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Ecshon Autorez Nova Tech Marines Hephaestus Forge Alliance 27	Posted - 2013.05.21 02:50:00 - [1] - Quote An equipment that you equip (obviously), aproach an enemy vehicle, and "fire" it will take time similar to hacking an objective or structure, but upon completion will "Cause the generator inside the vehicle to overload." or something similar, depending on what effect it has. This could have numerous effects depending on what Devs decide to make it do. Destroys vehicle/ deals (large? I hope so, otherwise it wont help against HAVs and such) amount of damage to vehicle (if destroying instantly is OP) Temporarily randomly reasigns all of the controls to other buttons, allowing teamates to run, attack, or do whatever they want because the driver is to busy trying to figure out what button shoots. Kills occupants (can be done by slow damage caused by the generator, allowing them to escape demise by jumping out, or by an instant internal explosion). Temporarily (or permanenlty) disables the vehicle (completely or just one part, be it movement or weapons), forcing them to recall it, or wait it out and hope no AV Heavy shows up. Ejects all enemy occupants and performs lockout to prevent them from getting back in for say, lets go with 10-20s Temporarily disables the use of active modules, and turns any that are currently on off (not sure if it should make them all simply have to recharge, perform a lockout for X amount of time, or what). Disables viewing (would only effect HAVs and similar vehicles, LAVs would be immune) causing you screen to be replaced with static or something else (Trollface anyone?) be you using first or third person. In my mind I see this as just simply equiping the Cortex and running around with it, perhaps in different color if the Dev in charge of the coloring feels like it. Since this would only actually need one button (R1) that means that they could fit a secondary effect onto L1, allowing a single one of these to eject the occupants (R1), or if its got a squad of Heavies inside making that a bad idea, destroy or damage the vehicle/ occupants (L1). Perhaps R1 would change depending on what type you used but L1 will always remain do X amount of damage, or something of the like that can affect all vehicles. When your vehicle is being hacked a warning would appear similar to the one that appears when being scanned with an active scanner. Skills could include things like: Increased hack speed You can hack longer before the warning appears (making it not appear instantly) Increases duration of effects Increases amount of damage done (be it bulk or DPS depending if done instantly or not) Any thoughts on this?
Nova Knife Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 975	Posted - 2013.05.21 04:13:00 - [2] - Quote If you have enough time to 'hack' a vehicle... You should be running in a fit that has remote explosives, and AV grenades. Seriously. You have no idea the amount of pwn you can inflict on a vehicle with a cluster of remote explosives, following by some AV nade spam. (Or maybe you do?) Either way... I'm not sold on the idea of forcibily ejecting enemy players and the like. UI disruption and mobility penalties for vehicles are forms of E-War that are worth exploring though, IMO.
Ecshon Autorez Nova Tech Marines Hephaestus Forge Alliance 27	Posted - 2013.05.21 19:09:00 - [3] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: If you have enough time to 'hack' a vehicle... You should be running in a fit that has remote explosives, and AV grenades. But this wouldn't need to reload, just recharge like the active scanner, meaning that the player wouldn't have to give up another equipment slot for nanohives, only take out a few vehicles per life, or keep running back to supply depots. Several differences between the currently unnamed equipment and Remote Explosives REs can be used as Anti-Infantry, this cannot. REs have a set amount of explosive charges that you can carry at a single time, this simply needs to recharge. REs can only be used to destroy enemy vehicles, this (depending on the effect it has) can be used to capture an enemy occupied vehicle (by ejecting them, forcing them to jump out because their screen has become static, or damaging them while inside) or destroy the vehicle, like REs would. In order to use this, you must remain within a set distance of the vehicle, REs can be left on the ground, some of them are proximity and don't even need to have a player watch them, allowing players to drop them in the middle of a street in an urban environment, run to the top of a mountain, and kill a full tank. I'd post more but I have to leave, once I get back on I'll add on another possible effect that I thought of to the list, finish this post (if I can remember what I was planning on saying), amd delete this so people know I came back
CharCharOdell Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 181	Posted - 2013.05.22 03:14:00 - [4] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: If you have enough time to 'hack' a vehicle... You should be running in a fit that has remote explosives, and AV grenades. Seriously. You have no idea the amount of pwn you can inflict on a vehicle with a cluster of remote explosives, following by some AV nade spam. (Or maybe you do?) Either way... I'm not sold on the idea of forcibily ejecting enemy players and the like. UI disruption and mobility penalties for vehicles are forms of E-War that are worth exploring though, IMO. Only if we get to use E-war on the grunts. I want to emit a pulse that is a giant flux grenade to everyone around my tank for 10m.
