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[Request] - Betrayal For Hire

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Daedric Lothar Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 374	Posted - 2013.05.20 15:39:00 - [1] - Quote The forums are exploding due to the Awoxing/Jenzaing going on. Why not run with it, make cool features that support this type of activity. Dust isn't EVE and Spies aren't really as useful. Why not make the name of the game about Betrayal? In the video to showcase Dust the guy betrays the merc and orb bombs him then the girl betrays the guy. Lets have that cool stuff! How about a corp can make a blanket offer to the opposing team that all members can see, Something like "Kill 10 members of your team and get 50,000,000" and if you kill 10 of your teammates then you can get the cash. Or how about, "You can now hack your own "B" to give it to the other team for 1,000,000" . Make Betrayal a part of the game. maybe even make it even smaller and more evil. Like "Red offers you $100,000 to allow them to see your minimap and allies location, you hit 1 button and it engages betrayal mode and you subtly can show the other team all your guys locations and you get paid." The other team can see who betrayed and can negotiate with them later for other stuff, but the friendly team can't see the info. So then the team who paid for the information can sell out the informate to the team he betrayed. Super Metagame What do you think?
Rachoi HavoK Core RISE of LEGION 52	Posted - 2013.05.20 15:42:00 - [2] - Quote not only no, but **** no. that would kill ANY cohesion that current alliances have, and make corporations something nobody wants to join. i really dont see how giving a money incentive to killing an ally is any good, espcially when in PC it currently rapes your Warpoints to do so
Daedric Lothar Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 374	Posted - 2013.05.20 16:01:00 - [3] - Quote Rachoi wrote: not only no, but **** no. that would kill ANY cohesion that current alliances have, and make corporations something nobody wants to join. i really dont see how giving a money incentive to killing an ally is any good, espcially when in PC it currently rapes your Warpoints to do so Humbug, people will play for the metagame. What other game out there has anything like this? It would be new fresh and exciting. Eve always gets press when there is a big corp theft. People want this feature, it's exciting. It will bring new blood. There are a lot of ways to go also. If you could, wouldn't you like to turn someone so you could win?
Daedric Lothar Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 375	Posted - 2013.05.20 16:25:00 - [4] - Quote We can have all sorts of cool stuff. You could access the betrayal menu from the death screen or menu. A red comes to your nano hive, clicks it and offers to buy it. Turn drop uplinks Sell out for the other team to listen to your coms. Sabotage the RDV, cause delays. Maybe have it deliver a bomb instead of the tank someone ordered Sell out your hack points make it so the other team can instantly start the hack. Betrayal for eve pilots. Orb strikes target the requester and not the target. Ability to load dummy bullets and grenades that don't hurt. Get paid to spawn as a decoy. Drop uplinks that allow the enemy to spawn there instead of allies. Sell out orbital request sites so the reds know where it will fall. Ability to revive reds So much that could be done....
Jadek Menaheim WarRavens 8	Posted - 2013.05.21 06:29:00 - [5] - Quote I love these ideas! There should be some 'difficult' way for corporations and alliances to perform counter-intelligence on your clandestine activities. This may play into a merc security rating. There may be a payable isk/aur service that corporations subscribe to which provide emails to CEO's of hacked/intercepted transmissions. Possibly, there could be tiers of security of services which have a higher probability of detection yet cost more for subscription. Corps would have to weigh the costs of security subscriptions with maintaining enough isk revenue to support district clones and other corporation endeavors.
Jadek Menaheim WarRavens 8	Posted - 2013.05.21 06:31:00 - [6] - Quote "MCFLY!!!! I was monitoring that scan you just interfaced...YOU ARE TERMINATED!" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlEFqR4SaVA
Daedric Lothar Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 410	Posted - 2013.05.21 11:05:00 - [7] - Quote Jadek Menaheim wrote: I love these ideas! There should be some 'difficult' way for corporations and alliances to perform counter-intelligence on your clandestine activities. This may play into a merc security rating. Well I was thinking about it and you don't want to give to much away to the corp a merc is in, because that would definately promote less teamwork. I think that for this to work that it would also be good for the Dust Mercs to not have a corporate history, that each corp and alliance should keep their own list of who is who. That you can be sold out by the corp who paid you should be enough to keep most people in line. I also think it may be interesting if you can offer betrayal. Instead of just selecting offers the Reds choose, that you can make clandestine offers to them that they can pick. The most interesting part would be if it wasn't guarenteed. Like you could be paid to drop an uplink the enemy could spawn at, however, that doesn't mean the blues won't be camping it. You could take an offer to give them a hack point and then have it not transfer.
Robert JD Niewiadomski NULLIMPEX INC 129	Posted - 2013.05.21 11:44:00 - [8] - Quote Betrayal is not something that needs to be built into the game. It is built into you. If you can betray in this game you will do this IRL. It's a matter of integrity. Or rather lack of it
Daedric Lothar Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 411	Posted - 2013.05.21 12:15:00 - [9] - Quote Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Betrayal is not something that needs to be built into the game. It is built into you. If you can betray in this game you will do this IRL. It's a matter of integrity. Or rather lack of it Sounds like you haven't sat down to a nice game of "Diplomacy"
Robert JD Niewiadomski NULLIMPEX INC 129	Posted - 2013.05.21 12:23:00 - [10] - Quote Daedric Lothar wrote: Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Betrayal is not something that needs to be built into the game. It is built into you. If you can betray in this game you will do this IRL. It's a matter of integrity. Or rather lack of it Sounds like you haven't sat down to a nice game of "Diplomacy" meh

