by Cinaed because of how it encourages people to fully skill into weapons to really be able to enjoy the true value each piece can bring to the battlefield. I find that since CCP started with ****-poor range on a laser and then nerfed the crap out of the beam laser rifle, the combination and the thinking behind Cinaed's proposal just makes way more sense. The passive heat build is supposed to be a trade-off for the strengths of the weapon (mind you, I still think a heat-reduction passive makes the most sense for the weapon skill). However, it doesn't make sense at the moment because the direct competition outstrips it in every conceivable way (dispersion, range, fire-rate, etc.). So, a TAR can outrange a laser... but also outdamage it.... and it doesn't overheat. That's problematic. I can see what you're saying - drawbacks make less sense when a weapon is already underpowered in comparison to the competition.
Exactly. I would like to see other suggestions for the passive skill besides ours. It seems that most people just want the TacAR to be OP a d those that have felt the fury of the current incarnation of the scrambler rifle are very afraid of what it will become (and very honestly should be in the first place) if the adjustment is made to it. And I think the range issue should be made along with a change in the passive skill. |
Kazeno Rannaa
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
184
|
Posted - 2013.05.28 14:40:00 -
[4] - Quote
BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote:Kazeno Rannaa wrote:Zeylon Rho wrote:Kazeno Rannaa wrote:Zeylon Rho wrote:I don't know about a range increasing skill. I think the optimum range for a pulse-laser should be higher than a blaster, but that seems like it would be a lot more unbalancing as a passive than something like heat-build up reduction (which is a pretty balanced change, given the current Amarr example).
I'd say to correct the ranges and passives, and balance from there.
ARs besides being plasma require practically nothing in light weapon op to unlock (at rank 1), and give the player a variety of weapons that have short high damage options (Breach), mid range, and super-long range options (Tac AR). So, they've basically made blasters/plasma weaponry the most versatile, flexible, and damaging weapons in the game. It's not even remotely balanced at the moment. It seems like the TAR belongs more in a rail rifle category that doesn't exist yet (and wouldn't or shouldn't have the fire rate it does if it did).
So, on the topic at hand, heat-build-up reduction seems like the safest change balance-wise. Heat reduction shouldn't be restricted to Amarr Assaults as a group anyhow, that's very limiting. It's one thing if they're the best at it, it's another if they're the only ones who can get it.
The range on pulse should be longer than blasters as well - I'm not sure if 4 to 1 like EVE is practical, but it definitely shouldn't be crappier like it is now.
On that note, the scrambler pistol should probably have better range than it does as well, but I guess that one's less likely to get love. I see the point you bring up, yet I find the passive heat build up for both the ASCR/SCR and the Laser rifle doesn't make any sense at this point, at least not to me and not with the myriad threads that have brought up no other reason than "its a fricking laser, man!". I am still partial to the idea presented by Cinaed because of how it encourages people to fully skill into weapons to really be able to enjoy the true value each piece can bring to the battlefield. I find that since CCP started with ****-poor range on a laser and then nerfed the crap out of the beam laser rifle, the combination and the thinking behind Cinaed's proposal just makes way more sense. The passive heat build is supposed to be a trade-off for the strengths of the weapon (mind you, I still think a heat-reduction passive makes the most sense for the weapon skill). However, it doesn't make sense at the moment because the direct competition outstrips it in every conceivable way (dispersion, range, fire-rate, etc.). So, a TAR can outrange a laser... but also outdamage it.... and it doesn't overheat. That's problematic. I can see what you're saying - drawbacks make less sense when a weapon is already underpowered in comparison to the competition. Exactly. I would like to see other suggestions for the passive skill besides ours. It seems that most people just want the TacAR to be OP a d those that have felt the fury of the current incarnation of the scrambler rifle are very afraid of what it will become (and very honestly should be in the first place) if the adjustment is made to it. And I think the range issue should be made along with a change in the passive skill. I got It. How about, instead of "5% to heat build up reduction", go for "5% scrambler rifle cooldown speed after overheating" ? This way the build balances the weapon, yet the skill reduces the time it takes to get back into battle? similar to the lazer rifle
I think that is a fair recommendation. Thanks. I need to ponder that after finding this piece from a corporate
"Sergeant Wiznowski wrote: CCP Rampart
We'll be making some adjustments to the rifle ranges in the near future. We're currently testing the Rail Rifle and Combat Rifle internally (the two missing archetypes). Within the assault rifle class the four weapon types will break down as follows:
Assault Rifle (Hybrid - Plasma) - short range Combat Rifle (Projectile - Autocannon) - short-mid range Scrambler Rifle (Laser - Pulse) - mid range Rail Rifle (Hybrid - Railgun) - long range
Keep in mind though that long range for an assault rifle is not equivalent to long range for a sniper rifle, so while they will adhere to existing category definitions don't expect massive differences in the distances between these weapons A lot of the original assault rifle variants (Breach, Burst, Tactical) were created to fill the gaps these newer weapons will fill and so mightGÇÖve felt out of place (not to mention we just plain made mistakes with some of them). The scrambler rifleGÇÖs optimal range will be increased and weGÇÖll be releasing an iteration of the Tactical Assault Rifle with a smaller clip and much wider hip-fire spread making it less effective in CQC. If that change alone does not prove enough we will walk the damage of the TAR down slowly. No big, sweeping changes this time. "
I need to find the total post to have more perspective.
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Kazeno Rannaa
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
184
|
Posted - 2013.05.28 14:43:00 -
[5] - Quote
Found it here |
Kazeno Rannaa
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
184
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 14:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
Meeko Fent wrote:If the TAR is supposed to be for the CRR (Caldari Rail Rifle) Then Somebody needs to balance them both. The Rail Rifle Need to preform like a Shorter range Sniper, Not a Long Range SCR with no drawbacks. Slow the ROF of the RR, and the TAR since they both are Kinda being placeholders for the other
Oh yeah, and as More and More Weapons that the AR variant were standing in for, DELETE THEM. Or at least severely hamper there usage so people use the New weapon More then the Old. This game will exist Forever in Perpetual Beta until all the Gear Is put in to fill in the Racial Holes and the Weapon types we don't have.
I completely agree. I don't know why CCP decided to call this a release since the basic racial variants of all the weapon classes (i.e., Heavy, light, sidearm, knife, LAV, HAV, and Dropship) are yet to be released. I can see doing without the racial variants for the time being on the MCC and such, but these other things? NAH, not a release just an over glorified beta still.
The thing is, with all of this balancing going on, it can not be done properly without the basics racial variants.
But this is just my 0.02 ISK. Nothing more, besides maybe a bit of common sense, which seems to be in short supply in the commonality of it.
I would also like to see racial variants of grenades maybe some time in the future along with the PvE aspects. |
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