Ecshon Autorez Nova Tech Marines Hephaestus Forge Alliance 29	Posted - 2013.05.22 21:21:00 - [5] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: Seriously. You have no idea the amount of pwn you can inflict on a vehicle with a cluster of remote explosives, following by some AV nade spam. (Or maybe you do?) In regards to the above: I just plcaed two REs directly beneath (as in it drove over them and then I detonated them) a Gunnlogi, didn't even take it down one quarter of its shields. BUT, while I was placing them (about 2ft away with the driver in a missle turret, failing to hit me) I feel I had enough time to hack the vehicle.
Nova Knife Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 1018	Posted - 2013.05.23 01:13:00 - [6] - Quote Ecshon Autorez wrote: Nova Knife wrote: Seriously. You have no idea the amount of pwn you can inflict on a vehicle with a cluster of remote explosives, following by some AV nade spam. (Or maybe you do?) In regards to the above: I just placed two REs directly beneath (as in it drove over them and then I detonated them) a Gunnlogi, didn't even take it down one quarter of its shields. BUT, while I was placing them (about 2ft away with the driver in a missle turret, failing to hit me) I feel I had enough time to hack the vehicle. Yeah, two RE won't really do much. Generally speaking, RE's are much better used as a manually triggered cluster of mines, than as a "run up and blow them up" kind of weapon. (They'd be much more viable at the latter if the third person camera on HAV didn't make them immune to this) Five RE's in a cluster will seriously hurt any HAV enough that most can be finished with AV nades before they move out of range. (Good 'traps' are laid with some proxy explosives laid down shortly before or after the RE's. Don't mix them within each others' blast radius, it doesn't work) I guess I'm not really sold on the "If you get close and can stay close for X seconds, you get Y" as being something that improves the gameplay at all. Maybe it's just the suggestions tied to it. Instant destruction without some sort of warning (I do note that you have the "being hacked" warning in there, but wouldn't someone just like... drive away, at that point?) Messing with their controls seems messy and unfun. You're proposing options where the infantry have a massively unfair advantage without proposing any proper counter for vehicle people, and that's where I really take issue. AV already have a massive advantage over vehicles as-is. The idea of stealing someone's tank somehow is awesome, but we really don't need 'easymode' AV mechanics right now. We need actual balance between the vehicle and AV dynamic, and I honestly think that these suggestions -as proposed- would make things worse. That's not to say the idea of "Get close for X and get Y" is a bad idea in itself, but you really need to work on your 'Why we need Y" in the first place.
Ecshon Autorez Nova Tech Marines Hephaestus Forge Alliance 29	Posted - 2013.05.23 02:30:00 - [7] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: I guess I'm not really sold on the "If you get close and can stay close for X seconds, you get Y" as being something that improves the gameplay at all. Maybe it's just the suggestions tied to it. Instant destruction without some sort of warning (I do note that you have the "being hacked" warning in there, but wouldn't someone just like... drive away, at that point?) Well they don't always drive away when its obvious your placing REs because you've been attempting the same thing for about 2 minutes... I'm looking at you Gunnlogi driver. >_> Also, thats why I brought up the skill that as it increases a delay happens and increases in duration before the warning appears. I'm sure that thay could also implement a "Firewall" skill for vehicle people that increases the amount of time it takes to hack. Maybe make an entire E-War skill tree for things like this? Nova Knife wrote:* You're proposing options where the infantry have a massively unfair advantage without proposing any proper counter for vehicle people, and that's where I really take issue. AV already have a massive advantage over vehicles as-is. The idea of stealing someone's tank somehow is awesome, but we really don't need 'easymode' AV mechanics right now. We need actual balance between the vehicle and AV dynamic, and I honestly think that these suggestions -as proposed- would make things worse. That's not to say the idea of "Get close for X and get Y" is a bad idea in itself, but you really need to work on your 'Why we need Y" in the first place. Those are good points, I'll get on that. only came up with that thanks to your input See what happens when there's input from more than one person? I'm looking at you, every single person who read this thread and didn't bother to post. >_> Fun fact: I came up with this after reading the Amarr Laser Blade thread, my thought process was: anti infantry laser sword thing-> a welding torch -> BF3 repair tool-> A Plasma Cutter for AV similar to the BF3 repair tool (it is sci-fi after all)-> hacking device that you carry and attach to the side of the vehicle-> using the Cortex to hack enemy vehicles Edit: OH! Ya, on the subject of REs, I only skilled into them so I could give details about the bug that lets you turn them invisible by placing them inside objects, so I'm not that proficient with them.*
Ecshon Autorez Nova Tech Marines Hephaestus Forge Alliance 29	Posted - 2013.05.23 02:44:00 - [8] - Quote @CharCharOdell Why don't you help out with coming up with things that could be implemented to help counter this, as Nova knife said: they don't have any means to counter it right now.