Vermaak Doe SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 730	Posted - 2013.05.21 12:25:00 - [11] - Quote It's not meta g ame if it's this artificial.
Daedric Lothar Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 411	Posted - 2013.05.21 12:27:00 - [12] - Quote Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Daedric Lothar wrote: Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Betrayal is not something that needs to be built into the game. It is built into you. If you can betray in this game you will do this IRL. It's a matter of integrity. Or rather lack of it Sounds like you haven't sat down to a nice game of "Diplomacy" meh Well, looks like nobody likes this idea anyways. Or they are afraid to comment because they don't want their corp to misunderstand lol. You can just hit the like button on the first post if you want to remain anonymous. Thought I would give it a shot. I think it would have made the game much more interesting. On to new ideas!
Robert JD Niewiadomski NULLIMPEX INC 130	Posted - 2013.05.21 12:34:00 - [13] - Quote Daedric, lack of enthusiasm here may be deceitfull. I bet all of this is already happening and nobody involved wants to fall for you sting operation Anyone spilling here theirs beans would be compromised immediatelly. Look at all those SP, WP and ISK biomassed... I guess you will get a lot of fanmail with lots of lucrative betrayal propositions
Jadek Menaheim WarRavens 8	Posted - 2013.05.21 15:53:00 - [14] - Quote Daedric Lothar wrote: Well I was thinking about it and you don't want to give to much away to the corp a merc is in, because that would definately promote less teamwork. I think that for this to work that it would also be good for the Dust Mercs to not have a corporate history, that each corp and alliance should keep their own list of who is who. That you can be sold out by the corp who paid you should be enough to keep most people in line. I also think it may be interesting if you can offer betrayal. Instead of just selecting offers the Reds choose, that you can make clandestine offers to them that they can pick. That seems reasonable. The potential for blackmail is a very good deterrent for betraying your teammates. I imagine said corp who paid you to betray could extort you for 'your-own-protection' money.
Jadek Menaheim WarRavens 8	Posted - 2013.05.21 16:48:00 - [15] - Quote Vermaak Doe wrote: It's not meta game if it's this artificial. Well yes, that does seem the case if you label a feature of the game 'betrayal'. However, the introduction of some tools have great potential to expand a very real and juicy meta game. Off the top of my head, one tool in particular that could be called in is a kill feed name scrambler. This outrageously expensive cyber-warfare tool (off-map support) temporarily makes names that display in the "who-killed-who" feed illegible for 45 seconds allowing you increased opportunities to turn on your allies without their full knowledge. Likely such a mechanic would work best for a sniper. The true impact of a tool is felt in the after-game debriefing as corps attempt to conduct mole hunts. I do believe it should stand that you DON'T gain WP for killing your teammates; only a contract payout of blood money. A low WP count for a high kill performing player could also be used as red flags; (the number crunchers will be our saviors). In turn, this may deter betrayers from killing the team en-mass, yet I do see this being useful for contracts placed on taking down individual mercs. Maybe a corp wants to push an adversarial corp's merc several rungs down the k/d leader-board or destroy a few of their proto-fits. The glaring elephant in the room with this mechanic is the likelihood for how polarized this could make the Dust community. Additionally, it would likely turn a lot of high-tier players away from public matches (if they betrayal mechanics of FF where available in public matches). What are your thoughts on this? On a final note. As a New Eden merc, there is real question to ponder. How does one balance loyalty, reputation, and a paycheck?
Jadek Menaheim WarRavens League of Infamy 16	Posted - 2013.06.26 04:14:00 - [16] - Quote Bump
Krom Ganesh Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 33	Posted - 2013.06.26 04:25:00 - [17] - Quote One of the dev blogs mention they were SoonTM adding player to player ISK transfer as well as Corp to any player ISK transfer. Wouldn't that allow for betrayal funding?
D3LTA Blitzkrieg II 0uter.Heaven League of Infamy 5	Posted - 2013.06.26 04:33:00 - [18] - Quote they announced that soon ull b able to kick un-invited guests
Daedric Lothar Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 716	Posted - 2013.06.26 11:18:00 - [19] - Quote Krom Ganesh wrote: One of the dev blogs mention they will SoonTM add player to player ISK transfer as well as Corp to any player ISK transfer. Wouldn't that allow for betrayal funding? Isk transfer should facilitate a base for it, but I am not sure if there is enough content to support someone taking the time to do it. The Awoxing of a PC match was fun, but what do you really gain from it? Not much at this stage. it's going to be much harder to pull off in the coming months and you only get 1 shot at it before you get kicked. There should be more incentive to be sneaky and underhanded. A whole system doesn't have to be created, but more features that can be abused would make it more attractive. Like Dusties being able to see where corporate EVE ships are in the galaxy, or if there were hidden features that were known to corpies and not the enemy, like hidden PC attack opportunity timers or if adding cool new features to corp owned districts took time and made the district vulnerable, but only if you know the stuff was being added.
Aikuchi Tomaru Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 28	Posted - 2013.06.26 15:30:00 - [20] - Quote Daedric Lothar wrote: Rachoi wrote: not only no, but **** no. that would kill ANY cohesion that current alliances have, and make corporations something nobody wants to join. i really dont see how giving a money incentive to killing an ally is any good, espcially when in PC it currently rapes your Warpoints to do so Humbug, people will play for the metagame. What other game out there has anything like this? It would be new fresh and exciting. Eve always gets press when there is a big corp theft. People want this feature, it's exciting. It will bring new blood. There are a lot of ways to go also. If you could, wouldn't you like to turn someone so you could win? Basically you said "Make betraying more worthwhile than normal playing and let everyone now that you're a spy". So: No. Also: I'm not sure how spying works in Eve Online. But wasn't it something about getting into a corp and giving your real corp information? Like fittings they use, events thay plan and so on. I can't remember that spying in Eve is about Teamkilling. And guess what: You can already do this in Dust! If you have a spy in the enemy team you can communicate with him via teamspeak or something like this.



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