Pseudogenesis Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 11	Posted - 2013.05.23 04:06:00 - [9] - Quote I'm still holding out for AV Nova Knives
Ecshon Autorez Nova Tech Marines Hephaestus Forge Alliance 29	Posted - 2013.05.23 04:17:00 - [10] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: I'm still holding out for AV Nova Knives meet Ecshon Autorez wrote: A Plasma Cutter for AV similar to the BF3 repair tool (it is sci-fi after all) To any AVers or drivers who read this, if you have any ideas for evening the playing field and providing a counter to the hacking tool (seriously, someone come up with a name for it) please post about it.

Ecshon Autorez Nova Tech Marines Hephaestus Forge Alliance 30	Posted - 2013.05.23 19:14:00 - [11] - Quote Well so far I've got one counter down for the drivers. An active module that when activated it emits a (non-lethal/lethal? gimme some input on that aspect, I think it might be able to screw around with their vision like in S8:P if a Pulse Cannon hits near you.) energy blast that pushes nearby enemies away. This would not JUST be useful for countering the proposed equipment, but also other things like: Enemy trying to place REs next to you? Activate the module and send them flying! Enemy being annoying at close range, but if you get out they'll start strafing around the vehicle to keep it in-between you and them? Activate the module to push him far enough away so you can get out and kill him before he gets to cover! Enemy trying to hack you? No worries, activate module, send them flying, proceed to shoot them with your cannon. Area denial, though this one would be difficult. Got a compound under attack with only one road in? Plop a tank down in the middle of the entrance! What's that? That stops vehicles but not infantry because infantry can fit in-between the tank and the walls? No problem! Just use the module to send them flying! Got a Logi outside healing you but a Scout Shotgun is coming up and you can't seem to hit him? Buy the Logi some time by pushing the Scout back with this module! I think it should have specs like: Short recharge time, to handle really persistant people Push back to around 20m? (Is that far enough? Or too close?) Screws with vision, similar to the effect the Pulse Cannon had in S8:P when it hits near you.
Xender17 Murderz for hire 92	Posted - 2013.05.23 19:53:00 - [12] - Quote I take your a anti-vehicle politician... Explain how someone would be forced out of their vehicle if you hacked it. Sure they could stop access to it. But you would have to get inside to control the tank... There is a hatch and I don't think the lock would be on the outside. Tank Driver "LOL. That gut is hacking us" Turret 1 "What does he expect to happen?" Turret 2 "There is hatch how would he get in?" Hack completed. Everyone teleports outside of tank. Tank driver "Wut?"
Ecshon Autorez Nova Tech Marines Hephaestus Forge Alliance 30	Posted - 2013.05.23 21:15:00 - [13] - Quote Xender17 wrote: I take your a anti-vehicle politician... Explain how someone would be forced out of their vehicle if you hacked it. Sure they could stop access to it. But you would have to get inside to control the tank... There is a hatch and I don't think the lock would be on the outside. Tank Driver "LOL. That gut is hacking us" Turret 1 "What does he expect to happen?" Turret 2 "There is hatch how would he get in?" Hack completed. Everyone teleports outside of tank. Tank driver "Wut?" I'm actually a logibro with nothing aganst tanks or other vehicles. I have, on occasion, followed a tank around with my repair tool. How do you explain them teleporting out of the tank when they get out normally? I don't see them open a hatch and hop out. It would do the same thing that they do to normally get out, except this time, it's forcing them to. How do you hack it when it's empty and get inside, if the lock is on the inside? Do you think they use a key? If you think that you need to be inside to "control the tank" then you are wrong. Using your logic we wouldn't need to hack enemy vehicles to begin with, they would be more like the vehicles in BF3, whoever is currently inside controls it, but the second they get out it is neutral and anyone can hop in. As for how would it kick you out, well, how does it know not to let enemies in? Once the hack is complete it tampers with the tanks IFF (Identify Friend or Foe) causing it to believe that the current operators are on the opposing team, as such it will try to "purge them", kicking them out and temporarily locking them out of the vehicle (until it can fix the changes done by the hack). If this is implemented then the diver and turret operators won't be going "LULZ, look at this scrub." (Except for maybe the first time it happens) From then on they will know that someone hacking them is just as dangerous as other AV methods (except that it is arguably easier to deal with), like a forge gunner or a cluster of REs and will react accordingly. When you see a squad of swarm launchers backing a couple of forge gunners how do you react? I bet you don't behave like you suggested they would. After all, everyone will be able to go onto the market and check to see what effects any equipment, vehicles, weapons, ect. has, so I feel like a dedicated driver would take the time to read the stats and effects of AV weapons and gear, so that they are better prepared to deal with it on the field. I also suggested a new module that would allow them to counter the hackers (by pushing them out of hacking range and (probably) into range of the turrets), So I feel that for the most part it is rather balanced (if we continue to come up with new ideas to help counter) They need to be approx. within melee range to hack. So don't park next to doors or hallways that you can't see or shoot down, otherwise you can kill them before they even reach you. It takes time to hack, So once you see that someone is hacking, start to do whatever it is that you do to deal with them. (Jump out and shoot, use the module I brought up, drive away, call for assistance from infantry, ect.) There will most likely be modules and skills that increase the amount of time required to hack and also ones that reduce the duration or effect of hacks.
Ecshon Autorez Nova Tech Marines Hephaestus Forge Alliance 34	Posted - 2013.05.26 03:23:00 - [14] - Quote Second counter for the drivers. A counterhack module: When activated it removes progress on the hack, buying time in a "two steps forward, one step back" kind of way. A high level one would completely undo the work of someone using a low level hacking module, by removing progress faster than they make it. But when a PRO counter hack module is up against a PRO hack equipment you get the "two steps forward, one step back" scenario. Even a PRO module won't make a net decrease on progress done using a PRO hacking equipment, but it will slow it down. This would be useful if your HAV has low acceleration but high (or at least decent) top speed.
Ecshon Autorez Nova Tech Marines Hephaestus Forge Alliance 39	Posted - 2013.05.26 07:29:00 - [15] - Quote Got third counter fordrivers down. CharCharOdell wrote: Only if we get to use E-war on the grunts. I want to emit a pulse that is a giant flux grenade to everyone around my tank for 10m. Thanks for the inspiration. Basically turns the vehicle into a giant Flux Grenade, but with a few twists. Flux radius is 10 meters (2.8 meters larger than the PRO Flux Grenade) from the tank (so the radius doesn't start inside the tank, the 10m starts at the outside of the tank) In other words: If you are within 10 meters of any part of the tank, you will be fluxed. Longer recharge time than the other modules I suggested so far. Has a 2-3s charge time before the pulse occurs, during that time something happens that lets people know it's being charged. (like how armor repair modules and shield boosters glow) Due to it being more powerful than handheld Flux Grenades, this also temporarily disable some HUD elements/dropsuit capabilities. Possibilities include: IFF (Identify Friend or Foe), Minimap, pasive scanner, Voice chat, Ammo/Armor/Shield counters, Remotely operated things (like REs, any drones that the person actually controls), The ability to call support (OBs, vehicles, and such) Possibility Due to it being more powerful than handheld Flux Grenades it prevent shields from recharging for X amount of time (so if X is 10s but your depleted recharge delay is 4s, you won't be able to recharge until the 10s are up, but if X is 5s and your depleted shield recharge delay is 6s then you won't be affected)


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